uBPD Sister headed for disaster

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello, all: I signed up here today because I'm beyond concerned for my sister, who I will call "Erin". Based on 'Stop Walking on Eggshells' and other online research, I think she has unconventional BPD/NPD. She's middle-aged and has exhibited these behaviors all her life. She has two degrees and until recently held down high-paying jobs, but she can't keep friendships or boyfriends, exhibits zero empathy, is a hardcore control freak, has had 'failure to launch' three times (and each time the moveout period has gotten shorter), has a history of alcohol and Rx abuse, and is one of the worst compulsive buyers I have ever known. You can't have a two-way convo with her - she talks AT you with barely a pause for breath and sends a literal wall of words in response to a simple text question. If I dare to suggest a single solution to her problems, she jumps down my throat, or in the case of my mom, flies into a screaming rage and storms out of the room. She never asks how I'm doing or expresses any appreciation for listening to her.

Last year, Erin moved away from home for the third time in her life to take a new job about an hour away from our hometown. My mom had been letting her live rent-free in a small property near her house for the last 14 years since our dad passed away. Erin is (my best guess) a Stage 2/3 hoarder and she left a lot of her stuff behind when she moved. We all told her not to buy a house until she got a feel for the job, but she's a shopaholic, so she ignored us and bought one anyway, which she proceeded to fill with new stuff. Soon after moving in, she realized the house had flooding problems due to a nearby rail line with poor drainage. She got the railroad company to address the problem, but a couple of months later she started having bad allergies and found out the house had a strain of black mold growing in the garage and crawlspace. She moved out and got the railroad company to admit culpability. They sent her $3500 to pay for temporary housing and air purifiers, and said they would pay for remediation, but the work hasn't started yet.

Things went downhill from there. In September, she got fired because she locked horns with management all the time. She hated the long-term apartment she was renting, so she moved back home and is still there. She believed all her stuff was contaminated with mold in both the small family property AND her "new' house, so she's living in my mom's house and has stuffed it to the rafters with brand-new EVERYTHING: TV, electronics, bed, clothes, linens, you name it. Per Mom, all this is going on Erin's credit cards. Erin refuses to file for unemployment because she believes she's going to get a cash payout from the railroad company. She also refuses to look for another job because she's convinced that she's "toxxed out" from not only the mold, but pesticides, grass, dust, Wifi signals, and mercury poisoning from an amalgam filling. She paid out of pocket for bloodwork and a mail-in urinalysis test (not FDA approved) that allegedly showed she has high levels of mycotoxins in her system, but hasn't gotten any allergy tests. She bounces around from one doctor to another in search of answers she wants to hear. Over 16 years ago she thought she had Lyme disease, which she hasn't tested positive for in ages, but now thinks she still has it, and she also believes the Covid-19 vaccine "woke up" her immune system, causing it to overreact. She belongs to online Lyme support groups that are rife with misinformation and pseudoscience. Worse, she's trying to convince Mom that she has Wifi sensitivity and mold poisoning too, but tests of the house show nothing of concern.

Erin and my mom have always had an unhealthy co-dependent relationship. No matter where she was living, she would call Mom 2-6 times per day and monopolize her time for hours. Both of them try to make me feel guilty for not being more "supportive" (in other words, letting Erin run roughshod over my life too). I live about three hours away but haven't been back to visit in months. Mom is embarrassed to have anyone over because her house is so cluttered with Erin's stuff. When I call Mom to check in, Erin hijacks the phone and besieges me with endless health complaints. I finally got a chance to talk to Mom today while Erin was at a doctor's appointment. Mom is at the end of her rope. She said, "I am so angry at your sister right now. She's trashed her old house, her new house, and now my house." She said she has no idea what she's going to do if Erin runs out of savings before the railroad settlement comes through (if it comes through. I'm skeptical). She's living on retirement income and can't afford to pay Erin's bills/mortgage/car payments (about $900/month for two vehicles) etc.

Today, Mom agreed to order Stop Walking on Eggshells, but she often says things that people want to hear and not the truth. Classic appeaser. I warned her not to confront Erin about the possibility of having BPD and encouraged her to find a support group. She and Erin need family therapy but I'm afraid we're a long way from there yet. Despite all this, I think Erin has a good heart. Her family wants her to feel loved and be successful. But none of us want to fall down the bottomless rabbit hole of disordered thinking with her. Okay, that's it for now. Sorry for the long first post! If anyone here has any advice to share, I would be so grateful. Thank you for reading this.

