Recognizing other's sign of parental neglect

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Hi all,

Yesterday I went to visit my in-laws, and of course, inner critic kept me up all night following an event...

I was talking with MIL and FIL, and FIL started talking about teenagers nowadays who have no respect, and how parents did not discipline them. FIL really likes to bring the conversation back to himself, a lot... If his son tells him he was able to achieve something good, FIL will answer with: "Ha it's like me, I yada yada yada". Yesterday, I was feeling a bit more assertive, so I started telling FIL how I experienced more aggressivity in certain childcare, and that I think the behavior he was talking about was due to parent neglect and a society who think it okay to have children and then abandon them (not talking here about people struggling to put food on the table, more about people who prefers to have a big house and two-three cars of the year and work A LOT instead of prioritizing their children). A society who keeps encouraging consumerism lead, by default, to people working more and more to consume and children being left behind.

He tried to cut me before I was done talking, and I didn't let him: the as*hole just stopped listening ! He literally stopped looking at me, and drank his tea and STOPPED LISTENING ! I kept going, trying to get back his attention. I felt a bit of distress (remind me of my mother who didn't care about what we were saying, unless we were praising her). But coming home, I was so angry. And I was angry at myself that I tried to get his attention back instead of calling him out on it: "Hey FIL, am I boring you?" would have been a very nice come back. But then... I also am not interested in starting a family feud.

I really don't like him. I try to like him, but I don't...

But I am starting to understand where he is coming from... I think he himself was neglected. I hear his mother was quite the angry character, and whenever we have all of them (FIL and his parents) over, he is quiet... He doesn't talk. But within his own family, as master of the house, he talks about him him him. I've seen him put my husband down a couple time. Thankfully, my husband fights back. Fifteen years away from home will do that. He became very assertive through his work. 

And in FIL, I saw my own tendency, with my own mother, to talk a lot but in a 'praising her' manner. Sometimes, talking feels like a defensive mechanism for me when I am uncomfortable. Because my own mother was either silent or having outbursts when I was young. I wonder too if I am not trying to meet a narcissistic developmental arrest I never got to meet with her. And since she is narcissistic, I keep talking while I praise our relationship as a way to keep her calm. I don't do it right now, I am in no contact... But I can recognize this is something I have been doing in the past few years.

Which brought me to realize my FIL probably didn't meet his own narcissistic toddler needs with his own mother. It gives me some empathy toward him. Maybe it will help me manage him better to know where he is coming from.

But still... Such disrespect. And my first reflex was to think: "did I do something wrong to deserve him to stop listening to me?" And this morning, channeling my anger, I can rightfully say: "No, I didn't." He was the prick in that discussion who just can't wait his turn to speak. He cuts people off to talk about him and how amazing he is. Well, too bad I know everything about his own shortcomings as a father and how he neglected and scapegoated my husband many times over. I am ok with him around, he is a good GRANDfather but I will try to remember that : I do not need approval from this kind of person.

Thank you anger !

Connecting to it, allowing myself to really feel it, has been a huge gift this week. No shame. Anger is just another emotion, and it is one of assertiveness and protection. If I feel it, it means I feel I am being treated unfairly and it brings on introspection. Then I can see, am I right or wrong in feeling this way? Great emotion.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Hi all,

Yesterday I went to visit my in-laws, and of course, inner critic kept me up all night following an event...

I was talking with MIL and FIL, and FIL started talking about teenagers nowadays who have no respect, and how parents did not discipline them. FIL really likes to bring the conversation back to himself, a lot... If his son tells him he was able to achieve something good, FIL will answer with: "Ha it's like me, I yada yada yada". Yesterday, I was feeling a bit more assertive, so I started telling FIL how I experienced more aggressivity in certain childcare, and that I think the behavior he was talking about was due to parent neglect and a society who think it okay to have children and then abandon them (not talking here about people struggling to put food on the table, more about people who prefers to have a big house and two-three cars of the year and work A LOT instead of prioritizing their children). A society who keeps encouraging consumerism lead, by default, to people working more and more to consume and children being left behind.

