How did you tell them you were leaving? Safety planning help needed.

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

 

Hi everyone, I want to start by saying how thankful I am for these boards. I am not able to have a T right now, and I only have one friend who knows what's happening...so just coming here and reading is helping me hold on to sanity.

I know I want to leave. I need help with planning. This feels so complicated to tell but I will try to keep it as short as possible...if you have questions please ask.

I left once 2 years ago, packed my stuff secretly and left a note. My daughter (not biologically his) was 10 at the time and was already at my moms so I just had to get myself out. I left a note and went NC. I broke NC after a week because I listened to his crying messages about how he had already started regular therapy, anger management, and meetings with the pastor. I got charmed and love bombed and came back after 3 weeks. 

I want to leave and not come back this time. I am sure that this is what I want. I need to get myself and my daughter to a home that is our own and is safe in all ways. She has joined me in walking on eggshells and emotional caretaking and I need to get both of us out.

He is more aware of things around the house so I won't take as much as last time so I don't alert him ahead of time. I have already moved important papers to my trunk, and I am working on a few clothes and other important items I don't want lost or destroyed but that won't be noticed. The last thing I will need to get out is my work computer and screens. I can't get these out ahead of time because these are a symbol of my "sneaking out" last time and he always checks if they are there to see if I'm leaving (abandoning) him again. I don't feel comfortable leaving them here unless it's a true safety emergency because they are work property and I work in healthcare. I don't want to be liable if he destroys them or breaks into them.

I also have my D12 with me all the time - because of the pandemic she hasn't been going to grandma's, so I have to get her out safely too.

Last time I left we had very little money (Side note: I hadn't been truthful about this with him out of fear, this now has been spun into a history of me being a "bad Christian wife who lied to her husband for 5 years and ultimately abandoned him because of not wanting to face the music of what I had done to him, and my complaints about his rage and anger were blown out of proportion because of me wanting to escape responsibility for my lies." My guilt about this was definitely part of my coming back and subjecting myself to this for 2 more years). So last time I left I left him the few hundred dollars that we had and said in the note that I would keep paying utilities etc. This time I don't know if I should leave a note again or what, I know that was very painful and shocking for him.

I am the breadwinner and he hasn't worked (by choice, says he is disabled but is really overweight and doesn't actually qualify for disability...he worked before I started taking care of everything. He has a large amount of cash now from prior work/under the table work). He has had job offers and possible jobs but he wanted to "get well" while I worked first, this has been going on for over 10 years. The house is in my name but I don't want it. The bank account is in only my name. We both use the debit card for grocery shopping, etc and he often has it with him when he goes out in a rage. When he leaves like this is one possibility of when to leave, but he will probably have the debit card with him and I need to take it with me. He will have his cash and I'm sure he won't think it's enough but it is definitely enough for him to start out somewhere else, his extended family has all moved to FL and I know it's probably wishful thinking but I WISH he would discard me and move there with his money. I know I have no control over what he does, this is just my wishful daydream. Is it possible to detach/leave in a way that will make the BPD more likely to discard you and never want to talk to you again?

Ok I was trying to keep this brief here is where I am:

I know D12 and I can go to my mom's, at a moment's notice whenever we need to and we can stay as long as we need to. He would know we went there. She has a security camera.

I am already gathering documents, clothes, needed items and getting them to my trunk/mom's. Items I'm not sure about are my computers and the debit card.

I don't know how/when to tell him I'm leaving. I wanted to do it in therapy but I have asked for marriage counseling several times and his thought is why should he go to counseling with me when I'm the one with the issues and he's not wrong. When I came back and felt really guilty he asked me to never sneak out again and to promise to talk to him if I ever feel unhappy or feel like leaving in the future. "he would never hurt me and it hurt him that I acted like he would with how I left". I felt really guilty and agreed to this promise. My one friend who I am talking to about this said my safety and D12 safety is more important than breaking my word. I know this is true.

I know I can't control his reaction and I know nothing I do will make the whole thing acceptable to him...but I do want to handle it all in the most non-escalating way possible for our safety as well as his. Should I say at some point I need to stay at my mom's for a few days and need space, then after awhile let him know that I'm not coming back? Should I "sneak" us out again and leave a note or call/text after I'm out? I am at a loss with this part and need help.

I completed the Mosaic tool last time I left and I did it again this time. Both times my score was 7.

Thank you for your help in advance.

[Reawakening]

 

Hi everyone, I want to start by saying how thankful I am for these boards. I am not able to have a T right now, and I only have one friend who knows what's happening...so just coming here and reading is helping me hold on to sanity.

