Out of the blue contact - We knew it was coming...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Ragdolllover,

I gave my ex a second chance after receiving a very similar letter.

Most of us have been where you are. Know that we are not judging you, we will support you, no matter what!

B53

Very much to the point - these two things.   

On second chances - I gave my ex many in my five year relationship. It only ever got worse. Things getting worse is a common story.  It took two very good friends the make sure I didn't go back once I was out.  To be honest, I finally got to a place that I was afraid of myself and my judgement because I was, with reason, very afraid of her.

So on to the second point - we have all been at the place where we search for our voice of self compassion. And so we WILL support you until you find that sweet spot where your voice of self-compassion can be heard.

Be well. Stay safe.

Peace and light to you.

Rev

[Rev]

Ragdolllover,

I gave my ex a second chance after receiving a very similar letter.

Most of us have been where you are. Know that we are not judging you, we will support you, no matter what!

B53

Very much to the point - these two things.   

On second chances - I gave my ex many in my five year relationship. It only ever got worse. Things getting worse is a common story.  It took two very good friends the make sure I didn't go back once I was out.  To be honest, I finally got to a place that I was afraid of myself and my judgement because I was, with reason, very afraid of her.

So on to the second point - we have all been at the place where we search for our voice of self compassion. And so we WILL support you until you find that sweet spot where your voice of self-compassion can be heard.

Be well. Stay safe.

Peace and light to you.

Rev

[B53]

Ragdolllover,

I’m starting to think they have a some sixth sense, that lets them know that we are finally moving on and have a chance for happiness?

My ex just called me after four months and left a voice mail. I didn’t answer, didn’t listen, deleted both. The last chance I gave him, cured me of any fantasy of happily ever after. For me there did come a point of no return. I’m not conflicted.  I have a bad feeling about this. 

I so wish I had that nice guy you were talking about!

B53

[grumpydonut]

And to add to the above.

I gave mine a second chance when she cheated on me. She said it meant nothing, she didn't really know or like him, and he basically raped her.

6 months later, she ghosted, sent mixed messages, would come running back when I threatened to cut her off. Said she needed time to "fix myself".

Guess what...she was seeing the bloke she cheated on me with, and is still dating him a year later.

[Ragdolllover]

Thank you so much everyone. I know there's no judgement here, just as I wouldn't judge anyone here, but I do like hearing the harsh truths from you all, it's been very helpful. And I know so many of you have lived this exact moment too...

Don't worry! New bf is still here, we actually just had a lovely staycation in the south of the UK this weekend. He knows the ex is messaging me and has been super supportive. He even said, "well you got over him last time he left you, and that time you were on your own. This time you have me here to help you and support you". He knows it's hard and bringing back all the pain...

My mum helped me see something though... That it isn't an either/or situation. It's not my exBPD or nice new guy. I need to look at them differently. Do I want to get back with ex? Yes or no? Do I want to be with nice guy? Yes or not? Her point was it's not just ex or nice guy. Because she knows I'm comparing and knows I keep thinking, but some parts are just not as good or as fulfilling. My mum's main advice was not to settle. She is concerned that new nice guy, although very nice, isn't really right for me and maybe I am settling so as not to get hurt. And she keeps telling me she is positive I will meet someone who makes my heart skip, who doesn't have BPD...

You are all right. 12 weeks isn't enough to heal 34 years of BPD, I am sure, and although he has another 12 weeks coming up, he seems to think he is "cured" regardless. There has been a change in him over the last few messages for sure. From telling me he was dying and had a fatal heart condition intially - which is why he reached out... to now being positive and saying that all he can think about is the potential bright future we may have... But it all still feels like part of the condition. Charming his way back into my life, as you say...  And I don't want to cycle again if he 're-realises' his ex is "the one" all over again...

The other thing I can't shake is that when I did meet him, my heart *didn't* skip a beat... Actually, all I felt was the hurt and pain come back to the surface. I kind of hated him. I refused to laugh at his jokes because I didn't want to give him the satisfaction. I avoided eye contact and the times I cried were when I told him about the pain he caused me, not when he spoke about our "potential bright future"...

Do any of you feel like this? It's like I only know it was "the best I've ever felt" and "the most in love I've ever been" and "the happiest and most at peace" because I said it aloud to lots of people, family, friends, on this forum, to myself, in my diary etc. But I can't actually really remember feeling those things now. I think I have just subconsciously blocked all these feelings and emotions.

