witholding contact after initiating?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Just simply

What are possible reasons for contacting me about owed money then not responding and staying silent?

What would payoff be?

[cherryblossom]

Just simply

What are possible reasons for contacting me about owed money then not responding and staying silent?

What would payoff be?

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[livednlearned]

Stress.

Stress about not being able to live up to the ideal he wants to be, feeling anxiety about not being able to be who he needs to be (consistently) for you -- trying to make something, even a small thing, work only to realize in a later moment that he is not capable.

Pay off could possibly be self protection.

A person with BPD is emotionally underdeveloped. He does not have emotional skills in times of stress, and a relationship on the rocks is a time of stress.

A person with BPD also struggles with impulsivity, so he may be feeling something in one moment, only to find he cannot follow through on that impulse down the line.

What are your thoughts about why he is staying silent?

[cherryblossom]

U have helped me think about it in different way. I was thinking it was a form of control or a way of getting me to get angry at him so he gets the pain he thinks he deserves.

How could I proceed?

Perhaps a text along lines - im interpreting ur silence as if u are really stressed right now so im backing off - I have faith u will contact me at some point soon

[cherryblossom]

Also have seen it as his way of getting me to keep thinking about him and to stop me moving on - but without any interest at genuinely meeting in middle and working things out

[cherryblossom]

I would have done anything to sort our issues out - he is the one who gave up

Is he trying to get me to devalue him?

[livednlearned]

Impulsivity is a core part of BPD. Even in situations that are high stakes, it can be astounding how a person with BPD will self-sabotage. Your ex is trying desperately to get his needs met and he will probably do anything and everything to manage his anxiety and despair. You may be expecting much more thoughtful behavior from him than he is actually capable of doing under the circumstances.

It sounds like his first instinct is to drink, which of course makes everything better very briefly and then much worse shortly after. My guess is that he is trying to manage a much more basic need that is driven by his own sense of emptiness, unstable sense of self, self-loathing, etc. Sometimes, the behavior that affects us is really not about us at all. It affects us, yes. It is not necessarily done to hurt us or confuse us, although that can certainly be the consequence.

I wonder if you might be expecting more of him than he is capable giving at the moment?

One thing that (I see in retrospect) helped my ex in our marriage is when I let go of topics I knew he did not have the emotional skill or understanding to process. I very much felt that I was the adult in the relationship, and there were many decisions I made on my own because he was not my emotional partner -- he was too easily triggered, too unpredictable in his mood swings, too prone to feel shame and then battle that feeling by lashing out.

My suggestion then is to write a very neutral text and not (even implicitly) make reference to a larger narrative. Just something simple like, "When you are ready to reach out, I am here to listen."

If what you want is to get your money back, that is a different kind of conversation, perhaps more difficult.

[cherryblossom]

Can u pls explain the impulse behaviour in this scenario? Do u mean he impulsively acted in a stand up decent way then impulsively acted like a d×××? So do morals go out the window even if they have held them for a good solid period of time? I find it hard to comprehend that morals that he seemed to repeatedly strive by seemed to go out window? Surely the shame he deels after is because he knows he has gone against morals therefore indicating some sort of self?

[MapleBob]

Can u pls explain the impulse behaviour in this scenario? Do u mean he impulsively acted in a stand up decent way then impulsively acted like a d×××? So do morals go out the window even if they have held them for a good solid period of time? I find it hard to comprehend that morals that he seemed to repeatedly strive by seemed to go out window? Surely the shame he deels after is because he knows he has gone against morals therefore indicating some sort of self?

Two things: First, it's literally Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hyde. They are both him, but those parts don't always know each other. He gets triggered by missing you and he finds a reason to message you, then that feeling passes, you reply and he gets triggered the opposite way and he remembers that he's bad or that he's supposed to be pulling away now. That's the impulsive part.

Secondly, this feels to me like an extension of the classic push/pull behavior that pwBPD tend to engage in. Was there push/pull in the relationship itself?

