Shame will keep them away

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

So much good stuff in this thread. 1.5 years out, still ruminating, still very, very confused, still wondering if she will contact me. I've excerpted some of the things you all have written in here, just to say 'exactly, me too' with some brief thoughts. I'm grateful for the community, there are so many heart-centered people here, willing to share and discuss things.

The original subject was will shame keep them away. I've thought that very thing. She ditched me over the holidays, ghosted me and left town, mocked me and snapped at me in front of her family the week before, humiliating me. The last we spoke I said, gently, "honey, my experience was ...(the above)". She exploded, called me all sorts of names, then told me she needed someone who would show up for her (I always did, even at last second requests) and someone who didn't melt under pressure (she told me I melted into the floor when she snapped at me at a show with her family- I did not, I gave her a quizzical look...that's it).

One night, early on, post coitus she started crying.  I asked, "What's wrong?" She said through the tears, "It just doesn't matter, it just won't work out, 1 year or 10 years, it won't work!"
    She cried once...after coitus, and asked me if I would take care of her. I said of course I will. Later I was accused of not being able to take care of her because she didn't think my books were arranged on a shelf well.

 She made up excuses repeatedly for not meeting my family and even friends.  That's a thing, it seems.

She refused to come to my functions at my business, mocked my friends when I suggested I have a party for her to meet them and vice versa ("why would I want to be around these people?"), refused to come with me to my hometown ("no, why would I want to go there. you haven't made it seem very nice") when I went on long tours of her hometown with her.

Once, when she was describing her husband's manipulative tendencies to me, I remember looking at her and thinking, "That's kind of what you do."

She complained about her ex-husband constantly, called him a liar and manipulative and an abuser. I often thought, wait...this is how you are acting.

She knew to say that I was engaging (or others) in a behavior before it was even clear that behavior was evident.  So skillful was she that I would wonder, 'am I manipulating her by asking her to go to lunch at noon?'   'I haven't seen her in 10 days, is having lunch too controlling (for a girl like her)?'

I found myself asking the exact same question. Is she going to think I'm being controlling by asking her to lunch? Also, many times would go days without seeing her, days without her responding to a text or call. Or just plain ignoring lunch invitation (by text, then phone thinking she didn't get the text...didn't answer the phone, never responded at all).

In our first phase our talks always were about her ex, his manipulation, keeping her short, no direct financial access, control and lack of interest and attention. I felt so sorry for her, I did not see that she had a part to in his behaviour. Because of all the PLEASE READ she was in and her constant diversion to the behaviour of her ex, we never talked about us and our relation.

So much. CONSTANT talking about her ex. She would even send me his emails and texts, then call to discuss them. She had me go on his Facebook page to see if there was a companion with him on a trip he took. 75% of our conversations were about him, what a jerk he was, how he was an NPD abuser. I bring up something in my life, immediate cutoff, or "I thought I told you...", "I don't have time for your emotions".

My ex was no longer in therapy, hadn't been for years, and when I asked if we could do therapy together, she became a little angry for even making the suggestion. That showed me her dedication to our relationship.

She told me she had CPTSD from her abusive marriage, but took care of it with EMDR years ago. Always told me I needed therapy though, exploded at me once when I asked her why she wasn't communicating over several days, telling me I need help. Embarrassingly, I did an attachment style inventory after that to see what was wrong with me (she was ghosting me on purpose- admitted it later when I told her that ignoring calls and texts for days at a time is confusing and hurtful and dehumanizing-that's why she exploded when I asked why she wasn't communicating), and when I told her I'd share the results with her she didn't want to see it. I asked her what her style was, she condescendingly told me 'secure', of course. By the way, CPTSD apparently looks a lot like BPD.