I know I want to leave. I need help with planning. This feels so complicated to tell but I will try to keep it as short as possible...if you have questions please ask.

I left once 2 years ago, packed my stuff secretly and left a note. My daughter (not biologically his) was 10 at the time and was already at my moms so I just had to get myself out. I left a note and went NC. I broke NC after a week because I listened to his crying messages about how he had already started regular therapy, anger management, and meetings with the pastor. I got charmed and love bombed and came back after 3 weeks. 

I want to leave and not come back this time. I am sure that this is what I want. I need to get myself and my daughter to a home that is our own and is safe in all ways. She has joined me in walking on eggshells and emotional caretaking and I need to get both of us out.

He is more aware of things around the house so I won't take as much as last time so I don't alert him ahead of time. I have already moved important papers to my trunk, and I am working on a few clothes and other important items I don't want lost or destroyed but that won't be noticed. The last thing I will need to get out is my work computer and screens. I can't get these out ahead of time because these are a symbol of my "sneaking out" last time and he always checks if they are there to see if I'm leaving (abandoning) him again. I don't feel comfortable leaving them here unless it's a true safety emergency because they are work property and I work in healthcare. I don't want to be liable if he destroys them or breaks into them.

I also have my D12 with me all the time - because of the pandemic she hasn't been going to grandma's, so I have to get her out safely too.

Last time I left we had very little money (Side note: I hadn't been truthful about this with him out of fear, this now has been spun into a history of me being a "bad Christian wife who lied to her husband for 5 years and ultimately abandoned him because of not wanting to face the music of what I had done to him, and my complaints about his rage and anger were blown out of proportion because of me wanting to escape responsibility for my lies." My guilt about this was definitely part of my coming back and subjecting myself to this for 2 more years). So last time I left I left him the few hundred dollars that we had and said in the note that I would keep paying utilities etc. This time I don't know if I should leave a note again or what, I know that was very painful and shocking for him.

I am the breadwinner and he hasn't worked (by choice, says he is disabled but is really overweight and doesn't actually qualify for disability...he worked before I started taking care of everything. He has a large amount of cash now from prior work/under the table work). He has had job offers and possible jobs but he wanted to "get well" while I worked first, this has been going on for over 10 years. The house is in my name but I don't want it. The bank account is in only my name. We both use the debit card for grocery shopping, etc and he often has it with him when he goes out in a rage. When he leaves like this is one possibility of when to leave, but he will probably have the debit card with him and I need to take it with me. He will have his cash and I'm sure he won't think it's enough but it is definitely enough for him to start out somewhere else, his extended family has all moved to FL and I know it's probably wishful thinking but I WISH he would discard me and move there with his money. I know I have no control over what he does, this is just my wishful daydream. Is it possible to detach/leave in a way that will make the BPD more likely to discard you and never want to talk to you again?

Ok I was trying to keep this brief here is where I am:

I know D12 and I can go to my mom's, at a moment's notice whenever we need to and we can stay as long as we need to. He would know we went there. She has a security camera.

I am already gathering documents, clothes, needed items and getting them to my trunk/mom's. Items I'm not sure about are my computers and the debit card.

I don't know how/when to tell him I'm leaving. I wanted to do it in therapy but I have asked for marriage counseling several times and his thought is why should he go to counseling with me when I'm the one with the issues and he's not wrong. When I came back and felt really guilty he asked me to never sneak out again and to promise to talk to him if I ever feel unhappy or feel like leaving in the future. "he would never hurt me and it hurt him that I acted like he would with how I left". I felt really guilty and agreed to this promise. My one friend who I am talking to about this said my safety and D12 safety is more important than breaking my word. I know this is true.

I know I can't control his reaction and I know nothing I do will make the whole thing acceptable to him...but I do want to handle it all in the most non-escalating way possible for our safety as well as his. Should I say at some point I need to stay at my mom's for a few days and need space, then after awhile let him know that I'm not coming back? Should I "sneak" us out again and leave a note or call/text after I'm out? I am at a loss with this part and need help.

I completed the Mosaic tool last time I left and I did it again this time. Both times my score was 7.

Thank you for your help in advance.

[Rev]

Wow... that's alot of planning - and good for you for staying so rational about it.

I see two things - first, at least from my point of view, your safety plan is already on the road to fine points - something that I would not want to talk about here. Have you considered talking to a police officer, a social worker or help line?  Sometimes even the help lines will talk to you more than once - depending on where you are.