[cherryblossom]

On reflection: He pulled me in very strongly at beginning, he had a superfical self harm incident which was designed to pull me in further - he would do little things that would hurt me sprinkled in beginning like suddenly mood would change - things he seemed to live about me became things he felt bitter about or unhappy about - over the whole telationship his "good" side tended to dominate id say "bad" side dominated in last 1/3rd - at end blatantly making the home environment unlivable - i.e come home from work and he'd hav dnb music on - be drinking special brew and self harming on a regular basis - very extreme pushing behaviour. What upsets me is that he is an intelligent person there is so much info out there on BPD - yet he choses to wallow in self pity - that may sound harsh but I feel like I'm on the spectrum but never acted out so overtly and I persevered on a path of self discovery and healing -just battle with feeling so frustrated with him for not talking to me or doing this work - i hav 2 b careful this frustration  does not  undo any potential healing of relationship regardless of we get back together

[cherryblossom]

Any tips appreciated and thanks for insight provided so far x

[livednlearned]

Hi cherryblossom,

If I remember correctly, he has OCD? This could make it doubly, triply hard for him to harness compulsions like self-harm or substance abuse. You are right that there is a lot of information out there, though I think some conditions make the journey to emotional health that much harder. The self-harm behaviors can be a sign of how powerful the pull is to manage extreme (and often negative) feelings.

It sounds like you feel so much grief about his inability to meet you halfway.

What do you think about MapleBob's insight that your ex has two sides, and the two don't necessarily recognize one another?

[cherryblossom]

Yeah it makes a lot of sense - yeah it is sad and frustrating  - sad that he seems to have gone down a rabbit hole of darkness - it's frustrating not knowing what current opinion he has of me and our relationship - that there is no problem solving going on or reflecting - or meaning making or shared understanding being developed  - plenty of avoidance - yes he does have ocd - the picture is so bleak - i just want him to get proper help - i know it's out of my control - ive stayed quiet and have not sent the text u suggested yet will wait and c if he makes contact in next couple weeks 1st. It is so hard seeing someone set up such a destructive pattern x

[Grey Kitty]

Yes, it is incredibly sad and frustrating to watch him making such a continual mess of his life.

If you accept that this is what he's going to keep on doing, what is the right thing for you to do?

[cherryblossom]

Just do what im doing detach away -im getting more successful-i dont feel much for him now- it's just annoying he has 350 of my money and wont meet me half way - i feel like he needs to b held accountable for his actions as how is he going to learn anything? and why should he get away with keeping 350 from me? Why should i have to keep asking him about it? I'm keeping silent for another 2 weeks and reassess

If the feelings for me pass why does he not just pay my money?

I feel like I mean jack ___ to him - so why does he have to drag this out - why doesn't he just pay me my f***n money back and leave me the f alone?

Im not going to stoop low to text him that but he is making me angry

[cherryblossom]

I dont know how he can hav any feelings for me now - as the length of time we haven't spoken properly has really left a dry sour note and an unatural wedge- it feels like hes pushed it too far now for anything meaningful to happen with any depth- i cant c how he can hav any feelings for me left so why doesnt he just pay back my money?

[sebastian.l]

I think the initiate contact and not following through is best explained with difference of rational and emotional states.

My exBPD proposed several times to stop texting and instead talk on phone or meet if we want to say something. I liked the idea. The entire texting culture is just a source for double guessing and a disease of our century.

However, she never followed through on calling or meeting. I put her up on it and asked, hey I thought you want to call or meet and nothing came. She got defensive and brought up things I said that left her 'powerless' so she decided not to call. Anytime it was something I did, that made her not do.

So... .their rational mind or their counselor (T, or Mum, friend) might say: 'talk to each other', but the emotional state and anxiety just drives them away and find excuses. We are an anxiety trigger that only shuts down, when they devalue, delete and replace us. Sad but true.  

[Grey Kitty]

I dont know how he can hav any feelings for me now - as the length of time we haven't spoken properly has really left a dry sour note and an unatural wedge- it feels like hes pushed it too far now for anything meaningful to happen with any depth- i cant c how he can hav any feelings for me left so why doesnt he just pay back my money?