I guess there was a limit, or conditions, to what she would do as a partner. Her idea of having a partner hit a wall when she realized that she would have to do certain things that a "partner" asked of her. That's a true partnership

I did anything and everything for her, was happy to. Wanted to. In our two year relationship, I can't think of a single thing she helped me out with. Never even offered. Shamed me for "not taking care of her when she was sick". I tried, tried. Called her and texted her and kept asking how she was feeling and what I could do for her, she kept saying she didn't need anything. Then, confused and sensing I was doing something wrong, tried suggesting some things I could do, she rejected them and said she didn't need anything. Then, she stopped responding to me, later told me she turned off her phone, for 3 days, angry at me that "I didn't take care of her...my friends know what to do without asking". When I was under the weather...nothing.

Essentially saying, "I'm a child, care for me".  You're 49, you should be fine


Crying "will you take care of me". Then, later, yelling "you can't take care of me." My books are not arranged the way she thinks they should be "you can't take care of me, look at your bookshelves". Actual quote.

The sneaky way of behaving, gaslighting and so so many (little) lies made me lose sight of reality. Her slyly way of communicating and occasional compliments towards me created a fog so you couldn't see what was going on and gave me the conviction that I was the best and sweetest for her. I still am convinced it was true love and somewhere I screwed up.

I am, in the last 1.5 years, slowly recognizing all the sly evasive answers to questions that were completely naive and not intended as 'gotchas' at all, since I didn't think she would want or need to hide anything from me, the lies, gaslighting she constantly engaged in with me. They are so clear now.

And yet, yet. I think somehow I screwed up, I feel deep remorse and that I threw away a deep and powerful love.

[jaded7]

So much good stuff in this thread. 1.5 years out, still ruminating, still very, very confused, still wondering if she will contact me. I've excerpted some of the things you all have written in here, just to say 'exactly, me too' with some brief thoughts. I'm grateful for the community, there are so many heart-centered people here, willing to share and discuss things.

The original subject was will shame keep them away. I've thought that very thing. She ditched me over the holidays, ghosted me and left town, mocked me and snapped at me in front of her family the week before, humiliating me. The last we spoke I said, gently, "honey, my experience was ...(the above)". She exploded, called me all sorts of names, then told me she needed someone who would show up for her (I always did, even at last second requests) and someone who didn't melt under pressure (she told me I melted into the floor when she snapped at me at a show with her family- I did not, I gave her a quizzical look...that's it).

One night, early on, post coitus she started crying.  I asked, "What's wrong?" She said through the tears, "It just doesn't matter, it just won't work out, 1 year or 10 years, it won't work!"
    She cried once...after coitus, and asked me if I would take care of her. I said of course I will. Later I was accused of not being able to take care of her because she didn't think my books were arranged on a shelf well.

 She made up excuses repeatedly for not meeting my family and even friends.  That's a thing, it seems.

She refused to come to my functions at my business, mocked my friends when I suggested I have a party for her to meet them and vice versa ("why would I want to be around these people?"), refused to come with me to my hometown ("no, why would I want to go there. you haven't made it seem very nice") when I went on long tours of her hometown with her.

Once, when she was describing her husband's manipulative tendencies to me, I remember looking at her and thinking, "That's kind of what you do."

She complained about her ex-husband constantly, called him a liar and manipulative and an abuser. I often thought, wait...this is how you are acting.

She knew to say that I was engaging (or others) in a behavior before it was even clear that behavior was evident.  So skillful was she that I would wonder, 'am I manipulating her by asking her to go to lunch at noon?'   'I haven't seen her in 10 days, is having lunch too controlling (for a girl like her)?'

I found myself asking the exact same question. Is she going to think I'm being controlling by asking her to lunch? Also, many times would go days without seeing her, days without her responding to a text or call. Or just plain ignoring lunch invitation (by text, then phone thinking she didn't get the text...didn't answer the phone, never responded at all).

In our first phase our talks always were about her ex, his manipulation, keeping her short, no direct financial access, control and lack of interest and attention. I felt so sorry for her, I did not see that she had a part to in his behaviour. Because of all the PLEASE READ she was in and her constant diversion to the behaviour of her ex, we never talked about us and our relation.

