Any suggestions?

[Parents! Get help here!]

I hope you don't feel I'm posting about trivialities but sometimes you help me come up with solutions I haven't thought of or help me to avoid mistakes.

Awkward situation here.

Some of you will remember that my family had a major row at Christmas which began with DD1 (with BPD) hacking her sister's e-mail.

She turned this all round and made it my fault and I had to work very hard to re-establish contact with her.

Well today I get an e-mail from her. She wants to visit this area and stay overnight, she will bring GC.

I am aware that this is for her own convenience, nevertheless I am pleased.

However DH says NO, NO WAY she needs to apologize to everyone before I even consider it.

If I say anything like that we'll be back to square one.

I understand where DH is coming from. He has been discharged from hospital today and only last week she was saying she didn't care if he dropped dead (he doesn't know that).

I also feel in a way I am saying its ok to treat your sister any way you like and we'll forget all about it.

I could try to insist she stays but DH and I are going to argue and the atmosphere will be very uncomfortable.

My best idea is to pay for local hotel for her and see her during day.

Can anyone help me to use tools (eg SET) to communicate with both DD and DH?

[lever.]

I hope you don't feel I'm posting about trivialities but sometimes you help me come up with solutions I haven't thought of or help me to avoid mistakes.

Awkward situation here.

Some of you will remember that my family had a major row at Christmas which began with DD1 (with BPD) hacking her sister's e-mail.

She turned this all round and made it my fault and I had to work very hard to re-establish contact with her.

Well today I get an e-mail from her. She wants to visit this area and stay overnight, she will bring GC.

I am aware that this is for her own convenience, nevertheless I am pleased.

However DH says NO, NO WAY she needs to apologize to everyone before I even consider it.

If I say anything like that we'll be back to square one.

I understand where DH is coming from. He has been discharged from hospital today and only last week she was saying she didn't care if he dropped dead (he doesn't know that).

I also feel in a way I am saying its ok to treat your sister any way you like and we'll forget all about it.

I could try to insist she stays but DH and I are going to argue and the atmosphere will be very uncomfortable.

My best idea is to pay for local hotel for her and see her during day.

Can anyone help me to use tools (eg SET) to communicate with both DD and DH?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[mama72]

Hi, lever.

You are sure in a tough spot! A question for you: Is your DH's health well enough to handle the stressor of your DH being under the same roof? The effect stress can have on someone who is healthy can be considerable, let alone someone who has just been in the hospital.

I understand your excitement. When our loved ones with pwBPD show an interest in contact (even if it could be for their convenience), we get our hopes up that things will go well and start to heal. Many times, we get let down, but we have to keep trying. Hope is powerful.

My advice (and I am far from an expert, barely keeping it together myself!) would be to pay for the hotel. Maybe just explain that your DH needs his rest. Not sure what time frame you are talking about for the visit?

I am not sure a forced apology is going to mend any hurt feelings. Apologies need to be genuine or they don't really work, for either party.

Hope I have helped a bit. No easy answer.

[lever.]

thanks autkpi.

He isn't that well. He has complications of diabetes and heart problems. He had two toes amputated last week.

Relationship between dd and Dh not great. He will probably be short with her and that could trigger a rage ( a common pattern).

He won't particularly like me paying for hotel but that's the way I'm leaning.

I do feel slightly as if I'm condoning the bad behaviour towards other daughter but can't see a way round that.

I agree about forced apologies.

Thanks for your reply-it helps just to have people to talk to who "get it".

DD tends to dis-regulate and say horrible things when she is angry and then acts as if she never said them.

The rest of the family unfortunately remember only too well

[llbee814]

I am so sorry you are stuck in the middle like this.  I know how it feels and it really bites!  My thoughts on this are that if dh is standing firm on this, at the expense of seeing gc, he must be pretty much set on his desired course of action.  Seeing as how he has only just been discharged from hospital, I don't know if I would be willing to push for dd to come.  You certainly know his situation better than I, but my first concern would be with his health.  Perhaps dd will be okay with the hotel idea.  In any event, good luck.  (And for the record, I don't see this as trivial in the least... . it's a really tough call when your loyalties get pulled apart like this!)

[lever.]

Thanks for your understanding llbee.

I do feel a sense of very divided loyalties. I will try to talk to DH again tomorrow, he got little sleep in the hospital so this evening isn't the time.

You have given me some ideas to put to him eg "Are you really so set on this as to not see the GC" ":)o you think a forced apology would have any value?"

If he still won't budge I will write an e-mail in the SET format to DD offering to pay for hotel and treat the kids to a day out.

I do think DH has a sense of loyalty to other DD who has put up with a lot.

[co.jo]

I would sure go for the hotel, and use your husband's health as an excuse.Might make things easier all around.

As for the apology, as I understand the illness, in your daughter's view of things she will not have done anything she needs to apologize for, and that is truly the way BPD people see things, not just something she is making up to avoid responsibility.

I get that your husband is probably not going to read valerie Porr, but would your nonBPD daughter? Might make her understand things a little better. My kids refuse to read it, but I am asking them to read the first 2 chapters as a birthday present to me.

[lever.]

You are right co-jo. She has no understanding of other people's boundaries and doesn't think she has done anything wrong. She thinks we are all nasty with her and treat her like a scapegoat.

The Christmas incident was just one example. The things she has done to her sister are unbelievable.

