Making false accusations... what to do?

[suchsadness]

Hello again,

Once more, I am in a frustrating and mind-blowing situation with my dd37.  Things were going ok, of course because she needed me to do her a favor last week, and then yesterday I get this outrageous text telling me that she was "molested, beaten, emotionally abused and eventually raped by the men I brought into her life".  She said that the only reason she was telling me this was because her ex husband was going to "out her" and tell everyone that is the reason she acts the way she does, so she is saying it first to take the power away from him.  She also said he is the only one she has ever told and now he is using it against her to keep her boys from her.  She has eluded to her being abused in the past, and I have tormented myself trying to figure out when this could have happened and who would have done it.  She says she doesn't EVER want to talk to me about it and closes the door to disclose any information.  I feel horrible if this is true about her, but she lies so much and makes up things so I don't know what is truth, what is perceived truth, or what are out and out lies.  I had just said to my dh that I thought something was going on with her again because there was this silence on fb, no texts, and all the behaviors that indicate she is having issues.  Her last text to me said she wanted nothing to do with me (again) and that we would never see our 2 grandsons.  This is a repeated threat to me/us and I really feel like I am done dancing this dance with her... .  going to talk to my T this afternoon!  I have gone over every timeline in our past and cannot even come up with a person (other than my 2nd husband of 3 years) that she was exposed to during her childhood or where there would have been opportunity for this to happen.  I am so torn about "what if this is actually true" and "how can she say this - who and when did this happen".  I finally just came out in my last text and said "who are you talking about... .  and when did this happen".  I feel like I have just HAD IT!

I have been reading Valerie Porr's book... and read Walking on Eggshells, have thought about writing the "sorry letter" (but have not yet).  I have tried validation, empathy, withdrawl, acceptance... .  what more can I as a mother do and will this ever end?  Maybe I just need to realize and accept that no contact is best for all of us   

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

suchsadness-   

I am so sorry things are so hard right now. It is impossible to figure out the lack of cohesion in our D's minds   My D has very distinct memories of physical abuse by dh, even to the breaking of a glass shower door, that are just not in reality. That shower door is still there, same glass, since before she was born. Yet, she has shared this with most of T's throughout her life.

You can do all the 'right' things, and yet your D will continue to be who she will be. Takes an ongoing practice of RADICAL Acceptance to maintain sanity. Perhaps you can step back and let her 'control' the NC. It has come and gone in the past - most likely it will move on again when things settle for her this time. All this really doesn't make the distress and pain as a loving mom being painted BLACK go away.  The threats of NC with your gsons must be the hardest of all.

Keep coming back - I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.

qcr  

[Pilate]

I am sorry that you are experiencing this with your daughter. I am not a parent of someone who has BPD, but the behaviors you describe are similar to some that my MIL has experienced with my upbdSIL as well as another SIL, who has a diagnosed PD. In our 2+ decades together, my uBPDsil has used her children when she has similar feelings=facts episode. Although I don't agree with my MIL that "nothing ever happened because I was home all of the time with them*," I think that both SILs let feelings or projection drive their lives. So, I don't think the accusations are true, but I think my MIL's logic is faulty, and my SILs' perceptions are feelings=facts based. My MIL has had the best luck when she tells uBPDsil that she, MIL, hears that uBPDsil is feeling upset and admires/acknowledges uBPDsil is a good mom and protector of her children. (My MIL has many narcissistic qualities, so it is very hard for her to validate or compliment anyone other than herself, so I wish she could learn to do this better.) For uBPDsil, the accusations of abuse seem to often relate back to parenting, and uBPDsil wants to a) be seen as a better parent than MIL and b) wants to be seen as a good parent. The longest my uBPDsil has been able to go NC with MIL is a few months before she starts having her children make calls to Nana. Perhaps your daughter is struggling with parenting, so she is projecting this on to you? I thought I would share this with you because the withholding grandchildren is a pattern I have watched for many years now in my husband's family.

