The aftermath after being blocked PART 3

[Yellowpearl]

This post is a continuation of this thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=331609.0

so I ended up going with the casually direct approach because I kind of felt sending an empty txt may not really do anything and seem i'm trying too hard. I ended up sending him a few days ago on Friday "are you up for talking this weekend?" I thought that it would give him the whole weekend to get back to me and show i'm open while kind of signaling that i'd appreciate an answer. Except he still didn't respond.

now i'm wondering if I did too much? I thought it was light when I sent it. On the other hand, I feel it's kind of messed up of him to initiate plans with me, and express all this interest in talking further and leave me high and dry. I just felt I deserved to know if he needs space or what's going on and I feel like i'm being a bit mistreated here. I wonder when it's appropriate to call some one out on this but since we just started talking after no contact it doesn't seem the best idea to tell the person i deserve at least an answer. Not sure he realizes it's disrespectful/hurtful and still just focused on his own feelings. I don't really understand what's going on now that he didn't reply to my last txt either, and hopefully I didn't make it worse.

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[once removed]

i like the approach, actually. now the ball is clearly in his court.

I wonder when it's appropriate to call some one out on this

it usually isnt. its just saying "answer me!". you took a risk... .you knew what the risk entailed. it may feel like rejection, and it may be hard to sit with, but the hardest aspects about it will pass if you do.

you played your cards, and no, i dont think it was too much. he may get back to you, he may not. but youve apologized for things you did that bothered you, and youve been proactive in trying to reestablish that connection. the next move is his.

[Yellowpearl]

Yeah, I feel like at least with the text I went with it's clear that it's his turn and it acknowledged that i'm open to talking but also respecting his space and asked if he's up for it.

It would have been nice if he would have let me know "yes" or "no" in some form instead of completely dismissing it and letting the weekend pass.

you played your cards, and no, i dont think it was too much. he may get back to you, he may not. but youve apologized for things you did that bothered you, and youve been proactive in trying to reestablish that connection. the next move is his.

You are right, it wasn't too much and at least i'm not going through what I was before in feeling bad and wanting to apologize. I'm going to just leave it alone but I feel really confused, if he's doing this on purpose, or something really switched off in him that he no longer cares even though he expressed a lot of excitement when I first reached out and replied immediately. Or if he's too overwhelmed by his feelings and got triggered by fears of getting close again when it came to actually meet or talk again. If it's the latter, I get that, but it's really hard for me to understand how he cannot see how this would be leaving me hanging in the air and be hurtful. In this case, he literally isn't responding despite telling me he was going to be free and telling me he wants to reconcile.

I wonder if he realized it's too much for him when he realized what he done/said and his silence means he doesn't have the courage to tell me.

I'm just at a loss.

The last ditch effort I considered was giving a call at some point but I really don't want to get yelled at if hes dysregulated, that's what happened during the blow out when things got really bad.

[once removed]

its hard to say whats in his head here, or if he even knows himself.

hes done similar things before, right? its worth taking that into consideration.

The last ditch effort I considered was giving a call at some point but I really don't want to get yelled at if hes dysregulated, that's what happened during the blow out when things got really bad.

thats just saying "answer me!". i think long term, youll respect yourself a great deal more if you leave the ball in his court. there was some risk that this would happen, but its not like you laid your heart on the line in terms of say, asking him for a date, telling him you wanted to get back together, and got rejected.

you apologized... .he wanted to get together... .you were open to it... .he flaked out.

[Yellowpearl]

hes done similar things before, right? its worth taking that into consideration.

He has, it used to be me reaching out every week or two to get back in touch because he kept doing this over the last month of the summer. Part of it was a transition/career change and him talking about overthinking about the new job and freaking out and feeling uncertain about his life. But he's pretty settled in his job, although I get the sense it's not really what he wants to do long term and its when he started to distance himself when he started it. Right before and during our blow up, he kept bringing up another new job idea every other week and I always got the sense if hes not happy with career he doesn't feel happy with anything.

He said he was "all clear" now that we had time apart and ready to move forward yet I'm not sure he actually is. He just seems really confused based on these actions you outlined:

you apologized... .he wanted to get together... .you were open to it... .he flaked out.

[Yellowpearl]

Oh no! I think I did something terrible that may or may not have made things worse. It's been 3 weeks of silence. Since I reached out the other week asking if he can talk and got no response, I hadn't heard anything. It has been 11 days since I asked that. I'd been feeling really anxious and worried at this point and during Christmas yesterday I reached out.

I thought why not, maybe it will cheer both of us up and I felt myself feeling like I just want to address the situation and say how I feel for once, about getting this silence after he said he wanted to see me. Thought I'd actually acknowledge it. Though it would help in getting in healthy communication again. I felt so long I've been just empathizing and pretending it's okay in the past by sending light texts when this happens so maybe he thinks its okay. But now with what I said, I feel emotionally exposed. I used the direct approach. I worry, did I JADE him? Ugh! I didn't know what else to say. I just went with it, now I'm worried. He may get defensive or continue the silence! Was I too nice/forgiving, was I too harsh. Or am I good. Don't know.

So I said this:
Hey, I'm feeling really confused. Didn't you say you liked me and agreed to meet up? Why aren't you talking to me? It would be great to hear from you. Merry Christmas : )

An hour went by no response, at this point, I felt a bit upset. I thought, doesn't he see how confused I am. I sent a final text again, stating:
"If you want me to leave you alone, I will. I just want to know where we stand."

I can't believe I double texted. No reply yet... .(if ever)

I have no idea if I did the right thing or if these sort of messages only push him away. I'm going a bit crazy, thinking "what did I just do" and oh great I seem like I really care too much. Why can't they see how much silence hurts us, especially giving no indication and right after having a talk that he will improve communication and talk to me if something's wrong or needs space, rather than going silent. Now I'm wondering, is he doing this on purpose and did I make it worse. I don't know what I'm doing anymore.

