My ex has refused to pay for a joint holiday booking

[Depression = 72% of members]

Since I broke up from my wife, I have had a very on/off relationship with a woman I met in an AA meeting. The woman in question is now a year sober and we met up recently to ‘celebrate’ her sobriety milestone. Unfortunately this followed a period of almost a month of her blocking me on all media and refusing to see me. She finally relented a couple of weeks ago after stating that she wanted to go to the cinema. I bought the tickets and she refused to come out of her house. I managed to change the tickets to the following Wednesday after she stood me up but went with a friend. She then got upset and asked why I hadn’t offered to take her on the Wednesday. I told her that I didn’t think she would come and didn’t want to be stood up a second time. She told me that she wanted to see the film (Rocketman) and so I booked two tickets the following night and this time she came with me. We had a fairly nice evening but she seemed different than our previous high intensity relationship and said this time around she didn’t want any emotional intensity but wanted to see if we could be friends. I agreed as I had missed her.

We went for a walk the following morning and continued to get on well and she suggested that we both go away together to cement our new relationship. I agreed but was a bit wary when she asked me to book it. She said she’d pay me later and as I’d already been stood up for cinema tickets I wasn’t sure whether to trust her but took a leap of faith.. Stupidly I paid over £1,000 for the holiday to Greece and asked her several times before confirming it if she was sure. She declared herself excited and said she really wanted to go with me.

The very next day she changed her mind and said she didn’t want to go and felt uneasy about it. As I was working and got home late, I didn’t want to get into a protracted WhatsApp argument (she had identified our previous WhatsApp arguments as a major source of anger for her towards me). We went for a walk the next day where she was agitated and kept complaining about my behaviour in our relationship previously. She said I’d never apologised for what she considered to be my abusive behaviour, especially in front of her 17 year old daughter. When I pointed out to her that in fact her daughter had witnessed her physically attacking me she hit the roof and started shouting at me in the street and stormed off. I picked her up in the car and ran the gauntlet of her screaming at me before dropping her home. That evening she said since I hadn’t contacted her, I clearly didn’t give a damn. I said I felt whatever I said was going to be misconstrued.

The next morning was her one year sober birthday. We met up for coffee and she seemed genuinely pleased that I was making such a fuss of her sobriety milestone. That evening we cuddled on the sofa watching a movie and she asked me to take everything slowly. I told her that was fine by and and she thanked me for being so gentle and kind. I went home happy that we were in a good place again. The following morning I went over to her house intending on going out for another walk but she seemed anxious. She immediately reiterated that she didn’t want to sleep with me, especially when her 17 year old daughter was in the house as she didn’t feel she was being a good role model. I had a look of hurt on my face which she immediately interpreted as aggression. I said I wasn’t angry but upset. I said I would always respect her boundaries but was just trying to understand exactly what they were.. I said in our previous relationship she wanted me as much as I wanted her and her daughter was used to me being around and slept with her boyfriend In the house anyway. I reiterated that I would respect her boundaries though. My gf reiterated that she didn’t want to sleep with me and when I asked ‘what ever?’ she hit the roof. She started screaming that I was trampling over her boundaries and that I was a Narcissist and she was scared of me. She continued screaming at me and made me leave. She then cut me off WhatsApp and said that she never wanted to see me again so that I couldn’t trigger her. She also told me that she wouldn’t pay for the holiday I booked.

The history of our relationship is that we had a very passionate and loving first few months in which she was all over me physically and became dependent on me emotionally. Given that she was in early sobriety I tried to look after her but her emotional volatility was such that she would often shout and scream at me and I would have to leave her flat triggering her abandonment issues.

Sexually she was very forthcoming touching me as soon as I walked into her house and practically dragging me into the bedroom. It helped that her daughter really liked me and said she liked the way I related to her mum. Since my gf had walked out of her marriage when her daughter was 15 months old and her husband got custody of the child, she had a very difficult time seeing her daughter as much as she wanted and suffered a lot of residual guilt and grief over not seeing her daughter. My gf also told me that her own mother was a Narcissist and used to abuse her when she was 11, making her eat food out of a dog bowl and treating her like the black sheep of the family. She also told me the first time around that the way I argued with her reminded her of her mother.

