DD 90 day residential treatment almost over...

[Momslove]

DD dome March 1st with her residential treatment. 90 days, thousands of dollars, and not sure I see a difference.
She was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, dependent personality disorder, ADHD, persistent depressive disorder and general anxiety disorder.
We have tried family counseling. Not seeming to help. She beings up how awful I was in certain time ( she was the abusive one to our family) and how I will never understand her.
We get no where. I try to validate and it’s nit good enough because she wants an apology... .she put us through hell and back. I feel like I am jumping through hoops constantly, it’s never enough, I am feeling discouraged today.
It seems like she is nicer to people that aren’t nice to her, thinking I am too nice and I need to say I just can’t listen to anymore of her ugliness.
How long will all her diagnosis be an excuse for abuse to others. I understand her perceptions are skewed,  it just having a hard time.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Only Human]

Hi Momslove,

I'm glad you've returned for support before your DD completes her 90 days at RTC. I'm so sorry to hear that you're not sure you see a difference - you DD is not accepting of your validation, just wants an apology. Does she say what she wants an apology for?

~ OH

[wendydarling]

Hi Momslove

I too am glad you're here for support ahead of your DD's return.  I can understand you feel discouraged today, you've clearly worked very hard so to feel like you're getting no where is frustrating. Hang in there! It certainly sounds like your DD is fixated on the apology.

You say you are not sure you see a difference in your DD following 90 days in treatment. I'm wondering what kind of treatments are covered at the RTC? And what other BPD symptoms/behaviours is your DD suffering apart from the verbal abuse.

Your DD sounds like she's engaging - family therapy, even though you're stuck right now, she's trying? Is she engaging at RTC?

Momslove, I have had to remind myself how complex this is and there are many 'barriers/walls', they have to jump through treatment. In hindsight I've seen my DD focus on one thing at a time, otherwise it's overwhelming, she works at her pace, my middle name is patience.

You deserve a break through with your DD, they do come and this often involves us changing our approach, ok yet again, collective sigh parents  

WDx

[Witsnd]

Hello Momslove, I read your post and I can relate to you 100%. My DD is in treatment right now also. I have apologized to my DD many times over and over. For things that did happen , that were unfair, but also, for things I had no control of. It just doesn’t work. She is like a broken record. Same complaints, same made up embelessed stories. She lives in a skewed reality , and i feel her goal is to destroy me. My DD didn’t show symptoms of BPD until she started doing drugs 10 years ago and has only gotten worse as the years have gone by. I did notice some symptoms when she was a child of anxiety disorder and did get her help. I did everything i could to help her. I am raising her children and I have finally had to distance myself from her. for me, it became life or death because I was an empty shell and emotionally bankrupt.Her Ex Hb is no different. I have given my all to help her. I have finally created boundaries and I have no guilt in doing so anymore. It took years, but it works. How old is your DD? 

[livednlearned]

I can imagine how deeply disappointing it must be to have a BPD loved one go through intensive treatment only to see so little change.

I try to validate and it’s nit good enough because she wants an apology... .she put us through hell and back. I feel like I am jumping through hoops constantly, it’s never enough

Validation is more about creating a validating environment -- if you are feeling attacked and abused and overwhelmed it will be difficult to create that environment. For there to be validation, there must be empathy and that has to begin with compassion for yourself first.

You have been through hell and back and nothing is good enough which is a challenging place from which to validate someone who is exceptional at detecting emotional subtext. At the same time, she cannot figure out how to connect with others or communicate her feelings, thoughts, and needs in an effective way. 

As for apologies, how about something like, "It must be awful that ________. That was then and this is now. What are we going to do about this situation that we're in right now?"

About being nicer to people who are not nice  -- I wonder if it's boundaries that she responds positively too. Sometimes they can appear to be one and the same.

[Momslove]

Thank you for your responses... .I was trying to figure out how to reply. At age 13, she started getting sexual and lieing to us. We took her to a restaurant and said how much we loved her and wanted to provide guard rails. It went well, but she didn’t like that we checked in phones at night. She was lieing to us a good bit back in those days as well. We couldn’t leave her at home with other kids as she was a bully and would be violent to get her way. We also had got her counseling and at that time the counselor stated she was the worst case of borderline she had seen, but too young to diagnose. I needed to get her treatment. Anyway, she had hardly a relationship with her father Until we set our boundaries, than her hate for him turned to me. I told her father she needed help per the Psychologist, he swarmed in and gave her what she wanted. She left in an ugly way and never returned to our house until age 16 when her dad put her things outside their house in garbage bags. He has not talked to her since.  
Anyway, when she went to her dads at age 13 when I had custody and wouldn’t return, at my time to pick her and her brother up, she wouldn’t come and was quite verbally abusive. Our lawyer told us to calmly call the cops to note I was there to pick her up and she would not come. This was so her dad could not say I abandoned her... .Just for our protection as my x was not so loving or nice... .he was also said to be on axis 2 personality disorder years prior.
So the apology Is for having the cops come and state she would not leave. We had to for our Legal protections. I have validated her feeling over and over again.
 Later she bashed me on social media on a regular basis while at her dads. All kids but her lived with my husband and I. It was a betrayal that I can’t explain, and I forgave her, took her back in at 16, and it’s never been easy. She was stable for about a year before going back to her old ways.

