Season 2 - Adventures of BeagleGirl - The Adventures Continue

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

The previous topic was reaching the 6 page limit and I had an ideal "cliffhanger" to end the "season" on, so I'm starting up season 2.  If you didn't watch last season you can catch up here.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=327972.0

I swear that I'm not intentionally leaving the cliffhanger out there longer than necessary.  The season opener will explain a bit about why it's taking a bit longer for me to get the next episode written.

While you wait, I'd love "fan feedback".  While I've focused a bit more on the action sequences, I have been doing a lot of processing and have appreciated the insight of my T and IRL friends the past few weeks.  Those of you on this site have a unique perspective by virtue of having the shared experience of a relationship with someone with BPD and the marks and distorted perceptions that can leave us with.  If there is anything popping out at you in what I'm relating that you think I may not be seeing or could use a different perspective on, please let me know.  I'd also love to hear about things that are resonating with you.  This is the Learning board, after all.  What can we learn from the Adventures of BeagleGirl?

Possible topics -
Was it a "date!" or a "date?"
What flag colors do you see in the description of Cat Guy's behavior/history so far?
Are you a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why?
Are you NOT a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why not?  Flags?
What flags do you see in BeagleGirl's behavior with Neighbor B?
What are some of the "dark staircases with creepy music playing" that you want to tell BeagleGirl about?
Suggestions for future plot twists?  Celebrity guest appearances?  
What "characters" do you think should be getting more/less air time (BeagleGirl's attention)?

BG

[BeagleGirl]

The previous topic was reaching the 6 page limit and I had an ideal "cliffhanger" to end the "season" on, so I'm starting up season 2.  If you didn't watch last season you can catch up here.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=327972.0

I swear that I'm not intentionally leaving the cliffhanger out there longer than necessary.  The season opener will explain a bit about why it's taking a bit longer for me to get the next episode written.

While you wait, I'd love "fan feedback".  While I've focused a bit more on the action sequences, I have been doing a lot of processing and have appreciated the insight of my T and IRL friends the past few weeks.  Those of you on this site have a unique perspective by virtue of having the shared experience of a relationship with someone with BPD and the marks and distorted perceptions that can leave us with.  If there is anything popping out at you in what I'm relating that you think I may not be seeing or could use a different perspective on, please let me know.  I'd also love to hear about things that are resonating with you.  This is the Learning board, after all.  What can we learn from the Adventures of BeagleGirl?

Possible topics -
Was it a "date!" or a "date?"
What flag colors do you see in the description of Cat Guy's behavior/history so far?
Are you a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why?
Are you NOT a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why not?  Flags?
What flags do you see in BeagleGirl's behavior with Neighbor B?
What are some of the "dark staircases with creepy music playing" that you want to tell BeagleGirl about?
Suggestions for future plot twists?  Celebrity guest appearances?  
What "characters" do you think should be getting more/less air time (BeagleGirl's attention)?

BG

[once removed]

Was it a "date!" or a "date?"

im interested in your thoughts on this, as well as the conversation topics. first date conversations make me anxious!

What flag colors do you see in the description of Cat Guy's behavior/history so far?

depends on whether we are talking personality traits or dating potential. i dont see much to go on with the former. i mostly agree with the observations of others (possibly flaky, not necessarily a high potential), though if im not mistaken, the two of you hadnt met before this date... .id want to know more about what he does afterward. did your interest grow, subside, stay the same?

[Cat Familiar]

I’m a big Neighbor B fan. He’s playing the long game. Smart guy—build a friendship first and be patient as you heal after your divorce. He doesn’t want to be the rebound guy. He likes you.

[Caco Canepa]

Was it a "date!" or a "date?"

I've enjoyed reading the first season, Beaglegirl. Along with others' stories about getting their sexual/dating mojo back after a BPD relationship. As I've been dipping my toes back into life after my separation, I've been trying to be open to new friendships, and finding myself attracted to certain individuals. And I'm left wondering about some of the interactions and get-togethers we've had. Your question above about "is it a date?" keeps popping up.

Not looking to hijack your story, but wanted to share where I've been along a similar part in my own path:

• Probably no as removed from my marriage as you are from yours
• Definitely no desire to start a capital-R Relationship or enmesh my life with someone else for another couple of years
• Still treading carefully (on eggshells?) about publicly seeming to enjoy life "too much" until the separation agreement is signed — I don't want my uBPD STB-XW to go berserk and torpedo the negotiations on the child custody and house
• Learning to deal with living alone and to live with the feelings of loneliness & anxiety I get sometimes. (Breathe, breathe.)
• Re-integrating myself into the communities I belonged to and wanted to belong to but couldn't because of my uBPD's jealousy: music, outdoor enthusiasts, folk dancing, civic organizations, circles of friends
• Finding joy once again in things that made me happy — being able to learn new songs after years of feeling "stuck" artistically, etc.

