Standing Firm in Her Storm 2...

[MaroonLiquid]

Here is my previous thread... .https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=276400.0

My thoughts?   Really tired of her unhealthiness and not seeking help.  I know I can't control her, but she continues her poor a$$ behavior... .Even in front of her kids and she wonders why they are struggling!  I don't know what to do regarding our r/s anymore.  I'm hanging tough, and staying strong.  Yes, she has gotten better.  Yes, yesterday was a step backward.  Not sure where to go from here... .A part of me wants to hang in there and a part of me wants to completely cut her off and let her see what life is like without me... .My love for her hasn't changed, but I need to protect that and maybe lovingly detach for a while.  What sad, is each time I go through this, I see that I begin to care less.  Does that make sense?  I don't know how to explain it other than that... .

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

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[Fian]

Hello, I am new to the board and only discovered that my wife has BPD in the past week (no formal diagnosis).  Having read your first thread, here are my thoughts:

1.  I don't think it is fair for those on this thread to question whether you are right about not paying off the 401k loan.  We don't have all of the details, and you didn't ask us if your position was reasonable.  Considering that your wife has BPD, there is a good chance that your position IS reasonable.  (On a side note, though, what I am struggling with now is how to not consider all of my wife's requests as unreasonable.  Just because she has a skewed view of the world does not mean that my view on things is correct.  There are probably psychiatric terms to describe many of my behaviors as well.)

2.  I think your wife violated 2 limits that you need to have in your relationship. One, she stole from you.  Two, she damaged your car.  If you are going to be able to interact with each other, she needs to respect those 2 limits.

Now that she has violated the limits, you have to decide what your response will be.  Personally, I would have a hard time being in the same room with her if she is going to attempt to steal something from you each time you get into an argument.  You may want to look into legal options (file a police report?).  I don't know much about such options, so you might want to check the legal thread to see what people suggest.  You also mentioned that she stole your laptop and still hasn't returned it.  You may want to tell her that one of your limits is stealing from you and that you need her to respect that limit.  As a sign that she is willing to respect that limit, she needs to return your laptop.  Until then, you won't do X (you will need to fill in what that is - maybe not being in the same room with her, I don't know).

[formflier]

 

Maroon,

I hope to spend some more time on your thread later today.


I know you are tired of all this... .I'm with you man... .this stuff is hard. It's not fair... .but it is. There are also good moments... .those will come again. 

Take deep breath... .let's work on a sports analogy.

You are my star hitter... .your skills have improved dramatically over the season... .lots of practice!   

Bases are loaded... .2 outs... .I'm not sure what the count is against you during this at bat... .but I think this thing resolves... .one way or another pretty quick.

Here is the thing... .I'm not aware of any more ammo she has to toss at you.  So... .fairly soon... .she will call your bluff... .or you will call hers. 

My guess is that it will be a conversation with her lawyer... .as he asks what to do next.

So... .back to sports analogy.  She's the pitcher... .and she has been putting some serious junk on her pitches.

If she sends you an emotionally healthy pitch... .the team needs you to swing with all you've got.

If she pitches you something that is unhealthy... .the best you can hope for is a walk... .don't swing.

She gets some kind of odd thing... .which we as nons don't really understand (at least I don't)... .from cheating when she pitches (that is emotional bs that she sends you)

So... .the team (your family)... .needs you to get back out there... .and keep your eye on the ball... .and know when to swing.

You can do this... .

Last thought for now:  "Telling her several times you are here for taxes... ."  I see you trying to use the tools... .but I'm thinking that a tool switch was in order.  Tell her once... .MAYBE... .twice if you see the temp coming down... .then switch tools and exit.

My guess (I may be wrong)... .is that it came across to her as you "pleading" with her to be reasonable... .to stick to an agreement to talk about taxes... .

Even if it didn't sound that way to you... .that is my guess for how she took it. 

That put her in the power position... .she likes having power over you... .you are "pleading" with her to give it back.