[2020]

Hello Yellowpearl. You seem so very wise in your replies to my woes, yet here I see you are dealing with much the same as what I endure. I'm sorry to read your experience you are going through right now. We are all here in a similar boat really. Before I found this forum I had no idea what the issue was. The more I read here, the more certain I am of what this is.

The silent treatment is such a nasty thing. I too wonder if they do it on purpose. It is the thing I fear the most. I can handle it when it means the verbal abuse stops and I need a break. When they are totally having a meltdown and I fear for their safety, the silence is hell. Can they really be so unaware of what they are doing? No matter how many times they pull this card from their deck, eventually it wears us down. Even the question of whether it is intentional punishment they are delivering to us or they simply can't connect for some other reason, can really do ones head in. It goes around and around. Perhaps they want this, want us obsessing about them 100%? Do you think maybe there is shame involved on his part? Apparently they feel such a thing, although right now with my current situation, I find that hard to believe.  

I wish you luck!

ALSO: I wouldn't go worrying about whether the text messages were the wrong thing to do. We are only human! I have left three desperate notes to my partner this evening. She could be reading them right now getting a lot of joy out of my desperate plea to communicate.

[Yellowpearl]

2020, thank you for your kind reply and it indeed sounds like we are dealing with quite similar behaviors. Sometimes I feel like I’m complaining about something so small such as a silent treatment but it’s really feeling like some sort of mental abuse. The question is how much they realize it. I’d been wondering the same thing. Do they really just get a kick out of this? Last week I didn’t think I’d send another txt. I thought wow I’m gonna be calm about this and casually ask if he’s up to talk and leave it at that. I even had some calm days and space away from this that I enjoyed.

I bet I even deep down thought he’d eventually reply. But he didn’t and it just gets to the point that you do get desperate and upset. I started to feel is he even aware this hurts me maybe I need to acknowledge it instead of playing it cool. When I do that, it’s even worse not getting a reply. Cause I just seemed desperate probably.

You’re right too at a certain point we are just looking for an answer. I think he may be ashamed or feel guilty that he already took so long, maybe triggered or fearful of a relationship too. He does get anxiety but a normal person would just still reply and treat you like a human being, despite any shame. I’m starting to wonder it’s needy thing too. For them to feel secure they need to be in control of the situation and it isn’t until they see we are hurting that they see we care. How can he be so selfishly caught up in himself and not realize he made plans, said he wants to reconnect, and does the same thing he said he wouldn’t do. I understand doubts I have them too. But all this silence makes me doubt myself that I feel like I’m going insane.

Thanks for your reassurance that those texts I sent aren’t that crazy and that I’m not alone I’m sending them. In such a situation I’m like at least if he never replies he sees how I felt about it and knows it was hurtful to me. But still i feel quite utterly embarrassed and worry I’m “chasing” him and he’s laughing at me somewhere. My hope was it would help him see the reality of then situation. I’m doubting myself too much.

I just hope  things improve! It’s way too much. As much as they do we need reassurance, some acknowledgement  and support too.

[2020]

I think the silent treatment is the worst. I'd almost go as far as to say I'd prefer a beating, a bite, or some other physical smashing up of one thing or another, over the silence.

I experience it in conjunction with the good ol' disappearing act. Sometimes, almost out of the blue, seemingly random, or when everything is pretty much fine... .she disappears. Other times she is yelling and I won't buy into the nonsense or I tell her she needs to stop playing the victim, she'll walk off. Seconds later she is nowhere to be found. She might hitch to her son's house, get drunk for three days with a bunch of kids, while I am going insane looking for her. Then she'll turn up in the small hours of the morning and tell me how they used her and got her to spend $700 in three days. Try and validate that!  On another occasion she was walking to the sewing shop to buy a zip and never returned. Three days later I have been sending frantic emails but no response. I then remember she is signed into yahoomail on my computer from a few days prior. I see instantly that she has been getting my emails and reading them. I also see that she is at her sister's house, so I drive the five hour round trip to see her but she isn't there when I arrive. I leave a note and that was enough for her to email me... .as if nothing was wrong! It is all crazy cr@p isn't it? I have not slept tonight and the mental hospital will be open in an hour. I just hope they can tell me she is there.

I really feel for you and the days and weeks of silence. I have endured this often. Once it went on for 10 months! It is a long hard road. Somehow we need to manage the way we react to it. I'm not sure how we have supposed to have a relationship with someone where we have to NOT react to this sort of playing up. It really is torture.

[once removed]

for starters, i dont think your messages specifically, were/are a big deal. you effectively said "im confused, whats up?". if it were left at that, at face value, its fine.

looking a little deeper though, it was an anxious move, one that sought to alleviate that anxiety, but seems to have perpetuated it. this isnt new in the dynamic between the two of you. it is something that without careful attention may reoccur in future relationships.

where do you want to go from here?

[Yellowpearl]

Somehow we need to manage the way we react to it. I'm not sure how we have supposed to have a relationship with someone where we have to NOT react to this sort of playing up. It really is torture.

Very true, thanks for the support again, it's amazing we feel we can't react, and when we do, it can make us look like WE are the ones acting out too much! Silence is worse than physical violence to me too.

looking a little deeper though, it was an anxious move, one that sought to alleviate that anxiety, but seems to have perpetuated it. this isnt new in the dynamic between the two of you. it is something that without careful attention may reoccur in future relationships.

I felt sure as I was sending it, but when I didn't see that I got a response within 2 hours, I did get quite anxious. The fact that it was Christmas made the silence harder to get through. Oh true, it was an anxious move on my part. The silence was getting to me and I thought if I expressed my feelings, he may realize how it's affecting me in case he didn't and it would help move things along to talking again.

