Anger management?

[Ozzie101]

So, last week, my uBPDh started anger management. It was his idea, which I fully supported, as he knows his anger has been a problem for his entire life. As I said, I've been supportive but skeptical. He's tried talk therapy before MANY times (before we were together) and it's never lasted long. He doesn't like to answer a lot of questions or talk about himself and he feels like it's a waste of time and money. He's also told me he thinks psychologists are basically scam artists who get people dependent on them so they can get more money. The last therapist he saw, he only went once and the therapist told him it didn't seem like he really needed any help. I'm sure H came across as fully reasonable, rational and intelligent. He tends to present things as "My wife's family is a problem and I don't know how to deal with them." That's true, but it's not fully accurate.

Anyway, his current psychiatrist referred him to this new therapist for specific anger management sessions, at H's request, and after last week's appointment, H was pretty upbeat. Said she'd told him "Looks like you'll be a challenge!" (which pleased him) and he said she'd gotten some things out of him. He's hopeful it can help. But at the same time, he was uncertain about it because he knows his track record. He said he likes her, but he's felt this way about therapy before and always quits.

Yesterday, he started talking about it again, saying he's not sure it's going to work, though he'll continue to try for now.

We did uncover something that raised a red flag for me. I was talking about how there are many different methods of anger management and that different things work for different people, etc. At one point he told me that the way he viewed it, the point of therapy was to learn how to eliminate the triggers from your life. "But that's not the way it works?" he asked.

I told him, no, it's not about eliminating triggers. That's impossible to do. You can eliminate some, but there will always be more. The point of therapy is to retrain yourself and learn coping tools so you know how to handle the triggers and how to respond in better ways. He got pretty quiet after that, but said that made sense. I think it disappointed him and now he's seeing it's not just about working on other people and the environment but about working on himself.

He asked me to come with him to his next appointment since, as he told me, he doesn't always say things the right way or give an accurate picture of things. I've been going to all his psychiatric appointments, too, though I don't have a whole lot to contribute. I said of course I'd go.

But now I'm not sure what to do. I don't think I can be completely honest -- that when he gets angry, he's verbally, emotionally and (while he's never exactly laid a hand on me) physically abusive. That he becomes a monster. That I strongly suspect he has BPD. I've never really successfully discussed those things with him and can't spring them on him in a therapy setting. At the same time, if I don't give a full picture, can the therapist really know what she's dealing with?

Anyone else been in this situation?

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[once removed]

this is a difficult spot to be in... .on one hand, the fact that hes taken the initiative to get into anger management, discuss it, stick with it for a bit, and wants to involve you in those steps is all ideal.

on the other, i can see things going badly at such a meeting, at least right now.

are you committed to going to the next appointment? im wondering what might happen if you postponed your attendance, gave him and his therapist some time to form their relationship and make progress, but i can see that going badly too.

[Ozzie101]

I told him I would go so, yes, I'm committed for now and think I'd better go through with it. I can see things going badly either way. Kind of like walking in a minefield.

[once removed]

i think itd be in everyones best interest to primarily listen... .if youre asked questions, id be honest, but stick to things like "yes or no", not elaborate too much.

what do you think?

[Ozzie101]

That's a good plan. I'll just go in and see how things go and avoid giving too much information. Honesty without over-sharing.

[Ozzie101]

The appointment got moved to tonight and, luckily for me, I had an appointment with my therapist so I was able to bring it up with her. She, too, suggested postponing going but when I said I'd told him I would go, she agreed I'd better go through with it. Backing out could be a big trigger.

She agreed it's a tricky situation and gave a couple of options:

1) (Just like your recommendation, once) Go, read the room and be honest without saying too much.

2) Contact the therapist privately either before or after and let her know that I wouldn't be able to be completely honest in the session because it's a DV situation. My T said that it could help his T to have a fuller picture -- though, she cautioned, I might not be believed.

Anyway, my T offered to call his at some point if the sessions continue (I'd have to sign a release to allow her to do it) to fill her in on what we've discussed. Again, it might not make a difference but she said she always welcomes getting a fuller picture of what's going on with her clients to better assess treatment. I couldn't remember his T's name but my T might know her.

She did say, though, that she's skeptical about his therapy working. His track record and his statements about therapy (it's about getting rid of triggers and training the people around you to not trigger you -- a belief he reiterated during a mild episode last night) indicate he has very unreasonable expectations, which typically causes clients to get frustrated and give up. Also, if he's not fully honest and the T doesn't really know fully what's going on, it's unlikely she'll be able to choose a treatment plan that will be effective. She said I shouldn't give up on hope, but it's best to be prepared.

[once removed]

i think thats good, and sober advice from your therapist.

you had the appointment, right? how did it go? have you contacted his therapist privately?

[Ozzie101]

Things went fine, for the most part. I had to be very guarded and careful and felt like I was in a minefield, unsure how he would take whatever I said. She asked how I felt when he got angry. I hedged a bit, said I felt "alarmed." She asked if I felt scared and I admitted that sometimes I did. I couldn't be fully honest about what has happened in some of his angry outbursts because it just didn't feel safe to do so.

It seems like what he's told her so far focuses on things like people at work frustrating him or on his discomfort with my family get-togethers. I know it all goes well-beyond that but I didn't feel comfortable saying so.

