Crossing the Line - Exiting the Theme Park Entirely

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

I hear you. I’ve struggled with those thoughts for months. I still have those those thoughts and dreams, but less often and less intense now. Time and distance.

You know what has made it 100x worse for me? Reaching out to my ex. It rips the scab off and the pain starts over again. I’ve made that mistake more times than I care to admit.

[cranmango]

I hear you. I’ve struggled with those thoughts for months. I still have those those thoughts and dreams, but less often and less intense now. Time and distance.

You know what has made it 100x worse for me? Reaching out to my ex. It rips the scab off and the pain starts over again. I’ve made that mistake more times than I care to admit.

[OKrunch]

I hear you. I’ve struggled with those thoughts for months. I still have those those thoughts and dreams, but less often and less intense now. Time and distance.

You know what has made it 100x worse for me? Reaching out to my ex. It rips the scab off and the pain starts over again. I’ve made that mistake more times than I care to admit.

Yea, I won't be doing that.
Each day I want to more, but I know itll be fruitless and likely painful.

[OKrunch]

 I cracked again.

 Emailed an instagram link about archeology. This was the reply.

 "Please understand that I do not hate you but I need you to stop contacting me. (HER DAUGHTER) is NOT well. It was shared with me that she cites one of her traumas being you and I fighting, the violent outbursts, and all the angry energy we put into the house. (She mentioned being terrified and listening the day of the head lock) I am blaming myself for all her pains right now because one of the contributing factors was me having you move in so fast. It is hindsight of course and I’m trying to go easy on myself, but I cannot handle any contact at this time. Please give me space. Please. I cannot and will not reconcile, especially after hearing the damage we did to (HER DAUGHTER) (and MY SON, although that is speculation). I can only hope that I will make better choices and never hurt anyone the way they were hurt again. Be well. "

I feel blamed, and hurt. Please let me know your analysis of this. I need a deep dive. Seems odd in light of her forming new relationships...

The headlock thing she mentions was a day she punched me, and i held her down in defense of myself.
It always gets brough up, and her punching me is rarely mentioned.

I didnt ask about reconciling. Or her daughter.
It was just an instagram article about Roman coins.

I have not replied to this.

If I did it would be "I was just trying to share something i thought you'd find interesting. I wasn't trying to reconcile. I am sorry to hear about DAUGHTER. You be well also"

[OKrunch]

Yea, I won't be doing that.
Each day I want to more, but I know itll be fruitless and likely painful.

Well, that lasted all of 4 hours

[Pook075]

"Please understand that I do not hate you but I need you to stop contacting me. (HER DAUGHTER) is NOT well.

You wanted a deep dive.  Here we go.  First two sentences are very clear- she doesn't want to talk to you because she wants to focus on her daughter.  

I get that you said she's seeing other guys, so that doesn't mesh with the whole "focus on the kid" angle.  But in her mind, you/her hurt the kid and she can't do that anymore.

It was shared with me that she cites one of her traumas being you and I fighting, the violent outbursts, and all the angry energy we put into the house. (She mentioned being terrified and listening the day of the head lock)

This is tough.  My gut reaction- I feel for the kid more than anything, whether any of this is true or not.  I've learned from others with BPD that a counselor says one thing, they hear what they want to hear.  But you have to accept this as her reality because it's real to her.

Again, I really feel for the kid here.

I am blaming myself for all her pains right now because one of the contributing factors was me having you move in so fast. It is hindsight of course and I’m trying to go easy on myself, but I cannot handle any contact at this time.

She's taking responsibility here, which is good.  She's setting boundaries as well, which is healthy.  It is also clear that she's reflected on everything that happened and taken partial ownership.  The "problem" wasn't you moving in, it was the fighting...but still.  She's working thru this.

Please give me space. Please. I cannot and will not reconcile, especially after hearing the damage we did to (HER DAUGHTER) (and MY SON, although that is speculation).

To you, it was a harmless link to a story.  To her, it was you trying to win her back in some way.  You have to respect her wishes brother and give her space.  It is interesting though that once again, she uses "we" in causing damage.  She's taking responsibility.

