Filing without a lawyer?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

My ex has been gone almost two years now. He has very rare contact with our son and finally came up to visit him after being absent for 15-16 months. He left to another state. He has not provided any financial assistance. When he did visit he had a wedding ring on and admitted he had been engaged for at least eight months. He was wanting to get the divorce over with asap and said he would pay. He suddenly went silent and has been fairly impossible to get ahold of. From let's get this done now to, I'll let you know when I have the money to file. He is working a really good job now and has the finances. He also said, around that time, that he doesn't want me to know his personal business and he hesitated to admit he was planning to move across country. Though, it was clearly on his fb page, which he blocked me from suddenly one day last year during a conversation where we were talking about something that had nothing to do with anything that would make him angry.

I don't have the money to file and it would take me a decent amount of time to get it. Through my state I can file without a lawyer and apply for an idigent waiver, meaning I wouldn't have to pay the court costs because I simply can't. However, I have been advised against doing so and now I'm not sure how to proceed. Any advice? I appreciate any answers, feel free to ask any questions if I didn't explain well. Thank you.

[purekalm]

My ex has been gone almost two years now. He has very rare contact with our son and finally came up to visit him after being absent for 15-16 months. He left to another state. He has not provided any financial assistance. When he did visit he had a wedding ring on and admitted he had been engaged for at least eight months. He was wanting to get the divorce over with asap and said he would pay. He suddenly went silent and has been fairly impossible to get ahold of. From let's get this done now to, I'll let you know when I have the money to file. He is working a really good job now and has the finances. He also said, around that time, that he doesn't want me to know his personal business and he hesitated to admit he was planning to move across country. Though, it was clearly on his fb page, which he blocked me from suddenly one day last year during a conversation where we were talking about something that had nothing to do with anything that would make him angry.

I don't have the money to file and it would take me a decent amount of time to get it. Through my state I can file without a lawyer and apply for an idigent waiver, meaning I wouldn't have to pay the court costs because I simply can't. However, I have been advised against doing so and now I'm not sure how to proceed. Any advice? I appreciate any answers, feel free to ask any questions if I didn't explain well. Thank you.

[I_Am_The_Fire]

Have you talked to a lawyer just to get some legal advice? I found a legal company that provided free consultations with absolutely no obligations. I got some great advice without any pressure to give them money or to hire them.

Who advised you against applying for an idigent waiver and why? Just curious.

[zachira]

I don't know where you live. The states of California and Texas have the Nolo Guides which teach you how to act as your own lawyer in all kinds of legal cases, including divorce. You might try to find info on the do it yourself divorce. I once took classes on how to do my own lawsuit that were inexpensive and have helped me to deal better with personal and business challenges. Learn all you can, and let us know how it is going.

[purekalm]

He called the majority of lawyers in my area without me knowing until I had made an appointment with one for a free consultation for advice. He made first contact, so they can't talk to me. The other lawyers want you to be able to retain if you make an appointment and won't consult over the phone.   I just remembered a legal advice website that I could try to ask on. Thank you for reminding me.

One is someone I trust who went through a divorce and been with a few women that were going through divorces and said that from experience it could potentially end badly for me. A friend originally said it was a good idea then changed his mind because of my ex's current and sudden behavior shift. I have my own doubts about it turning out well without advice. I know simple things can lead to something going horribly wrong just because I was unaware of it.

[purekalm]

Thank you zachira.

I have looked up how to file and it's overwhelming doing it on my own though not impossible. My main concern is that of my son and not wanting to mess anything up for him. I don't live in either of those states and actually just ran into the sites while looking for information. I will keep learning. Updates will definitely happen as I have them.  Thank you for caring.

[ForeverDad]

Have you tried avvo.com?  Also, your local county's Bar Association should be able to make recommenations for you, perhaps free or inexpensive on a sliding scale.

Be aware that if he has a good job and your funds are that limited, you can petition for temp child support and temp spousal support, perhaps even for him to pay your legal costs.  Generally you can at least get child support retroactive back to the date you file.  Sorry, waiting to file can delay the start dates for lots of things.

Technically, getting child support also opens you up to him seeking parenting time.  Not that the court would give him much, after all he is far away and hasn't seen the child in many months or longer.  It's tough to weigh the advantages of filing versus the disadvantages.