Where do you want to go from here?

First off, it may be a good idea to check my phone soon. When I sent the apology, I did the same thing, i took 3 days to get back to him, thinking he wasn't going to reply, and not checking my phone for that amount of time.
I assumed he hasn't replied, but I didn't check my phone since last night, after two hours passed by, I made a judgmental call that he wasn't and didn't look at my phone since.

The other thing is, I'd like to learn how to effectively discuss silence and how it affects me if he does ever get back to me because its at a point it drives my anxiety through the roof, since it's happened quite often by now. He makes plans, acts very enthused and dropps off. This exact thing led to our summer blow up too.  So it's feeling all too familiar and its triggering. I thought we briefly addressed it on the phone and he recognized it as a mistake he won't do again. So I've been driving myself insane wondering if he is doing this on purpose, or if he really did feel he overpursed and hes anxious about everything or what is going on at this point. I really was trying not to push this, or pursue too much and leave him alone, but last night it got to the point, I just felt the urge to say something. Now I have no idea if I did too much.

I think all the silence, it's what causes the anxiety, I don't know how to be understanding about that. It's starting to feel like mental abuse.

Right now, I can't even bring myself to check my phone.

[Skip]

Maybe he doesn'y know what to say and feels like he should know what to say. Maybe he feels the truth will upset you. Maybe he feels you'll wait until he is ready.

We can't really know. But one thing that we do know is that when the other person reaches out, we feel calm and that we have time to respond - right?  So does he.

Be patient. Lower the barrier to communicate (hey, did you see that the Eagle's won)... .

It's hard, but these are the only tools we have in these situations.

[Supertrouper]

Hi Yellowpearl, the silent treatment is one issue that i used to get really bothered about. It still bothers me a little but nowhere near as much.  I will give you my experience and take on it, it might be wrong, but it is what i have noticed in the five years ive been with my BPD partner.

He uses it for a variety of reasons and unfortunately i do have to try and work out why he is doing it, because his communication is not great and he wont tell me why, until the silent treatment has ended. The main reason for the silent treatment is control. Control of himself, because he just cannot deal with the feelings he has at the moment, so staying silent is his way of trying to deal with those feelings. It might not seem right to us but that is how he deals with it. Also it is control of us for a variety of reasons. They know the silent treatment infuriates us and causes anxiety but they cant deal with our emotions as well as their own at the time and as for talking about any issues or the relationship, there is no chance. Also, they know that we will text them and try to call, to try and get them to respond, they want you too. They get to know you care because they can read it or hear it, they also get to control whether they answer you or not. I may be wrong but i feel that they want you to feel as anxious as they do. It might not be the same reasons, but they know what works.

Now, i have had the silent treatment many times and i actually can see it coming, although i dont always know why he does it. What i do now though, instead of texting or calling him, i just let him have the silence. I do not call, text or do anything. I get on with my life. This does take some doing though and it takes ages to be comfortable with yourself while receiving the silent treatment. He usually calls me eventually and asks me why i havent called him. I usually say because i thought you needed space, you were bring rude so i left you alone, whatever the reason. It is then once they contact you back can you communicate, but only briefly about what the issue was before they went silent.

It is difficult to do but keeping calling, texting, whatever, while he is giving you the silent treatment is rewarding him for the silent treatment, you have to let them be. If it is a long silent treatment, just do one text, just lighthearted, and then let them be and get on with your life. They know where you are. I really do understand hiw hard that is to do, ive been there too, but for your own sake, you have to look after yourself.

[Luan]

Good old silent treatment. Any resistance will be futile. Attempts to break it will be interpreted as reinforcing the ideas behind giving you the silent treatment. Frustrating.

Consider the exquisite pain of this type of punishment as reserved for only those who have got close enough to that person to have had some effect on their complex protection system. I gave it to someone (friend) once. They had breached my trust, and any attempt they made to communicate I saw as manipulation. The difference was if they had acknowledged their breach of trust, I think I would have forgiven them. They did not, because it would have meant admitting they were indeed manipulative on many fronts. Three years later I do have liminal communication with that person because we are in the same social circle, but I keep it non personal. This is exactly what I am getting from my uBPD -  occasional non personal dialogue, and avoidance of any heartfelt conversation.

So... .to address Once Removed's prescient question, we want to regain an emotional connection with our special person. Trouble is, they see us as an untrustworthy and manipulative emotional monster coming at them at 100mph. We are the emotionally regulated one dealing with someone who is disassociating. We are aware of the consequences, and wish to steer things to our advantage. You might want to take the driver's seat by reaching out, but they have bailed and are finding another way home. They are:
a) Not feeling attachment to you/or perhaps anything
b) Overwhelmed by your emotional need
c) Seeking to find their own new equilibrium that you upset
d) Not trusting you
e) Seeing you as manipulative

Next step? For me, it is to think long and hard about how I have been untrustworthy and manipulative. Also turning down my emotional need. Having time apart is good for starting to see things from their point of view. We all have needs, but in trying to fulfil them we have transgressed their highly sensitive being. There may be no way back, we might become just another person in a string of failed relationships for that person. How deep are you willing to go? To forsake your needs in a selfless effort to earn back trust? If so:
a) Apologise - only after fully recognising where you breached trust and/or manipulated situations - I think we don't get a second chance at this, so make it good. My uBPD has incredible emotional intuition. Acknowledge with all honesty every small instance where this occurred. You are setting an example for you and them. Imagine being a teacher and breaching trust of your students. They will no longer respect you, and even though they might behave far worse, you are judged by a much higher standard.
b) Be the loving adult. Your door and your heart is always open - unconditional love and endless patience. As much as my uBPD might try, these are difficult things for her to achieve. That is my job, hers is protective love and spontaneity.
c) Be unambiguous about your wants, no metaphors or poetic inferences. I love you, I care for you, and I want honesty and trust between us. Trusting no one must be very tiring for them, but also the most acceptable default position. Ask yourself if they sense any dishonesty or manipulation in your intentions, how can you become the one they trust?
d) Let them know they have the steering wheel, they have control over their destination. (they'd like control over yours too) But you have control over your own .
e) Practice all the skills on here, but especially the mindfulness, validation and empathy. We are all too focused on our needs in the guise of love.