I can only hope that I will make better choices and never hurt anyone the way they were hurt again. Be well. "

The blame is still twisted, it's not the fighting or yelling that hurt the kid, it was letting you move in.  She clearly wants and needs space.

If you were to reply to this (which you shouldn't), it would be a huge mistake to defend your intentions for sending the link.  Your #1 concern should be her #1 concern- comforting the kid and making this right.  Because let's face it, she's right that the kid is worse off because you were there.  I'm not saying it's your fault or anything like that, but the only proper reply would be about her daughter and offering to help fix that relationship.

Again though, replying is a mistake.

[OKrunch]

Pook,
That was a tremendously insightful and helpful response and I cannot thank you enough. You are spot on with every point you make and your level headed responses helped me make sense of a very hurtful and confusing situation. The only thing about what she said that sticks out to me is the fact that she said I can't handle any contact at this time. I don't know if that was just the way that she phrased it, or she said that on purpose but I'm not going to ruminate over choice of words too much, because she also said I cannot and will not reconcile (although I have heard that more than once before)
At the end of the day I care most about DAUGHTER and MY SON being well.

She is an amazing little lady and I love her like she is my own.
If I need to be Batman right now and be "the hero the city needs" by being "the bad guy" (more excommunicated than BAD, but im reaching for a nerdy metaphor here, work with me)
If I need to suffer so DAUGHTER and EX can heal, so be it. I will Heal too while I'm at it.
If I have to do this knowing she's filling the space with a replacement, SO be it.
It sucks, but I'll endure it, and survive it. Because its what we all need right now.

When we are painted White I have often heard the term "White Knight" used. This suits me as I am definitley a "caretaker" and a huge medievil/fantasy nerd.
So if being painted black, means I have to be The Dark Knight, then so be it. Light up that Bat Signal folks. I'm on the job.

“Because he's the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt him. Because he can take it. Because he's not our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. A dark knight.”
Lt. James Gordon, Gotham City Police

[Couscous]

I gotta say, I really feel for the kids. I think they are going to need to get into counseling to help them process what was likely a traumatizing experience for them. It would also be hugely beneficial for your son if he sees that you are getting help for the anger management issues, and for you to abstain from dating until you have that under control. As parents one of our main jobs is to teach (and model) anger management skills to our kids, and I am sure that you do not wish to see your son following in your footsteps.

[OKrunch]

Moving day is here. The end of my camper isolation. 198 days, two full seasons.



I still find myself dissecting the email she last sent me, looking for little hidden meanings that I know are probably not there. She has opened and reread that email 33 times. Most were in Rapid succession on Thursday night after I sent it. I did not reply to what she had sent me. I'm a bit confused as to why she would need to open an email that was 2 sentences long, 33 times.

Moving Forward:
 with moving into a new home I am trying to start a completely new book not even a new chapter. I will continue to post here but I'm only going to do so to talk about my own development, and to track my no contact progress. I will obviously make note of any Reach Out attempts that I have from her. My point is that I'm no longer going to be using this form as a way to try and figure out what she thinks what she's going to do or why she has done what she has done. I have as much insight into that as I'm going to get, and the rest of it is guess work.



I have several goals and new habits that I'm going to try and form and adhere to with my new apartment.
Fathering comes before all other things
Fitness
Better Diet (I dont need to lose weight but Ive been eating like crap for 6 months)
Re-Quitting Tobbacco
Establishing a consistant savings
Finding a "Side hustle" to earn more money during all my down time at work as opposed to useless rumination.
Start a garden at my work.
Find new social hubs in my new town.