Beware... .if he files he will likely file in his area.  Would his state give a more favorable divorce than you would get in your state?  Do you want to seek out a lawyer in his area and travel there for court appearances?  However, if you file first, you can file locally, very convenient for you.

As for the difficulty of self-filing... .when I first investigated divorce options, the court had a huge list of forms, maybe 20 or more pages, I had to fill out.  When I finally selected a lawyer, he said, don't worry, I'll file for you and his filing was, yes, only 3 pages.  What seemed so daunting for me was much simpler for my lawyer.  (And it appeared the court scarcely glanced at the paperwork when we had our initial temp order hearing.)

[flourdust]

Since he's the one who needs the divorce and he has money, ask him to cover your legal fees. Have him give you a check for a retainer to get the ball rolling. His response should show you if he's serious.

[purekalm]

ForeverDad,

That's actually the site I remembered this morning and wrote a question there. I haven't gotten a reply yet but am checking. I have called the local Bar Association and received no help. I contacted Legal Aid and they sent me through a bunch of hoops that also yielded nothing because of their requirements to receive help.

We have a previous child abuse history wherein he was blamed, jailed, no bailed and we had to go through a year of doing whatever the court asked before the case was closed. No one was blamed but it was stated my son was abused. He doesn't want any parenting time, he actually doesn't want any custody of him whatsoever. He only wants to visit as he has time, whenever he has time. He actually told me about being upset a lawyer he talked to wanted him to have time with my son if that says anything... .I've never held my son back from contacting him and he actually texts him regularly with no response from his dad. I have a notebook of the contact he's had with my son since he left, which is sparse.

He called lawyers in his area about filing before and I can't remember the exact reasons why, but he can't/won't file. He's an over the road truck driver now and was in the area is the only reason he stopped by to see my son a few months ago.

Yeah, the amount of paperwork and copies is daunting to be sure. It's so much simpler and quicker to have a lawyer do it but getting the lawyer is the issue.


flourdust,

That's part of the issue, he won't even return my calls. I leave voicemails here and there. To actually get ahold of him I have to call multiple times a day for a few days in a row until he gets ticked off enough to answer with a "WHAT?" He said he would cover the legal fees and I didn't even ask him for the money but to give it directly to the lawyer we had already contacted which he agreed to do. His fb page says he married this other woman last July so I don't know if it's illegally he married her or that's when they consider themselves married. He was desperate for a divorce and then suddenly doesn't seem to care so I don't know what's going on. Before he went dark he told me he would have the money soon to file.

[flourdust]

So ... .is getting officially divorced something that's really urgent for you? If not, just leave this ball in his court and see if he does anything with it.

[purekalm]

flourdust,

Yes, for a myriad of reasons and not all I'd like to discuss. I haven't dated, not with anyone or anything. It's more important than something like that.

[purekalm]

A kind of update.

So, my ex finally answered the phone, yelled at and put me down then hung up on me. He's saying that he can't file in Florida but won't explain and is going to file where I'm at. I asked on Avvo and lawyers responded saying he can't do that. So, a few days after, he responded over an hour late to my son's text message which he has notoriously ignored. Then last night he responded immeditately. It has left me feeling uneasy. He never acts without his own interests in the forefront, what could he be up to? He's already made himself look like an uncaring parent and has yet to call my son for two months currently.

[DoxieLover]

Is it possible he married his girlfriend/fiancé/whatever in Florida and that’s why he says he can’t file there?

[I_Am_The_Fire]

Maybe read up a little bit on divorce laws in Florida. Also, he may not be able to file there depending on how long he's lived there. It's also possible that he wouldn't get much from filing in Florida. Maybe the laws are less generous there and he thinks he has a better chance where you're at?

[ForeverDad]

Is it possible he married his girlfriend/fiancé/whatever in Florida and that’s why he says he can’t file there?

My gut is rumbling in agreement here.  It's possible he's got himself into a jam as a technical bigamist?  Or he got her pregnant, she wants to get married and he has to clean up the prior marriage first?

You may be limited in what you can research.  I don't know if you can browse marriage records online.  I've often commented that some things that we can't do (due to limited time, experience or a potential appearance of stalking) can be accomplished by a professional (private detective) who is officially neutral, bonded and trained.

[GaGrl]

My gut is rumbling in agreement here.  It's possible he's got himself into a jam as a technical bigamist?  Or he got her pregnant, she wants to get married and he has to clean up the prior marriage first?