If I was to let my exBPD back in, it would take a lot of work. Rebuilding trust, rebuilding out relationship, probably doing some couples counseling if we took it seriously... And even then, I'm not sure it I can ever trust him again...

Perhaps it was closure for me to see him and see that I feel like this, I hope it was. I think regardless of new nice guy, this needs to be over with my ex.

I need to block him once and for all and move on.

And if things don't work out with new nice guy, I need the strength to keep looking forward, not behind.

[Rev]

You are all right. 12 weeks isn't enough to heal 34 years of BPD, I am sure, and although he has another 12 weeks coming up, he seems to think he is "cured" regardless. There has been a change in him over the last few messages for sure.

But it all still feels like part of the condition. Charming his way back into my life, as you say...  And I don't want to cycle again if he 're-realises' his ex is "the one" all over again...

Perhaps it was closure for me to see him and see that I feel like this, I hope it was. I think regardless of new nice guy, this needs to be over with my ex.

I need to block him once and for all and move on.

And if things don't work out with new nice guy, I need the strength to keep looking forward, not behind.

Hi Ragdoll,

I've intentionally reduced what you wrote so that you can see it at it's most basic.

Here's a rule of thumb that I learned at a workshop on grief. The doctor was saying that for every year together, it's about 1 month of processing time. Now that doesn't mean that you wait 35 months before dating again. Nor does it mean 35 months of gloom. What it means is that, generally, you can expect a certain amount of time to process who you are, where you are at, etc. And as you process, you can expect the ambiguity to fade.

Now that's with a death. But I have found that it applies somewhat. It took me much longer than that - and when I realized that I was past the so-called one-month-per-year thing, and was still ruminating about the relationship, even though I was in a new one with a great person, it became clear that the ruminations, although about my ex on the surface, were not really about her at all, but more about what I really wanted for my life, etc.

All in all, that really helped me be realistic about my relationship and keep moving forward.

Hang in there.

Rev

[grumpydonut]

Hey Ragdoll,

Very similar thoughts to ones I have had.

In addition to your Mum's advice, here's something else to consider:

Do you want to re-enter an already damaged relationship with someone who you know you cannot trust JUST BECAUSE you are fearful you'll not find another connection like the one you had? That sounds like settling, also.

[Sappho11]

This is currently one of my favourite threads, because I'm in the situation you were in half a year ago -- hoping for my ex to "see the light", apologise, come back and (hopefully) live up to all the promises he made.

He knows the ex is messaging me and has been super supportive. He even said, "well you got over him last time he left you, and that time you were on your own. This time you have me here to help you and support you". He knows it's hard and bringing back all the pain...

That kind of support sounds like a dream come true. You don't seem to be convinced however (and your mum is right with her advice) -- is there something wrong about him?

From telling me he was dying and had a fatal heart condition intially - which is why he reached out... to now being positive and saying that all he can think about is the potential bright future we may have... But it all still feels like part of the condition. Charming his way back into my life, as you say...  And I don't want to cycle again if he 're-realises' his ex is "the one" all over again...

My ex told me in the very beginning that he had wasted most of his adolescence alone, until he falsely diagnosed himself with early-onset Parkinson's disease. That kind of hypochondria was a huge turn-off even with rose-tinted glasses on. Seems to be a common thing though.

And same story as yours, he left his ex for me, only to keep in touch with her for the entirety of our relationship, of which she spent half living under the same roof as him... she still had her things at his place after eight months and is still driving with his mother's car on a daily basis to this day.

I'm almost one-hundred percent certain they're in touch now. He cried to me about her and he's likely to cry to her about me.

Triangulation is real. It's a horrible situation to be in.

The other thing I can't shake is that when I did meet him, my heart *didn't* skip a beat... Actually, all I felt was the hurt and pain come back to the surface. I kind of hated him. I refused to laugh at his jokes because I didn't want to give him the satisfaction. I avoided eye contact and the times I cried were when I told him about the pain he caused me, not when he spoke about our "potential bright future"...

Future faking is such a low manipulation tactic. I fell for it, too. When he broke up with me the first time and came back after two weeks (because none of his former female friends wanted anything to do with him, no less), he promised me the world and more, just like the beginning. Within a month and a half he had broken every single promise he had made, blaming it on me (!) -- saying that I couldn't reasonably have expected him to follow through.