Second - I think that I hear a "leap of faith question" in there. And no amount of planning is really going to help you overcome the really hard part of this. My T reminded me that it is much easier to get into a relationship than get out of one. I think this really is a faith question - different than religion in the way I am using it here.

One thing I am reminded of by Wayne Dyer - who wrote about the fear that we can feel when processing such massive questions.  One step at a time, day by day, towards a real (not imagined) goal mean that in 6 months we will be different people than we are now. And that new person - the one in six months - will be perhaps better equipped to deal with what the future brings.

You don't need to have it all figured out today - just enough to get started.

Be safe. Be true to yourself. You got this.

Rev

[Reawakening]

I see two things - first, at least from my point of view, your safety plan is already on the road to fine points - something that I would not want to talk about here. Have you considered talking to a police officer, a social worker or help line?  Sometimes even the help lines will talk to you more than once - depending on where you are.

Second - I think that I hear a "leap of faith question" in there. And no amount of planning is really going to help you overcome the really hard part of this. My T reminded me that it is much easier to get into a relationship than get out of one. I think this really is a faith question - different than religion in the way I am using it here.

One thing I am reminded of by Wayne Dyer - who wrote about the fear that we can feel when processing such massive questions.  One step at a time, day by day, towards a real (not imagined) goal mean that in 6 months we will be different people than we are now. And that new person - the one in six months - will be perhaps better equipped to deal with what the future brings.

You don't need to have it all figured out today - just enough to get started.

Be safe. Be true to yourself. You got this.

Rev

Hi Rev,

Thank you for your point about maybe not discussing the fine points of the plan here. I won't discuss further fine details for safety's sake. Last time I left I did call a help line a few times. They were not super helpful last time, but I can try again maybe it will be different. I guess my big question here about leaving comes down to whether ultimately it will be a better, safer outcome for ME if I withdraw/detach
from someone with BPD a little at a time (i.e. leaving "for a few days") at first, or does it just not matter?

You are right about the "leap of faith" for sure. I love the Wayne Dyer reference and also appreciate your profile picture. A huge part of my initial "awakening" a little over 2 years ago and my "reawakening" recently has been through meditation and awareness, learning about being present, and a quiet focus on my own personal healing and growth. I stopped this practice soon after coming back last time and then recently restarted it and immediately felt myself coming back. I know the direction I want to walk. I have visualized it clearly and completely down to fine details, and I think about it every day. I know on a deep soul level that if I keep walking in that direction each day, even if it's a baby step, I will be a different person in 6 months who has the strength, tools and awareness to deal with what the future brings. Thank you so much for that reminder.

[Rev]

Hi Rev,

I guess my big question here about leaving comes down to whether ultimately it will be a better, safer outcome for ME if I withdraw/detach
from someone with BPD a little at a time (i.e. leaving "for a few days") at first, or does it just not matter?

Hi again,

With reference to this particular question - it's really hard to tell, and of course everything is happening with COVID in the background, which means that people are not necessarily behaving predictably. It was an adage to say that past behavior is a good predictor of future behavior. Still holds true to some extent, but I am finding that people are showing their true, deeper colors much faster than a few months ago. Little things become big things really quickly.

In general, people with mood disorders can be highly perceptive when they are tuned in. When they are tuned out, they tend to be oblivious because basically they are very self centered people. So I'm not sure about a step by step process so much as lulling him into a sense of security. Are you able to play that game? 

Do you know what grey rocking is?  Can you be as boring as possible? Like just go about your business, ho hum?  Then watch for the moment.

Guaranteed that there is no "clean" way to do this. I know you know that, just stating the obvious so I can sound smarter LOL - but you know what I mean.

Already you convey a real sense of self awareness. I am sure that you know what parts of you that he really needs and wants for his needs.  That's the part you need to keep in the forefront, just with less sincerity each time.

Not sure if that makes sense. It's essentially the way I got out - right down to provoking her to lose it and actually kick me out.

If I could hold one thing in prayer for you, what would it be?

Rev

[Reawakening]

With reference to this particular question - it's really hard to tell, and of course everything is happening with COVID in the background, which means that people are not necessarily behaving predictably. It was an adage to say that past behavior is a good predictor of future behavior. Still holds true to some extent, but I am finding that people are showing their true, deeper colors much faster than a few months ago. Little things become big things really quickly.

In general, people with mood disorders can be highly perceptive when they are tuned in. When they are tuned out, they tend to be oblivious because basically they are very self centered people. So I'm not sure about a step by step process so much as lulling him into a sense of security. Are you able to play that game? 