I will go with the hotel suggestion. There is likely to be another blow up if she stays here. I think she will act as if she is doing us a great favour by bringing GC and DH will not be using appropriate communication tools

If she stays here there is potential for a complete breakdown in relationships, its hanging by a thread anyway. If she starts swearing at DH to his face he will make her leave.

I am working on getting DH and DD2 to read Valerie Porr. They know she has had mental health problems (suicide attempts, eating disorder etc) but still think I make too many excuses for her. They see a lot of it as just outrageous behaviour.

She really wants to come hear because she wants to see someone else in the area and has no money to stay anywhere else, so hotel might suit her anyway.

[lever.]

PS co-jo. Like your daughter she thinks I have a magical ability to control other family members responses to her and engineer a situation in which they all accept her.

Its so difficult

[tristesse]

Wow... . really sorry that you have to tugged in two different directions. I know your pain, and I know how hard it is to try and figure out what answer is the right answer. My dBPD is now30 and we have been doing this since she was about 12, so I know tortuous it is. Like you, my other family members think it's over dramatization, and that she needs to grow up, and she thinks I have a magic wand and can control how they think, feel  and act. I wish there was a right answer here, and a guaranteed good outcome. Good luck to you. I'll be praying for a peaceful visit.

[lever.]

Well I e-mailed with an attempt at SET and she has accepted the hotel idea although sounds resigned.

She had said a couple of days between now and 20th May.

I told her that her sister had already arranged to visit on 9th and 10th May.

Now she says those are the only two days she could bring eldest grandchild because of school and she is very disappointed that I have once again but DD2 before GC.

I will phone her sister tomo and see what I can do.

If I reply that I couldn't love anyone more than eldest GC but am trying to keep my relationship with her and with her sister separate for the moment do you think I will be giving her something to argue with? Or should I just ignore? would that be invalidating and could I phrase it another way?Thanks for your answers. In one way I feel I am making a mountain out of a molehill. In another way a lot hinges on how I handle this.

I will actually be disappointed not to see GS

[js friend]

Lever I think you are damned if you do and damned if you dont. 

Personally i wouldnt reply to your dd,s comment telling her how much you love your gc because it will be turned against you in someway. I know if were my dd she would be guilt tripping me if i were to say something like that.  I can just hear her now... . to the effect that if I loved him so much I would be  doing x,y and z to see him... .

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

lever-  seems your BPDDD will continue to put you in the middle if she is able. Did she reply about the 9th-10th only after you mentioned nonD coming to visit then? Will that nonD be staying at your home?

It might be worth considering asking any visitors in May to stay at a motel to give your dh the healing space that is needed. This would be a true statement for both your girls and with your DH.

Something I am learning is that giving my marriage priority at this stage of life is so valuable. This is the person I intend to share my day-to-day life with for as long as we live. When I put this priority in place, then I be more clear in my responses to my BPDDD27.

Seeing your GC - this is the next priority, at least it is in my life. The gkids are so often innocent victims in the family dynamics with BPD. Can you offer to spend some special time with your GC while your BPDD is visiting in the area?

Just some random thoughts. You are in a hard place.

qcr

[lever.]

Yes, she replied about 9th-10th after I said her sister will be here.

DD2 would help,- cook us a meal, joke with her Dad and cheer him up. She has planned to stay here because of organising something for work but only lives an hours drive away so doesn't actually need to stay.

DD1 now lives much further away

I will phone DD2 tomo and tell her the situation.

However she is with DH in getting frustrated with me and saying I allow DD1 to treat us all like c**p.

Thanks everyone for your patience with me. I feel like dumping them all and joining a convent

[co.jo]

Well at least you gave us all a laugh with your last line!

[qcarolr]

Thanks everyone for your patience with me. I feel like dumping them all and joining a convent

Maybe just a retreat for a few weeks -- see how they can really get along without us for a bit. 

[hopeangel]

Can I come too! 

[lever.]

Well I spoke to DD2 who said that she would stay away and see us another time as she doesn't want to see her sister at present.

I e-mailed DD1 and just said that she ?could come any time including that weekend (didn't mention her sister).

The reply "Why don't you just tell her that I'll be there and she can visit anyway or f*** off... . thought not... . Anyway will visit the week after.".

Not going to respond -just venting really but what on earth did she hear that caused that re-action

At what point do boundaries come in and I pull her up on all this nasty swearing? I think I've gone back to square one at present in being afraid to set boundaries

[llbee814]

Oh lever, our kids certainly make things harder than they have to be... . as do husbands  .  Of course dd1 knows you went to dd2 regarding what's going on.  And of course she doesn't appreciate what you did.  Judging from efforts I have made between some of mine (4 kids, 2 of which are feuding, neither of which are my BPD) you are lucky that dd2 is as understanding as she is.  Lord knows, mine aren't always!  It's so tiring.  Personally, I'm coming to the conclusion that it's not my job to referee.  I've just been advocating being respectful when all together.  The old, "if ya don't have nothing nice to say... . don't say nothing at all."  The boundary I'm sticking to is that otherwise they can leave.  I'm admittedly in a better position in this being that my dd w/ the gc is the reasonable one.  I just have had enough of being held hostage, ya know?  I don't know if this is at all helpful to your situation, but if nothing else please know I am sending positive vibes your way.

[lever.]

Thanks illbee.

It does help. Although I wouldn't wish it on anyone its good to know that it's not only my family