You may be limited in what you can research.  I don't know if you can browse marriage records online.  I've often commented that some things that we can't do (due to limited time, experience or a potential appearance of stalking) can be accomplished by a professional (private detective) who is officially neutral, bonded and trained.

Or... .He didn't even tell her he is still married.

[ForeverDad]

In my state the marriage application requires each person to list any prior marriages, where ended and whether there was any issue (children) of that marriage.  At least it did when I looked a couple decades ago.

I had a SIL who had a couple kids with her BF, all while he was waiting several years for his divorce from his prior relationship to go though.  Once it was final they still didn't marry, not until they bought a house.

I'm not confident of the rules and laws but why can't he file in your county?  If the problem is that a resident has to file, I guess you could start it.  Just think if he filed in his state, then it all would be handled in his state.  Do you really want to travel to his state to respond to all the paperwork, appearances and hearings?  Keeping it local might be better for you IMHO.  Unless there is some reason filing in his state is better for you.

If you had children together you could automatically get child support.  Whether he sees the kids or not, you can still get child support.  Whether you want child support or not, he can still see the kids.  Child Support vs Visitation ... .these are separate matters, more or less independent of each other.  Don't turn down child support thinking it will keep him away, though he does seem to be an "out-of-sight, out-of-mind" sort of father.

Are you okay with him having some time with your son?  What if that question comes up during the divorce proceedings?  What amount of visitation would you be comfortable with?  It would be hard of the child if he pops into your son's life then wanders away again.

[purekalm]

Doxie Lover,

It's very possible.

I_Am_The_Fire,

He's lived there ever since he left us, almost two years. He's used one person's address even though he hasn't strictly lived at it. He's met the requirements to file for a long time. He's talked to lawyers in both states and it won't turn out well for him either way. Back when he was more open about everything he revealed more information.

Gagrl,

I don't think he did. The first time he hid a relationship after leaving some people told me that he told her he had divorce papers. That was only about four months after he left, if that. She probably assumes he is officially divorced and has no idea he's lied about it.

ForeverDad,

On one of her recent posts he said they "don't have one on the way yet" when responding to a comment from a friend. (I rarely check it, don't wanna look at him to be honest.) I do believe it's very possible that he married her without her knowing he's still married. I am limited to what I can find online. For one, I don't know if her name, since it's not common, is even her real name and not all counties in the surrounding area have marriage information public record or online. I can't hire a private dectective or I probably would have by now.

He's never offered support. He basically said he'll pay when and what the court orders him too but not before, so, there's that. I've never kept him out of contact with my son (Voice, Video, Text. Since he moved over 14 hours away that's all that was possible but he has barely made contact.) and actually pushed it for quite a few months initially because my son was so upset. He left without warning and didn't say goodbye.

No, no. I'm not ok AT ALL with him having time with him unless I'm with him. He has no idea how to be a parent and has never accepted his autism even though he says he has since he's left. He tries to make him act "normal" and gets angry very easily. He's actually told me many times he wants no custody of our son at all. He wants to give it all to me because he already lives with me and I make all the decisions because he's never cared to give input when asked and he'll rarely be able to see him, if that. He has visited him one time in almost two years for about 10-15 minutes. He picked us both up and took him to Little Casesar's to get a pizza bread, (my son is very picky with what he will eat) next door for something to drink and then back to drop us off. He talked to me more than my son and I had to ask him if he would say goodbye and give him a hug when he dropped us off for my son's sake because he made no move to get out of the vehicle. He was ... .nice, but that never lasts long.

Speaking of popping in and wandering away, he only texted two nights in a row and has ignored him since. It's already affected my son because at first he was really happy and then when no reply has come after he ended up very out of sorts for the next couple days. I feel so bad for him.

[Shrek]

I was certain I responded to this thread but I either didn't do it or didn't do it right. I would personally recommend against filing without an attorney. I am NOT an attorney or affiliated with one except my divorce attorney who is better than a rock star in my eyes. He was very diligent, conscientious, and effective. My ex initially did not seek representation and made many mistakes including ignoring court orders to produce discovery and submit to depositions, psych evals. She eventually went through two lawyers and is now duping the local women's shelter into paying for an attorney in a (his words) "rescue mission".
It cost her dearly. If she were rational and compliied with the court rulings, I would be a standard divorced dad with the standard dad package of steep alimony, child support and every other weekend... .but, in addition to being very high conflict she had no attorney.