If, after all this, you think - but I am trustworthy and non manipulative - they are the one that has broken trust and is manipulating me! - then you are still missing the point. You are dealing with a child's awareness of emotional consequences, who has an adult's awareness of emotional intensity. They are putting you in a place where you cannot hurt them accidentally through thoughtlessness. You want to show that you can be trusted, but you feel the need to interact with them to do that. It may be game over, or you may find a way to show them your selfless side, after apologising and being patient, very patient. Not bothering them is a sign you are not trying to manipulate them, being honest about your past actions is a way of building trust. But remember, overwhelming them when they feel emotionally detached from you will always have the opposite effect.

Having said all that, I sent my silent exBPD a photo of her in a funny hat and said ho, ho, ho, merry christmas... .no reply, but no expectation of one ether. Hopefully she had a chuckle.

[Yellowpearl]

Thanks Skip, I never thought about it in that sense. When I reach out he may feel at ease he heard something, and feels calm and thinks he has time to gather his thoughts. It could be a number of things why I'm not getting a reply too. At this point, I agree it's best to be patient. What gets me is is feeling like why it isn't obvious to him i'm hurting over this and whether he is doing this on purpose and by that message if I made a fool out of myself, or if its actually important for him to know.

They know the silent treatment infuriates us and causes anxiety but they cant deal with our emotions as well as their own at the time and as for talking about any issues or the relationship, there is no chance. Also, they know that we will text them and try to call, to try and get them to respond, they want you too. They get to know you care because they can read it or hear it, they also get to control whether they answer you or not. I may be wrong but i feel that they want you to feel as anxious as they do. It might not be the same reasons, but they know what works.

Hey Supertrouper, thanks for your reply and thoughts, I think you're on to something. I agree, they have trouble managing their emotions, so it could be true they want us to feel upset because they are unsure or not as confident about the relationship or if they are good enough or they are anxious, so they do silent treatment. I wonder if they do it on a subconscious level. Like, from feeling so much at once, when they see our message, they aren't as phased by it or eager to reply because maybe they felt a bit rejected by something or anxious and they need a break from those feelings and are kind of numb in the moment.

It is difficult to do but keeping calling, texting, whatever, while he is giving you the silent treatment is rewarding him for the silent treatment, you have to let them be. If it is a long silent treatment, just do one text, just lighthearted, and then let them be and get on with your life. They know where you are. I really do understand hiw hard that is to do, ive been there too, but for your own sake, you have to look after yourself.

Yeah, i'm not going to say anything further. I just felt if I say something, at least he will know how I feel. I wondered if he really isn't aware of how it's affecting me, since there was a recent blow up, and we both had been on high guard. It was just tough to be that vulnerable again especially on Christmas. I'm a bit worried if that message stressed him out. It's difficult to know when's the right moment to send that kind of message. I do hope I didn't do too much.

It may be game over, or you may find a way to show them your selfless side, after apologising and being patient, very patient. Not bothering them is a sign you are not trying to manipulate them, being honest about your past actions is a way of building trust. But remember, overwhelming them when they feel emotionally detached from you will always have the opposite effect.

Luan, I understand what you're saying and I agree sometimes they see us reaching out or making a point during silent treatment as manipulation. But I don't know about apologizing. Or if it a manipulation, if you are just telling them the truth, that you feel confused and you're wondering why they aren't talking to you, in simple language. I also wonder if they are too caught up in themselves sometimes or their own emotions, they that may not recognize we may be hurting. Maybe sometimes they need to see that, too.

[Yellowpearl]

This does take some doing though and it takes ages to be comfortable with yourself while receiving the silent treatment. He usually calls me eventually and asks me why i havent called him. I usually say because i thought you needed space, you were bring rude so i left you alone, whatever the reason. It is then once they contact you back can you communicate, but only briefly about what the issue was before they went silent.

Supertrouper, it's interesting that you mentioned, he usually calls you back after you just leave him be for a while. I've actually read and heard this happens with many BPD, that if you get the silent treatment, their abandonment fears usually kick in that, they just contact you with a week or so. What makes it tricky in my case is that he seems he can go longer than 2 weeks without talking, and at that point you're wondering does he want a relationship, is he still in this, what's going on here, etc. So knowing that, I felt maybe its better to just send that firm text, so i'm not getting led on or anything, if he intended never to get back to me and i'm just waiting around. I just thought about that possibility. In your case, since I have been wondering about this, how long does it take for him to get back to you when he becomes silent usually?

[Yellowpearl]

well he replied this:

"merry christmas sorry for going MIA but i would just prefer to be left alone. I just have a lot going on right now i'm sorry"

im devastated. i don't even know what to say. i just feel hit with a bricks after reading that. maybe those texts did make it a little worse. im not even sure i should say anything, ideally id still like this to work, i dont know what to do, i guess it looks like hes final about this. i just dont know. do i say something supportive? or just silence, lets say id want to leave things open. HALP! Do i use SET or it is it pointless now. im just devastated. I cant believe this.

[2020]

Yellowpearl,

I am so sorry you are going through this pain. I do not know what to suggest. On a positive note, he did send you a reply, and he wished you Merry Christmas. I am thinking (in your case and mine), they are having such a hard time with their own feelings that it simply isn't possible to consider ours much at all.