Do you know what grey rocking is?  Can you be as boring as possible? Like just go about your business, ho hum?  Then watch for the moment.

Guaranteed that there is no "clean" way to do this. I know you know that, just stating the obvious so I can sound smarter LOL - but you know what I mean.

Already you convey a real sense of self awareness. I am sure that you know what parts of you that he really needs and wants for his needs.  That's the part you need to keep in the forefront, just with less sincerity each time.

Not sure if that makes sense. It's essentially the way I got out - right down to provoking her to lose it and actually kick me out.

If I could hold one thing in prayer for you, what would it be?

Rev

Hi Rev,

You're not kidding with COVID. He has not been able to hide some darker parts of his thinking (Racism, Sexism, Paranoia and Conspiracy Theories to name a few) as easily as usual lately, with COVID and now the other current events added and his inability to step away from constantly watching/reading the news along with lots of questionable online sources. In some ways, it is a blessing because it is helping me see clearly that I need to get us out and not bury/make excuses for his behavior.

I am very familiar with playing that game - lulling him into a sense of security. I did it last time as I prepared to leave and I am doing it again now. I have to push down the guilt around feeling inauthentic, but it's about survival at this point and I know I'm doing what I have to do. I am working on grey rock, not always succeeding at it but getting better I think.

I do know what you mean and it makes complete sense - thank you.

Hmmm I have been thinking about what you could hold in prayer for me. I think right now it would be clarity and discernment. Thank you so much.

[GoblinMom]

Don't make the mistake I made.  I was honest and told him I wanted a divorce.  He said we could do it amicably.  I was stupid and believed him, but he went after me for everything he could get and lied in court about everything.

So I recommend that you see a lawyer now so you'll know how to prepare.  Take paper work that shows who pays the bills and how much he makes under the table because you may have to pay alimony depending what state you live in.  The day you leave you can call the bank and tell them you lost your debit card and they will cancel it right away so he won't be able to use it. 

I had to give up a lot to be able to leave but it was worth it.  I just wish I'd done it sooner.

Best of luck to you.

[onthewater79]

Reawakening, it almost sounds like we are with the same person. Your comment on COVID amplifying your SO's racism, sexism and other undesirable traits hit me hard. I have dealt with the same - my partner has gone down such a rabbit hole with the pandemic and the protests, and whereas normally I'd spend at least a few days a week away from him at the office, I now witness his conspiracy theories and rage against TV news most of the time. He also doesn't work, and blames me in part for his inability to do so (the arguments of which are weak at best).

I am also in the process of building a plan to leave, and questioning how to do it strategically in the face of a very strategic and manipulative foe. I am working to employ greyrocking as Rev suggested though a lack of attention can cause him to lash out as much as engaging does. This life, as my former therapist once said, is like playing cards with someone who keeps changing the rules and then lying that he's done so.

I wish you well on your journey and hope we can both move forward in constructive and strategic ways.

[Reawakening]

Don't make the mistake I made.  I was honest and told him I wanted a divorce.  He said we could do it amicably.  I was stupid and believed him, but he went after me for everything he could get and lied in court about everything.

So I recommend that you see a lawyer now so you'll know how to prepare.  Take paper work that shows who pays the bills and how much he makes under the table because you may have to pay alimony depending what state you live in.  The day you leave you can call the bank and tell them you lost your debit card and they will cancel it right away so he won't be able to use it. 

I had to give up a lot to be able to leave but it was worth it.  I just wish I'd done it sooner.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks GoblinMom. I luckily have all of these records. I will most likely have to pay some kind of alimony (I'm thinking restorative/temporary) but hopefully the records and being prepared will keep it to the minimum. Thanks for the thought about canceling the debit card too. I will do that if I need to leave when he has it.

[Reawakening]

Reawakening, it almost sounds like we are with the same person. Your comment on COVID amplifying your SO's racism, sexism and other undesirable traits hit me hard. I have dealt with the same - my partner has gone down such a rabbit hole with the pandemic and the protests, and whereas normally I'd spend at least a few days a week away from him at the office, I now witness his conspiracy theories and rage against TV news most of the time. He also doesn't work, and blames me in part for his inability to do so (the arguments of which are weak at best).

I am also in the process of building a plan to leave, and questioning how to do it strategically in the face of a very strategic and manipulative foe. I am working to employ greyrocking as Rev suggested though a lack of attention can cause him to lash out as much as engaging does. This life, as my former therapist once said, is like playing cards with someone who keeps changing the rules and then lying that he's done so.

I wish you well on your journey and hope we can both move forward in constructive and strategic ways.