[Strubblich]

Hello, all: I signed up here today because I'm beyond concerned for my sister, who I will call "Erin". Based on 'Stop Walking on Eggshells' and other online research, I think she has unconventional BPD/NPD. She's middle-aged and has exhibited these behaviors all her life. She has two degrees and until recently held down high-paying jobs, but she can't keep friendships or boyfriends, exhibits zero empathy, is a hardcore control freak, has had 'failure to launch' three times (and each time the moveout period has gotten shorter), has a history of alcohol and Rx abuse, and is one of the worst compulsive buyers I have ever known. You can't have a two-way convo with her - she talks AT you with barely a pause for breath and sends a literal wall of words in response to a simple text question. If I dare to suggest a single solution to her problems, she jumps down my throat, or in the case of my mom, flies into a screaming rage and storms out of the room. She never asks how I'm doing or expresses any appreciation for listening to her.

Last year, Erin moved away from home for the third time in her life to take a new job about an hour away from our hometown. My mom had been letting her live rent-free in a small property near her house for the last 14 years since our dad passed away. Erin is (my best guess) a Stage 2/3 hoarder and she left a lot of her stuff behind when she moved. We all told her not to buy a house until she got a feel for the job, but she's a shopaholic, so she ignored us and bought one anyway, which she proceeded to fill with new stuff. Soon after moving in, she realized the house had flooding problems due to a nearby rail line with poor drainage. She got the railroad company to address the problem, but a couple of months later she started having bad allergies and found out the house had a strain of black mold growing in the garage and crawlspace. She moved out and got the railroad company to admit culpability. They sent her $3500 to pay for temporary housing and air purifiers, and said they would pay for remediation, but the work hasn't started yet.

Things went downhill from there. In September, she got fired because she locked horns with management all the time. She hated the long-term apartment she was renting, so she moved back home and is still there. She believed all her stuff was contaminated with mold in both the small family property AND her "new' house, so she's living in my mom's house and has stuffed it to the rafters with brand-new EVERYTHING: TV, electronics, bed, clothes, linens, you name it. Per Mom, all this is going on Erin's credit cards. Erin refuses to file for unemployment because she believes she's going to get a cash payout from the railroad company. She also refuses to look for another job because she's convinced that she's "toxxed out" from not only the mold, but pesticides, grass, dust, Wifi signals, and mercury poisoning from an amalgam filling. She paid out of pocket for bloodwork and a mail-in urinalysis test (not FDA approved) that allegedly showed she has high levels of mycotoxins in her system, but hasn't gotten any allergy tests. She bounces around from one doctor to another in search of answers she wants to hear. Over 16 years ago she thought she had Lyme disease, which she hasn't tested positive for in ages, but now thinks she still has it, and she also believes the Covid-19 vaccine "woke up" her immune system, causing it to overreact. She belongs to online Lyme support groups that are rife with misinformation and pseudoscience. Worse, she's trying to convince Mom that she has Wifi sensitivity and mold poisoning too, but tests of the house show nothing of concern.

Erin and my mom have always had an unhealthy co-dependent relationship. No matter where she was living, she would call Mom 2-6 times per day and monopolize her time for hours. Both of them try to make me feel guilty for not being more "supportive" (in other words, letting Erin run roughshod over my life too). I live about three hours away but haven't been back to visit in months. Mom is embarrassed to have anyone over because her house is so cluttered with Erin's stuff. When I call Mom to check in, Erin hijacks the phone and besieges me with endless health complaints. I finally got a chance to talk to Mom today while Erin was at a doctor's appointment. Mom is at the end of her rope. She said, "I am so angry at your sister right now. She's trashed her old house, her new house, and now my house." She said she has no idea what she's going to do if Erin runs out of savings before the railroad settlement comes through (if it comes through. I'm skeptical). She's living on retirement income and can't afford to pay Erin's bills/mortgage/car payments (about $900/month for two vehicles) etc.