So much. CONSTANT talking about her ex. She would even send me his emails and texts, then call to discuss them. She had me go on his Facebook page to see if there was a companion with him on a trip he took. 75% of our conversations were about him, what a jerk he was, how he was an NPD abuser. I bring up something in my life, immediate cutoff, or "I thought I told you...", "I don't have time for your emotions".

My ex was no longer in therapy, hadn't been for years, and when I asked if we could do therapy together, she became a little angry for even making the suggestion. That showed me her dedication to our relationship.

She told me she had CPTSD from her abusive marriage, but took care of it with EMDR years ago. Always told me I needed therapy though, exploded at me once when I asked her why she wasn't communicating over several days, telling me I need help. Embarrassingly, I did an attachment style inventory after that to see what was wrong with me (she was ghosting me on purpose- admitted it later when I told her that ignoring calls and texts for days at a time is confusing and hurtful and dehumanizing-that's why she exploded when I asked why she wasn't communicating), and when I told her I'd share the results with her she didn't want to see it. I asked her what her style was, she condescendingly told me 'secure', of course. By the way, CPTSD apparently looks a lot like BPD.

I guess there was a limit, or conditions, to what she would do as a partner. Her idea of having a partner hit a wall when she realized that she would have to do certain things that a "partner" asked of her. That's a true partnership

I did anything and everything for her, was happy to. Wanted to. In our two year relationship, I can't think of a single thing she helped me out with. Never even offered. Shamed me for "not taking care of her when she was sick". I tried, tried. Called her and texted her and kept asking how she was feeling and what I could do for her, she kept saying she didn't need anything. Then, confused and sensing I was doing something wrong, tried suggesting some things I could do, she rejected them and said she didn't need anything. Then, she stopped responding to me, later told me she turned off her phone, for 3 days, angry at me that "I didn't take care of her...my friends know what to do without asking". When I was under the weather...nothing.

Essentially saying, "I'm a child, care for me".  You're 49, you should be fine


Crying "will you take care of me". Then, later, yelling "you can't take care of me." My books are not arranged the way she thinks they should be "you can't take care of me, look at your bookshelves". Actual quote.

The sneaky way of behaving, gaslighting and so so many (little) lies made me lose sight of reality. Her slyly way of communicating and occasional compliments towards me created a fog so you couldn't see what was going on and gave me the conviction that I was the best and sweetest for her. I still am convinced it was true love and somewhere I screwed up.

I am, in the last 1.5 years, slowly recognizing all the sly evasive answers to questions that were completely naive and not intended as 'gotchas' at all, since I didn't think she would want or need to hide anything from me, the lies, gaslighting she constantly engaged in with me. They are so clear now.

And yet, yet. I think somehow I screwed up, I feel deep remorse and that I threw away a deep and powerful love.

[Ad Meliora]

Jaded and Erfan.  I'll include the link to how to quote, there are some screen shots that help.  For some reason the FAQ section is now archived, maybe the moderators can help with that.  Here's the basics if you don't want to follow the link:

-- Just use quotation marks, "You guys are doing a good job." --Ad Meliora
-- Cut & Paste text from a post, use the button in the format tools that looks like a quote box and that will highlight your text in a quote box, add a name if you like.
--Click the "Excerpt" button in the post that you want to reply to.  The post shows up in your reply box with a header and a footer.  Delete the text you do not want, but keep the headers!  Then it will show their name on it.  Write your comments below the last header which will look something like "[ quote ]"

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=56733.0

Of course shame and guilt figure in.  This is an underlying driver of all their behaviors and shouldn't be confused with them not accepting responsibility for their actions.  They will never tell you about their feelings of shame, but their actions point to it though.  Heck, my BPDex never talked about her feelings at all! When I wanted to talk about mine she ran into the bedroom and played candy crush on her phone!