 I will see that I have improved on one front, while I still have many intrusive thoughts about how she is living happily with the replacement, building on the foundation that we started, acting like I never existed and all the other things that hurt, I'm reminding myself that just like the rebound guy, this new fella, even if he ends up being longer term, is going to have to deal with all the same crap that I did. It is not the everyone is happy Fantasyland that my negative thinking brain likes to tell me that it is. She is still erratic, stressed, quick to flip a mood and can be seriously judgmental. My brain is faster to remind me of these things now, even though I still think about things like the moment I proposed to her, our kids belly laughing together, our trips and vacations and all of the loving moments that I know were so real to me and Dr Jekyll, but Mr Hyde is behind the wheel now and there's nothing for it

[Pook075]

Moving day is here. The end of my camper isolation. 198 days, two full seasons.

All good stuff buddy, you're heading in the right direction.  Just wanted to share a tidbit of my life that may help give a little perspective.

As you know, I'm a Christian.  I've struggled to move on because the Bible says not to divorce, so in the back of my mind I've always wanted to honor God and avoid making the wrong move.  I've prayed to move on and didn't 'feel like' those prayers were answered, so I've just remained on hold for these past 8 months.

Last week, I got laid off out of nowhere.  I texted my wife to let her know the health insurance would end on the 1st.  She called that evening and we talked a little bit, and it felt good that she had some sense of decency left when it came to me.  Nothing kind, mind you...but she called to check up on me.

She also asked on that call if I'd meet her at the DMV to transfer her tags since it's in both of our names.  I agreed because I'll always help her no matter what, even though she hasn't been there for me at all since the break-up.  My requests go unanswered, yet she calls when she needs something.  So typical.  We were going to meet yesterday but the DMV was closed for the holiday, so another call from her to reschedule.  Then she called yesterday for help with her taxes and how to file.

As I was talking to her about the taxes, she said, "I'm sorry to bother you, I've bothered you a lot lately and I don't want to."  I replied, "It's never a bother, we spent half our lives together and I'll always be there for you."  She replied, "Yeah, but I don't want that and I don't want you."

Now, in this moment, you'd think I'd be hurt- that was cold as ice.  But it had the opposite effect and I felt a release.  It was almost like God said, "Okay, it's finally time for your next chapter to begin."  Maybe 2 hours later, someone from a dating site reached out to me, someone I'd had my eyes on for awhile.  We exchanged contact info and talked for the next 4 or 5 hours, and it was so weird because it was like we had known each other for years already.  Everything just clicked.

I'm not saying that the new gal I met will lead to anything, who knows.  My point here though is that I finally heard that one sentence, that one thing, that completely shifted my mindset and focus.  I deserve better than what I've received and I'm a great guy, a great 'catch'.  That's who I woke up as today and I'm not just saying it, I believe it.  I know it to be true because that's who I always have been.

I know you don't believe in God, so hopefully you understand I only included that because it was a part of my journey, a message I've been waiting for.  If you let it, the universe will eventually tell you the same thing- you're a great guy and you're okay, stop chasing the past and the pain that it brings.  There's a new you just waiting to be born and live the life you're meant to live.

I hope that helps buddy- I'm here for you anytime.

[OKrunch]

All good stuff buddy, you're heading in the right direction.  Just wanted to share a tidbit of my life that may help give a little perspective.

As you know, I'm a Christian.  I've struggled to move on because the Bible says not to divorce, so in the back of my mind I've always wanted to honor God and avoid making the wrong move.  I've prayed to move on and didn't 'feel like' those prayers were answered, so I've just remained on hold for these past 8 months.
I may not be a religious fellow, but as you know, I was married and divorced before the relationship with my EX that I post about here. My ex wife cheated on me within weeks of getting married, and I still wanted to save that. I believe in Oaths and the strength of ones words and convictions BIG TIME. I held on to that "In sickness and in health" clause for a long time. I did the same in regards to my recent EX, promises i made to her, and the Oath of Engagement we made together. It was as strong as a marraige oath in my eyes, and i honestly believe that getting engaged was the catalyst to this entire second downfall. She cannot handle the thought of something that serious and permenant.


Last week, I got laid off out of nowhere.  I texted my wife to let her know the health insurance would end on the 1st.  She called that evening and we talked a little bit, and it felt good that she had some sense of decency left when it came to me.  Nothing kind, mind you...but she called to check up on me.