I just got an email from my partner: "Hello, I am fine thank you." followed by her name. Pretty pathetic really, but maybe that is all she can do. So I am sitting here feeling sick as I am sure you are too. I'm feeling my relationship is pretty much gone. I don't know how to deal with that. It is a tragedy.

I wish you strength in this difficult time. Take care.

[Yellowpearl]

Sorry to hear that you got a similar response, 2020. I’m just in a lot of pain and I really almost I can go back to the silence then deal with the outcome of that message I received. Have no idea I should reply or not, how I can make it better if it’s been possible now... I also still feel upset, it’s like they aren’t taking our feelings into consideration in this, maybe they really are in that much pain. Though I wonder if he cares at all at this point. This is all too confusing for me.

Sorry this is happening to you too you’re not alone. Sending you strength during this time too.

[Skip]

"merry christmas sorry for going MIA but i would just prefer to be left alone. I just have a lot going on right now i'm sorry"

Take the tension off... .

Thanks for getting back! We can certainly talk at another time. Merry Christmas to you, too.

Yes, it looks like you misunderstood the note - that's OK.  This is positive, upbeat, leave the door open, and ends the exchange on a positive note.  This is mostly about lowering the barrier for a potential future exchange - assuming a best case scenario.

Don't expect a response. You don't really want one right now. You don't want him to cement these negative thoughts.

pwBPD are impulsive. You don't want to solidify a down cycle.

[Supertrouper]

Hi Yellowpearl, it is difficult, but just take one step at a time for yourself. It is infuriating and upsetting when you are the one who likes to talk things through in a relationship and your other half just cant. The silent treatment is awful. I think ive read your post that he contacted you about needing space, he answered and told you what he needed. I know its not what you want but he obviously needs space, so give him a little space. You can still do little reach outs.

To answer your question, i have had the silent treatment many times over five years, but trust me it has gotten to smaller intervals and i can sometimes recognise why he is doing them.  At the beginning i did what you did, call, text, firm texts to try to get him to talk, but that didnt work. So gradually over the time, if he started the silence, i left him to it. If it went a week, then i would contact him, just briefly to say hi. If he responded, great,  but however, he knew that i would contact him at some point, that is his control thing ‘winning’ as such. He told me that he knew i would call, he wanted me too, but it was always me calling him. So later on if he did it again, i did not call or text him, a little bit msnipulative but he had to make some effort to reach out once hed gone silent. He got this when i didnt call or text him for two weeks once. He did call  and i dont think there is a timeline, it could be days, weeks or months from what i have read, but it is when they are ready.

When he called back though, he did not want to discuss the relationship. He wanted to know that i would speak to him, at first, then he would want to know that i would be pleasant to him. Once he realised that i would be pleasant and not angry with him for the silent treatment and would not straight away go into relationship issues, the silent treatment lengths got shorter. Now when he does the silent treatment, and it is now usually a day or maybe even two, he usually calls but sometimes i do, and with one or two sentences say what we were not happy about, then leave it at that, for another time, if you can. Tbh, i am fed up of walking on eggshells with him and have got to the point where i dont want to, but i am also at a point where i get him a little, and can say what i want, as long as it is said calmly.

Not sure if that helps. The main thing for you is to try and get on with your life as best you can for now by yourself, with just little reach outs to him, till you get something back, and then when he does, still just keep it calm.

[Yellowpearl]

Take the tension off... .

Thanks for getting back! We can certainly talk at another time. Merry Christmas to you, too.

Yes, it looks like you misunderstood the note - that's OK.  This is positive, Don't expect a response. You don't really want one right now. You don't want him to cement these negative thoughts.upbeat, leave the door open, and ends the exchange on a positive note.  This is mostly about lowering the barrier for a potential future exchange - assuming a best case scenario.



pwBPD are impulsive. You don't want to solidify a down cycle.

Good suggestion. I'm just going to say something simple and positive letting him know he can talk to me as soon as he is ready and hope he has a good start of the new year, using your idea of starting off with "thanks for getting back!"

You're right it's better not to cement these negative thoughts and it doesn't seem it would be a good time to talk to him anytime soon. I just wonder why he is so all over the place and wanting all this space. It almost now feels he didn't tell me anything and kept up with the silence because he wanted me to wait until he was ready so he decided not to say anything. Just speculating. He's done this in the past, during a career transition, or major stressor, but it only lasted few days until he was back.

It's also interesting how just a few weeks ago he said his head was clear, arranges all these plans, but the day after he drops off again. I wonder why he keeps going in and out of these cycles and if he would actually reach out to me again. It's all very disheartening and discouraging. I got 1 hour of sleep last night after reading that message.

It is infuriating and upsetting when you are the one who likes to talk things through in a relationship and your other half just cant. The silent treatment is awful. I think ive read your post that he contacted you about needing space, he answered and told you what he needed. I know its not what you want but he obviously needs space, so give him a little space. You can still do little reach outs.

I feel a bit taken aback and it is frustrating that he couldn't talk to me about it, he just sent one little message that he wants to be left alone and has a lot going on right now, even though for so long I was given silence after HE made plans and talked about dates etc. you are right I'm going to just give him space. But I just worry whether this was permanent and if by "left alone" he means for good or he is just taking some time to figure things out. I'm not sure if I don't hear anything, let's say for a few months, would little reach outs still be okay? This whole silence/taking space for this long is just new to me and it seems anytime I reach him it only makes things worse.

So later on if he did it again, i did not call or text him, a little bit msnipulative but he had to make some effort to reach out once hed gone silent. He got this when i didnt call or text him for two weeks once. He did call  and i dont think there is a timeline, it could be days, weeks or months from what i have read, but it is when they are ready.