[rob66]

The most intriguing thing about everything is why she did not tell me she had a problem.

Yeah, that's pretty crazy; so many clues, but not actually admitting it. It seems like one more nebulous layer of their past-trauma manifestations. They're deep and dark.

Erfanovich, you will eventually realize that what you are really missing is the way you felt during the relationship. Once you figure out they way someone like that thinks, how you possibly miss, or pine for that? That's not what we want. What we miss is how we felt. Missing the feeling rather than the person is a good perspective to have and helps in feeling better faster. Honestly, 2.5 months out, and I can't even really see her in my mind without a slight shudder at the darkness in her mind. The feelings of love I experienced, however, remain singular, standing alone above the the experience of the relationship itself. That is what I miss. And that is the elevated state of existence we all want back.

[Ad Meliora]

The feelings of love I experienced, however, remain singular, standing alone above the the experience of the relationship itself. That is what I miss. And that is the elevated state of existence we all want back. ---Rob66

Bingo⁴

[rob66]

Ok, still not getting the quote thing correct. It's laughable. I really am much more capable than this makes it seem.

[Erfanovich]

She cried once...after coitus, and asked me if I would take care of her. I said of course I will. Later I was accused of not being able to take care of her because she didn't think my books were arranged on a shelf well.

I experienced the same. Crying after good en tender coitus she cried. I asked her why? She told me never felt so loved before...

Maybe a personal quenstion, but my ex told me all bad things about her e as I told you in water post,  also he was so teriible in bed. So even in love making my attention and concentration was all on her and satisfactioning for me, although I learned a lot and it was never a dull moment between the sheets, never had so much s*x and she always started.

Was the attention en pleasing the same for you all? And was the ex of the BPD also terrible in bed?

[Erfanovich]

I experienced the same. Crying after good en tender coitus she cried. I asked her why? She told me never felt so loved before...

Maybe a personal quenstion, but my ex told me all bad things about her e as I told you in water post,  also he was so teriible in bed. So even in love making my attention and concentration was all on her and satisfactioning for me, although I learned a lot and it was never a dull moment between the sheets, never had so much s*x and she always started.

Was the attention en pleasing the same for you all? And was the ex of the BPD also terrible in bed?

Terrible post.

Water = earlier post
It was never satisfactory for me

 

[Ad Meliora]

Was the attention en pleasing the same for you all? And was the ex of the BPD also terrible in bed?

No.  Reverse in almost all ways for me.  Inexperienced, though, and wanting to stick to basics.  Rarely did she initiate, being shy.  Always good, almost.  Yes to the crying, Jaded was quoting me as well.  We all had that experience.

So your ex wanted to have sex all the time, but the sex was terrible?  I think that deserves a  , wow.  That's a new one.

[Ad Meliora]

Erfan, no worries.  You can "Modify" your post within the first 30 minutes to fix spelling errors.  Look in the corner by the "Excerpt" button.  That way you don't have to make a new post.  It is primary for spelling/grammar changes and not to substantially change content as the moderators have described in the posting guidelines.

[ILMBPDC]

Ok, still not getting the quote thing correct. It's laughable. I really am much more capable than this makes it seem.

You are just putting your quote closing tag in the wrong spot. Or you are missing the close tag. tech nerd here, sorry if that makes no sense...basically for every (quote) tag you have to have a closing (/quote) tag - the text between those is what is quoted (and this forum uses square brackets not the curved ones I used as an example, so keep that in mind)

[ILMBPDC]

I experienced the same. Crying after good en tender coitus she cried. I asked her why? She told me never felt so loved before...

Maybe a personal quenstion, but my ex told me all bad things about her e as I told you in water post,  also he was so teriible in bed. So even in love making my attention and concentration was all on her and satisfactioning for me, although I learned a lot and it was never a dull moment between the sheets, never had so much s*x and she always started.

Was the attention en pleasing the same for you all? And was the ex of the BPD also terrible in bed?