I'm thinking a better answer is to take it back... .it's yours.

Taking it back means exiting the conversation... .and house if needed.

Hang tough!  Keep eye on ball!

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Hello, I am new to the board and only discovered that my wife has BPD in the past week (no formal diagnosis).  Having read your first thread, here are my thoughts:

First, I am sorry that you find yourself here, and second, thank you for contributing to my thread in the midst of your circumstances.

1.  I don't think it is fair for those on this thread to question whether you are right about not paying off the 401k loan.  We don't have all of the details, and you didn't ask us if your position was reasonable.  Considering that your wife has BPD, there is a good chance that your position IS reasonable.  (On a side note, though, what I am struggling with now is how to not consider all of my wife's requests as unreasonable.  Just because she has a skewed view of the world does not mean that my view on things is correct.  There are probably psychiatric terms to describe many of my behaviors as well.)

Everyone is entitled to their opinions.  What most people aren't looking at is if I wanted to be nasty, I could go after half of her 401k if we do go through a divorce.  I wouldn't do that considering I'm not that way, she doesn't get child support from her ex, nor do I feel I am entitled to it regardless that I am her husband.

2.  I think your wife violated 2 limits that you need to have in your relationship. One, she stole from you.  Two, she damaged your car.  If you are going to be able to interact with each other, she needs to respect those 2 limits.

Now that she has violated the limits, you have to decide what your response will be.  Personally, I would have a hard time being in the same room with her if she is going to attempt to steal something from you each time you get into an argument.  You may want to look into legal options (file a police report?).  I don't know much about such options, so you might want to check the legal thread to see what people suggest. 

This is where I am struggling.  I am not sure how to set this limit and what that looks like.  It's not that I am scared to, but how do you enforce such a boundary.  :)oesn't mean she might not try it again.

You also mentioned that she stole your laptop and still hasn't returned it.  You may want to tell her that one of your limits is stealing from you and that you need her to respect that limit.  As a sign that she is willing to respect that limit, she needs to return your laptop.  Until then, you won't do X (you will need to fill in what that is - maybe not being in the same room with her, I don't know).

She is using the "community property" excuse to not give it back knowing full well I bought it with my student loan.  I have tried letting it go and not mentioning it thinking eventually she would do the right thing (in other words, when she sees something is important to me, she tries to control it).  That didn't happen.

Maroon,

I hope to spend some more time on your thread later today.

I really appreciate that.

I know you are tired of all this... .I'm with you man... .this stuff is hard. It's not fair... .but it is.

It is tough.  It wears on you.

There are also good moments... .those will come again. 

Why do you think that?

Take deep breath... .let's work on a sports analogy.

You are my star hitter... .your skills have improved dramatically over the season... .lots of practice!   

Bases are loaded... .2 outs... .I'm not sure what the count is against you during this at bat... .but I think this thing resolves... .one way or another pretty quick.

What thing?

Here is the thing... .I'm not aware of any more ammo she has to toss at you.  So... .fairly soon... .she will call your bluff... .or you will call hers.

My guess is that it will be a conversation with her lawyer... .as he asks what to do next.

So... .back to sports analogy.  She's the pitcher... .and she has been putting some serious junk on her pitches.

If she sends you an emotionally healthy pitch... .the team needs you to swing with all you've got.

What would you consider "emotionally healthy"?

If she pitches you something that is unhealthy... .the best you can hope for is a walk... .don't swing.

What would you consider "emotionally unhealthy"?

She gets some kind of odd thing... .which we as nons don't really understand (at least I don't)... .from cheating when she pitches (that is emotional bs that she sends you)

So... .the team (your family)... .needs you to get back out there... .and keep your eye on the ball... .and know when to swing.

You can do this... .

Last thought for now:  "Telling her several times you are here for taxes... ."  I see you trying to use the tools... .but I'm thinking that a tool switch was in order.  Tell her once... .MAYBE... .twice if you see the temp coming down... .then switch tools and exit.