I'm not going to say that his feelings make a whole lot of sense... .or that they are consistent from one day to the next... .he is disordered, afterall.

I'm sure he has some kind of feelings for you. Most likely you are painted black and they are all negative. Or perhaps you are painted white and they are all positive. Who knows what he will actually do about his feelings... .but I'm almost certain he has plenty of them!

And no, I don't think this is going to be very comforting... .just what is going on most likely.

[cherryblossom]

Leading from what u have all said - given me something to think about - it's helpful for me to consider his behaviour as a complex anxiety disorder - he must have been so anxiously attached to me the whole way through - leading him to behave badly in end stages. I think he painted himself black rather than me but this makes it difficult to meet halfway. It has been upsetting that rather than seek out psychotherapy  (his fam offered to pay) having dbt and learning about disorder he is avoiding and drinking alcohol. Nothing i can do about that i know - but has been main source of my concerns. If he applied himself I believe he has strength and ability. I've let go a lot more but with this communication being up in the air not completely.  Will review how i feel 2 weeks. I'm not obsessing anymore which is positive

[cherryblossom]

Im afraid u wont c me on this thread or board anymore - firmly on healing and detaching now. Had wicked day back with band. Got home saw a pic on fbk of exBPD with his ex with his sis - messaged his sister turns out thats an old pic her friend put on there- but woman to woman she let me know he is seeing someone at work - what a joke! I cant actually believe it snd what a fool i feel wasting all this time on theseboards agonizing over a text and he's doing this!

[cherryblossom]

Im on phone so cant do long post - but i know for sure now that he has no interest in recovery at all whatsoever so saves me wondering and wasting my precious time! I'm afraid i sent a text saying how i cannot believe what ive found out and want my money along with some other stuff - it was angry in tone but not vicious. No answer yet. I dont care about his feelings at all now i just want my money back. I cannot believe he didnt hav the balls to let me know - well i can because I've read so much about the behaviour of BPD. I just genuinely believed he was going to focus on himself - I cannot actually believe what ive found out! It's good though it means I can move on now and not feel guilty about it. How can he b with someone else what sort of quality relationship will that be?  - that girl must b nuts - he looked like a mental patient last time i saw him - he's a drunken dishevelled mess what a weird girl?he told friends he still loved me- he's still got pics of me and him over facebook and is still friend on fbk with my sister and my friends! Has he no nerve? ? I'm tempted to hav a look at his profile now thru my friend's account! I'm in shock! But he's made it a lot easier for me to let go now - which is making me laugh now!

[Circle]

Read your whole thread. Sorry you are dealing with this crud. Be thankful it's now and not later. It could eventually have been $3500. Take care of yourself!

[cherryblossom]

Hi circle thanks for showing support -nice bit of synchronicity - i had a dream about a pure circle of birds the other night -think it represents freedom and wholeness - im going to get a tattoo of it! I feel so much more free - it all makes sense - I wondered why he had painted himself so black obvs because he knew he was being so fickle and cunning! He has sent some replies now - last one was angry! I asked how can he b angry at me how does that work? - think it's because I foiled his attempts of controlling me. Still no payment he says deposit hasnt been released and he doesn't have internet. My sister had a look at this new pieces profile -total minger! He has completely lost the plot. I know facing therapy is hard but surely not as hard as dealing with the consequences and negative emotions born of terrible behaviour and choices?

[Circle]

I wondered why he had painted himself so black obvs because he knew he was being so fickle and cunning!

Yeah, it seems that whenever my pwBPD was acting fishy, angry behavior was a typical response. It's all really hard to read when you're enmeshed. Once you get a little distance though, it becomes a little more clear. When I haven't been sexual with my pwBPD, they become a very different person toward me. I start to see different attitudes emerge from them. And, suddenly our "mutual interests" are no longer mutual. I'm still babbling on about the same old band, movie, book, etc. They just no longer have mutual interests. It's all so temporary. My pwBPDs efforts are always fleeting and shallow.