She also asked on that call if I'd meet her at the DMV to transfer her tags since it's in both of our names.  I agreed because I'll always help her no matter what, even though she hasn't been there for me at all since the break-up.  My requests go unanswered, yet she calls when she needs something.  So typical.  We were going to meet yesterday but the DMV was closed for the holiday, so another call from her to reschedule.  Then she called yesterday for help with her taxes and how to file.
Boy, did those words ring true. Rules for me but not for thee big time.
As I was talking to her about the taxes, she said, "I'm sorry to bother you, I've bothered you a lot lately and I don't want to."  I replied, "It's never a bother, we spent half our lives together and I'll always be there for you."  She replied, "Yeah, but I don't want that and I don't want you."
She was waiting for a moment to slide that in there, and see if it hurt you, and in her hubris assumed you saying you'd always be there, that you meant "im here for you to do whatever, whenever". Seriously, cruel.

Now, in this moment, you'd think I'd be hurt- that was cold as ice.  But it had the opposite effect and I felt a release.  It was almost like God said, "Okay, it's finally time for your next chapter to begin."  Maybe 2 hours later, someone from a dating site reached out to me, someone I'd had my eyes on for awhile.  We exchanged contact info and talked for the next 4 or 5 hours, and it was so weird because it was like we had known each other for years already.  Everything just clicked.

I'm not saying that the new gal I met will lead to anything, who knows.  My point here though is that I finally heard that one sentence, that one thing, that completely shifted my mindset and focus.  I deserve better than what I've received and I'm a great guy, a great 'catch'.  That's who I woke up as today and I'm not just saying it, I believe it.  I know it to be true because that's who I always have been.

I know you don't believe in God, so hopefully you understand I only included that because it was a part of my journey, a message I've been waiting for.  If you let it, the universe will eventually tell you the same thing- you're a great guy and you're okay, stop chasing the past and the pain that it brings.  There's a new you just waiting to be born and live the life you're meant to live.

I hope that helps buddy- I'm here for you anytime.

Worth mentioning I don't NOT believe in God either. I really believe that whatever is on the other side of The Veil is far and above what out simple 3dimensional minds can even begin to comprehend. I can say that in the last 10 years of my life I have come to believe in some degree of "things are meant to happen and they will, and theres a reason for it"
When I talk about "The Universe" or "The Great Magnet" (Earth), i feel like that is the same sense of presence you find from God.

I appreciate everything Pook, and I feel similar "cutting of cords" occuring.
The move, a new area, a new schedule, new hobbies and habits, this will all fade from Vivid 4k, to 720P, to CRT to black and white, to silent film.
In the archives it will go, and the pain will lessen, as it already has.

Thank you all.

[Pook075]

Worth mentioning I don't NOT believe in God either. I really believe that whatever is on the other side of The Veil is far and above what out simple 3dimensional minds can even begin to comprehend. I can say that in the last 10 years of my life I have come to believe in some degree of "things are meant to happen and they will, and theres a reason for it"
When I talk about "The Universe" or "The Great Magnet" (Earth), i feel like that is the same sense of presence you find from God.

I appreciate everything Pook, and I feel similar "cutting of cords" occuring.
The move, a new area, a new schedule, new hobbies and habits, this will all fade from Vivid 4k, to 720P, to CRT to black and white, to silent film.
In the archives it will go, and the pain will lessen, as it already has.

Thank you all.

Thanks friend, and I agree with everything you said.  The Bible says God created the universe, you connect with the universe, which means you're connecting with God (in my opinion, anyway).  You will get through this and come out a better man for it on the other side.

Good luck moving bro!  It has to be exciting to be taking this big step.

[OKrunch]

Just finished moving, too tired to be depressed tonight.
Feels good to have my own pad again.

[Rev]

Just finished moving, too tired to be depressed tonight.
Feels good to have my own pad again.

Congratulations.

Pleasant dreams.

Tomorrow is a new day.

Rev

[SinisterComplex]

Just finished moving, too tired to be depressed tonight.
Feels good to have my own pad again.