My guess (I may be wrong)... .is that it came across to her as you "pleading" with her to be reasonable... .to stick to an agreement to talk about taxes... .

Even if it didn't sound that way to you... .that is my guess for how she took it. 

I see you're first point and see your second point also.  It's exhausting in the middle of it to try and figure out what her thought process is.

That put her in the power position... .she likes having power over you... .

Yes, I totally see that and see that the divorce is another way of that, "having control".

you are "pleading" with her to give it back.

I'm thinking a better answer is to take it back... .it's yours.

Taking it back means exiting the conversation... .and house if needed.

Hang tough!  Keep eye on ball!

FF

OK. 

[formflier]

 

The thing I am referring to is your marriage.


Either she will "blink" and toss out myriad reasons why the divorce isn't going forward... .

Or... .she will proceed... .

To be clear... .I don't think you should bring this up... .or respond to her divorce talk... .that's why you have lawyers.

Plus... .right now... .I'm sensing you are a bit "raw"... .and worn out.  That is the time for even stronger boundaries... .because your energy reserves are low.

Make it about you... ."I'm too upset to discuss this now... ."... .exit. 

I'll try to spend some time later on this... .

Oh... .yeah... .the reason I think good times will come again... .is that is the "order to the disorder"

There have been times before when I got the vibe from you that you were at end of rope... .and things got better.

No guarantees... .but I think this will get better as well.

Last thing:  Take her out of the equation... .random person vandalizes your stuff... .what do you do?

Emotionally healthy is big topic... .but the quick answer... .is known trigger conversations... .jadeing... .baiting... .

FF

[KateCat]

Maroon, I think that the only healthy way to get to good times in your relationship is through the strong boundaries that are being described here. (And I guess I'm not really seeing a great variation of opinion from people who have responded to this thread, despite the confusion regarding the 401K payback.)

Right now, I would argue that no parts of this cycle are healthy. Not the parts where you have passionate make-up periods with your wife, and not the parts where her kids do the happy dance because the man sometimes-known-as-Dad is back again, however briefly. It's all pretty traumatic.

You became part of this daunting picture as a very young man, I believe. No wonder you didn't know what hit you. But now, even though you are quite a bit younger than your wife, the only candidate in the family for leading in a very grown up way is you.

You've got formflier pitching you excellent questions. And Fian shows a quick grasp of your situation as well. They are both seeing the really tough stuff you face right now quite clearly it seems. Their posts bear re-reading, and contemplating at the deepest level. 

I can't imagine how tired you must be right now. Maybe you can take some kind of break after finishing with the IRS business.

[formflier]

I can't imagine how tired you must be right now. Maybe you can take some kind of break after finishing with the IRS business.

Is there a deadline with IRS?  Why is this being discussed right now?  What happens if you decide to ignore it for 4 months... .6 months... .12 months?

Have you filed your own return ... .or did you extend it?

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

The thing I am referring to is your marriage.

That's what I figured... .

To be clear... .I don't think you should bring this up... .or respond to her divorce talk... .

I won't... .

Plus... .right now... .I'm sensing you are a bit "raw"... .and worn out.  That is the time for even stronger boundaries... .because your energy reserves are low.  Make it about you... ."I'm too upset to discuss this now... ."... .exit. 

I am.  I do need even stronger boundaries right now.  Honestly, I don't even care at the moment that we aren't talking.  is is bad that I'm almost happy and at peace with it.  It gets more that way each time this cycle starts anew... .

Oh... .yeah... .the reason I think good times will come again... .is that is the "order to the disorder"

There have been times before when I got the vibe from you that you were at end of rope... .and things got better.

No guarantees... .but I think this will get better as well.

You're definitely right about the "order to the disorder".

Last thing:  Take her out of the equation... .random person vandalizes your stuff... .what do you do?

File a police report... .