After a few months of wonderful times, including many lovely trips away to places and cultural events, my gf began to change. Despite telling me she wanted to make love every day, she then started accusing me of treating her like a whore. I apologised profusely and said I was mortified that she felt that way. Her sexual behaviour after that became more erratic and she seemed conflicted between enjoying it and feeling shame around it. She enjoyed me doing certain things that made her feel submissive but then would verbally attack me afterwards and say that she wasn’t going to be manipulated by me. As the relationship progressed she began to devalue me and the sexual conduct became an issue and she started calling me a Narcissist on a daily basis. I then realised that anybody who dared to upset her got tarred with the Narcissist brush too. Her emotional dysregulation led her to attack me physically on a number of occasions (including one time when I nearly crashed the car)  and her daughter witnessed the final attack in her house and had to pull her off me. Of course I got the blame for that and after (stupidly) taking her to task in front of her daughter she told me that her daughter no longer wanted me around. Not long after she cut me off for a month.

It seems to me that I make my ex uneasy just being around. I think she seems to have a particular issue around sex and when we briefly reconnected seemed to be at pains to stay away from me physically. I have tried hard over the year to keep the love in the relationship alive but I can’t do it on my own. I have reluctantly accepted that the relationship is over as my ex clearly finds being around me triggering. I find myself confused what the problem is. She is convinced that I’m a Narcissist and has accused me of gaslighting, manipulating, twisting events and misrepresenting ‘the truth’ of arguments between us. She says I trample all over her boundaries. My perspective is that I’ve been trying to clarify what kind of a relationship she wanted to see whether or not I wanted the same thing. Unfortunately, any needs or desire I show is met with rage.

My ex has been diagnosed with bi polar but does not take medication. My feeling is that this kind of regular emotional volatility and dysregulation seems more like BPD and her constant need to get revenge on me seems almost NPD. She told me I can ‘swing’ for my money and she is fed up with being nice and kind to me. When I pointed out that leaving me with a £1,000 bill for a holiday we both wanted is neither nice or kind she cut me off. Is this BPD?

[RomanticFool]

Since I broke up from my wife, I have had a very on/off relationship with a woman I met in an AA meeting. The woman in question is now a year sober and we met up recently to ‘celebrate’ her sobriety milestone. Unfortunately this followed a period of almost a month of her blocking me on all media and refusing to see me. She finally relented a couple of weeks ago after stating that she wanted to go to the cinema. I bought the tickets and she refused to come out of her house. I managed to change the tickets to the following Wednesday after she stood me up but went with a friend. She then got upset and asked why I hadn’t offered to take her on the Wednesday. I told her that I didn’t think she would come and didn’t want to be stood up a second time. She told me that she wanted to see the film (Rocketman) and so I booked two tickets the following night and this time she came with me. We had a fairly nice evening but she seemed different than our previous high intensity relationship and said this time around she didn’t want any emotional intensity but wanted to see if we could be friends. I agreed as I had missed her.

We went for a walk the following morning and continued to get on well and she suggested that we both go away together to cement our new relationship. I agreed but was a bit wary when she asked me to book it. She said she’d pay me later and as I’d already been stood up for cinema tickets I wasn’t sure whether to trust her but took a leap of faith.. Stupidly I paid over £1,000 for the holiday to Greece and asked her several times before confirming it if she was sure. She declared herself excited and said she really wanted to go with me.