But also:

• Worrying about whether I still "have it" when my half-a##ed flirting falls flat; concerned that I'm coming off as "creepy" (i'm told I'm not overstepping)
• Wanting to be more conscious ethical about my relationships this time around than the last time i found myself suddenly single
• Concerned about consent — especially in the light of #metoo
• At the start of the summer I asked a couple of women out on unambiguous "dates" — there was a bit of a spark, but not enough, and there wasn't enough mutual physical chemistry for me to warrant more than two dates with each. This felt like a little blow to my ego and I tried to be mindful of that.
• I've had a platonic-touch thing going with a friend who's a single mom. We grab takeout, hike to a secluded streamside, and trade massage. The touch feels good and is very needed, mutually. We've wound up in bed, mostly clothes-on, but have backed away. She wants a partner eventually to have a second child with, and I've had a vasectomy. And we value our friendship and know that we're treading on dangerous ground sometimes. So the touch is what it is.
• Also have had some heavy smooching-petting sessions with an old flame from 10 years ago. But I don't want to get enmeshed or coupled so I keep that at arms-length.
• Yup, I've gotten on Tinder. It's doing nothing for my ego, and It seems like a time-suck. If a hook-up ensues, that wouldn't hurt my feelings.

The main thing I have of interest right now — an intriguing woman from my musician circle who plays the fiddle. We have many acquaintances in common but I don't know her current dating status, although she's talked about being bisexual. I've given her a brief overview of my separation situation. She invited me to a group dinner at her place, and when I offered to reciprocate she said — "yes — Invite me over." We had a nice evening at my place, no physical contact though we played music afterwards. In a couple of days we're going to check out an art exhibit and then dinner at her place. Again ... .I'm still really not sure whether these things qualify as dates, or what her interest is in me, exactly. I asked a couple of female friends about their take on it. One said "Oh yes, she wants that booty!" I have no expectations. But Beaglegirl, I loved reading about your anticipation for your dinner dates with the neighbor. There's something delicious about anticipating.

[BasementDweller]

Hi, BG! 

Glad to hear you are having some adventures out there! :-) Whether or not it's a real "date" it's just nice to spend time with people that don't scream at you or embarrass you in public. 

Re: Cat Guy - he seems ok, but a little flaky. I have encountered a lot of guys in my day that I meet and have a fun date or two with, but they aren't that driven to really pursue anything, or make much effort. I won't do the pursuing though, so I just let those fizzle out, or file them in the "beer buddy" category. I used to worry that there was something about me that they didn't much like, until time and time again I'd stay acquaintances with them and they would serial date until they were blue in the face and never get serious with anyone. Cat Guy might be like that. He wants to meet people, but isn't ready to seriously invest. (Please correct me if I am wrong here - he's the guy that delays calling, and is a bit inconsistent about calling when he says he will?) If so, those guys can be fun for an occasional hang out, but I lose interest pretty quickly if they seem like they're on the fence.

Neighbor B seems like a good guy who is taking it slow and respecting the fact that you both have some things to work through. I'd keep him in mind and see where that goes... .and meanwhile - keep dating or even just going out and having a beer (or a non alco drink if that's your thing) with guys, and female friends too.

I think that's what helped me to recover in the end from my break-up - or at least to detach a lot. I went on some dates and also have a lot of male friends I drink beer with and am seen as "one of the dudes" by. They never let me sit around too long and feel sorry for myself, and would check in on me and drag me out if I was in too much of a funk. They reminded me (once my pwBPD was out of the picture) that I was attractive and a hell of a catch and my ex was a fool. (They were too afraid to say anything when I was still with him, of course.) But once I got away from his toxicity for while I remembered - other people like me - even if he went nuts on me.

So maybe look at it like that. Go out with friends. Date a bit, have fun, and if it doesn't become a romance, that's ok. When it feels right - you'll know, and you will click with someone the right way. No harm in casual dating now, just to talk to new people, and have some fun out on the town.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey BG, OK, here's my "fan feedback": suggest you try to let things unfold naturally.  It seems to me like you're putting a lot of pressure on yourself regarding neighbor B and your date w/cat man.  Maybe you would have more fun and feel more relaxed if you didn't have your fans eagerly awaiting an update via text or video chat the moment the date ends?  Suggest you chill out and listen to your gut feelings.