We have had a hard time with her treatment. The counselor allows her to divert the session to one thing. I think it’s to take things off her from having responsibility. I am to blame for everything.
I think after today, I am about done. I don’t think I can continue to take her verbal abuse and flip flopping anymore.
Last week she stayed at our house for 1 night from her transitional house. While we were gone her and her friend were vaping in our den(juul) who knows... .anyway. My sons said she was as they were concerned, she is dual diagnosis.
When I asked her about it, she lied and said she didn’t. She is known for lieing, my son both said she was. Later she admitted to it kinda and turned it back on me saying I don’t trust her and never will. Mind you she has lied multiple times since being in treatment, asked me to lie to her counselor, I said no, and said she forges her signatures that she went to NA meetings... .so, yes I have a hard time with trust. In all this, her counselors say she is doing great. Although they don’t feel she is ready for a car because they suspect she may relapse. She is out in 3 weeks... .
when I talk to them about her behavior, I swear they think I am making it up. She is an expert snow artist. This isn’t her first rodeo in treatment and counseling. At first she can hide it until any conflict arises than the ugliness shows.

Anyway back to tonight... .she asked me if I talked to her counselor. I said no, she said T says that I don’t ever need to go home because your invalidating in family therapy and I need to stay at transitional housing because of you until I am ready to Find a home for myself.

That was the last straw... .we have paid over 15k in last 3 months, 2100 each month for transitional hoisting, weekly allowance of a $100 for her, she is in class 3 hours, she isn’t doing any of her community service or for a job... .and she just puts  me down all the time like I am the crap on her soles and I just can’t hardly take it anymore. I know she is ill, but so very toxic, it’s impacting me. It took me years to get help and make changes after divorcing my abusive x. I don’t want to be in toxic relationships.
I know it’s validate validate validate, but I have tried that... .and she just goes after more blood.
Her dad will not even speak to her and she so wants a relationship with him. I have always been there and she is so abusive. It’s not just me, she is abusive in all relationships where she is not the center of attention and getting what she wants.
I am sure I sound so unloving and ranting, but I feel the more you give the more she takes.

[Momslove]

One last thing, We were not ready for her to live at the house. The therapist had said they thought it was best for her to be in transitional housing to keep her from relapsing. DD said last weekend she wanted to come home, T was not in charge once she graduated and she could leave... .
my reaction was to her stAting she could leVe her because I was so invalidating in fAmily therapy... .that is so far from the truth... .just more spins... .
She will be so ugly, call me shortly after and ask how much money in on her card?
Diagnosed with borderline, dependent personality disorder traits, persistent depressive disorder, general anxiety, adhd?

[Only Human]

Hi Momslove 

I'm glad you figured out how to reply and that you gave some background information. It really sounds like you've been through so much with your DD, I can see why you'd be reluctant to invite her back into your home. It seems that she doesn't want to come live with you so you both agree on that, right? Is there a cost for transitional housing?

Thanks, also, for sharing the specifics of what she wants an apology for, calling the police that day when she wouldn't come with you for your parenting time. What you did was reasonable and her adolescent brain couldn't see that - I also called the police on my DD when she was 14, the incident is part of her arsenal when she's painted me black. There is nothing to apologize for here, so I say let it go, you don't want to validate the invalid.

When she is discharged, where will she go? Is that what you're trying to figure out?

~ OH

[Momslove]

When she is discharged she can stay at hope homes at 2100 a month plus counseling fees etc... .we can only afford this for so much longer. She has a dui and another charge for drinking I. Public. She has legal court dates coming up and that will be more cost.
We have paid for her treatment, but all her hospital bills will hit collections and she will have to deal with that.
She has no money, all she had was used to pay for the lawyer and she still owes more.
Treatment wants her to go out with friends, etc... say $100 a week for food... .we are at home cutting our expensesz
She demand her CAR, tells me she will live at hope homes until she can move out on her own, etc... .because I am toxic... .
a normal person would never think to treat us this way and demand money, etc. we have gone over and beyond and read books etc... .and the blame, the nastiness, it just seems to get worse. She is doing good to counselors because they are listening to her complain. It’s nit reality...

[Mjobpd]

May I ask how old your daughter is? My daughter is 18 next month and I have no idea where she can go. I feel like I can’t ask a relative if she’s not even safe to come home! No PHP in our area. She’s doing online courses so she could actually finish those anywhere to graduate.

[Momslove]

She is at skyland, but in her case, the validation is not working. I believe she has too many narcissistic traits... .
I spoke with a friend, the lies and twisted stories. If you could get 5 people that have listened to get and experienced her, I believe everyone would see their pawns in her game.
She plays victim of one person to get attention from others. Her stories don’t align. It is really really sick and sad. And she doesn’t see her part.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Mjobpd]

Liying that grows into stealing which are things I cannot stand. Ofcourse her big issue is that I don’t believe her. Go figure?

[Momslove]

My daughter lies, takes my clothing as if its hers without asking, she is just entitled.

[Turkish]

That's a lot of money to spend on an adult, even if she is your child. It sounds like nothing has changed. 

You said that validation isn't working. Can you give an example or two?

If you cut off the money,  what are your thoughts about how it would go forward? You've already provided so much in that regard. 

[Momslove]

We go to family therapy or we did at 268 a pop. It seems my dd seems to go back to an event and her perception is awfully skewed. I think it’s a diversion technique not to take responsibility for anything else. Anyway, I will say I understand that could have upset you to have the police there. Then she will fly into something else. The counselor says what would make you feel heard, she yells an apology!
What we had to do was not in the wrong at all... .I am not apologizing for a consequence to her actions... .

[Turkish]

So the counselor validated,  and DD threw down, so to speak.  If you apologized, do you think anything would change?