First, he's crafted a new "story;" second, I lost it so much I scared myself

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

It's been a roller coaster several weeks, let me tell you. First, in the last two weeks, my uBPDh has developed a whole new story about me. This story is that I look down on him because I think he is "low class." He's re framed my middle class, suburban childhood as some sort of beaugois existence. Granted, there were some times in his childhood where he had it rough, living with a single mom who was struggling to raise two kids. However, my family struggled as well. My parents were small business owners in the service industry. We stretched and saved and got by. There were times when things were better, and times when things were worse - as it is with many folks. I started working at 16 to start paying for things I wanted. I bought my first car. Nothing was handed to me. But, for some reason, he has taken to painting me as an elitist when I ask him to be more considerate in the way he says things.

For example, he rarely ever asks me to do things, he tells me to do them, or implies they need to be done and I should do them. For example, he'll say, "You can empty the dishwasher now." I can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's a very condescending, paternalistic way of dealing with me, like he has to order me to do it or else he thinks I won't do it on my own. I told him it bothered me and said I'd respond much better to him asking me to do things instead of telling me to do them, and he blew up. He saw it as me thinking he was uncouth and uncultured and not good enough, which had nothing to do with what I was asking of him. I grew up in a household where, for the most part (at least when I was older - not a small child), we asked each other to do things. "Could you put your dish in the dishwasher please?" or "Please pick up your socks." I find it rude to order people with reasoning faculties around. Also, as we know, BPDs tend to be controlling, so it feels controlling when he does it. He doesn't care what else I'm doing at the time, he just starts piling on "orders."

That time, I could not get him to concede. He stood firm in that he wasn't going to be asked to do things differently here. He has never been like that. He usually compromises at the very least. I dropped it because I wasn't getting anywhere.

He's also taken to berating and lecturing me more often for making small mistakes. For example, he was working on the car in the garage and wanted me to come get him when it was 4PM so that we could go to the store. I ran out to the detached garage at six minutes to the hour. I'd intended to pop my head in and announce the six minute mark, but when I popped my head in, he was raging out over something in the garage and kept talking to me. Then, he yelled at me for keeping the door open and letting cold air into the garage. I went inside the garage and closed the door behind me, saying I had just wanted to pop my head in for a second, but he kept yelling at me, going on and on and on. He kept saying I had no common sense, that I was stupid, etc. I ran inside, and, by force of habit, locked the door from the inside behind me. He came in after me and was stopped by the locked door, which enraged him even more. He kicked our outdoor garbage can. He came inside, raging and going on and on and on.

At this time, I managed to remain calm and eventually the lecturing and rage subsided. But I explained to him afterward that I had an ex who used to lecture me like that and treat me like a piece of poo under his shoe. He said he understood and it was just his upbringing, that his mother used to lecture him and scream at him like that. I said, "Well, it didn't feel good to you as a kid, did it?" He said, "No." I said, "Well, then think about that when you're doing it to other people."

Yesterday, we got into another argument where he thought I was oversharing information in a professional group on social media by asking about getting passed over for a promotion. He again began lecturing and calling me stupid and contemptible. He ground and ground into me. I snapped. I yelled at him, saying he made me feel lower than poop and like I just wanted to die. I screamed that if he really thought I was dumb, he should just leave. My rage was coming out of me like a hurricane. I was yelling and sobbing and sobbing and shaking, and I kept repeating out loud that I was sorry and that I was obviously too dumb to live. I hit myself. It was horrifying, a total and utter breakdown of the self. I felt like nothing. Of course, then he tried to calm ME down and be all nice-y nice. There was still some part of him that thought his behavior was normal and that I was some overly sensitive freak. When he does the lecturing and berating, I can't handle it. Because, it does not matter whether I say that I'm sorry for doing something, he just keeps going on and on and on.

He apologized over and over, as he always does, and said he wouldn't do it again (until the next time, right?) but what happened scared me a lot. When I was with my ex 17 years ago, I remember feeling low, but just taking it because I didn't know any better. I just believed what he said. This feels different. I feel low, but I feel rage at being made to feel that way. All stuff to discuss with my therapist, for sure, but I'm still processing it. Am I being driven nuts by this guy? What is happening?

[WitzEndWife]

It's been a roller coaster several weeks, let me tell you. First, in the last two weeks, my uBPDh has developed a whole new story about me. This story is that I look down on him because I think he is "low class." He's re framed my middle class, suburban childhood as some sort of beaugois existence. Granted, there were some times in his childhood where he had it rough, living with a single mom who was struggling to raise two kids. However, my family struggled as well. My parents were small business owners in the service industry. We stretched and saved and got by. There were times when things were better, and times when things were worse - as it is with many folks. I started working at 16 to start paying for things I wanted. I bought my first car. Nothing was handed to me. But, for some reason, he has taken to painting me as an elitist when I ask him to be more considerate in the way he says things.