[purekalm]

Shrek,

Sorry it's been so long but thank you for your reply. I understand the risks but at this point, I could be waiting another couple years on him as he's not seeming to be motivated much and I don't personally care to hang around that long. I'm not a high conflict person by any means and I would never ignore a court order or any such thing like that. Not in me to do so. I would rather file with a lawyer but it's not financially possible for me right now.

I have decided to file without a lawyer and have looked up as much information as I can to help me fill everything out right. I should be filing sometime this week. It's a process here as I think I've mentioned, can't directly file, have to go through the process of getting the paperwork approved.

My ex called back and apologized oddly enough but I could care less. At this point, I just want to stay focused and get it done. He reiterated the same things about the divorce he told me last time and wants to get it done but obviously not put forth much effort himself.

Thank you all for your advice, questions and concerns. I very much appreciate it. I'll keep this updated as things move along.

[Kwamina]

Hi purekalm

Sorry it's been so long but thank you for your reply.

Better late than never

He has visited him one time in almost two years for about 10-15 minutes.

This pretty much sums it all up when it comes to him as a father. It is very sad for your son, but your ex has serious issues which he does not acknowledge and based on everything you've shared, he has never acted even remotely close to what a real father would look like.

I have decided to file without a lawyer and have looked up as much information as I can to help me fill everything out right. I should be filing sometime this week. It's a process here as I think I've mentioned, can't directly file, have to go through the process of getting the paperwork approved.

Just want to wish you good luck  It's a tough situation, good that you've looked up as much information as you can to help you navigate this new challenging journey through divorce court.

At this point, I just want to stay focused and get it done.

Yes, pure focus and pure calm are needed now.

Take care and know you can always come here for support and advice

The Board Parrot

[zachira]

You are concerned about what your husband is doing because he always is acting in his own best interests. At this point, you have to do what is best for you. I realize this is hard as you cannot predict what your husband will do and naturally you dread his reactivity. Not everything your husband does is in his own best interests because acting badly is not in anyone's best interests. You might want to read "Spitting", if you have not done so already. Countless members have found this book to be helpful in dealing with a high conflict divorce. Keep us posted on how you are doing, and we will listen and try to help.

[DivDad]

Depending on the Florida county, most have on-line Official document searches for marriages... .with a PDF copy of the marriage licence.  Just Google the Florida county, and Comptroller (or Clerk of the Court) to see if they have posted the marriage license.

[purekalm]

I was able to get to the case management office and get my paperwork looked over. I ended up going home with quite a few pages of corrections to make but I know it couldn't have all been right the first time. Hopefully next time I won't need any corrections and can actually file. From what I could gather by being there it won't take but a few minutes to actually file. It is just getting the paperwork approved. Thank you all for your replies, well wishes and advice thus far. I will continue to update as I learn more.

Oh, I do have one question. I have to write an ex parte order about residential parent status and child support and am looking up information but was wondering if anyone here has had to write one and can offer any advice?



Hey Kwamina,

This pretty much sums it all up when it comes to him as a father. It is very sad for your son, but your ex has serious issues which he does not acknowledge and based on everything you've shared, he has never acted even remotely close to what a real father would look like.

Exactly. Nothing at all like one. Even now it's a random reply text to my son's, never on his own.

Just want to wish you good luck. ... .Take care and know you can always come here for support and advice

The Board Parrot

Thank you so much! I have always appreciated this board and it's parrot.    

zachira,

You might want to read "Spitting", if you have not done so already. Countless members have found this book to be helpful in dealing with a high conflict divorce.

Thank you for your reply and advice. I can't remember if I've read that book. I will look it up.

DivDad,

Thank you for the reply. I have Googled and looked them up but the counties that he is in and near don't all have online records or have just transitioned from online recently.

[Kwamina]

Thanks for the update purekalm!

You are getting there, though you need to make some corrections, you've already taken the important first step of getting your paperwork looked over

No experience with ex parte order but perhaps this will help:

Use of ex parte orders in family law proceedings

Family Law Ex Parte: Ex Parte Motions in Divorce, Parenting and Child Support Cases

The Board Parrot

[purekalm]

Kwamina,

You're welcome and thank you. I am trying though the task is daunting at times.

Thank you for the information. I'll look it over. 

purekalm