We never discussed sex with his exes so I don't know what his opinion was of them.
My opinion of him though was it was...basic. He always just wanted missionary and really didn't seem to know or care how it was for me. The first few times, the emotions were crazy, I felt amazingly connected and his lack of finesse or skill didn't matter...by the last couple times, I felt like didn't really matter to him in the least that he was with me, I could have been anyone.  No connection at all. And that led to me telling him I felt used which led to him discarding me.

I keep hearing how mind blowing the sex is with a female BPD - maybe that is the difference, because I sure didn't get that with a male BPD.

[ILMBPDC]

Thx for your kind words, understanding and clear view of things. It helpes me understand and get things in perspective. It hurts to see that you have been where I am. I hope things are going well.

I am getting better every day. You will too.

In addition to my post: I have a therapist for a few weeks and things are going better. I do have  codependent behaviour, based on my past, esspecially containing emotions  ( and ignore them) and please others and think for them.

I am glad to hear it - and not at all surprised to hear that you have codependent tendencies - its pretty common for BPDs to find the codependent people,  we might be the only ones to actually put up with them

Still hurts me when I think of this, thinking to be special but I wasn't anymore for over a year. She did give me the special feeling  to the end and even when I broke up she told me I was special, and she would never get over it when she saw me with another woman, because she lost me forever. I know it is just all BS or a sort of stringing, but sometimes I'm not sure.

Yes, they have an innate need to feel validated and knowing that you are not over her validates her.

Things you say are bingo. My head tells me the same, my heart tells me otherwise. Just have to hang in there to wear it out.

Yes. It takes time. Sometimes a long time. I am the same way - 95% of me is rational and knows it wasn't real for him but 5% things "but only if..."  Bah.  (Actually its more like 99%/1% for me now. I've made a lot of progress on letting go recently.)

I just have a question: my friends tell me she will come back. I am so afraid of this to happen ( she did this before and all the things they warned me for happened). She lives 2 blocks away and haven't seen her for 5 months. I discovered she is asking around a bit in my surrounding. I am so afraid to melt again when I see her ( which is going to happen sometime!). How do you cope with that?

Its very common for them to come back - either to try and get back together or to just try and make sure they still have you on their string in case they  ever need you. Not always, but it is common.
When my ex started poking around again, I started over thinking it and getting worried and wondering about his motivation.  It was awful - like living through the discard again and he hadn't even said anything.  That's my own issue and I don't recommend it . 
Really, all you can do is work on yourself, learn to love yourself, learn that you are a whole person without her and that her treatment of you was wrong...and learn to believe that.  Once you have that in your head- and actually believe it - your whole outlook will change. You will change from wanting her to being angry with how she treated you. You absolutely do not deserve how she acted. You deserve a healthy relationship. She is not it.

[MeandThee29]

I just have a question: my friends tell me she will come back. I am so afraid of this to happen ( she did this before and all the things they warned me for happened). She lives 2 blocks away and haven't seen her for 5 months. I discovered she is asking around a bit in my surrounding. I am so afraid to melt again when I see her ( which is going to happen sometime!). How do you cope with that?

Again, thanks for your understanding and time to react...

It's tough, but make a plan and rehearse it in your mind. Some people even go to the place where they might run across their ex and practice what they will do. Do that over and over until it is in the fabric of your thinking.

After I refused reconcilation, the life coach I was seeing had me do that. What if he called? What if he texted? What if he showed up at my place? What if he showed up at places where he knew I'd be? I actually wrote it out and practiced it until the anxiety faded. He never did show up in that period, but then I was freaking out every time my divorce attorney mentioned going to trial. I just could not imagine meeting in a courtroom. My attorney's answer was much the same. He said he had a professional that would coach me step-by-step how to handle different scenarios so I could practice them. We could do a mock trial with one of the other lawyers in the office cross-examining. We would ride together in his car and enter the courthouse together. I could have anyone else I wanted with me, and he would have instructions for them.