He tried to cut me before I was done talking, and I didn't let him: the as*hole just stopped listening ! He literally stopped looking at me, and drank his tea and STOPPED LISTENING ! I kept going, trying to get back his attention. I felt a bit of distress (remind me of my mother who didn't care about what we were saying, unless we were praising her). But coming home, I was so angry. And I was angry at myself that I tried to get his attention back instead of calling him out on it: "Hey FIL, am I boring you?" would have been a very nice come back. But then... I also am not interested in starting a family feud.

I really don't like him. I try to like him, but I don't...

But I am starting to understand where he is coming from... I think he himself was neglected. I hear his mother was quite the angry character, and whenever we have all of them (FIL and his parents) over, he is quiet... He doesn't talk. But within his own family, as master of the house, he talks about him him him. I've seen him put my husband down a couple time. Thankfully, my husband fights back. Fifteen years away from home will do that. He became very assertive through his work. 

And in FIL, I saw my own tendency, with my own mother, to talk a lot but in a 'praising her' manner. Sometimes, talking feels like a defensive mechanism for me when I am uncomfortable. Because my own mother was either silent or having outbursts when I was young. I wonder too if I am not trying to meet a narcissistic developmental arrest I never got to meet with her. And since she is narcissistic, I keep talking while I praise our relationship as a way to keep her calm. I don't do it right now, I am in no contact... But I can recognize this is something I have been doing in the past few years.

Which brought me to realize my FIL probably didn't meet his own narcissistic toddler needs with his own mother. It gives me some empathy toward him. Maybe it will help me manage him better to know where he is coming from.

But still... Such disrespect. And my first reflex was to think: "did I do something wrong to deserve him to stop listening to me?" And this morning, channeling my anger, I can rightfully say: "No, I didn't." He was the prick in that discussion who just can't wait his turn to speak. He cuts people off to talk about him and how amazing he is. Well, too bad I know everything about his own shortcomings as a father and how he neglected and scapegoated my husband many times over. I am ok with him around, he is a good GRANDfather but I will try to remember that : I do not need approval from this kind of person.

Thank you anger !

Connecting to it, allowing myself to really feel it, has been a huge gift this week. No shame. Anger is just another emotion, and it is one of assertiveness and protection. If I feel it, it means I feel I am being treated unfairly and it brings on introspection. Then I can see, am I right or wrong in feeling this way? Great emotion.

[missing NC]

   Thumbs up for standing in your own power, Riv#rWolf.  Yes, anger can be a clarifying, protective emotion.  As women we are to often taught to instinctively doubt ourselves when someone else misbehaves, attributing their actions to ourselves rather than placing the responsibility where it rightly belongs. 

[Goldcrest]

Horrible and triggering experience. I am always gobsmacked at this sort of behaviour. It's so rude. I respect your empathy and compassion, in trying to consider what has made him that way. Praps it's got to be Grey Rock with him from now on?

[Riv3rW0lf]

Horrible and triggering experience. I am always gobsmacked at this sort of behaviour. It's so rude. I respect your empathy and compassion, in trying to consider what has made him that way. Praps it's got to be Grey Rock with him from now on?

Absolutely !

I agree, grey rocking is the way to go with him.

[lm1109]

It's nice to read about the positive side of anger. I have REALLY been struggling with it these past few days. Out of nowhere I seem to get these waves of intense anger at my parents and all I want to do is confront them with the pain they've caused...then I'm angry that I can't do that. Anger seems to be the one emotion I'm still really struggling with...I just don't know what to do with it? I know it's healthy to feel and my therapist says I need to feel it and embrace it...she said to go outside and scream, hit a pillow, etc. I say ok...but I don't do those things. I suppose I channel it when I'm working out by releasing energy, but it just always hits me at random weird times...so I find myself stuffing it. My husband took my kids to practice last night and I allowed it to come up(it's been really bubbled up at the surface these last few days). All I did was yell once and slam some things around and I ended up apologizing to my dog...yes...I apologized to my dog for feeling my anger!  I know that this anger is good and that it is the emotion that is actually protecting me from going back and allowing more abuse! I wonder if anyone has any tips on actually releasing it?