For example, he rarely ever asks me to do things, he tells me to do them, or implies they need to be done and I should do them. For example, he'll say, "You can empty the dishwasher now." I can't put my finger on it exactly, but it's a very condescending, paternalistic way of dealing with me, like he has to order me to do it or else he thinks I won't do it on my own. I told him it bothered me and said I'd respond much better to him asking me to do things instead of telling me to do them, and he blew up. He saw it as me thinking he was uncouth and uncultured and not good enough, which had nothing to do with what I was asking of him. I grew up in a household where, for the most part (at least when I was older - not a small child), we asked each other to do things. "Could you put your dish in the dishwasher please?" or "Please pick up your socks." I find it rude to order people with reasoning faculties around. Also, as we know, BPDs tend to be controlling, so it feels controlling when he does it. He doesn't care what else I'm doing at the time, he just starts piling on "orders."

That time, I could not get him to concede. He stood firm in that he wasn't going to be asked to do things differently here. He has never been like that. He usually compromises at the very least. I dropped it because I wasn't getting anywhere.

He's also taken to berating and lecturing me more often for making small mistakes. For example, he was working on the car in the garage and wanted me to come get him when it was 4PM so that we could go to the store. I ran out to the detached garage at six minutes to the hour. I'd intended to pop my head in and announce the six minute mark, but when I popped my head in, he was raging out over something in the garage and kept talking to me. Then, he yelled at me for keeping the door open and letting cold air into the garage. I went inside the garage and closed the door behind me, saying I had just wanted to pop my head in for a second, but he kept yelling at me, going on and on and on. He kept saying I had no common sense, that I was stupid, etc. I ran inside, and, by force of habit, locked the door from the inside behind me. He came in after me and was stopped by the locked door, which enraged him even more. He kicked our outdoor garbage can. He came inside, raging and going on and on and on.

At this time, I managed to remain calm and eventually the lecturing and rage subsided. But I explained to him afterward that I had an ex who used to lecture me like that and treat me like a piece of poo under his shoe. He said he understood and it was just his upbringing, that his mother used to lecture him and scream at him like that. I said, "Well, it didn't feel good to you as a kid, did it?" He said, "No." I said, "Well, then think about that when you're doing it to other people."

Yesterday, we got into another argument where he thought I was oversharing information in a professional group on social media by asking about getting passed over for a promotion. He again began lecturing and calling me stupid and contemptible. He ground and ground into me. I snapped. I yelled at him, saying he made me feel lower than poop and like I just wanted to die. I screamed that if he really thought I was dumb, he should just leave. My rage was coming out of me like a hurricane. I was yelling and sobbing and sobbing and shaking, and I kept repeating out loud that I was sorry and that I was obviously too dumb to live. I hit myself. It was horrifying, a total and utter breakdown of the self. I felt like nothing. Of course, then he tried to calm ME down and be all nice-y nice. There was still some part of him that thought his behavior was normal and that I was some overly sensitive freak. When he does the lecturing and berating, I can't handle it. Because, it does not matter whether I say that I'm sorry for doing something, he just keeps going on and on and on.

He apologized over and over, as he always does, and said he wouldn't do it again (until the next time, right?) but what happened scared me a lot. When I was with my ex 17 years ago, I remember feeling low, but just taking it because I didn't know any better. I just believed what he said. This feels different. I feel low, but I feel rage at being made to feel that way. All stuff to discuss with my therapist, for sure, but I'm still processing it. Am I being driven nuts by this guy? What is happening?

[Cat Familiar]

Here's what I think: He's created a narrative that your life has been easier than his and for some reason, he needs to "oversee" you, as a way to enhance his own self esteem.

You've bought into this and he's hit upon a trigger for you, based upon a previous relationship, which causes you to doubt yourself and feel bad.

Does this seem to describe your experience?
 

[formflier]

The same dynamic applies in my relationship.

My wife tries to cast herself as coming out of poverty and that I had a life of luxury.

Much of my family's "wealth" is tied up in farmland and isn't "spendable".  Farming makes us ok money, but if you put the money in stocks and got average returns over 10/20 years... .you would be MUCH better off in the stock market.

If I'm counting right... .I'm 5th generation on our land.  

Anyway... .I wasn't given much of anything growing up, I was expected to earn it.

I should amend that to say many broken things were given to me and I fixed them up with the help and investment of my Dad.  

Sorry for hijack... back to the OP.