Thankfully my ex lives far away and indeed never showed up even though he threatened that several years ago. The divorce settled without going to trial. So my concerns were a short-term issue, but I still know what I would do. 

[Cromwell]

My ex was very open to come back. I wonder if her approach was natural or manipulative, she'd play the helpless without me and 'me and you against the cruel world' card. In those moments I was and felt the centre of the universe. What's not to like its akin to bring godlike worshipped. Until it wears off.

As it always does. Or worse, the checkout operator at Costco who gave a friendly smile becomes the next to idolise, stalk, obsess over.

Anything external other than a dive into introspection and self analysis.

Cats are the borderlines of the animal world. If my ex goes out and gets no success at fed elsewhere of course its only natural she will pace back to my house and start nuzzling to be served again.

All that changed in these 3 years is within myself, not her, that i will not be a slave to anyone and I won't WAIT for anyone including my ex to. Somehow change that as a. Material fact.

[jaded7]

Please don't blame yourself. For her it was never true love - she had a phase of idealizing you and putting you on a pedestal. It made you feel amazing to have her love bombing you, you fell in love (or maybe it was just the oxytocin making you feel good). Then one day something happened - an innocent comment, a look, maybe you were 5 minutes late to pick her up, maybe you wore brown shoes with black slacks - and suddenly, in her eyes, you weren't perfect anymore... all the while stringing you along because she needs to know you are still on her string, that you will still validate her existence, before *she* makes the decision to cut you off.

Yeah I get this, I felt the same - that I alone could love him the way he needed, that I could help him, that we could heal together.
 

We have all been where you are. Its confusing, painful, feels like the end of the world. We are here for you

These words-something happened- really speak to me today. I remember a few months in the explosions started, just sudden anger and shaming words. The first was when I went to clear the dishes after dinner she made, trying to be respectful and courteous. I got to the sink with them and she suddenly starts freaking out "what are you doing, don't stack them like that! Stop!" when I was getting ready to rinse them for dishwasher. She then snapped "just put them back on the table!" I was dumfounded and confused. I placed them back on the table like she said, and a few minutes later suggested we go sit in the living room, which caused a second angry explosion and she jumped up to angrily start rinsing the dishes. Confused, I said 'Are you upset?". She said "You think I like waking up to dirty dishes in the morning?". I said no, I don't think that. Then, "and who puts dirty dishes back on the table?" I said, "you told me too". She ignored that. I offered to help, she angrily said no.

I was always being caught off guard by these kinds of reactions to things. I once called to say I'd go shopping for our camping trip food, and asked her for the list of items I knew she always kept. She got very angry, exploded and told me "You don't want to go shopping! You're just trying to cover your ass!" I said but I do want to go shopping to save you money and time? She then told me "You're worthless in a grocery store and I'd just have to fix it anyway, it'd take me more time.". Then she admitted she'd already gone shopping 3 days before.

Many, many more incidents just like this. And yet, I loved her. I miss her, 1.5 years later.  God, when I read this I'm horrified.

[jaded7]

Maybe a personal quenstion, but my ex told me all bad things about her e as I told you in water post,  also he was so teriible in bed. So even in love making my attention and concentration was all on her and satisfactioning for me, although I learned a lot and it was never a dull moment between the sheets, never had so much s*x and she always started.

Was the attention en pleasing the same for you all? And was the ex of the BPD also terrible in bed?

Sex became a very strange thing with us. When we were first speaking I told her that I had been sexually abused as a child, and sex is really vulnerable, sacred thing for me. I once told her after sex that I was scared that she'd leave me because she didn't like sex with me, and that would be really hurtful to me. Her response "I told my friend that it's the best sex I've had in 15 years". Which, wasn't really to the point.