LuckyJim

[flourdust]

I swear that I'm not intentionally leaving the cliffhanger out there longer than necessary.  The season opener will explain a bit about why it's taking a bit longer for me to get the next episode written.

What? No second episode? Just a commentary track? I want my money back!

Was it a "date!" or a "date?" What flag colors do you see in the description of Cat Guy's behavior/history so far?

You're overthinking it ... .and trying to fit things into little boxes. I think he has some dating interest in you ... .and you do in him, but you were trying to smack him down a bit for flaking on you. I see the flaking as the same red flag everyone else does -- it's disrespectful of your time. But, I think you can give him one do-over and see if he improves. So, I am in favor of meeting up for a "date" (no punctuation necessary), and just see what happens. Don't try to force it into a particular category, but do be in touch with your own feelings and reactions.

I'm going through something similar now -- I had my first post-divorce date (and first "first date" in seventeen years!) on Sunday. It was an enjoyable conversation; I didn't feel any vibe other than "friendly," and I don't want to rush things along in any case. So I'm considering keeping it on a casual friendly level rather than ramping up ... .but I'm not certain how to communicate that. Go out with her a second time to see if there are sparks? Or just offer to go out on a friendly basis? I dunno... .

Are you a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why?
Are you NOT a Neighbor B fan?  If so, why not?  Flags?
What flags do you see in BeagleGirl's behavior with Neighbor B?

I don't see any particular flags -- just a case where it's helpful to be as honest (both with him and yourself) as possible. He seems like a good guy who is aware of his own priorities (kids!) and your mutual attraction and has generally communicated clearly. I think you've moved on from being very flirtatious to more of a friendly neighbor vibe.

At the same time, if you want to move this to something more romantic, you should be honest about your diverging intentions ... .and talk to him about what his timeline is. If he has no plans to be available for the foreseeable future, then you should move on. If he does signal interest in dating, then I would suggest you separate yourself a bit more from his kids than you have been... .even if his boundaries in that area are a little soft.

What "characters" do you think should be getting more/less air time (BeagleGirl's attention)?

BeagleGirl. Putting her desires first, not second-guessing what she wants or should want.

[BeagleGirl]

Thanks for the fan responses.  I will get to them as soon as I can.  I'm a bit swamped right now, both from a time and an emotional energy standpoint.  I'm hoping that this putting this "episode" out will help open up some of that emotional energy, but I'm still a bit time limited as this is a custody week for me and I've got other time commitments this week (more on that later).

So we left off with BeagleGirl having just returned from her "date?" when Neighbor B texts... .

"We've last minute decided to go to {night time event at one of the most beautiful locations in our town}.  You interested in going with us?"

OF COURSE BEAGLEGIRL IS INTERESTED!  BEAGLEGIRL COULDN'T THINK OF ANYTHING IN THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD SHE WOULD RATHER DO!

BeagleGirl: "That sounds fun.  I just got home but can put my shoes back on."
Neighbor B:  "Great! We'll be there in 15 minutes - is that enough time?"
BeagleGirl:  "Yep"

In the stretch of this exchange BeagleGirl has realized that she is still dressed for a "date?" and while it was a casual day "date?", this is probably the most made up Neighbor B will have ever seen her.  Obviously not putting the heels back on for outdoor walking, but those maroon suede flats will add a lovely pop of color... . In case I haven't mentioned it before, my interactions with Neighbor B have mostly been when I've been out doing yard work or on a wog around the neighborhood or otherwise casual and often rather sweaty.  I'm generally a "low maintenance" type and have been a bit intentional about not dressing up for things like the drive-in movie or movie night at his place, etc.  While the "date?" with Cat Guy was at a casual time, it was at an upscale place, so I was more "made up" than I think Neighbor B has ever seen.  And I have to say that I was looking rather good.  

Neighbor B comes to the door in jeans, t-shirt, and ball cap.  I think he pretty much instantly picked up on the fact that I wasn't "just getting home" from running errands.  He has been instructed to not compliment me, so all he said about what I was wearing was "Do you think you'll be warm enough in that?" but I am learning to recognize when a man finds me attractive and I felt an undertone of "You look really nice".  I assured him that I had a sweater in my bag.  He had brought back the container I gave him soup in, so he stepped inside as I put that in the kitchen and grabbed my bag.  He asked me what I'd been up to that day and I let him know that I'd met {friend} for coffee, gotten my 11 mile run in and just come from meeting someone for drinks.  I'm pretty sure he put the lack of me naming the person I met for drinks with how I looked and came to the logical conclusion.  There were at least two points during the evening where it felt like he might have been trying to get a bit more info on that portion of my day, but I avoided providing them.  