Thanks for providing more insight to silent treatment. This is helpful to know and it does seem leaving them be is the best response or saying something very light. I've seen days/weeks as a time line, I just hope in my situation it won't take months. Although I'm sure this is silent treatment anymore. It seems he didn't want me to reach him, set up plans, realized maybe he wasn't ready or something going on with him and couldn't tell him. I don't know how to deal with something like this. It's just a lot!

Not sure if that helps. The main thing for you is to try and get on with your life as best you can for now by yourself, with just little reach outs to him, till you get something back, and then when he does, still just keep it calm.

Thanks for saying so, I really appreciate that. I guess all I can do is stay calm indeed for now. I'm still not sure about little reach outs at any point, it seems like I can't really say anything to him, maybe if ever.

I wish I knew what's going on in his head. Looking back, he does get easily stressed and seems unsettled with career stuff which bothers him. What really gets me is how he keeps doing "im ready lets meet lets hang out, I want to do dates" then literally changes overnight and stops responding" as a repeated pattern for the last few months. Its like hes so sure now he wants to be left alone when he was so sure a few weeks ago he wants to see me. It's difficult to handle. I thought we were finally repairing and talking again.

[Yellowpearl]

I thought about it, I wondered it isn't the worst idea to ask him if he can talk for a few minutes, since getting that message from him? I just have been feeling pretty low, that his message leaves me in limbo. I wonder if I can call and just talk it about for a bit, at least have some say before he goes mia again or have some insight into what is going on, so we just both know what is going on. It feels there so much pent up stuff and not talking without anything clear whatsoever just makes it worse. He isn't really clear in his message if he wants to talk again ever, is he taking space for good and it makes me feel like he isn't considering my feelings at all and im just kind of left like this after weeks of silence. Thought at least I can talk to him before he goes mia again for who knows how long.

I was thinking something like that:
"Thanks for getting back! Can we just talk for a few minutes. I just wanted to clear something up and it'll let me leave you alone." Maybe highlight just for five minutes. I'm getting anxious from all of this uncertainty and this seems the mature way, but because of BPD, I feel like I don't know if I can do this. I'm having doubts too, what if this pushes him away further and makes things worse or he lashes out and becomes stressed on the phone or by text. I guess there is also a risk of not getting a response. Also, if he agrees, how to start the conversation and not JADE, how to help smooth it over a little and get on a page we both know whats going (and I know).

Any input/thoughts?

[once removed]

i would just prefer to be left alone

I thought about it, I wondered it isn't the worst idea to ask him if he can talk for a few minutes

YP, pressing him to talk after he asks to be left alone will almost certainly push him away, and leave you feeling even worse. he is not able to sooth this at this time.

these overwhelming feelings will begin to pass.

your best play here for the best possible outcome is to do something like Skip suggested (i wouldnt change a word). it takes the tension off, and puts the ball in his court. it may catch him off guard, too.

[Yellowpearl]

You are right a call will likely make things worse. I really can’t let my own feelings or anxiety affect what I do here, only to make things worse. I’m now changing my thought on it, it seems like he wouldn’t be able to organize his thoughts well if we were to talk, he could lash out or get stressed like he did before the blow up.

yeah once he’d feel pushed.

I like what Skip said too but what about something like this:

Thanks for getting back! You say you wanna be alone, I hear you and do respect that. You can come talk to me as soon as you feel ready. Hope you have a good start of the new year

To show him I’m understanding he needs space and validate that and maybe by saying “you can come talk to me as soon as you feel ready” would show him it’s up to him to talk to me now and I’m not going to reach out or bother him as I’m wishing him have a good new year (which is far out)

Maybe this would have a good effect and even make him feel open.

[once removed]

he knows he can talk to you when hes ready... .giving him permission to do so might feel condescending.

[Yellowpearl]

i'm not sure how else to word it, to also put the ball in his court, i was thinking he might not know im accepting of his alone time in saying that, im trying to think the gentlest way of letting him know its up to him to reach out.

[once removed]

Thanks for getting back! We can certainly talk at another time. Merry Christmas to you, too.

this is a clear message that you are accepting of his alone time and that the ball is in his court.

[Yellowpearl]

But doesn't it push my own feelings back. Cause " We can certainly talk at another time." It's like im almost cheerful and not hurt about it, cause in reality id rather talk as soon as he is up to it. does it also make sense to say merry christmas too since christmas passed and we already said that to each other

i'm thinking about which message or kind of message would make him feel more understood, and open to talk in the future.

[once removed]

It's like im almost cheerful and not hurt about it

it leads with strength. strength is disarming, its attractive, its confident.

hes not going to want to talk to you out of a sense of obligation to make you feel better about things. and remember, if he expects anything, he may expect you to over pursue.

strength will catch him off guard. it says "okay cool. i can handle that. no biggie". it lowers the tension and pressure.

does it also make sense to say merry christmas too since christmas passed and we already said that to each other

"happy new year" is fine

[2020]

Hello Yellowpearl. I am sending you positive thoughts here today. I thought I'd never get though yesterday myself! About these BPD people in our lives, or temporarily out of our lives, then back in for a bit: I don't think they are like you and I. They appear to almost need to go missing or silent for a bit. I might be wrong or unscientific about this, but I do have 10 years of experience with my current friend, and a 16 year endurance test with my pervious (suspected BPD/bipolar?) partner.

In my frantic quest yesterday to find my partner (I thought I was going to die, or go insane), I spoke to an old landlord of hers nearby. He told me a story. He said that a good friend of his had met my partner many years ago when she lived in the house next door to the landlord. They hit it off and began a relationship. They moved to a major city together. The landlord told me that she was too much for his friend and he couldn't cope with being involved with her. I asked what happened. He said they would go out together and she would just disappear for the night. Sometimes she would walk out the door at home and not come back for days. After it all fell apart she returned to town and saw the landlord. She told him that he didn't really know what his friend was really like... .blah blah. The landlord said that he couldn't figure out what was so bad about his friend as he was a quiet gentle hippie type. She has been doing this for a long time... .

