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Author Topic: parent and grandparent alienation by BPD  (Read 416 times)
judd

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Family other
Relationship status: grandparent
Posts: 3


« on: March 22, 2020, 02:55:47 PM »

Divorced  after 20+ years living w/ BPD spouse. When divorce occurred, ex w/ BPD launched an aggressive effort to alienate spouse and other family members from children. It has continued over a year. Looking for ways to stop it and to protect children from mis information. Children in joint custody
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Sluggo
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Divorced 4 yrs/ separated 6 / Married 18 yrs
Posts: 596



« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2020, 10:44:58 PM »

Judd,

Welcome to the board and glad you found us. 

That is a great question which I have struggled through.  Divorced after 18 yrs with 7 children ages at that time (16, 14, 11, 9, 7, 6,  2).  I left house in 2016 and alienation started then.  Truth be told there were signs of alienation even before separation... allowing Exbpdw to usurp my authority in discipline, allow her to set schedules which severely limited any 1-1 time with the kids, allowing her to limit time spent with extended family. 

I share that as when I left house for the 2 older kids they had seen  father (me) who allowed my wife to take total control in the marriage.  I was not her equal but just another kid.  Again I allowed that to happen over time... a death of a 1000 cuts.  So for those two... still 4 yrs later almost 0 communication with me when they turned 18. 

11 and 9 year old has been difficult.  It has improved only when I got full custody august 2019.  Exbpdw gave up all custody voluntarily after over a long court battle spanning over 3 years which she got everything she wanted... primary custody and financial security.  Then 3 months after final court case, she wanted nothing of kids.  And signed all rights over to me. 

The other 3...  had not seen what I allowed my exbpd to treat me, talk to me, etc.  They have always been like nothing ever happened.    They feel 100% comfortable with me as their Dad. 

For the older 4 kids, they shunned any relative, friend, even ex family who still spoke with me.  It was incredibly sad. 

The older 2 still shun them, but the rest do not anymore. 

How did I get through...
**learning about alienation from reading books and you tube videos of dr. Childress.  It help me understand the dynamics at play and not take things so personally.   

An Attachment-Based Model of Parental Alienation: Foundations https://www.amazon.com/dp/0996114505/ref=cm_sw_r_em_apa_i_76cEEbTAAMCAN

**  watch videos of 'Ryan Thomas Speaks'.  It gave me an understanding what the child feels like.  He was a child who was alienated from his father growing up but had reunited back with him. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=ryan+thomas+speaks+youtube&oq=ryan+thoma&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j35i39j69i65l3.5875j0j7&client=ms-android-verizon&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#


** this board.  Posting my story.  A lot of great people on this board with loads of experience. 

What quelled the alienation the most was: 
*extended time with kids.  The 1/2 summer was huge for me.  My first summer was just in 2019.  It was after the 1/2 summer that I felt closer to kids and they with me.  It was after that extended period with them that exbpd released all custody to me. 

It has been the hardest thing I ever went through.  So so painful.  And still is especially with the oldest 2.  However, I am at peace with it but pray it changes with those 2.  I am so much a better father to the other kids. 

Tell us a little more of your background, marriage, divorce, and current alienation and how it has impacted you? Kids?   
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judd

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Family other
Relationship status: grandparent
Posts: 3


« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2020, 11:41:33 AM »

Thanks so much for sharing your experience and resources. Have found the YouTube presentations by Dr. Childress very informative and am still working my way through them. Will also access the other resources you mention. One of the biggest difficulties has been limiting the relentless access of ex spouse to kids, calling and texting them multiple times a day  during father's parenting time. She uses her parenting time and the obsessive continuous contact with kids to constantly misrepresent the facts and undermine all relationships with all members of husbands family. This all reinforces her attempt to control. Very much follows the pattern Dr. Childress describes but has not succeeded in totally alienating the kids. She has refused any professional help for herself and has her entire life. She is compounding her mental health issues with alcohol. The kids are in therapy but with the virus isolation they are temporarily not receiving and spend every other week with father. For now our entire family does everything we can to reinforce our love for them and they seem to be balancing between mother's life and fathers but it is going down hill and is relentless.  Courts seem to be more supportive of mother although some progress is  being made. I can't imagine her voluntarily giving up custody or seeking any kind of therapy. Her health appears to be deteriorating at times and she has had some brief episodes with anxiety attacks. My sense is the kids are somewhat afraid/intimidated by her and also afraid for her ( "I might hurt myself" conveyed to them by her) .
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alleyesonme
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Divorcing
Posts: 347


« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2020, 12:16:59 AM »

I don't know enough about this topic, but is it possible to take her to court for this intentional alienation? I would assume there was some sort of agreement in the divorce settlement to not do that.
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alleyesonme
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Divorcing
Posts: 347


« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2020, 12:18:12 AM »

Sluggo - that's absolutely heartbreaking. Your strength and persistence are truly inspirational.
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worriedStepmom
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Posts: 1157


« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2020, 08:32:52 AM »

Excerpt
She is compounding her mental health issues with alcohol. The kids are in therapy but with the virus isolation they are temporarily not receiving and spend every other week with father. For now our entire family does everything we can to reinforce our love for them and they seem to be balancing between mother's life and fathers but it is going down hill and is relentless.  Courts seem to be more supportive of mother although some progress is  being made. I can't imagine her voluntarily giving up custody or seeking any kind of therapy. Her health appears to be deteriorating at times and she has had some brief episodes with anxiety attacks. My sense is the kids are somewhat afraid/intimidated by her and also afraid for her ( "I might hurt myself" conveyed to them by her) .

Are you the grandparent?  What does your son (the father) want?  How does he see this affecting the kids?

Dad might be able to ask the therapists if they will do therapy through an app or on the phone.  It's not ideal with kids, but it might be better than not having it.

My H filed an emergency court petition two years ago when we found out that his ex was making vague comments like "I might hurt myself" to SD-then-10.  The court was not happy about those comments.  That's incredibly damaging to a child (SD was afraid to go to sleep when she was at her mom's, because she thought she needed to protect mom).  The dad in this case might want to ask his lawyer whether the court would take action with that.
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judd

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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Family other
Relationship status: grandparent
Posts: 3


« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2020, 01:44:28 PM »

Thanks for all the comments. Yes, grandparent . Their dad is pursuing with atty and with legal system in every way available but this is a very drawn out process. BPD has had restraining orders filed against her , been arrested for spouse abuse, etc  but turns those actions right back into feeding her parental alienation tactics. "Your dad is going to make me lose my job," "he is trying to put me in jail." etc. She definitely uses the kids as weapons against not only dad's family but his other associates - friends, colleagues, neighbors etc. She is very skilled and very convincing . For now we are waiting out the  court process but looking for ideas that might help both current situation as well as legal process eventual outcome. Realizing this alienation attempt is a continuum that went on even before the divorce but has been steadily scaled up by BPD. Need to find every way possible to scale up the counter effort without demeaning her to the kids.
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worriedStepmom
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Posts: 1157


« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2020, 01:58:36 PM »

How old are the kids?  How are they handling the alienation?  Does it seem to be working, or do they shrug it off?
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ForeverDad
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
Posts: 18073


You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2020, 04:53:49 PM »

Typically courts default to joint custody unless there is substantive reason to assign sole custody to one parent.  Our persons with BPD (pwBPD) have had all their lives to hone their manipulation skills.  Generally they have enough street smarts to know how far they can go without hitting that high bar where behaviors become 'actionable'.

So it is up to us sane and reasonable parents to resist our (too often) passive, appeasing, accepting traits and be proactive and seek solid strategies.  Besides the lawyers and other local professionals, peer support such as here can share their hard-won time-tested strategies for what usually works as well as what usually doesn't work.

My story... I was in divorce process for two years.  The custody evaluator was excellent, a child psychologist.  He perceived the real situation yet knew court, lacking an outright abusive situation, defaulted to start with joint custody.  "Mother cannot share 'her' child but Father can... If Shared Parenting fails then Father should get custody."

Well, it did fail and I returned - twice - to court.  Courts seem to prefer making tweaks in hopes the smallest change can work.  The first time the court awarded me Legal Guardianship but wanted the parenting time to remain equal so Mother could get child support.  The second time the court noted - six times - Mother's disparagement of Father had continued and combined with school related issues it ruled that I would also get majority time during the school year.  We had been in and out of court for some 8 years, finally her entitlement burst (enough that we haven't been back to court since).  Six years later and our son is now an adult and has aged out of the system.

The ex may never fully behave but at least the misbehaviors should get contained over time as the court order gets refined.  Boundaries are important.  Read Boundaries by Henry Cloud.  We know pwBPD resist boundaries but look at them a bit differently, boundaries are for us.  How so?  Our firm and consistent boundaries are to guide our responses.  "If you do or don't do ___ then I will do or not do ___."
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