Hi Onthewater, thanks for your note. Yes, mine blames me for his not working too...I know that story. I do have to continue to give some attention while I am in this process too, or else he will get upset and suspect something. I am giving "bland" attention as much as possible just to show that I am listening, but I'm not volunteering anything about myself or my thoughts at all.

I wish you well too, we can do this.

[Kaylina15]

Reawakening:
I have been trying to slowly leave my husband as well. He finally stopped drinking in October and has been on meds for bipolar and anxiety for the last six or so months, and is going to therapy,  but I had already decided to leave two years ago after the last timehe got pissed at me and asked for a divorce.  I told him i wasn't playing games anymore and that I'd start doing what I needed to prepare myself to leave. He has been trying to win me back ever since.  He doesn't have the racist or conspiracy theory issues that plague yours, but he does have abandonment issues and paranoia occasionally.

My family lives in the state next to ours and is three hr away so i had been going there once a month or so over the last few years to visit. I'm currently here now and he is having a hard time with the separation part of it more than usual. I have my own money coming in from unemployment so that is a nice nest egg, but when he found out i wasn't putting in our checking acct, he got a bit defensive.  I'm transferring some over each week to appease him, and lied about how much I'm getting.
My biggest issue with leaving him and moving three hrs back home eventually is that he really has no support system where we live. He doesn't have many, if any, friends,  we have one 27 yr old son who has his own issurs, and he only has his stepfather,  who has health issues.
I know he isn't my responsibility and I am tired of walking on eggshells, even though he says he is getting better, I'm still not happy and i still don't see it ever working. He thinks we had a great marriage,  but in reality, we had some great moments, but it was really hard for both me and my son, mentally and emotionally.
I am trying to move away slowly, but can't find a job yet, so that makes it hard. I almost want to do what you said and try to provoke him into changing his mind and having him kick me out, though that scares me too. I have a lot of furniture and household items that are from my grandparents and i don't want to leave them behind.

I hope you find success in leaving and know you are not alone in this journey!

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi Reawakening, 

I'm glad you are here, posting and sharing with us. Btw, welcome! Glad to have you as part of our family. Since I don't know your story, is your DH (dear husband) BPD? My exH was not BPD, but he often reminded me of my uBPDm with some of his behaviors. It can be scary to be in an environment where you feel unsafe and may very well literally be unsafe.

Here is an important link that can provide some good information for you:

https://bpdfamily.com/pdfs/safety-first-dv-1.pdf

It sounds like you have some solid plans in place already. My T suggested that I have items stored off site, away from my home and not in my car, such as at a friends house. Is that an option you have?

I'm glad you have been saving some money. Are the accounts where the money is only in your name so that he cannot get access to them? I planned for quite some time to leave, never knowing when. My situation was such that every evening after work my purse went on my chair in the same place by the door with my key attached to my purse, shoes there by my chair that I could slip on, and a coat on my chair. My T helped me to plan, and the link above will also help you to plan.

The more prepared you are, the better you will feel. It is important first of all to be safe and stay safe, not only physically but also mentally, spiritually, and financially. Tell me about the support system you have. An option about the computers might be that you have another one there that you can replace it with. A used computer store might have some available, including monitors. When I left, I planned a trip out of town and let him know about that, then I didn't come back. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Looking forward to hearing more from you.

 
Wools

[Reawakening]

Reawakening:
My family lives in the state next to ours and is three hr away so i had been going there once a month or so over the last few years to visit. I'm currently here now and he is having a hard time with the separation part of it more than usual. I have my own money coming in from unemployment so that is a nice nest egg, but when he found out i wasn't putting in our checking acct, he got a bit defensive.  I'm transferring some over each week to appease him, and lied about how much I'm getting.
My biggest issue with leaving him and moving three hrs back home eventually is that he really has no support system where we live. He doesn't have many, if any, friends,  we have one 27 yr old son who has his own issurs, and he only has his stepfather,  who has health issues.
I know he isn't my responsibility and I am tired of walking on eggshells, even though he says he is getting better, I'm still not happy and i still don't see it ever working. He thinks we had a great marriage,  but in reality, we had some great moments, but it was really hard for both me and my son, mentally and emotionally.
I am trying to move away slowly, but can't find a job yet, so that makes it hard. I almost want to do what you said and try to provoke him into changing his mind and having him kick me out, though that scares me too. I have a lot of furniture and household items that are from my grandparents and i don't want to leave them behind.

Hi Kaylina, thanks for posting. It does help to know that I am not alone.