WitzEndWife

You are doing much much better at articulating your needs and boundaries.  I'm going to suggest you have gone too far.

Much less explanation... .much MORE succinct.  Followed by quick action... .and let him rage to himself.

What can you do to listen to 70% less of his nonsense.  My guess is there are times he is pleasant to be around.  

Seriously... .take out a pen and think about the last week.  (stick to a week).  List out all the times he was spewing nonsense.  Make some notes next to each about roughly how long you listened.

Then... .think about how you could get rid of 70% of that.

Let him have whatever story he wants for the reason.  You could be wealthy.  You could be the wicked witch.  Or perhaps you are Cruella Diville... .with a plan to make coats from puppy fur.

Last:  I solved the "telling thing" by saying "I'm your husband, not your employee" and I walked away. (this took a while to modify)

I did this in front of kids... anyone... I didn't care.

She occasionally does it now... .and sometimes I give her long piercing look.  Sometimes I will ask "Oh babe... .I didn't hear clearly.  Were you kindly asking me to do something?"

FF

[radoe]

I agree with cat

[WitzEndWife]

First of all, thanks everyone for being understanding here. I think you're almost right Cat. I think the trigger, though, is this: my ex used to deem me unworthy and unlovable, and would withhold affection as a result, sometimes going and spending the night away because he said I was so awful to be around. I think some of that language that my current H uses takes me back there and panics me. It's not being abandoned, because I'm not really afraid of being alone, but it's the fear of rejection - the thought that I am so contemptible and disgusting of a human that this person can't stand me. I'm always the kind of person who defaults to something being wrong with me and trying to fix it. When I feel like it can't be fixed because it's something fundamentally wrong with who I am, it sends me to a dark place.

I really appreciate your take FF, especially the idea that I don't have to listen to it, and that it doesn't matter what he thinks. Like I said, I default to, "Of course there's something wrong with me." For several years before him, and for the first couple of years with him, my self esteem was pretty high. I wouldn't have taken these things to heart so much. But, I guess, old habits die hard. Journaling will help, for sure. I've been beaten back down a bit. I need to get to the place where I default to, "Ugh, another story, time to tune this out." Any time I've left it alone and let him rage out by himself, he's come back, tail between his legs. I need to be more consistent, because being sucked in is hurting me, big time, in more ways than one.

[Cat Familiar]

No one deserves being told that they are unlovable and those unkind words weren’t true in the first place, or your ex would never have gotten together with you in the first place.

Here’s some hugs for enduring such unkindness.     

In the future when you hear such things, please remember the concept of projection. People who would say such awful things are hurting because of their own failings, not yours.

[WitzEndWife]

I know I have to remind myself that it's about him, not me. I think I really have to get more in the habit of going away and not listening to it. It's funny, we're working with my rescue dog and the veterinary behaviorist, and one of the dog's bad habits is demand barking (i.e. barking at you because she wants something). The vet says to ignore, walk away, or even leave the house when she's doing the demand barking. That way she knows that doing so will drive people away, and she won't get what she wants. It's kind of similar with uBPDh, in a way. He will realize he won't get the satisfaction he wants if I walk away or leave when he's lecturing. I need to do that for me too.

[Cat Familiar]

Awesome. Good insight, WEW!

[AskingWhy]

WEW, I know a lot of what you are going through.    

My uBPD H was raised in poverty.  His uNPD F left the military as a career because it did not allow for much time on the golf course, or for hunting and fishing.  FIL took a series of low skilled jobs and retired from a career as a sales clerk in a sporting goods store.  Even in their 80s, his parents have not paid off their house and they are always looking to H for a handout when they cannot make ends meet.  His sole sibling, a brother, is a drug addict and often out of work.

H is jealous of the suburban comfort I was raised in.  (H was raised in the rural Midwest.)  My father was career military, but parents scrimped and saved to pay off their modest home and invest in a small business.  My side of the family inherited the business.  He is jealous, screaming my siblings and I are "lazy" and "don't have to work."    H has worked since he was a teen on construction jobs before entering the military as a career, unlike his father.

My H also "orders" me to do things around the house, such as laundry or other chores.  This is like what FF experiences.  There are little posted notes all over on doors and cupboards.  I gets infuriating and annoying to see this.  I suspect he lacked a lot of control as a child with his uNPD F barely supporting the family while the F went golfing and hunting.

I can't change my H, but I have come so far over the last 5 years with a T who understands BPD, and reading a lot on my own.  I used to cry uncontrollably when H dysregulated and punched holes in walls, and made divorce threats almost weekly.  (In one case, he made three divorce threats in three days--one a day.)  I later learned he has an illness, and his rage was not my fault, and this helped a great deal.