He was quite the chatterbox on the drive to the event location, filling me in on his week and also bringing up things I had texted him about.  His focus was on me to the extent that he missed his D11 trying to say something to him twice.  I was waiting for a break in his story to ask her what she wanted to say but she managed to jump in and asked him to relay a funny story, which he did.  The freeway exit we were supposed to take was closed, so his conversation slowed as he looked for an alternate route, so I jumped in with conversation more directed at his kids (but he brought up things I'd said later in the evening that I hadn't expected him to be paying attention to while navigating) and we eventually made it to the event location.  

Only to find out that there was a special event that night that had cancelled our event... . The kids immediately said "Oh well.  Now we can go back to BeagleGirl's house and play hide-and-seek and you can be the seeker, dad."  Again, not sure if I've mentioned this, but hide-and-seek is something I do with his kids.  They know my house pretty intimately because of that, and I had the (somewhat awkward) experience of seeking the kids in Neighbor B's house while he was preparing dinner on a previous evening at his place.  On that occassion I explained to Neighbor B that I have a policy that any closed door is not a hiding spot room in my house and asked if he wanted to go close any doors.  He didn't.  So I've seen ALL of his house.  While I keep a fairly tidy house, I knew I had clothes scattered on the couch (from the "date?" outfit selection process) and an item or two of clothing hung to dry that I didn't really want to display, so I suggested that I get them started on RockBand while I did a quick tidy.  I've done RockBand on previous evenings with the kids and Neighbor B has joined on a few songs but mostly acted as spectator.  We did a few songs together, then I left them to do a set while I tidied.  I rejoined them and enjoyed just sitting with the kids while they played.  I'm naturally good with kids, finding their strengths and challenges and knowing how to interact with them in ways that engage their strengths.  It's something I know about myself, but wasn't really thinking about until I realized that Neighbor B was quietly watching us.  I know that one of his concerns early on was that I might be using his kids either to get closer to him or to fill a the gap that my S15's emotional distance has left (S15's opening up and less distant now, but Neighbor B knows there's been quite a bit of pain from that in the recent past).  I think (hope) that what he is seeing is that this isn't about either of those things.  I love kids in general, and have come to know his kids well enough to love them more specifically.  I know that his D11 tends towards perfectionism and anxiety and responds well to specific encouragement, order, and a calming presence.  When she has that she blossoms.  She is such a patient and caring girl.  She is also skilled in dance, singing, and art.  I know that his S9 is a ball of energy and likes to push boundaries.  He responds well to active engagement and exploration, but also needs clear, consistent limits.  But I digress... .

We had a blast playing hide-and-seek and chatting over ice cream afterwards.  His D11 saw the nail polish I hadn't felt the need to tidy away and asked me to do her nails, which I gladly did with Neighbor B's permission.

I mentioned in the Cat Guy date? episode that I'm not sure that I am ready to think about chemistry with someone until I have made an intellectual connection with them.  I can definitely say that I feel chemistry, with Neighbor B and I believe it's mutual.  (That statement is something my T pointed out to me as evidence of progress, because I have spent so much of my life doubting my attractiveness.)  I feel like there were times when he wanted to reach out and touch me, where he stood just a bit closer, when his attention was focused on me.  He hugged me when they were leaving and these hugs seem to be getting a bit longer each time.  I know there were a lot of times when I wanted to touch, stand closer, etc.  I don't think there's any danger of an impromptu make out session, but I think there's enough spark to keep this from feeling like a full "friend zone" situation.  

At the end of the evening he brought up the event that we had missed and the plans he had for this weekend to attend it with some friends from work.  He asked if I might want to have his kids over while he does that.  I can see how that might be a   for anyone who (like my protective BFFs) might think Neighbor B is getting more out of this "relationship" than he's giving.  I'm reserving judgement, because I think he knows how much I enjoy time with his kids.  I am also more than happy to   (or even  ) my own tendency to give more to relationships (family, friends, romantic) far more than I expect in return.  I'm trying to figure out how much of that is done out of a desire to prove myself worthy of relationship and how much is done out of just the joy I get from giving of my time and energy to others.  