Very soon in the relationship sex got strange. One night she came over to have a glass of wine on the deck, late, very unusual. Said she wanted to just destress from having her ex-husband in town (she said it scared her). I said of course, even though I need to get up at 5:20am. Around 10:30 she asked to go to bed for sex, and I very, very gently said "I'm sorry, I need to get to bed and I'm tired." She got VERY angry, 1 hour 'fight' followed.

Then she would sometimes point at me after saying "let's go to bed" and say "Are you going to get those off or what? (referring to my clothes).

She often would just get into bed, then turn away from me and wait for me to come to bed and start 'doing' things. I started to feel like an object, she started to snap and chastise me during sex, which made me very uncomfortable- remember, she said earlier the sex was the best in 15 years. I was doing nothing differently, same me...I was confused. It all felt very mechanical and I felt like a sex toy.

Then she withheld sex for months, ignored my requests to come over, when she did come over turned me down 4 times in 2 days. Later when I asked about what was going on, saying I'm confused and hurt that she's ignoring my texts to come over, she told me "it's your sexual abuse" that was causing me to feel bad.

Later, when I asked again what was going on, in GREAT anger, she admitted she'd been ignoring my requests for sex/connection because "I was reevaluating the relationship since I wasn't sure I wanted to be with someone who was so excited about a business partnership with that loser" (a person who is world famous, a household name in my industry, creator of an entire workout format that you would know, who loved my business and personally invited me to his home in CA to premiere a new piece of equipment with 20 other people from around the world). So she knew what she was doing the first time I asked, and decided to blame my sexual abuse for my hurt feelings.

Sex with her became a scary thing for me. I just wanted connection and closeness, all I cared about was her feeling good. I didn't even care about me...it was all about the connection for me.

[Erfanovich]

So your ex wanted to have sex all the time, but the sex was terrible?  I think that deserves a  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post), wow.  That's a new one. Smiling (click to insert in post)

I ment to say my ex BPD wanted sex all the time, a lot, at the most different places and sometimes promiscuous and extreme but it was  for her own satisfaction most of the times and not giving a lot of attention to me. She always stated her ex-husband was terrible and never enjoyed love making so I also tried to compensate that. I don't complain because I had my share and fun, but after a while I realized how she is and the ex-husband stories weren't true and part of playing the victim to get attention or to cover up her hypersexual behaviour. In fact her amazing body and 'easy willing' are the only strong points to get attention from men (in combinatie of playing victim and bad exes)

[Erfanovich]

Sex with her became a scary thing for me. I just wanted connection and closeness, all I cared about what her feeling good. I didn't even care about me...it was all about the connection.

Hi Jared!
I can relate on that. I too wanted connection and sometimes just lay to each other, spooning. It really never happend and always ended up in action. I sometimes realized that "no sex" is a rejection in their mind or a first sign of leaving? Of course not all BPD are the same but in my case she always made the move or just went on top... again, i did not complain and my friends told me I relived my puberty but that was the only thing my friends were jalous of...

[jaded7]

Hi Jared!
I can relate on that. I too wanted connection and sometimes just lay to each other, spooning. It really never happend and always ended up in action. I sometimes realized that "no sex" is a rejection in their mind or a first sign of leaving? Of course not all BPD are the same but in my case she always made the move or just went on top... again, i did not complain and my friends told me I relived my puberty but that was the only thing my friends were jalous of...

Exactly. I just wanted connection, closeness. Once I asked her to go to bed with me (she usually visited during the day) and she said she couldn't have sex because of that time of the month, and I said we can do other things or just be close, she emphatically shot that down. I would have enjoyed just holding each other, fully clothed.

Once when I reached to her as she came to bed (again turned away from me) and I put my arm around and began nuzzling up to her, I could tell she was just cold and distant. I asked her if she just wanted to go to sleep (very kindly, gently) and she exploded at me "________(my name), if you want sex touch me in a sexy way!" Said the woman who would point at me and tell me to get my clothes off. Said the woman who would just back into me in the morning, never even turning her head to me or saying a word.