What I was trying to suggest is that maybe they do this because they have to. Remember, they are very different to us. We need to get inside their brains; their way of thinking. They are like emotional burn victims. Tiny little things to you and I mean they need to isolate. This doesn't make it easy for us! I am thinking all we can do about it is try to figure out the best way for us to cope with it. The instant reaction is to take this personally, but is that correct?

I don't know where my partner is. Granted, I did have a less than 10 word email from her yesterday where she said half of  all. I think Skip has good advice. Imagine if we could be in that headspace and feel comfortable within ourselves responding like that? This is a game of chess of sorts. We need to be patient, very patient! And no, I don't like chess!

Good luck!

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

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[Yellowpearl]

I see what you mean, once. I would rather lower pressure and come off confident, strong, chill. I can see how the lighter message would accomplish this.

In the other message, I was thinking "you say you wanna be alone I hear you and do respect that part" would validate him and make him feel understood. Or does it just draw attention to his space/wanting to be alone request too much. "hope you have a good start of the new year", so say none of that, to avoid sounding okay with it or too hopeful?

The only other thing with "we can certainly talk at another time" vs "you can come talk to me when you're ready is" the 2nd one puts it in his court and acknowledges its totally up to him, the first one, i wonder if he would expect me to overpursue or start worrying about me reaching out again.Though the first one is so confident... .

[Skip]

the 2nd one puts it in his court and acknowledges its totally up to him... .

So you block your ability to send another PM in a couple of weeks - do you want to do that?

The fist is ambiguous in the matter or who and what.

[2020]

I think the first one, "we can certainly talk at another time" doesn't commit to which of you will make contact first, so it puts you in a better position, yes? The other one suggests you are going to wait for him to contact you. Are you prepared to do that or certain that is how it will be? The first one is more vague. These BPD people take us by our word. They don't like us acting different to what we say. They see it as betrayal!  Try and feel comforatble within yourself with what has been suggested. Maybe see this as an experiment? What do you think?

Ha! I see another post has happened suggesting similar... .

[Yellowpearl]

Skip, good catch, I didn't even realize that if I say the 2nd one wouldn't really give me the option to reach out to him, in case I wanted to do that in a month or weeks later.

2020, thanks for your input and insight BPD mindset. I'd been feeling very lost and your post gave me some clear perspective. The lighter/shorter one Skip mentions, also allows him to respond nicely "thanks happy new year" which could give either of us an opening to talk later. You make such good points about how people with BPD, (don't seem to like us these days!), but may almost need to isolate and that alone time to sort their thoughts and it may not be anything we can understand. I am thinking his mind must be very chaotic right now, in your situation too, it must be a scary place to be, and if we keep poking, the more they want to run and flee. You are right, its better to be extra patient when they are looking around for to be on their own. I hope your situation improves as well, i'm glad you at least heard from her, maybe we are being tested, maybe its a game of chess, and we just need to be relaxed within ourselves and how we speak to them.

Once is right too. I appreciate all of your guy's insight. I'd rather have the option for both of us to reach out. the lighter one seems best, ill update you guys what happens.

[Purplex]

Hi yellowpearl, regardless of what option you choose I would like to suggest something in addition. This might be way too much, but maybe you could add a sentence that expresses your feelings and reminds him of good times you had together? Something along the line of “I really miss doing xyz with you” or “I just remembered that day when *positive thing* happened”. Without any implications or requests. I think he might feel very pressured by your need to talk asap and this might help to get back on a positive emotional level to create a stable basis for serious conversation at a later time. What do you think?

[Yellowpearl]

Hey Purplex, thanks for the suggestion, and I agree he probably feels very pressured. i'd been thinking sending something very light or a fond memory the other week but had gone with something else instead. That could be something I can send this time, maybe it would help build a base to talk more serious later indeed. I hope it wouldn't be too much if I add this:

Thanks for getting back! We can certainly talk at another time. I just remembered when we would send each other goofy gifs around this time last year and that made me smile. Happy new year

does that sound OK? or I wonder if it makes me too vulnerable? Or maybe just add "hope things get better" (but may add negative connotation to his negative thinking) not sure

[Yellowpearl]

or maybe this "I just remembered when we would send each other goofy gifs around this time last year and that made me smile." could be an opening for weeks later if i contact him myself

not sure, im between those two, the super short light one, or the one above with the memory added.

[Purplex]

Thanks for getting back! We can certainly talk at another time. I just remembered when we would send each other goofy gifs around this time last year and that made me smile. Happy new year

This sounds great to me! It hints towards how much you care about him, it's sincere but not too heavy on emotions and doesn't apply any pressure. I would leave out the 'hope things get better' part so that he doesn't feel obliged to react in a certain way. Of course it's still possible that he keeps standoffish or doesn't answer at all. So be prepared for that. But I bet that this is gonna make him smile as well!

[Purplex]

or maybe this "I just remembered when we would send each other goofy gifs around this time last year and that made me smile." could be an opening for weeks later if i contact him myself

not sure, im between those two, the super short light one, or the one above with the memory added.

I don't think it's neccessary to hold back. Yes, it makes you vulnerable to an extend, but one of you has to take the first step and he is most likely not the right candidate for that. And if you need an opening for another time I bet there are many other positive memories you can refer to

[Yellowpearl]

Purplex, I see your point, maybe since things are rather tense right now, the good memory would help mend the fences a little more so it wouldn't be so so up in the air or difficult in talking to each other another time.

I do like the idea of him a lot of smiling at the thought of something fun/light. I just need to prepare myself if I send this one, and he doesn't reply since it is a giving a little more!

I hope this is the right one! i'm just nervous to send. It can just be hard to be emotionally vulnerable when you are hurting!