I'm noticing that, while I feel like our text conversations are a bit unbalanced, when we are together Neighbor B shows that he's been listening and thinking about what I say to him.  He brings up information or topics discussed in person or text from months ago.  He also shares a lot of family stories.  On our drive back from the event that we weren't able to attend he wanted to show me a house that his brother had owned previously.  When I'm with him I feel like he wants to know me and like he wants me to share in his family's memories and stories.  He also seems to want his kids to know that I'm a part of his life even when they aren't around.  He pointed out the bathroom fan that he helped me install to his D11 while they were seeking, and there have been other times when he has brought up our interactions in conversation with them.  

When I'm with Neighbor B, I feel safe and "at home".  When I'm with him, I don't doubt that Neighbor B is being cautious for my sake as well as his.  I don't doubt that we are both picturing the potential for what could be and liking what we see.  I feel confident, when in his presence, that he is dealing with his own awkwardness and insecurities at times and probably doing a bit of his own overthinking.  

It's when I'm away from him that MY overthinking kicks into high gear.  I start wondering if he really wanted to invite me to the event, or if it was just his way of repaying me for mowing his lawn.  Or if his kids suggested it and he went along with it to please his kids.  

My T is encouraging me to catch myself when I find myself trying to find meaning in Neighbor B's actions/inactions and ask myself if the fears I'm having are related to Neighbor B or dBPDxh.  I think she's a closet Neighbor B fan, but doesn't want to see anyone in a leading romantic role until BeagleGirl is ready.  Who knows how many seasons that will take.  Sigh.

I have a number of other story lines to update that I don't have time for now, but I didn't want to leave you hanging on that cliffhanger too much longer.  

BG

[Cat Familiar]

Awesome. Sweet. Honest. Real. Kind. Fun. Friends. Healthy. 

[BasementDweller]

"In the stretch of this exchange BeagleGirl has realized that she is still dressed for a "date?" "

A busy gal has got to multi-task! Sounds like a great evening - yay!  

[Lucky Jim]

I can definitely say that I feel chemistry, with Neighbor B and I believe it's mutual.

Hey BG, Maybe it's time to let Neighbor B know that you like hanging out with him?  Perhaps you could schedule some one-on-one time together?  (I'm intentionally avoiding the "date" terminology!)

LuckyJim

[flourdust]

At the end of the evening he brought up the event that we had missed and the plans he had for this weekend to attend it with some friends from work.  He asked if I might want to have his kids over while he does that.

Read what I said above about his soft boundaries around his kids.

What I'm seeing is that Neighbor B is attracted to you, but he's also viewing you as a replacement mom for his kids. I'm not saying this is deliberate or malicious, but it is worrying. You're being slotted into a role in his family dynamic that he misses.

In the future, should you end up in a relationship with him, you would probably become a part of the kids' lives, too -- but this should be an extension of your relationship, not the other way around.

I don't think you're going to like this recommendation, but I'm pretty firm about its importance if you want this to develop in a healthy and sustainable way. You need to solidify boundaries around the kids. No babysitting. No more hide-and-seek. No more joining them in the mom role on family outings. Spend one-on-one adult time with Neighbor B, period.

[Insom]

Hey, BeagleGirl! 

This has become quite the story!  Your choice to slip into the third person from time to time is an interesting one because it creates a degree of emotional removal, as if the story is happening to someone else.  You are a good writer.  I want to let you know, though, that you don't have to entertain us.  We are here to support you regardless of whether things are going well or badly or are interesting or boring. 

I'd like to echo Lucky Jim re: taking some of the pressure off.  How do you feel about letting life get boring for awhile?  What's it like to just be you as opposed to performing? 

Nice comment, too, by flourdust re: the family dynamic.   

[formflier]

Hmmm... .at first blush I'm finding myself in the same camp as Flourdust.  One on one adult time is the safe/healthy bet.

Then (overthinking alert... )  I start thinking.  You guys are neighbors and there are various levels of boundaries there, all of which are OK as long as everyone is on the same page... .with extreme clarity.

I like clarity.

Although looking back several episodes, I find it odd (hmm... perhaps interesting or noteworthy is a better word) that there is "extreme clarity" about compliments about appearance, yet the "pseudo-mom" thing apparently has never been discussed (am i correct on this)

I don't want to over-analyze that... .but some level of analysis is appropriate.  

Remind me what the issue is with him saying... "Wow... .that (fill in the blank article of clothing) really does you justice!" or "Hey... that color brings out your eyes nicely".

I don't remember the prior episode well enough where the no compliment thing came up, but I've never gotten the vibe that he was a "Ooohhhh baby... .it must be Halloween cause you Booty is saying trick or treat to me... "

(obviously a thinly veiled attempt to get hired as a writer for this show... .)

Anyway, I like the vibe.  Do some thinking about the kid thing.

FF