The very next day she changed her mind and said she didn’t want to go and felt uneasy about it. As I was working and got home late, I didn’t want to get into a protracted WhatsApp argument (she had identified our previous WhatsApp arguments as a major source of anger for her towards me). We went for a walk the next day where she was agitated and kept complaining about my behaviour in our relationship previously. She said I’d never apologised for what she considered to be my abusive behaviour, especially in front of her 17 year old daughter. When I pointed out to her that in fact her daughter had witnessed her physically attacking me she hit the roof and started shouting at me in the street and stormed off. I picked her up in the car and ran the gauntlet of her screaming at me before dropping her home. That evening she said since I hadn’t contacted her, I clearly didn’t give a damn. I said I felt whatever I said was going to be misconstrued.

The next morning was her one year sober birthday. We met up for coffee and she seemed genuinely pleased that I was making such a fuss of her sobriety milestone. That evening we cuddled on the sofa watching a movie and she asked me to take everything slowly. I told her that was fine by and and she thanked me for being so gentle and kind. I went home happy that we were in a good place again. The following morning I went over to her house intending on going out for another walk but she seemed anxious. She immediately reiterated that she didn’t want to sleep with me, especially when her 17 year old daughter was in the house as she didn’t feel she was being a good role model. I had a look of hurt on my face which she immediately interpreted as aggression. I said I wasn’t angry but upset. I said I would always respect her boundaries but was just trying to understand exactly what they were.. I said in our previous relationship she wanted me as much as I wanted her and her daughter was used to me being around and slept with her boyfriend In the house anyway. I reiterated that I would respect her boundaries though. My gf reiterated that she didn’t want to sleep with me and when I asked ‘what ever?’ she hit the roof. She started screaming that I was trampling over her boundaries and that I was a Narcissist and she was scared of me. She continued screaming at me and made me leave. She then cut me off WhatsApp and said that she never wanted to see me again so that I couldn’t trigger her. She also told me that she wouldn’t pay for the holiday I booked.

The history of our relationship is that we had a very passionate and loving first few months in which she was all over me physically and became dependent on me emotionally. Given that she was in early sobriety I tried to look after her but her emotional volatility was such that she would often shout and scream at me and I would have to leave her flat triggering her abandonment issues.

Sexually she was very forthcoming touching me as soon as I walked into her house and practically dragging me into the bedroom. It helped that her daughter really liked me and said she liked the way I related to her mum. Since my gf had walked out of her marriage when her daughter was 15 months old and her husband got custody of the child, she had a very difficult time seeing her daughter as much as she wanted and suffered a lot of residual guilt and grief over not seeing her daughter. My gf also told me that her own mother was a Narcissist and used to abuse her when she was 11, making her eat food out of a dog bowl and treating her like the black sheep of the family. She also told me the first time around that the way I argued with her reminded her of her mother.

After a few months of wonderful times, including many lovely trips away to places and cultural events, my gf began to change. Despite telling me she wanted to make love every day, she then started accusing me of treating her like a whore. I apologised profusely and said I was mortified that she felt that way. Her sexual behaviour after that became more erratic and she seemed conflicted between enjoying it and feeling shame around it. She enjoyed me doing certain things that made her feel submissive but then would verbally attack me afterwards and say that she wasn’t going to be manipulated by me. As the relationship progressed she began to devalue me and the sexual conduct became an issue and she started calling me a Narcissist on a daily basis. I then realised that anybody who dared to upset her got tarred with the Narcissist brush too. Her emotional dysregulation led her to attack me physically on a number of occasions (including one time when I nearly crashed the car)  and her daughter witnessed the final attack in her house and had to pull her off me. Of course I got the blame for that and after (stupidly) taking her to task in front of her daughter she told me that her daughter no longer wanted me around. Not long after she cut me off for a month.

It seems to me that I make my ex uneasy just being around. I think she seems to have a particular issue around sex and when we briefly reconnected seemed to be at pains to stay away from me physically. I have tried hard over the year to keep the love in the relationship alive but I can’t do it on my own. I have reluctantly accepted that the relationship is over as my ex clearly finds being around me triggering. I find myself confused what the problem is. She is convinced that I’m a Narcissist and has accused me of gaslighting, manipulating, twisting events and misrepresenting ‘the truth’ of arguments between us. She says I trample all over her boundaries. My perspective is that I’ve been trying to clarify what kind of a relationship she wanted to see whether or not I wanted the same thing. Unfortunately, any needs or desire I show is met with rage.