I can totally relate to the pwBPD's trouble dealing with separation. I am not able to go anywhere overnight. This has hampered my career growth and also just my enjoyment of life (in my life before him, I loved to travel and visit friends and family). It is a fight lately just for me to visit family that is 20 minutes away for a few hours. Even when I'm gone for an hour or two to family or the store, I have to be tied to my phone and constantly check in. It's exhausting and it feels horrible.

I also relate to feeling guilt about him not having a support system. I am telling myself more and more, though, that I need to leave him in God's hands and the fact that he does not have a great support system here is because he pushed people away or they chose to move away and that is ultimately not my responsibility. Just because no one else wants to take care of him doesn't mean that I HAVE to take care of him and get abused doing it. It's going to be very painful (for both of us) but I have to leave him to God.

Someone else commented about ultimately provoking them to change their mind and kick the nonBPD out. I don't know if I will be able to do that either, because mine doesn't usually kick me out. What I am doing now is trying to keep a boring outer facade that does not "wake him up" to the changes inside of me and the planning/steps I'm taking to prepare. Once everything is ready I will just look for the best moment. It will never be the perfect moment. So I will look for the safest, best choice and just take the leap.

I wish you well in your journey, thank you for responding!

[Reawakening]

Hi Reawakening, 

I'm glad you are here, posting and sharing with us. Btw, welcome! Glad to have you as part of our family. Since I don't know your story, is your DH (dear husband) BPD? My exH was not BPD, but he often reminded me of my uBPDm with some of his behaviors. It can be scary to be in an environment where you feel unsafe and may very well literally be unsafe.

Here is an important link that can provide some good information for you:

https://bpdfamily.com/pdfs/safety-first-dv-1.pdf

It sounds like you have some solid plans in place already. My T suggested that I have items stored off site, away from my home and not in my car, such as at a friends house. Is that an option you have?

I'm glad you have been saving some money. Are the accounts where the money is only in your name so that he cannot get access to them? I planned for quite some time to leave, never knowing when. My situation was such that every evening after work my purse went on my chair in the same place by the door with my key attached to my purse, shoes there by my chair that I could slip on, and a coat on my chair. My T helped me to plan, and the link above will also help you to plan.

The more prepared you are, the better you will feel. It is important first of all to be safe and stay safe, not only physically but also mentally, spiritually, and financially. Tell me about the support system you have. An option about the computers might be that you have another one there that you can replace it with. A used computer store might have some available, including monitors. When I left, I planned a trip out of town and let him know about that, then I didn't come back. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Looking forward to hearing more from you.

 
Wools

Hi Wools, thanks so much for your message. My H is undiagnosed, to my knowledge. He was diagnosed bipolar in the past but I believe that was a misdiagnosis, and he has not been in treatment for anything for the past 10 years or so. I believe he has mostly traits of BPD, and some traits of NPD, specifically covert NPD. Interestingly, last time I left he reconnected with his former therapist for help. After I came back I went to see her for one session (and was hoping for him to continue going to her or for us to go together - never happened). During that one session she didn't specifically say BPD, but she did use terms like "splitting" and I nodded quickly and we made what I think was meaningful eye contact. Is "splitting" a common trait to any other disorder, or were we letting each other know that we knew? I've always wondered about that.

I have looked at the safety resources but I will again, thank you for sharing.

Yes, I agree about the car...that is my first step to get stuff to the trunk. It is difficult to meet up with other family members right now (it is always a fight) but as soon as I can meet up with them I will move stuff from my trunk to theirs and they will bring it to their house to store it.

My accounts are only in my name, so yes that is a blessing. He cannot access them.

I think the mental and spiritual safety are the biggest challenges for me. Thank you for bringing that up. I can think through the physical and financial safety steps and move through those. (the replacement computer monitors to leave on the desk are a genius idea that I didn't think of - thank you!) Mentally and spiritually, I have to strengthen my boundaries and resolve to leave...and then I have to not let them get broken down and ultimately come back. That is where I slipped last time. I gave in to his crying and pleading and promises to change. I can't do that again. I have to keep going and stay away and get my daughter and I to our own home/apartment. I am visualizing that place down to the details with the hope/plan of calling that vision up whenever I need to remember what I am walking towards, so I don't slip back into the FOG and get stuck again. I have one friend who has known for awhile, two other friends that I just recently opened up to again, and one family member knows who I will be staying with. The family member I actually just told yesterday, and that kind of feels like "there's no going back now" which feels good and hopeful and scary. Does that make sense? I plan to set up a T as soon as I leave. If you have other ideas/suggestions for mental/spiritual safety I would love them - these are my remaining "weak points" I think.