Your post is helpful, you're right you do not need approval from that kind of person. I'm realizing that I have to remind myself of that sort of thing often. I tend to spin interactions like that around to make it my fault. As Missing NC said...we are taught as women, especially, to doubt ourselves... or to not seem "overly emotional" My mom actually did this a lot to me growing up. If I got upset about something ( abuse) she would sit there calmly and tell me she had no idea why I was so upset and then she would AlWAYS ask me condescendingly if I was on my period! It's no I wonder I'm struggling with suppressing my anger!

Anyways...I second in congratulating you on standing in your own power    This is one area I will definitely continue to do a lot of work in!

[Riv3rW0lf]

Im1109

For me, it seems the fact of acknowledging my anger without letting it disolve into guilt, and actually recognizing it and valuing it helps. I do not let it vanish, and I don't try to release it either, in the sense where I feel valuing it is a release in itself. I welcome it, and tell myself It's ok to be angry, and then I ask little Riv3rW0lf if she is ready to come back to the present, where it is safe and calm. And then I do...

Remember when we were talking about sadness and how feeling sadness did not exclude joy? I am learning to feel anger the same way. Just as an added face to my multiface persona, that is now welcome to join in.

[missing NC]

lm1109, I'm not sure if your reference to "releasing" anger means letting it go or working through it in a nondestructive manner. I've read contradictory advice on which is the best way to go. But if you are looking for the latter, a friend of mine suggested a tennis racquet on the mattress.  You may wish to put your fuzzy friend in the kitchen before whacking your bed as he/she might find it alarming. 

[lm1109]

Thanks for your responses. Since writing my response/post I've done a lot of reflection on my anger. It's amazing how much writing things out helps me understand myself. I think I worded it incorrectly, I do FEEL my anger, I feel A LOT of anger right now. Honestly, I've been feeling it a lot for the last few years. My struggle is expressing it. But I see your point Riverwolf, about sadness and joy. I will eventually learn to integrate anger into my life in the same way I have with sadness. It is just another emotion and it has value. And I can see where I have already made huge strides with this in my marriage and other parts of my life. As far as my parents go, they have created a life of such intense denial (for survival) I will never have it in me to hurt them with the truth, there would be no point anyway. I think that's why my therapist suggested hitting things, there will never be and never has been room for healthy expression there. And actually, Missing NC, I remembered she also suggested hitting the bed with a tennis racquet, which I think I may try. It's really interesting how deep these thought patterns are embedded, I never realized how much shame I still had wrapped up in expressing anger! I read a quote in a book the other day that I loved: "You know what is beyond that mountain? More  f*****g mountains! If you're going to climb, then you better adapt." I loved it because I find it to be so true, there's no end date, why beat myself up for continuing to learn and grow when that's the whole point of life! Some people aren't even brave enough to START climbing! Thanks again for your responses 

[Riv3rW0lf]

And it is interesting because since writing that answer, I realized acknowledging my anger was far from being enough ...

Thankfully, my husband and I decided to treat ourselves to a squat rack, so this morning, I woke up distressed and angry, so I went downstairs and pushed it out. My daughter was like : mommy why are you growling?

I pushed hard and it helped with the release. Then I listened to my favorite singer from childhood and cried.

I am starting schema therapy next week.. hopefully this therapist can help.

I feel stuck in emotional limbo.

Dreamt my husband was leaving me and woke up stressed, shaking.

It's time to truly open the door of my past.

He already did help by making me realize my main emotion was fear. I was scared of my mother, my whole childhood, I was terrorized by her. Amongst others emotions, but it's true that to this day, she still scares me.

Hopefully he can help decrease my stress level. I don't remember a time when I wasn't tense. Which is why I ran so much probably.. the high you get afterward, it relaxes the body instantly. Only release I could get.

Anyway... Maybe I will have to try the racket onto the bed too !