My H is also, like yours, hypercritical.  I also think this has to do with control issues.  When I get a character assassination, all I have to do is point to one of his children and their life choices:  drugs and addiction, homelessness, promiscuity, expulsion from the military, suicide attempts.  That puts things in perspective if he wants to hold his children up as paragons of perfection.  That reality cannot be refuted.

Take heart, WEW.  You are not alone in this.  You are strong and intelligent.  Being calm, in my opinion, is the best way to deal with a raging BPD H.  He wants to get a rise out of you.  Without a response, his rage has no place to go.  It's empowering to hear my own H bellow how much he hates me, wonders why we are still together after 20 years, and he wants me out of his life--and I won't be broken down to weeping as I once did.  (He makes a great show of searching for attorneys on his digital pad.  How juvenile!  As if that is supposed to scare me and beg him to reconsider.)  My response to him is, "Do what you have to do."  Calm and without emotion.

I also understand just "losing it" when things get to be too much.  The accumulated abuse from a BPD H is crazy making and sometimes all the self control in the world can't prevent you from snapping when your empathy well has run dry.

I am so glad you are finding insight into your H's inner life and how best to cope with it.

My H has only apologised a few times in the 20 years we were married.  H has a lot of NPD in his BPD.

 

[formflier]

My H also "orders" me to do things around the house, such as laundry or other chores.  This is like what FF experiences.  There are little posted notes all over on doors and cupboards.  

Uhh... .wow... .post its?  Have  I missed this part of your story before AskingWhy?

Sorry for the mini-hijack but that really stood out to me.   Tell me more.

Shifting gears:  A frustrating part of pwBPD ordering others to do work is that when they are "ordering"... that is usually an indication that emotion is at play, vice rational thought/executive control.  

Less rational thought means less ability to think things through, less ability to compromise and less ability for synergistic effects.  

One of the joys I have in a large family is organizing things in such a way that work gets done faster as a team than as a bunch of individuals.  Even better if you get to go to the park earlier because your the family work is done sooner.  When kids get that and really understand it... .big big learning point.

FFw often appears ticked off by these things... .labeling me "controlling".  I'm like... "uhh... yeah.of course, that's what leaders do."  Of course she ignores results.

It seems like in her world she will focus on work work work until and emotional moment has passed... .then a switch flips and now she is focused on playing/pleasure... .until switch flips.

"Facts on the ground"  (such as if the project is completed or not) don't often seem to matter.

FF

[AskingWhy]

Uhh... .wow... .post its?  Have  I missed this part of your story before AskingWhy?

Sorry for the mini-hijack but that really stood out to me.   Tell me more.

FF, uBPD H will order me around and make "check lists" to me to do during the day. He does this on little note pads like I am his subordinate.  I can always tell when something is nagging on his mind:  work, midlife crisis, not having seen his adult children lately, etc.  (Due to his dissociation, his children are not a fixed notion in his mind.  He has to physically see them to assure him they are still in his life.  He then showers them with expensive gifts.)  For control, H will rearrange food in cupboards at right angles according to his perceived order of things:  potato chip bags, boxes of crackers, etc.  It's really unreal!  If the tasks are not completed at the end of the day, he emotionally punishes me by the silent treatment and withholding of affection.  This used to really affect me--to the point of tears and my begging him to forgive me.  That is no longer the case.  I laugh at him, telling him he is not my boss, and then go about my own business.  That really frustrates him because he really thinks he is the authoritarian ruler of the house and I must obey.    In reality, he is dealing with the ghosts of his childhood where his uNPD F spent all the extra money on himself to hunt, fish and play golf.  The wife and children got nothing.

[formflier]

Please tell me you don't actually follow his "orders" and "post its"... right?

Or is he ok with you leaving him post its as well?

FF

[AskingWhy]

Please tell me you don't actually follow his "orders" and "post its"... right?

Or is he ok with you leaving him post its as well?

FF

No, FF, I don't follow his "orders." My self esteem is now to the point where I can laugh at him.  I mimic his "military officer" body language that he uses in an attempt to intimidate me.  His "directives" go straight to the trash.  I follow the same responses his children gave him as teens and young adults--fearlessness and independence and a disregard for his "authority."  With his children, he would cower when they defied him.  He made no attempt to correct them.  My defiance in the same manner is a subtle reminder of how fearful he was of his own children.   They emotionally blackmailed him and he did not have the spine to parent them.   

As for any messages I might leave, as you know, pwBPD have double standards.  It's OK for him to give orders, dyregulate, call names and punch holes in the walls, but not for me to exhibit like behaviour.  (I don't anyway.)