[Kaylina15]

Hi Kaylina, thanks for posting. It does help to know that I am not alone.

I can totally relate to the pwBPD's trouble dealing with separation. I am not able to go anywhere overnight. This has hampered my career growth and also just my enjoyment of life (in my life before him, I loved to travel and visit friends and family). It is a fight lately just for me to visit family that is 20 minutes away for a few hours. Even when I'm gone for an hour or two to family or the store, I have to be tied to my phone and constantly check in. It's exhausting and it feels horrible.

I also relate to feeling guilt about him not having a support system. I am telling myself more and more, though, that I need to leave him in God's hands and the fact that he does not have a great support system here is because he pushed people away or they chose to move away and that is ultimately not my responsibility. Just because no one else wants to take care of him doesn't mean that I HAVE to take care of him and get abused doing it. It's going to be very painful (for both of us) but I have to leave him to God.

Someone else commented about ultimately provoking them to change their mind and kick the nonBPD out. I don't know if I will be able to do that either, because mine doesn't usually kick me out. What I am doing now is trying to keep a boring outer facade that does not "wake him up" to the changes inside of me and the planning/steps I'm taking to prepare. Once everything is ready I will just look for the best moment. It will never be the perfect moment. So I will look for the safest, best choice and just take the leap.

I wish you well in your journey, thank you for responding!

Reawakening: mine would drink every time I would go away to visit them or even if i went out with a friend at night, he would drink. I would get drunk texts saying how lonely he was or how unfair it was that I was out partying (i don't "party") while he had all the responsibilities of the house. He still tries to guilt me about those. " you're going to leave and have no responsiblities etc.."  I've told him i will help him sell the house if that is what he wants to do. I feel that way about checking in too. Even though I told him I wouldn't really contact him while I am away, I'm still doing it because I feel bad.

About the support system..i have told him that it has been his choice that he has no one else but me. He chooses to not reach out to people because he is introverted,  and i am not responsible for that, and i know that. Ultimately, i did tell him that if he was really struggling,  i would help him get through it, just to appease him. And maybe i would be there for him if it was a desperate situation...but I am not going to be his security blanket anymore. But I am also not cold hearted and he is getting treated (for bipolar-anxiety), and i am proud of him for that, so if he needs any support from ms, I try to give it in a way he can grasp that is just friendship.  Because i do want us to be friends. We shared half a lifetime together and raised our son together.  So my process has been slow and steady, kind, compassionate,  and self-caring.

I hope you can leave in a calm manner and not have him blow up in your face! All the best to you!

[Reawakening]

Hi everyone,

Everything that can be done ahead of time is ready. Now I need to gather the strength and courage to walk out the door when the opportunity arises. I’ve been waiting for him to start a fight and drive off in a rage as he often does, but of course now that I want it to happen it’s not. Somehow I think it would be easier if I left during a fight rather than when he’s just out for groceries or sleeping. Maybe it doesn’t matter in the end.

If you left, how did you take that final step out the door?

[Rev]

Hi everyone,

Everything that can be done ahead of time is ready. Now I need to gather the strength and courage to walk out the door when the opportunity arises. I’ve been waiting for him to start a fight and drive off in a rage as he often does, but of course now that I want it to happen it’s not. Somehow I think it would be easier if I left during a fight rather than when he’s just out for groceries or sleeping. Maybe it doesn’t matter in the end.

If you left, how did you take that final step out the door?

Hello again,

So here you are - the act of leaving and it's the first step of having be the new you.

It really does matter how you leave. You want to leave in such a way that you have no regrets for having said something or done something that you will never be able to take back.

You want to leave in such a way that you leave for yourself and not for him. If there is unexpressed anger that you need to vent - you do that later - you don't give him the benefit of anything that is personal. You be true to the best version of yourself. However that looks like.

Personally - although she kicked me out ... provoked it. And then ... I just stopped talking. And I found this place and did all my venting here.

You got this my friend...

You asked me to pray for clarity.   Do you see your beautiful self clearly now?  Treat her well. She deserves to leave with all her dignity intact.

Hope that makes sense.

Rev

[once removed]

hi Reawakening,

we have a comprehensive guide on leaving these challenging relationships here: https://bpdfamily.com/pdfs/carver.pdf

one of the most important elements is knowing your motivations for leaving, and understanding what is holding you back.

for example, some of us (myself included) have exited, or made an effort to exit a relationship more as a means to get a partner to see the light and make changes. some of us (myself included) have done so as a means of trying to win a fight or get what we want.

not suggesting here that those are the motivations driving you. my point is more that some motivations are dubious. be clear, as clear as can be, on whether you want to leave, and why. because if you choose to do so, thats what will ultimately sustain you.

it may be even more important to discern what is holding you back. is it a fear of safety? is it a sense of FOG? is it hope? because whatever it is should inform your decision strategically.