I can't imagine how tired you must be right now. Maybe you can take some kind of break after finishing with the IRS business.

Is there a deadline with IRS?  Why is this being discussed right now?  What happens if you decide to ignore it for 4 months... .6 months... .12 months?

Have you filed your own return ... .or did you extend it?

FF

I need to find out when the deadline is with the IRS... .I will call this afternoon.  I filed an extension on last year's taxes and so did she.

Maroon, I think that the only healthy way to get to good times in your relationship is through the strong boundaries that are being described here. (And I guess I'm not really seeing a great variation of opinion from people who have responded to this thread, despite the confusion regarding the 401K payback.)

I agree.  Trying to think and talk through what those strong boundaries might be... .

Right now, I would argue that no parts of this cycle are healthy. Not the parts where you have passionate make-up periods with your wife, and not the parts where her kids do the happy dance because the man sometimes-known-as-Dad is back again, however briefly. It's all pretty traumatic.

Yeah, I agree.  It is strange.  I avoid telling anyone (except people I trust about the situation) because they all tell me I'm nuts.

You became part of this daunting picture as a very young man, I believe. No wonder you didn't know what hit you. But now, even though you are quite a bit younger than your wife, the only candidate in the family for leading in a very grown up way is you.

And the problem was, my first marriage was extremely unhealthy also.  I hate even typing that.  Never really recovered from the first one either.

You've got formflier pitching you excellent questions. And Fian shows a quick grasp of your situation as well. They are both seeing the really tough stuff you face right now quite clearly it seems. Their posts bear re-reading, and contemplating at the deepest level. 

I will make sure I read through them again later today and digest them.

I can't imagine how tired you must be right now. Maybe you can take some kind of break after finishing with the IRS business.

Honestly, I am tired.  Tired of several things at the moment and need a vacation for a bit.  Break from my wife's garbage, break from work.  Problem is, I think I would just sleep for the entire vacation and it would be a waste.

[formflier]

I am.  I do need even stronger boundaries right now.  Honestly, I don't even care at the moment that we aren't talking.  is is bad that I'm almost happy and at peace with it.  It gets more that way each time this cycle starts anew... .

I believe that is because you are getting healthier... .stronger... .

You are more centered about what you do... .and don't control... .

FF

[KateCat]

I too feel that you are getting stronger and healthier, doing pretty amazing work. 

[MaroonLiquid]

I too feel that you are getting stronger and healthier, doing pretty amazing work.  

I am.  I do need even stronger boundaries right now.  Honestly, I don't even care at the moment that we aren't talking.  is is bad that I'm almost happy and at peace with it.  It gets more that way each time this cycle starts anew... .

I believe that is because you are getting healthier... .stronger... .

You are more centered about what you do... .and don't control... .

FF

Thank you guys.  I really appreciate that and I do feel like I'm getting stronger.  The biggest are of opportunity for me is setting hard boundaries around how I'm treated.  It's my own fear of abandonment/loss... .

[Grey Kitty]

I can't imagine how tired you must be right now. Maybe you can take some kind of break after finishing with the IRS business.

Honestly, I am tired.  Tired of several things at the moment and need a vacation for a bit.  Break from my wife's garbage, break from work.  Problem is, I think I would just sleep for the entire vacation and it would be a waste.

Honestly, if you got a vacation where you just slept as much as you wanted and no phone calls, texts, emails, facebook things, or anything were accessible from your wife, you would be way ahead.

... .but that isn't really what I wanted to to say to you... .I've been mostly out of communications for a week or two, and missed most of this thread, but I did notice some serious escalation here.

1. She grabbed your phone and tried to keep it.

2. She started hitting your car with a baseball bat.

THIS IS A BAD SIGN. The escalation.

You've been doing better with her, and she's acting worse. It *may* be an extinction burst, however, you really should protect yourself.

Being alone with her (or with only kids as witnesses) seems like a rather big risk for you now. She could harm you. She could call police and falsely accuse you. You could be end up in jail.