Do any of you feel like this? It's like I only know it was "the best I've ever felt" and "the most in love I've ever been" and "the happiest and most at peace" because I said it aloud to lots of people, family, friends, on this forum, to myself, in my diary etc. But I can't actually really remember feeling those things now. I think I have just subconsciously blocked all these feelings and emotions.

Yes, constantly. I have a long list of situations and things he said which hurt me, and yet I often find myself longing for his company. He sometimes was loving and the perfect partner -- but only very sporadically, and very rarely towards the end. The psychological impact of intermittent reinforcement is powerful.

Another lady in another thread shared the wisdom of her parents, which boiled down to "A healthy partner will do these things ALL of the time, not just some of the time". Difficult to remember, but important.

If I was to let my exBPD back in, it would take a lot of work. Rebuilding trust, rebuilding out relationship, probably doing some couples counseling if we took it seriously... And even then, I'm not sure it I can ever trust him again...

Same problem here, and going by my experience, the second attempt will likely be even worse, because a person with BPD generally doesn't have the skills/capabilities/responsibility to actually repair the damage they have done.

I can only speak for myself but our second attempt was almost completely hellish. Few highs, lots of the lowest lows. It got so bad that I struggled to function in everyday situations completely unrelated to him because I got so caught up in the toxic dynamic.

Perhaps it was closure for me to see him and see that I feel like this, I hope it was. I think regardless of new nice guy, this needs to be over with my ex.

I need to block him once and for all and move on.

And if things don't work out with new nice guy, I need the strength to keep looking forward, not behind.

That's the spirit. Whatever you decide, I'm (and many others here are) rooting for you. 

[Ragdolllover]

Thanks for all the support guys!

...the ruminations, although about my ex on the surface, were not really about her at all, but more about what I really wanted for my life, etc.

This. All of this. I do think I've blocked a lot of the happiest memories of being with him, subconsciously as a mechanism to deal with the pain I think... But looking back, all of the 'good bits' or things that I loved about him were really just the top priority things I look and hope for in a relationship.

I guess you have your relationship checklist in a way. It's not a fully conscious thing, not really. But there's the "must haves", the "nice to haves" and the "cheeky bonuses".

You have an idea of a "perfect partner" and the BPD paints an extraordinary vision of this for you...

But, like you say, that probably speaks more about what I need rather than what he was/is.

And unfortunately high up on the 'must haves', possibly even #1, is trust and that has been completely broken...

Do you want to re-enter an already damaged relationship with someone who you know you cannot trust JUST BECAUSE you are fearful you'll not find another connection like the one you had? That sounds like settling, also.

This is also true. Thanks for adding this.

My ex told me in the very beginning that he had wasted most of his adolescence alone, until he falsely diagnosed himself with early-onset Parkinson's disease. That kind of hypochondria was a huge turn-off even with rose-tinted glasses on. Seems to be a common thing though.

Yes the hypochondria has been present throughout the whole time I have known him. There is always some kind of serious condition he is dealing with. And often viewed as "him against the world", nobody could ever understand what he goes through etc. etc...

One thing that worried me when we met was his fairly fresh scars on his forearms. The way he showed me and how he spoke of them was almost with pride. Like, "look how bad I was, I even did all this to myself. So I was really bad and that's why I treated you like I did - aka I have an excuse. But now I'm better and not ashamed..." I mean, it's very brave to not be ashamed of self harm and to get through times like that. It's very courageous. But I couldn't help but feel it was just too much self-absorption. Like he showed them off to me because he knows it's brave...

The other thing which I notice time and time again now with how he speaks and acts, is that every single negative thing, his actions or harsh words, they were NOT HIM, they were his condition and he can't control it and didn't want to do it. But all the 'good bits' and affection and love and care, that was ALL HIM and not at all related to his condition.

Again, it's hard because it feels uncomfortable demonising someone because of a mental illness which we don't have ourselves and can never fully understand. But it's exactly this black and white thinking which he is using now to try and absolve all his wrongdoings and remove any responsibility etc. Also, not understanding that a lot of the affection is 'love-bombing' and a part of the BPD in itself...

Future faking is such a low manipulation tactic.

Yes I guess I never really saw it like this, as a form of manipulation, but it absolutely is, isn't it...

OK, I think I know what I need to do, but it's not going to be easy.

I will let you know how it goes *fingers crossed*