I broke NC after a week because I listened to his crying messages about how he had already started regular therapy, anger management, and meetings with the pastor. I got charmed and love bombed and came back after 3 weeks.

for example, if you have made up your mind that youre done, but are primarily struggling with how to go about it, and youre susceptible to returning out of a sense of obligation, or guilt, then youre going to need to erect some pretty high walls in the short term. youre going to need to reroute emails to the trash, not listen to voicemails, the whole nine yards. put yourself in a position where you wont be on the receiving end of any contact for a while. wait until youre feeling stronger to listen or engage...maybe have a trusted friend or family member listen if there may be anything you genuinely need to know.

I’ve been waiting for him to start a fight and drive off in a rage as he often does, but of course now that I want it to happen it’s not. Somehow I think it would be easier if I left during a fight rather than when he’s just out for groceries or sleeping. Maybe it doesn’t matter in the end.

in general, if you are really done, leaving is a hard choice that needs to be made, that is not dependent on what he does or doesnt do.

if you are struggling with leaving, then the relationship is at a point where youre waiting for the last line to be crossed. not only could that never happen, a lot of us are pretty adept at moving the line. he can sense it, on some level. anyone in his position will act accordingly.

moreover, it could be an unsafe approach, and/or it could be an impulsive move that you may be inclined to go back on.

[Reawakening]

Thank you Rev and Once removed, you have both helped a lot and I will respond more fully when I am able to collect myself.

I am looking for an opportunity to leave today. He is supposed to be finally going to the store at some point and I’m going to take that opportunity to go.

Briefly once removed, I think the part that I’m struggling with is the FOG. I am clear on wanting to go. I have had to erase myself to be in this relationship and I’m not willing to do that anymore, and I’m not willing to have my D12 erase herself. I have given many many chances and 12 years of my life. I am in my early 40’s with (hopefully) lots more life to live and I am clear that I want to spend it differently than this.

Today I am feeling sick to my stomach and jittery. I have been ready and waiting for the opportunity for a few days. He has cycled between weepy victim, raging toddler; and total dysregulation, and the cycles are moving more quickly. Last night in the middle of the night he woke me up and said, “I just had a nightmare. I know you are going to leave me after coronavirus.” I half asleep said, “what? No”. He grabbed my hand and flashed the light in his eyes and said, “you can tell me. Please just tell me”. I simply said no and pretended to go back to sleep (meanwhile my heart was pounding and I wanted to be sick). It is common for him to disrupt my sleep with either raging or crying. This was especially unsettling.

I know I have the strength to do this and I know it’s also going to be really hard. I found a T and I am making an appt with her soon. Her “specialty” is healing from emotional abuse and narcissistic abuse and I have a really good feeling about her. 

I just want to push through and get this part over with today. The constant hyper vigilance and “ready at any moment” state is taking a toll on D12 and me. Especially with the more rapid cycling. Please send me prayers, energy, vibes or whatever you believe in today. Thank you all so much.

[onthewater79]

Godspeed, Reawakening. I am at a similar stage with a very similar partner. I have been greywashing as of late, and he is certainly attuned to that now, and alternates personalities (pity object, bully, manipulator) quite frequently. He is lying and says he knows my plan and has talked w/ my parents, which is a well-worn strategy to trip me up and get intel from me. And of course my FOG is rolling in on a daily basis now.

This is hard stuff and I'm hoping things go well for you.

[Rev]

Hey ...

All normal...  lots of very powerful emotions that swirl at times like this...  can't avoid it - just pass through it.

Godspeed as someone said.

You got this.

Hugs.

Rev

[Reawakening]

Hi everyone,

Just a quick update to let you know we are away and safe. Feeling good and grateful. More later...

[Rev]

Godspeed, Reawakening. I am at a similar stage with a very similar partner. I have been greywashing as of late, and he is certainly attuned to that now, and alternates personalities (pity object, bully, manipulator) quite frequently. He is lying and says he knows my plan and has talked w/ my parents, which is a well-worn strategy to trip me up and get intel from me. And of course my FOG is rolling in on a daily basis now.

This is hard stuff and I'm hoping things go well for you.

Godspeed to you too.

Rev

[once removed]

keep us posted.