Think about it. Think about keeping a more safe distance from her for a while, perhaps until the pending financial things are done... .taxes, mostly, I guess.

It may not be the best thing for your marriage, or for the kids you raised... .but you do  have other responsibilities, to yourself and your own kids, which you cannot deal with well from jail!

[MaroonLiquid]

Honestly, if you got a vacation where you just slept as much as you wanted and no phone calls, texts, emails, facebook things, or anything were accessible from your wife, you would be way ahead.

You're probably right here!

... .but that isn't really what I wanted to to say to you... .I've been mostly out of communications for a week or two, and missed most of this thread, but I did notice some serious escalation here.

1. She grabbed your phone and tried to keep it.

2. She started hitting your car with a baseball bat.

THIS IS A BAD SIGN. The escalation.

I'm still curious why the escalation happened so quickly considering she was doing better.  We had gone several months without a major dysregulation like this.  I was kind of shocked she resorted to this out of nowhere.  I shouldn't be and I know that she isn't emotionally healthy, but it did catch me off guard.  I am still surprised I handled it as well as I did.  Obviously she is struggling pretty bad.  One thing she has mentioned several times is her "having to be responsible for the kids college all on her own".  She seems to always dysregulate over money.  Unfortunately, I don't feel sorry for her because she is where she is because of her unhelathiness.  Doesn't mean I don't love her, but she made this bed.  When pwBPD pull their crap, it's almost like they expect nothing will happen to them.  As a Christian, I know that you "reap what you sow"... .The unfortunate thing is she knows that also... .Everytime she pulls something like this, it always bites her in the a$$... .

You've been doing better with her, and she's acting worse. It *may* be an extinction burst, however, you really should protect yourself.

I am.  Last night we had a softball event and our team took a picture and she was the only one that got the picture in time that I wanted.  I asked her for a copy and she completely ignored me.  At first I thought she couldn't hear me so I asked our daughter to ask her.  She did and she completely ignored her request.    I just walked away and shook my head.  They act like a two year old and it's quite ridiculous.  I didn't speak to her again. 

Being alone with her (or with only kids as witnesses) seems like a rather big risk for you now. She could harm you. She could call police and falsely accuse you. You could be end up in jail.

Think about it. Think about keeping a more safe distance from her for a while, perhaps until the pending financial things are done... .taxes, mostly, I guess.

It may not be the best thing for your marriage, or for the kids you raised... .but you do  have other responsibilities, to yourself and your own kids, which you cannot deal with well from jail!

I am going to do this.  I do have to look out for myself and my children right now and that will be my first priority. 

[formflier]

I'm still curious why the escalation happened so quickly considering she was doing better.  We had gone several months without a major dysregulation like this.  

Before I make these comments... .want to be clear... .her dysreg is not your fault... .at all.

Think of yourself as a firefighter (I guess my pitcher example didn't take... .    )

You realize that she has BPD traits... .you can see some smoldering... .a little smoke... .but... .there is no way to tell how hot things are underneath what you can see unless you pour some fuel on it.

Three choices. 

1.  See the smoke... .shrug and move along.

2.  See the smoke... .attempt to put some cooling water on it.

3.  See the smoke... .put some fuel on it... .stand back and see what happens.


To be clear... .there are times when firefighters dump all kinds of water on a situation... .and the house still burns down.    So... .you could have been "perfect"... .and maybe she wouldn't have hit your car with a bat (because they would still be in trunk) ... .but she might have picked up a rock and pitched it at you as you drove away... .while enforcing a boundary.

Very much like a firefighter... .when you "pull up" to a BPD situation... .take a long hard look at your strategy before entering the structure fire... .or else you could get burned.

And... .unfortunately for you and many of us... .there are others we care about in the burning house... .:'(

Good job testing the waters about the picture... .and then moving along.   

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

Before I make these comments... .want to be clear... .her dysreg is not your fault... .at all.