Today, Mom agreed to order Stop Walking on Eggshells, but she often says things that people want to hear and not the truth. Classic appeaser. I warned her not to confront Erin about the possibility of having BPD and encouraged her to find a support group. She and Erin need family therapy but I'm afraid we're a long way from there yet. Despite all this, I think Erin has a good heart. Her family wants her to feel loved and be successful. But none of us want to fall down the bottomless rabbit hole of disordered thinking with her. Okay, that's it for now. Sorry for the long first post! If anyone here has any advice to share, I would be so grateful. Thank you for reading this.

[Methuen]

Hey Strubblich,

You sound well read and informed.  I'm happy for you that you live 3 hours away.  It could be so much worse if you lived in the same town/city.  I live 6 min away from my uBPD mom (85) ... which does not give me enough "space".  

Strubblich, this story sounds rough.  I am so sorry.

I get the sense you already know you can't fix this.  For me, the hardest part is letting my mom make all her mistakes.  I never give her advice any more.  It's useless.  As you said, the reaction is to either jump down your throat or go into a screaming rage.  Or she FOG's.  Or now that she's 85 and weak and fragile and has early dementia, she goes into waif mode, and says the most terrible pathetic things to make me feel wretched with her.  So, what I've learned, is if she asks me for help or an opinion, I'll respond with another question.  
Mom: Should I go to the funeral?
Me: I don't know mom.  What do you think you want to do?
I never have an opinion on anything with her any more.  I haven't had any opinions (with her) for about 2 years now.  It's actually helped my interactions with her a lot (less conflict).

How old is "Erin"?  30's? 40's or ?  No kids?

She said she has no idea what she's going to do if Erin runs out of savings before the railroad settlement comes through (if it comes through. I'm skeptical). She's living on retirement income and can't afford to pay Erin's bills/mortgage/car payments (about $900/month for two vehicles) etc.

Does your mom have a history of "helping" Erin out of the jams she gets herself into?  Does she always or often come to Erin's rescue?  

Is there a risk Erin would manipulate her into paying these bills?  Does your mom have it in her to say she's not lending Erin money?

Has your mom ever set any boundaries with Erin, who lives with her?

Do you think your mom is at a place where she would ever consider telling Erin she needs her own house, and maybe give her a reasonable amount of time (say two months) to find a new place of her own?

Erin would probably never accept therapy.  But I'll bet your mom could use therapy.  It sounds like she might need some professional help to set boundaries, and help Erin "launch".  This can be done with love and kindness and support.  But if Erin doesn't launch, what will eventually happen?  My thought is that your mom is the one who needs help - to see that what she's been doing isn't working, and to give her the tools to interact and relate with Erin differently.  She's retired.  She needs her own life.  In addition to all the stress that comes from sharing her space with Erin, now she can't invite her own friends into her house and that's not right or healthy.  

The question is, is your mom just complaining to you, or does she want real help with this?  Is she willing to change how she reacts to Erin?  It kind of sounds like your mom has passed from helping and supporting Erin, to being her enabler, probably because she thinks that's her job as a mother, and because Erin knows how to pull the emotional heartstrings and get what she wants.  

Erin is going to do what Erin is going to do.  Nothing you say or do will change that.  It's so normal to want to help our loved ones so they don't screw up their life, but they don't want our help.  They see it as controlling.  Your mom on the other hand, what does she want for herself and her retirement? (since she can't change Erin)  

[Strubblich]

Hi Methuen! Thank you so much for responding. Wow, it's like you have a hidden camera in my Mom's house? (haha). I'll do my best to answer your questions:

How old is "Erin"?  30's? 40's or ?  No kids?

She is 50. Never married, no kids. She always wanted them but she has no idea how relationships work - the give and take, the compromise, the art of conversation. The few boyfriends she's had didn't stick around long once they realized how emotionally arrested she is. Mom and I estimate her emotional age to be around 11 or 12.

Does your mom have a history of "helping" Erin out of the jams she gets herself into?  Does she always or often come to Erin's rescue? 

Yes, both she and my dad would readily give her money and spend a lot of time getting her out of situations of her own making. They both feel guilty about their well-intentioned decision to send her to boarding school out of state from 10th-12th grade. Erin graduated and came home with a serious drinking problem, which continued through college even though she took challenging classes and got excellent grades. She got sober after grad school, began drinking again in her 30s (a boyfriend talked her into throwing away 8 years of sobriety) and didn't stop until two years ago. She still has the Rx and shopping addictions.

Is there a risk Erin would manipulate her into paying these bills?  Does your mom have it in her to say she's not lending Erin money?

