How to handle “charming”

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

So I left the marital home this morning and said to my wife that we needed space.

This came after a night where my wife verbally abused me and I came very close to physically hitting my wife. The atmosphere is toxic and I’m finding it increasingly difficult to maintain my composure.

Now my wife realises I’m serious she has been calling and texting me non-stop begging for me to return, and saying she will do anything to make our marriage work. I’m not sure what I want to do but I’m leaning towards separation. Were it not for our two children I would have left long ago.

It is so difficult to hear my wife in pain. I desperately want to make her happy again but not at the expense of my own happiness.

Is there a possibility that she is being sincere? Or should I maintain my resolve? I find it difficult to ignore that she had ample opportunity to take the steps I needed her to take for years - yet she waits for me to leave before promising me this.

I would welcome everyone’s thoughts and experiences! I’m so conflicted right now.

[orders4946]

So I left the marital home this morning and said to my wife that we needed space.

This came after a night where my wife verbally abused me and I came very close to physically hitting my wife. The atmosphere is toxic and I’m finding it increasingly difficult to maintain my composure.

Now my wife realises I’m serious she has been calling and texting me non-stop begging for me to return, and saying she will do anything to make our marriage work. I’m not sure what I want to do but I’m leaning towards separation. Were it not for our two children I would have left long ago.

It is so difficult to hear my wife in pain. I desperately want to make her happy again but not at the expense of my own happiness.

Is there a possibility that she is being sincere? Or should I maintain my resolve? I find it difficult to ignore that she had ample opportunity to take the steps I needed her to take for years - yet she waits for me to leave before promising me this.

I would welcome everyone’s thoughts and experiences! I’m so conflicted right now.

[BigOof]

Don't leave without getting evidence your wife is toxic to the children. Get a recording of her rampaging around the kids or at the kids.

Goes without saying - if you hit her, you'll do time.

Hire a lawyer who specializes in high-conflict divorce.

Once her fears of abandonment realize you're going to leave for good, she'll split you into all-bad. Then she'll be down the courthouse getting restraining orders from you seeing your children and evicting you. Buy a body camera.

The next few moves will determine your relationship with your children for the rest of your life. Think smart and not emotionally.

[Skip]

Is there a possibility that she is being sincere?

It's very likely she is sincere.  Is it sustainable - that will depend on both of you and if you both are willing to enter into some kind of constructive reunion. You may want to ask if she will work with a third party to heal this.

Or should I maintain my resolve?

It might feel powerful to say so no. Grasp that power and channel your strength.

Know that "walk-outs in anger" are often not sustainable or safe ways to leave- for all those involved. What if your wife responds by changing the locks and blocking access to the kids or taps the bank accounts... you don't want that.

If you're done, take time to plan your exit.

I find it difficult to ignore that she had ample opportunity to take the steps I needed her to take for years - yet she waits for me to leave before promising me this.

A valid point.

[ForeverDad]

I'm for a blend of the responses.  It's almost a predictable situation that once you return and a few days or weeks pass and she will be arguing yet again.  It's a dysfunctional cycle... she gets upset and pushes you away then she realizes she went too far and pulls you back.

Essentially the only things for her to break the current cyclical pattern:

• She seeks therapy (such as DBT or CBT) and both sticks with it and applies it in her life, perceptions and behaviors.  We're talking years, not a few token sessions.
• She complies with your newfound Boundaries such as you and the kids exit and take a break from her whenever she rages, etc.
• Or... you get long term distance from her and let family court set boundaries to legally limit contact, child expenses, etc.

The advantage of a ceasefire now would be for you to (confidentially - you have a right to privacy) consult local family law attorneys, analyze your financial status, reduce the number joint accounts, etc.  In other words, get your ducks in a row so you have practical strategies and leverage for whether (1) you stay or (2) you go.

Back in 2005 I wasn't consciously prepared for my marriage's demise.  Fortunately we did not have joint credit accounts.  I canceled her card on my account and I cut up my card on her account.  However, we did have a joint bank account.  When she refused to sign the J&S waiver required to get get a loan for my new used van, the dealer blew his top and I rushed to get a car loan from my other bank.  They required me to start a bank account there and have my paycheck deposited there.  You guessed it, she raged and demanded I undo that.  Too late, what was done was done.  The marriage was failing and did fail a few months later, this banking change actually made it simpler when we did separate and divorce.

And... back then cell phones couldn't record the incidents.  So I bought some digital voice recorders to document (very much on the down low, no waving it in her face!) I wasn't the one behaving poorly.  Despite that, the first time I called 911 the police came and were about to cart ME away until my preschooler screeched and refused to leave my arms.  That close.  Later I downloaded the incident's voice recording and police filed Threat of DV charges against her instead.  (Yeah, that marked the End of our relationship.)