My ex has been diagnosed with bi polar but does not take medication. My feeling is that this kind of regular emotional volatility and dysregulation seems more like BPD and her constant need to get revenge on me seems almost NPD. She told me I can ‘swing’ for my money and she is fed up with being nice and kind to me. When I pointed out that leaving me with a £1,000 bill for a holiday we both wanted is neither nice or kind she cut me off. Is this BPD?

[Leonis]

that I was a Narcissist and she was scared of me.

Yup. Been there.

My gf also told me that her mother was a Narcissist and used to abuse her when she was 11, making her eat food out of a dog bowl and treating her like the black sheep of the family. She also told me first time around that the way I argued with her reminded her of her mother.

Check number two.

Despite telling me she wanted to make love every day, she then started accusing me of treating her like a whore. I apologised profusely and said I was mortified that she felt that way. Her sexual behaviour after that became more erratic and she seems conflicted between enjoying it and feeling shame around it. She enjoyed me doing certain things that made her feel submissive

Had something similar. I once asked her if she felt uncomfortable going to church because we had premarital sex. She later accused me of insinuating her as a slut.

My ex definitely enjoyed sex, but there were subtle signs of shame. She always covered her breasts in missionary position and walking up going to the bathroom. Sometimes, she attempts to cover her vulva and chest with both arms as she's walking.

She is convinced that I’m a Narcissist and has accused me of gaslighting, manipulating, twisting events and misrepresenting ‘the truth’ of arguments between us. She says I trample all over her boundaries. My perspective is that I’ve been trying to clarify what kind of a relationship she wanted to see

Also been there. Mine claimed it was my form of control over her.

My ex has been diagnosed with bi polar but does not take medication.

That's a bad sign. They should be on meds. I have had a friend whose manic episode took him to interesting places back in 2015. He is still redeeming himself of all the damages he'd caused today.

But yeah, I quoted parts I could totally relate with you.

[Skip]

Hi RM,

Welcome back.  Just blowing off steam today or looking for help in all that is going on?

Can you fill in some of the blanks?

What is happening with wife (#1)? Are you living together? Is she staying with family? Have you filed divorce? Are things still in limbo (not really a couple, not really seeking to end it). Still joint home, joint finances? What is happening with "lady #3"? Did the relationship ever become serious or has it always been on and off - just out of reach? How long have you been seeing her? Do you have a time frame in mind for when "just on and off" has been going on too long? Whether it's bipolar or BPD, can you work with that long term? What has you social/sexual life been like the last two years? Have you connected with anyone else? How did that go? How have you been doing? You have thought you struggle with attachment issues and that you were emotionally impulsive and could get very controlling yourself. How has your handling of #3 compared to your handling of #2? I notice that you are not posting in "Conflicted" or "Bettering". This doesn't read like "I need  to move on" either (Detachinng). Where are you with the ladies?

Let's talk it out.

Or just blowing off steam is fine, too. 

Skip

 

[RomanticFool]

Hi Leonis,

Thanks for your input. Seems like alot of similarities.

That's a bad sign. They should be on meds. I have had a friend whose manic episode took him to interesting places back in 2015. He is still redeeming himself of all the damages he'd caused today.

I agree. She certainly seems to be suffering during the manic phases but I wouldn't say that it's just bi polar. Her emotional volatility seems minute by minute.

[RomanticFool]

Hi Skip,

Welcome back.  Just blowing off steam today or looking for help in all that is going on?

Thank you. Not just blowing off steam but looking for help.

Can you fill in some of the blanks? What is happening with wife (#1)? Are you living together? Is she staying with family? Have you filed divorce? Are things still in limbo (not really a couple, not really seeking to end it). Still joint home, joint finances?