I know this and why I can laugh it about it and see how ridiculous and unhealthy it is.  I do realize she has a lot on her shoulders, but it is her fault and her bed she has to lie in.  Only she can change it, but she would rather have a whipping post instead of looking at the culprit.  I refuse to be anyones whipping post any longer.

Think of yourself as a firefighter (I guess my pitcher example didn't take... .    )

  Noted... .

You realize that she has BPD traits... .you can see some smoldering... .a little smoke... .but... .there is no way to tell how hot things are underneath what you can see unless you pour some fuel on it.

Three choices. 

1.  See the smoke... .shrug and move along.

2.  See the smoke... .attempt to put some cooling water on it.

3.  See the smoke... .put some fuel on it... .stand back and see what happens.

To be clear... .there are times when firefighters dump all kinds of water on a situation... .and the house still burns down.    So... .you could have been "perfect"... .and maybe she wouldn't have hit your car with a bat (because they would still be in trunk) ... .but she might have picked up a rock and pitched it at you as you drove away... .while enforcing a boundary.

In the moment, I thought I was by diverting the conversation back to the original topic.  I even tried and validated.  In the moment, i forgot that sometimes, it won't work regardless and I forget that.  You can't reason with the unreasonable.  I should have left the convo much earlier.

Very much like a firefighter... .when you "pull up" to a BPD situation... .take a long hard look at your strategy before entering the structure fire... .or else you could get burned.

This is where I still need work... .

And... .unfortunately for you and many of us... .there are others we care about in the burning house... .:'(

Good job testing the waters about the picture... .and then moving along.   

FF

This is so true.  It's bad enough her kids have a deadbeat dad, but then to have an unhealthy mother who has murdered the only dad they have ever trusted to them is crap.  And she wonders why they are struggling.  It's amazing that she put them in counseling when she divorced her ex and he was a deadbeat, but now, doesn't want them anywhere near it.  That's very telling... .As far as testing the waters, I more or less wanted the picture, but I guess deep down I was... .

[Grey Kitty]

I'm still curious why the escalation happened so quickly considering she was doing better.  We had gone several months without a major dysregulation like this.  I was kind of shocked she resorted to this out of nowhere.  I shouldn't be and I know that she isn't emotionally healthy, but it did catch me off guard.  I am still surprised I handled it as well as I did.

Keep your eye on the ball.

*WHY* she dysregulated isn't your problem. You can't know. She probably doesn't even know.

Your priority should be to make sure you are protected from it... .you don't need to understand it.

It is really tough to look at that next step away from your marriage. I've been there.   

I'm glad to hear you are doing better on boundaries and management of it. Hang in there.

[MaroonLiquid]

I'm still curious why the escalation happened so quickly considering she was doing better.  We had gone several months without a major dysregulation like this.  I was kind of shocked she resorted to this out of nowhere.  I shouldn't be and I know that she isn't emotionally healthy, but it did catch me off guard.  I am still surprised I handled it as well as I did.

Keep your eye on the ball.

*WHY* she dysregulated isn't your problem. You can't know. She probably doesn't even know.

Your priority should be to make sure you are protected from it... .you don't need to understand it.

It is really tough to look at that next step away from your marriage. I've been there.   

I'm glad to hear you are doing better on boundaries and management of it. Hang in there.

I know that the "why" isn't my problem.  I am protecting myself from it and it is very difficult to look at next steps.

This weekend, we had a softball tournament, and my wife and I got along well.  We hadn't spoken in almost a week, but we set up some stuff from our old business to do a fundraiser for our team.  There was no real shows of affection, however we did sit together at the games.  We laughed at times, talked on the phone and had fun.  Today, I included her on a team text and responded to her response.  One thing I will never understand is they can completely dysregulate and act like nothing happened.  I am staying emotionally distant, and allowing her to come to me... .