[MobyCloud]

So I left the marital home this morning and said to my wife that we needed space.

This came after a night where my wife verbally abused me and I came very close to physically hitting my wife. The atmosphere is toxic and I’m finding it increasingly difficult to maintain my composure.

Now my wife realises I’m serious she has been calling and texting me non-stop begging for me to return, and saying she will do anything to make our marriage work. I’m not sure what I want to do but I’m leaning towards separation. Were it not for our two children I would have left long ago.

It is so difficult to hear my wife in pain. I desperately want to make her happy again but not at the expense of my own happiness.

Is there a possibility that she is being sincere? Or should I maintain my resolve? I find it difficult to ignore that she had ample opportunity to take the steps I needed her to take for years - yet she waits for me to leave before promising me this.

I would welcome everyone’s thoughts and experiences! I’m so conflicted right now.

My wife is violent, and I would have NEVER left the kids at the house and left. I am not judging you, but I think you should really determine if  leaving them with her is a good or bad idea. It will have long term impacts on separation and divorce. I may have some separation anxiety with our kids though, the last time we approached divorce she withheld my son for 41 days straight. It was something like 21% of his early life I missed. I would have fears coming home from work after that "what if they aren't home? What if she leaves?" I never fully realized how deeply it hurt me and still don't fully understand it.

Take BigOof and ForeverDad's input very seriously. My wife filed false allegations against me after splitting me to black.

Make sure you store any evidence you have somewhere private. I have had stuff deleted off my phone, and I have been pressured to delete things "to let her move on and heal in our relationship."

[orders4946]

Thanks very much for your advice everyone.

For context I should have clarified that my wife is a wonderful, selfless and committed mother and has never disregulated with the children. I am not worried about their safety with her. I have also been secretly making contingency plans  (a family member has an empty house I can move into and a car I can use as my own - finances have always been separate). I live in the UK and I’m hopeful, based on my research, that I could have the children at least 5/6 nights in 14 if I were to pursue court proceedings - which I would do if we separated and my wife was not facilitating my access (which I would expect).

I was in the habit of audio recording our interactions a few months ago but she found my DAR and that caused significant problems. I will start again from now but try and be more careful with it. She has a tendency to exaggerate our arguments and she can be vindictive and spiteful when hurting.

I suppose I am at the point where I need to decide our future - my current relationship ambivalence cannot continue and I have all of my ducks in a row.

When I told my wife I was leaving for some space her immediate reaction was one of “who will help me with the kids”. It was only when she realised I wasn’t coming back, and I refused her initial request to return, that the begging and pleading started. It really is difficult to resist that when someone who you love is in so much pain, even though you realise you might be better off separated longer term.

It is good advice re: the kids but our daily interactions are controlled by her anyway that it does make me wonder if I’m better off going the legal route to mandate access so at least I have autonomy when I am with them.

[BigOof]

For context I should have clarified that my wife is a wonderful, selfless, and committed mother ... I am not worried about their safety with her.

I incorrectly thought the same thing until my wife started making plans to kidnap our child, started committing DV in front of the child, and is now sacrificing our child to save herself.

[ForeverDad]

For context I should have clarified that my wife is a wonderful, selfless and committed mother and has never disregulated with the children. I am not worried about their safety with her.

That's now.  What about when you're not there to be her personal Whipping Boy?  (You being punished for her issues.)  And what about when the kids grow older and seek normal increased independence?

This is a common perspective of newcomers here.  Unfortunately, this is not a problem of simply her versus you.  If not you, then who else is there for a person with mental and perception issues inclined to vent upon?  Sorry to share that with you.

My own experience... Our son was her only and Golden child.  But once we separated, she would still vent and though we had equal parenting time he was the one with her.  One time after an exchange he was so sad because she told him she was going to adopt a child who loved her.  As he grew older, a few times she told he she was going to disown him.  He was in tears.  That's not normal.

[MobyCloud]

I incorrectly thought the same thing until my wife started making plans to kidnap our child, started committing DV in front of the child, and is now sacrificing our child to save herself.

x2

That's now.  What about when you're not there to be her personal Whipping Boy?  (You being punished for her issues.)  And what about when the kids grow older and seek normal increased independence?

This is a common perspective of newcomers here.  Unfortunately, this is not a problem of simply her versus you.  If not you, then who else is there for a person with mental and perception issues inclined to vent upon?  Sorry to share that with you.

x2