My wife has moved out and is temporarily living with family about an hour outside of London. We haven't filed for divorce as she is busy mountain climbing. We get on very well but we both think the relationship is over. We have never had joint finances and the home is originally my property but we have agreed that if I ever sell it she will get a percentage. Money is not really an issue between us.

What is happening with "lady #3"? Did the relationship ever become serious or has it always been on and off - just out of reach? How long have you been seeing her? Do you have a time frame in mind for when "just on and off" has been going on too long? Whether it's bipolar or BPD, can you work with that long term?

The woman that I've been involved with since my wife left is lady #3. As far as I was concerned the relationship was serious from the beginning. It became toxic during the time I was still living with my wife and she attacked me physically on a number of occasions after triggering her abandonment issues when I walked away to avoid a verbal battering from her. I've been seeing her for 11 months on and off. It seems to currently be off. I always intended that she was going to be the woman I ended up with but her behaviour is now so hostile towards me that it seems impossible we will ever be together.  I have learnt a few things during my time with her but I really don't know how to quell her rages. She effectively put me on probation with her when we reconnected and that lasted just under two weeks. It feels like she has been trying to provoke to prove that I am the Narcissist she has me down as and to prove to herself that I can't be trusted and am not the right person for her. I don't think I am equipped to deal with her emotional volatility and even if I was I think she no longer wants a relationship with me, despite telling me she loves me just three days ago (albeit in response to my declaration).

What has you social/sexual life been like the last two years? Have you connected with anyone else? How did that go?

For the past 11 months lady #3 has been all that I've thought about. I don't really want any other woman. Prior to that, as you know, I was trying to get over lady #2 who has now become a friend and is training to be a psychologist. Nobody else has been on the scene.

How have you been doing? You have thought you struggle with attachment issues and that you were emotionally impulsive and could get very controlling yourself. How has your handling of #3 compared to your handling of #2?

During the month long break from lady #3 I had a break down and was desperate enough to go to another fellowship dealing with co-dependency issues and love addiction. I started reading around the topic of love and sex addiction and have learnt a few things about emotional dependency.  I did look into therapy but it was prohibitively costly. Ironically the £1,000 I just spent on an aborted holiday could have really helped. It's a real shame. Ironically, I turned to lady #2 for emotional support during this time and she has acutally been a wonderful support, though she did declare herself 'betrayed' at my involvement with lady #3 and she couldn't believe I'd ended my marriage for another woman, albeit 'a crazy one.' Her words, not mine. I pointed out that she had put me through a great deal of pain during our time together and that since she was married I knew the relationship wasn't going anywhere. After a bit of a sulk she accepted my assertion and said she would help me. At the time I was feeling suicidal and since I knew lady #2 worked for a suicide prevention charity, I knew she could help me. I think we have forged something of a friendship. She said she thought lady #3 has BPD and is also manipulative and not a very nice person. I prefer to look on lady #3 as unwell rather than plain mean.

I notice that you are not posting in "Conflicted" or "Bettering". This doesn't read like "I need  to move on" either (Detachinng). Where are you with the ladies?

Every time we (myself and lady #3) reach an impasse like this, I am convinced it's over. The last impasse lasted for a month. She has said this time that she no longer wishes to see me, that I am a Narcissist and that she never wants to be triggered by me again. She also accused me of "gaslighting, manipulating, twisting events and misrepresenting ‘the truth’ of arguments between us. She says I trample all over her boundaries." I don't think that sounds like somebody who is coming back in a hurry, let alone going on holiday with me. Since she has let me down on this holiday, I don't want to see her again. £1,000 is no joke and I am appalled at her lack of empathy.

RF

[Skip]

Since she has let me down on this holiday, I don't want to see her again. £1,000 is no joke and I am appalled at her lack of empathy.

This is has been going on for a while and with all three women - roller coaster feelings. You can see evensee it in this thread.

My first question is why have you not filled for divorce. She's out. This was a major issue with lady #3 and you promised her you were "on it" a year ago.  Your marriage is dark shadow on everything you do.

Why not get on with it?

Do you think it is hurting your current relationship?