[MaroonLiquid]

The weather was really bad here last night andI texted my wife to check on her and the kids and made sure they were ok after softball practice.  She said they were and mentioned she had a headache and hadn't felt good all day.  I validated that and texted for a few minutes and could tell she was cutting it off by saying, "Have a good night and stay safe.  The weather is nasty."  I thought to myself, "   Seriously?  I had no idea.  I thought that is why I texted you."  But I just said, "You too.  Goodnight."  We haven't talked this morning and I'm letting her have her space. 

After we texted, I had a conversation with my first wife.  I called to check on our oldest daughter who was feeling bad.  We then got on the subject of softball, and she told me what my assistant coach's wife said to her a couple of weeks ago at a tournament.  She asked my first wife why my wife treats me the way she does at times.  She said that they see I am being very patient with her even in the midst of her anger, and even being mean at times.  She made the statement that I am always eager to help her when she needs it but that when she doesn't need me, she treats me bad.  I listened and it was hard to hear.  I know in the past I was that way, but not much anymore. 

[formflier]

  I know in the past I was that way, but not much anymore. 

What way?  Can you explain this a bit... .?

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

  I know in the past I was that way, but not much anymore. 

What way?  Can you explain this a bit... .?

FF

Really eager to put myself out there, regardless of how I am treated and thought that if I "tried harder", that would change the way she saw me.  I know now (and obviuosly have for a while) that I can't do that and it doesn't do any good.  The way I see it now is that I can only control me and she has the choice of how she acts.  I realize that people see the truth over time.  The other night, I think my wife got upset with me because after I helped loading her car up with the stuff we used for the fundraiser, she asked if I could run home with her and help her unload the first load.  I said I needed to stay and score the game coming up.  She got upset at first but then realized our oldest daughter wanted to go home so she dropped it.  Later, on her last trip from the fields, she called and asked if I had emptied the water out of the freezer as she could hear it sloshing around.  I told her, "No, I forgot to.  It won't leak as it is airtight when closed and won't open.  It will be fine until you get home".  No, I didn't validate her fear of it leaking in her car.  I really feel that what she was wanting me to do was come and help her unload it, empty it and whatever else.  At first I felt guilty, but then I realized a couple of things.  Number one, my car had gotten stuck in the mud earlier that day and a couple of guys were going to help me push it out.  Not a huge deal, but she didn't even address that in the conversation.  Second, I realized that when she wasn't speaking to me last week, she loaded/unloaded everything all by herself and didn't need my help then.  So now because she was tired (yes, it was one in the morning) and didn't want to do it by herself, she could call me knowing it was a no-win.  It also gave her the perfect out to paint me black and play the victim card.  She raised her voice and said, "Fine, I'll do it myself." and hung up.  I thought to myself, welcome to my world sweetheart!      Basically now, I'm not making myself as available to her as I once did.  She needs to feel the weight of her decisions. 

[MaroonLiquid]

So as I said earlier, I haven't made contact with my wife first within the last week at all.  She called me three times today.  The second time she called, we talked for over an hour and it was light, fun and we joked.  I have not told her I loved her in over a week and I feel pretty good about that, even though truthfully, I want to tell her. 

[formflier]

 

I'm impressed with your ability to feel... .your feelings... .and then make a emotionally healthy choice based on the patterns your wife has been displaying in the r/s.

I think I know why... .but... .I think lots of newbies out there might be interested in knowing why you don't just tell her how you feel... .

Isn't telling her you love her a good thing? 

(The fastball has been pitched... .let's see what he does with it!)   

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

I'm impressed with your ability to feel... .your feelings... .and then make a emotionally healthy choice based on the patterns your wife has been displaying in the r/s.

I think I know why... .but... .I think lots of newbies out there might be interested in knowing why you don't just tell her how you feel... .

Isn't telling her you love her a good thing?  

(The fastball has been pitched... .let's see what he does with it!)  