That therein lies the trick...load yourself up with tasks then you quite literally do not have time for anything other than getting S done. BTW...congrats. Take all the little victories you can and continue to get better.

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

[OKrunch]

I woke up with one oddly specific question in my head.

Why in every correspondence in the last few months that she reminded me that she doesn't hate me. Every behavior and word from her otherwise would indicate the opposite. Very strange.

Woke up feeling lonely but I suppose that's to be expected on the first morning in a new apartment, still twists my guts to think that she is not waking up alone. It is what it is I guess.

Beautiful day out.

[BigEasyHeart]

Congratulations on your new place. I'll be moving myself, probably this week so I can relate. I'm looking forward to having my own space again but also know it will be strange waking up alone those first days.

I don't know how to help you with the "I don't hate you" thing except to say that I've been through something similar and it may help to consider that this person does not process emotions as a typical adult does. Think of how a young child acts out towards their own parents.

[Pook075]

Congratulations on your new place. I'll be moving myself, probably this week so I can relate. I'm looking forward to having my own space again but also know it will be strange waking up alone those first days.

I don't know how to help you with the "I don't hate you" thing except to say that I've been through something similar and it may help to consider that this person does not process emotions as a typical adult does. Think of how a young child acts out towards their own parents.

I completely agree with everything Big Easy said.  Every conversation is an explosion of emotions in the moment and have nothing to do with what was said last week, last year, or 5 minutes ago.  They're not connected...everything is in the moment and without any logic or reason behind them.

[Couscous]

Why in every correspondence in the last few months that she reminded me that she doesn't hate me. Every behavior and word from her otherwise would indicate the opposite. Very strange.

In fact there is nothing strange about this at all. She doesn't hate you, she just hates the angry and violent behavior. Her Mama Bear instincts kicked in and her desire to protect the children supersedes her feelings for you, and as such, she is acting as a rational adult in this situation. Does that make sense?

[OKrunch]

In fact there is nothing strange about this at all. She doesn't hate you, she just hates the angry and violent behavior. Her Mama Bear instincts kicked in and her desire to protect the children supersedes her feelings for you, and as such, she is acting as a rational adult in this situation. Does that make sense?

I think you may have the wrong idea as to what occurred throughout the relationship.
I don't disagree with what you think she may think, but her recollection of events is not accurate.

[tina7868]

I want to join in on congratulating you on your move. Wishing you growth and success as you work on your admirable goals, and looking forward to reading you share your journey as you walk down this new path.

[OKrunch]

I know I look for patterns in too many things but I find it interesting that today  marks exactly 200 days since we broke up and I got kicked out.



I just wrote in my personal Journal that I have a few goals now that I'm in a completely new situation. No more checking social media, no more reaching out for any reason at all whatsoever no if ands or buts about it. Responding if she reaches out is the only thing, and I need to make sure that when she does reach out it's not just because she needs something which is the most likely scenario.



Too exhausted to worry about it over the weekend, although I did have a very strong spidey sense wave come through on Saturday evening. Other than that I am not paying it any mind other than respecting the fleeting thoughts that come into my head and then letting them go on their way.



I do have some milestones in my head, the anniversary of her grandfather's death, the anniversary of our engagement at the end of June, my birthday and mid July. These are all likely reach out. And then of course the anniversary of our breakup at the end of the September. By the time these dates roll around I probably won't give too much of a crap about it anymore anyway, but they are still in my head as of now.

 The random thoughts of her being with someone else still hurt an awful lot, and I will say this rebound doesn't feel like the last one. Maybe this will actually last for her who knows I don't know. I'm hoping by the time my birthday rolls around I truly won't give a rat's ass.

[OKrunch]

Although, these words will not leave my head," I cannot and will not reconcile"
 despite having heard several different versions of the same thing over the years.
And the fact that she read my email 33 times. that boggles my mind.

[Turkish]

This thread will remain locked due to excessive length.  If the topic is of interest, see the new thread here:

The forging of The Path