[once removed]

In the other message, I was thinking "you say you wanna be alone I hear you and do respect that part" would validate him and make him feel understood.

if we arent careful, validation can be used in ways that another person might find condescending.

in this case, its redundant, where an effective "hey thats cool, we can talk later" does communicate you hear him and show that you respect it.

[Yellowpearl]

Good point, once. Yeah, it's redundant since just by responding i'm good with it is enough to show i respect it. What about adding the light fun memory as a last sentence? Like the one i thought of above.

[once removed]

im not sure it hurts anything, but i suspect youre hoping for a response.

i think the original message communicates youre not expecting a response.

[Yellowpearl]

Would  be nice to get a response, but was hoping it doesn't say I expect one, but improves the situation a bit, in mentioning a good moment.

I'm torn. The first one is safer, yet the second one could help send a positive vibe to him and disarm him too.

[2020]

I just think perhaps you ought to stick to the script. I'm pretty bad at this myself. I tear my insides apart with the sick feeling of being amputated from my partner's life. Hard as it is I think we need to change how we act. If we change one side of the equation, then the other side will counter balance. I just know what I have been doing for years, although my intentions might have been noble, it hasn't really worked. Why not just go with the short ambiguous message suggested and see what happens? You can always send another one with a fond memory at a later date. What do you think? Can you do that? Just be cool. I know it is not easy!

[Yellowpearl]

You're right though. There comes a point you just have to stick with it and try a new way. I'm so used to wanting to show my insides so he knows how i'm feeling too, and it hasn't always gotten me much results. Least this short, light one, leaves things open. Low pressure as possible may be the best approach. if we are chill, low key, maybe that will rub off on them too. I do really like Purplex's suggestion so much, but i'm feeling this situation being so tense, I don't want to make a mistake but will save that suggestion for another time reaching out! Be cool - something new for me, but ill go ahead, give it a shot, and hope for the best.

Ill just got with the light one. if he never replies i don't feel as bad, and  he wont feel he is pressured to reply right away either.

[2020]

Yes. If I sent a more revealing-my-heart one, and I didn't get a response, I'd be thinking I blew it. I just know with myself, I have made some huge mistakes with how I approached my current relationship and its issues. I didn't even know about this Borderline stuff until a few months ago. We cannot change them, or anyone for that matter. I get the impression many of us are 'fixers' here and rescuers. These people can be very volatile. I'm thinking it is like disarming a bomb. Don't move too quick or cut the wrong wire.

Frustrating as it is, we may need to act in ways which we are not used to to get a result we want further down the track. This is a bit of a side track... .Someone once said to me that if you have a good idea in the UK and tell people, they will say, "That's not a good idea. Who would want that?" (I was born in the UK!). In the US, if you tell people your idea, they will say, "Great idea!" even if it is not such a good idea. (Probably a bit stereotypical!) In Japan if you have a good idea, you tell people in such a way that they will be telling you what your good idea is!  

What I am trying to say is I think we need to be tactical. These BPD folk are very different people to us. They are emotionally tuned differently. Perhaps as 'fixers', that is why we are so attracted by them?

EDIT: Sorry! I was just thinking the bomb thing I wrote is the eggshells all over again. It's a long road we are all on.

[Yellowpearl]

Well I sent it, nothing so far, but it's only been 12 minutes (not that i'm keeping track or anything).

I feel content with it. Hopefully it does something or gets me somewhere. Just trying not to expect anything so soon. I also get the impression many of us are fixers too, since they are like wild horses that cannot be tamed so easily, that seems part of why the attraction is there. I know what you mean, 2020, we spend a great deal wanting to talk about issues that come up, address things with them, make them feel better, and trying to find the right words. Maybe the better approach with the borderline is really a mix between being gentle, patient and non reactive without expressing too much emotion while waiting for them to come out of their bad cycles and simmer down. What I struggle with is identifying a bad cycle. Sometimes it seems they will just go silent, out of the blue when the previous day, they were in an elevated, happy mood. I think we need to learn to adapt to the unpredictability and impulsiveness. I'm still learning how but I can clearly see startling them when their in their caves might release a fire breathing dragon or a harder silence.

I like your UK, Japan, US example. You have to express yourself in a specific way to get a certain result from the targeted audience. In this case BPD persons. We need to be tactical, I agree. If we poke at a sleeping bear, we get buried.

It's tough though, it took so much out of me to deal with this mess. What bothers me is he didn't reply multiple times in the month! I felt so mad at him as sad as I felt! I was feeling like this is outright neglect and it's really hard to fathom staying cool in such a situation when you wonder if someone is deliberately hurting you (silence does this). He knows he was MIA and said that in his message. I guess I don't get how they justify this sort of thing and how can we feel validated and understand their perspective without feeling so betrayed. I still do and hope for this message cooling the waters but i'm feeling quite like i'm walking around with a broken leg. Maybe, it really is thinking of them as emotional burn victims. Sometimes I get worried, is this a trauma bond or something and hes not even supposed to come back because now i'm getting "damaged'. This all can be so discouraging.

Yet I still hope for a response and resolving this. Maybe if I continue to change how I act, and control my end more diligently, it wouldn't hit me hard like this and can be a healthy relationship eventually. I just hope so.

[once removed]

we arent always so different.

a lot of pwBPD are fixers and highly sensitive people. a lot of us are, too.

both bring similar baggage, attachment styles, coping mechanisms, to the table. its in finding ours, and cleaning up our side of the street that we can direct the relationship into healthier territory.

[Yellowpearl]

That makes sense. It’s jaw dropping when you realize how much you may have contributed to conflict with a pwBPD. i think it takes a lot of self reflection and also understanding of the BPD, not taking things so personally and being able to say we can improve too. We may be at fault too .