FF

Telling her how I feel gives her a "fastball over the middle of the plate" to "hit over the fence" and reject me... .It gives her the power.  It also puts pressure on her to say something she may not be feeling at the moment which gives them anxiety and in turn could lead to dysregulation.

[formflier]

 

Nicely said... .!

Ready for extra credit... .?

It also risks doing what to her.  Hint... .as opposed to adding oil to the "machine" (machine being your r/s) and having it runs smoother... .what might you do to the machine... .?

[MaroonLiquid]

Nicely said... .!

Thank you!   

Ready for extra credit... .?

It also risks doing what to her.  Hint... .as opposed to adding oil to the "machine" (machine being your r/s) and having it runs smoother... .what might you do to the machine... .?

It risks pushing her away.  It's part of the push/pull of the disorder... .

[formflier]

It risks pushing her away.  It's part of the push/pull of the disorder... .

A valid response... .however... .I was thinking invalidation.

If Maroon feels lovey dovey... .and wifey does not.  Maroon calls her up and says I love you... .you are the best... .blah blah blah... .  and she doesn't feel that way.

INVALIDATION... .

Here is my take on push pull... .it's similar to invalidation.  If maroon is feeling pull... .when wifey is feeling pull... .and you both get close... .nice work!  Enjoy the great time.

If both are feeling push... .that works out as well.

It's when each of you are opposite... .that it seems to go south.

Thoughts?

FF

[MaroonLiquid]

It risks pushing her away.  It's part of the push/pull of the disorder... .

A valid response... .however... .I was thinking invalidation.

If Maroon feels lovey dovey... .and wifey does not.  Maroon calls her up and says I love you... .you are the best... .blah blah blah... .  and she doesn't feel that way.

INVALIDATION... .

Here is my take on push pull... .it's similar to invalidation.  If maroon is feeling pull... .when wifey is feeling pull... .and you both get close... .nice work!  Enjoy the great time.

If both are feeling push... .that works out as well.

It's when each of you are opposite... .that it seems to go south.

Thoughts?

FF

That's true.  Right now we are both pull/pull and not really getting anywhere.  She asked me to pick up our daughter for practice and I said sure as she had choir practice at church.  I notice when she gets back in church (been out a while because of softball tournaments), she goes into a full on "pull".  It's almost like she can't have a r/s with me and be in that church at the same time (painted me black to all them obviously and feels guilty maybe?)... .

[MaroonLiquid]

From one point of view... .it appears she has been picking up different tools to try to get a rise out of me... . and not getting what she is looking for.

I was thinking this morning on the way to work and then reading this in your other thread had me thinking.  Our wedding anniversary is coming up in two weeks and I'm not sure how to handle this.  What should I expect from her (BPD-wise) as this event gets closer?  I could see her trying to get a rise out of me to paint me black considering this is a "big event".  I know that no one can speak for her, but what do you think she expects of me?  A part of me thinks that I just go on as that day doesn't exist and don't bring it up, but then again, a part of me wonders if I should.  Another no-win it feels like.  I don't want to reward her for her last dysregulation and denting the hood on my car by having a "romantic" night out.  I don't know that I can be romantic considering.  I also don't want to not do anything... . This is tough... .

Obviously at the moment, we are in a pull/pull deal, and I'm not chasing her.  Since her last dysregulation, I have pulled back a bunch emotionally.  The "divorce" is at a standstill (she's not pushing it and only does when she dysregulates) and the more time goes by, it just affirms for me that it is a form of manipulation by her.  Thoughts?

[formflier]

 

IMO... .the divorce is manipulation tactic.  Doesn't mean she won't go through with it... .


I think you need to start a new thread on what to do about anniversary... .

Of course it will be a big deal... .ignoring it seems wrong... .but... .she is such an exposed nerve right now... .sigh.

FF

[Fian]

Personally, I would not be celebrating an anniversary while divorce is on the table.  My approach would be to tell her that you are not planning on celebrating it due to the divorce and the fact that she took a base ball bat to your car.