One time, after many months not having sex (earlier in the relationship it was 2 times a week at least), after I had asked her the first time what was going on by ignoring my texts and calls to come over, now 2 months later we are spending the night together and she comes to bed so I reach out my arm to take her in, she physically knocks it away. Stunned, once she is in bed I again reach out to put my arm around her and she knocks it away again. I then ask, for the second time in 4 months, if there is something going on with our physical relationship and she EXPLODES. "You want to fight? Alright, let's fight! I'm fully awake now, let's go at it! Come on, let's fight!" I didn't want to fight. She then proceeds to yell at me, in bed, as I try to defend myself for over an hour. That's when she got so mad that she then admitted that she'd been withholding sex for months because of the business thing I wrote about above.

Geez. This is painful to write out.

[Cromwell]

Mornings were a complete different creature than the passion of the night prior. There is some science that alludez to an explanation, depression experienced up on awakening.

The more I studied the past the more aware of biochemical imbalances that play a role.there's not alot in terms of psychoanalysis that can alter a mind they is chemically imbalanced requiring medication intervention.

[Ad Meliora]

   She cried once...after coitus, and asked me if I would take care of her. I said of course I will. Later I was accused of not being able to take care of her because she didn't think my books were arranged on a shelf well.
===================================================

Crying "will you take care of me". Then, later, yelling "you can't take care of me." My books are not arranged the way she thinks they should be "you can't take care of me, look at your bookshelves". Actual quote.

Wow.  We had the same experience there, basically.  It makes sense that during sex, a state of heightened emotions, that the executive functioning goes to zero and it turns into a mini-meltdown.  The bookshelf stuff, that's bizarre, and a  .

You know Jaded, it's funny about the dishes as I had something go wrong there and I know others did too.  I was helping clean up her kitchen and putting dishes in the dishwasher.  She was in the other room on her phone.  I asked if the dishes already in the dishwasher were dirty or clean.  She started getting really mad and said "just look". I told her I couldn't tell.  She got up in a huff and said what "high maintenance" I was all the time and an idiot could figure it out.  She yanked open the dishwasher and looked...she looked some more...she looked yet some more and said, "Just put the dirty dishes in there and run it!"  I was just trying to be helpful, like you.

These words-something happened- really speak to me today.--Jaded

Good.  That's the point, and they will.  "A-ha" moments come from sharing, and reading other people's experiences.

It's funny hearing you guys complain about your partner wanting sex, but I get it.  It was the way you were treated.  They way we all were treated, before, during after.  She would question me during coitus: "Do you want me?" Umm, yeah..., now who is being Captain Obvious? 

However it works out as a behavior, the common thread is that it is another manipulation tool. Good, bad, or otherwise.

[grumpydonut]

On the week she cheated on me, she came home and got all upset over the dishes being in the sink. Went off.

Not washing dishes vs. letting someone else inside you. Seems about equal. I deserved it.

[Ad Meliora]

On the week she cheated on me, she came home and got all upset over the dishes being in the sink. Went off.

Not washing dishes vs. letting someone else inside you. Seems about equal. I deserved it.

Are you going for a second "Post of the Year" nomination? 

[Cromwell]

This feeling is the litmus test. It's a sign to me you lack the full undersdanding, you've not fully brought on board the pain and suffering and rejected it as part of the deal. Id you truly had, you'd sprint at the sight of this freak of nature as fast as if it were a rapist in an alley.

Your anxiety and hesitation is part of remaining in trance, in spellbound. In short l, reality is avoided Because reality sucked. Start reflecting start suffering and see how short term pain leads to long term strengthening

You won't be anxious afterwards you'll be new and changed.

Don't you want that? Don't you want to be less. Tepid

[grumpydonut]

Are you going for a second "Post of the Year" nomination

It's all about accepting that everything she did was my fault. I am the problem. Trying to love her unconditionally was disgusting behaviour that needed punishment. I am thankful.