Great question. I know Erin will try. I think Mom will stand up to her initially, but she always caves in to Erin's manipulations even though she knows it's not the best thing to do for her or Erin. Yesterday, Mom claimed that she was thinking of calling the Sheriff's dept to find out how to legally evict someone if needed. Could she actually go through with it? I don't know. She loaned Erin a LOT of money to buy this house that she can't live in now due to the mold. If Erin defaults on the mortgage, I have no idea what's going to happen.

Has your mom ever set any boundaries with Erin, who lives with her?

Some minor ones, mostly around Erin's tendencies to snap at her when frustrated or challenged. Mom acknowledges that Erin has taken over but I think she's too exhausted/cowed to really push back. Stockholm Syndrome for sure.

Do you think your mom is at a place where she would ever consider telling Erin she needs her own house, and maybe give her a reasonable amount of time (say two months) to find a new place of her own?

Apparently, she has brought this up and Erin's response was "But I'm SICK! I'm FIGHTING FOR MY LIFE! I have nowhere to go that's safe!" What's interesting is that Erin's latest health crisis arose less than a month after Mom decided to sell the family property and buy a house near Erin's new one. She does not want Mom to sell, although it's not really financially feasible to stay there anymore. Also, despite her claims of being "toxxed out" and fighting to live, she has no trouble getting up and driving to various stores in a 50-mile radius all day, every day.

Erin would probably never accept therapy.  But I'll bet your mom could use therapy.  It sounds like she might need some professional help to set boundaries, and help Erin "launch".  This can be done with love and kindness and support.  But if Erin doesn't launch, what will eventually happen?  My thought is that your mom is the one who needs help - to see that what she's been doing isn't working, and to give her the tools to interact and relate with Erin differently.  She's retired.  She needs her own life.  In addition to all the stress that comes from sharing her space with Erin, now she can't invite her own friends into her house and that's not right or healthy. 

Today is a good case in point. Erin texted me to tell me that she noticed a "laundry detergent smell" in the - wait for it - laundry room and discovered that the heating vent warms up the cabinet where the cleaning supplies are kept. She's ultra-sensitive to any and all odors and is now insisting that all of the "old chemicals" be thrown out, and they will donate the ones that are still "good." This is another excuse to go to the store. In the meantime, since there is no unheated cabinet to store the cleaning supplies in, I imagine they are adding to the clutter.

The question is, is your mom just complaining to you, or does she want real help with this?  Is she willing to change how she reacts to Erin?  It kind of sounds like your mom has passed from helping and supporting Erin, to being her enabler, probably because she thinks that's her job as a mother, and because Erin knows how to pull the emotional heartstrings and get what she wants.

You nailed it. Are you a wizard? LOL! My heart goes out to Mom. Just as she was starting to enjoy retirement and was ready to sell the old family property - wham. Erin's back and entrenched. In hindsight, there was a similar pattern with my maternal grandmother and Mom. Often when my parents would go on vacation, Grandma would call them and claim she was sick and beg them to come home. They would rush back and find there was no problem at all. As with her past Lyme episode, Erin has found a new illness that sounds plausible enough to garner sympathy, but not easily testable or disproven. If you push back, she can quote a study or website that purports to back up her claims. I texted Mom and told her that the laundry room issue is a good opportunity to set a boundary and say "enough". She texted back and said she wants to get through Thanksgiving and that it's hard to admit her daughter has a problem (ah-ha! breakthrough!). I replied and told her this is not her fault and reiterated what you said above about setting boundaries with love. Your response helped me frame my plea to Mom. I hope she finds the courage to take action.

I know this isn't what she wanted in retirement. She enjoys serving others but she also deserves a chance to relax and enjoy her golden years. If she can't find a way to get Erin out soon, I fear they are headed for a 'Gray Gardens' situation (if you haven't seen the movie or documentary basically, adult daughter fails to launch, moves back to her aging mother's once-lavish estate where they isolate themselves and live in squalor).

Again, THANK YOU for taking the time to respond, Methuen! I'm always glad to answer questions and provide updates. The situation is still unfolding and changes from day to day. I'm sorry to hear about your situation as well, but it sounds like you are working through it in a healthy way. Having a sibling with uBPD is one thing. Can't imagine life with a BPD parent. Much respect to you.