He also said that his anger isn't directed at me. His therapist suggested to both of us that even if he feels it's not, I may sometimes feel like it is. I agreed. But I didn't say that sometimes, yes, it is directed at me. I'm not sure how his getting in my face and screaming, or saying things like "I hate you right now" or "I really feel like hitting you" or "This is all your fault" or threatening to break a treasured family heirloom and so on isn't directed at me. Maybe he really does feel like it isn't. I'm aware that sometimes when he's angry, he's really angry about something else, just twists it around to focus on me since I'm there and an easy target. For instance, he was annoyed with his parents for not telling him earlier about a change in their travel plans (plans that did not impact his life at all) but he turned it into an attack on me about my handling of a completely different situation. He'll start off angry about one thing, then go off on a tangent about something I've done in the past and continue in that vein for hours. But, yes, sometimes it's actually something I have or haven't done.

She told him about a couple of books she wants him to look into that they might use for his therapy. One's a workbook about anger management for men and the other is about mindfulness.

I haven't contacted her privately. Still weighing that. I just don't want to risk her giving it away since that would created a HUGE problem.

[Ozzie101]

Once again, something I thought went OK over all ended up not being OK.

Last night, H got very worked up -- about something completely unrelated to his anger management therapy. He's trying to work out his Spring Break trip with his S8 and the original plan was to work in a visit to his bio parents. Well, they didn't respond to a text in a way that he liked. (He's planning to fly and was asking about dates. They suggested -- why not drive and spend a couple of days with us? He hates driving.) I asked, "Do they know you want to fly, not drive? Did you let them know that?"

I wasn't trying to criticize or tell him what to do. He seemed to be very annoyed and since I wasn't part of the text discussion I was trying to find out what was said and what was going on. Big mistake, I guess.

He went into a long diatribe about how I'm lecturing him on how to talk to his parents when I can't be direct or confront them on things myself. So, I'm a hypocrite. Threw in how awful the family beach trip was a couple of years ago (something he brings up frequently), how I never support him or do what he suggests, how my family isn't perfect, how he's glad we've had some tragedy (my uncle killed himself last year), how I'm the word and food police. Lots of not making sense with pretzel logic.

In the midst of this, he brought up the therapy session and said I'd spent the hour bashing him and knocking him down, while being so perfect and self-righteous. Accused me of talking the whole time. I apologized and said I would also be hurt if I felt like someone had done that to me. Said the therapist had asked me a lot of questions to get my viewpoint and I answered as best I could. He said he's never taking me back there. He also said he's going to change therapists since this one isn't cutting it and he's not seeing any progress (after 2 sessions).

On the plus side, after going on for about 45 minutes, he stopped, asked "Wait. What does any of this have to do with Spring Break?" Then apologized for going off the rails and went on with the evening. First time that's happened.

But I'm definitely seeing a pattern. Anytime anything annoys, worries or upsets him, he starts lashing out at me and finds some link (no matter how tenuous) to me, things I've done or haven't done, my family, etc., and rages about that. I see now that he's transferring and I try to be understanding, to keep it from bothering me. But it's very difficult to take sometimes.

[once removed]

what did you say/do during all this?

[Ozzie101]

I didn't handle it perfectly, to be sure. Mostly, I just sat and listened. Gave short, non-committal answers when one was expected or required.

As I said, I told him that if I felt like someone had attacked me in a therapy session, I would feel angry and hurt, too. I told him I had tried to answer the therapist's questions and I was sorry that had upset him.

When he brought up my uncle's suicide, I did feel a flash of anger. I went very cold and just said, "I'm going to stop you right there. That is something we're NOT going to talk about." He apologized for that one later on, said he hadn't meant it the way it had come across. He then brought up his father's suicide and how devastating that was. Actually, looking back, it was sort of a non-apology. He excused himself and then reminded me of how he'd been hurt and how I couldn't understand that pain.

It surprised me when he snapped out of it on his own. I don't know, though, if it was a sign of progress or more manipulation on his part. My DV counselor thinks a lot of it is manipulation.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure he'll quit anger management very soon. His expectations are unrealistic, his attitude is wrong and it's obvious he's laying the groundwork to quit. He might have even asked me to go along as a prep for that -- and a way to have a scapegoat for it not working out.

[Radcliff]

That's great that he snapped out of it.  Did you give him validation for that?

I understand why you're skeptical about whether he will drop out of therapy for the several reasons you've mentioned.  Have you validated that he's going to therapy?  You can't say you like the therapist or she's good since he'll disagree, but if you can can provide any validation for his efforts it could be helpful.  I totally understand why you think that he may be setting you up as a scapegoat, but I find that when I start to get caught up thinking about my pwBPD's potential motivations, it just spins up my emotions and makes me less effective.

It sounded by his therapist's comment that he may scare you even when he doesn't intend to that she may "get it" and was trying to handle him gently.  Signing a release so your therapist can talk to his could be a very good idea.  Your therapist may be able to communicate information about you to his therapist professional-to-professional and get some information to assess things on his side that could help you.

RC

[Ozzie101]

After he snapped out of it, I basically acted like nothing had happened. We watched tv on the couch, I slipped my arm through his, laughed at his jokes.

I do need to watch reading too much into things. He does that to me and is almost always wrong.

Anyway, I've been careful but have encouraged the therapy. I don't want to go too far because then it becomes me forcing him into it and pushing. But I have encouraged him to give it more time and to be honest with her about his needs and frustrations. They haven't really gotten into tools yet.

[Radcliff]

I wonder if you could be super subtle and reward him without him knowing that you're doing it.  A nice meal or a back rub after his anger management session, without mentioning a connection.  Positive reinforcement is very powerful, even if (perhaps especially if) it's unspoken.

What day of the week is anger management?  One week at a time.  Keep us posted.

RC