Pilate

[vivekananda]

Hi such sadness,

It is so hurtful isn't it? You even begin to think you are the unstable one, you may even feel guilty. And of course it is enough to make anyone angry. Such hard place to be in.

My dd32 believes she has been subjected to a lifetime of emotional and physical abuse at my hands with my dh's complicity. Not true. But she believes it, so it doesn't matter whether it is real or not in one sense, in her mind it is.

I have come to understand that she needs to have that as an excuse for why she is the way she is - it's my fault, our fault. It also helped to get her diagnosis of PTSD and probably a disability pension.

I have got to the level of acceptance where I am no longer hurt or bothered by what she says. I can be sympathetic to her situation. I can feel sorry that is the way it is, but it is not my responsibility and neither are her actions my responsibility.

With regards to n/c, I would leave it in her hands to make contact or not - except I would want to maintain contact with the gchildren. If there was a way to work on that, I would.

Regarding your comments about validation, I have found that it is not a situation specific tool, rather it is a tool that needs to become an automatic response for all situations. If it can become a default response to any situation, then you can see a difference in your relationships overall. I am working on it   similarly, acceptance is not something that you apply to a particular situation and not to others, it works when it becomes a default response in all situations. Life gets easier when you work on that - I have found that out for myself, and I am working on that 'acceptance' thing too 

To be able to have the possibility of a relationship with our loved ones with BPD, I have found, I needed to do a complete turnaround and change myself and how I thought about things. I feel much happier now and there is hope now for a relationship with my dd. If I hadn't changed, I would have no hope.

Cheers,

viv

[lbjnltx]

Hi such sadness,

It is so hurtful isn't it? You even begin to think you are the unstable one, you may even feel guilty. And of course it is enough to make anyone angry. Such hard place to be in.

My dd32 believes she has been subjected to a lifetime of emotional and physical abuse at my hands with my dh's complicity. Not true. But she believes it, so it doesn't matter whether it is real or not in one sense, in her mind it is.

I have come to understand that she needs to have that as an excuse for why she is the way she is - it's my fault, our fault. It also helped to get her diagnosis of PTSD and probably a disability pension.

I have got to the level of acceptance where I am no longer hurt or bothered by what she says. I can be sympathetic to her situation. I can feel sorry that is the way it is, but it is not my responsibility and neither are her actions my responsibility.

With regards to n/c, I would leave it in her hands to make contact or not - except I would want to maintain contact with the gchildren. If there was a way to work on that, I would.

Regarding your comments about validation, I have found that it is not a situation specific tool, rather it is a tool that needs to become an automatic response for all situations. If it can become a default response to any situation, then you can see a difference in your relationships overall. I am working on it   similarly, acceptance is not something that you apply to a particular situation and not to others, it works when it becomes a default response in all situations. Life gets easier when you work on that - I have found that out for myself, and I am working on that 'acceptance' thing too 

To be able to have the possibility of a relationship with our loved ones with BPD, I have found, I needed to do a complete turnaround and change myself and how I thought about things. I feel much happier now and there is hope now for a relationship with my dd. If I hadn't changed, I would have no hope.

thinking of you,

viv

Change in our relationships with our children (and anyone else in our lives) does begin with self.  Self is the only person we can change.  If we want someone else to behave differently towards us and they don't have the skills to know how, the best way we can affect this change is to mirror it for them... .  do first for ourselves what we are asking them to do. 

[suchsadness]

Thank you everyone for your support and sharing your experiences.  I wrote this yesterday at work - so in my hurried and frustrated state, I see that I said this was my dd37.  It is actually my uBPD dd35, with the 2 sons... .  just to clarify. 

I did go visit my therapist and am feeling better about things.  I read her my responses to the LONG texts that my dd sent me on Sunday, and we both agreed that I have made lots of progress in handling the attacks and rages.  I told my dd that I accept her right not to discuss things with me (which she interpreted as my admitting that I knew she was being abused)... .  as well as I accept her choice to not have a relationship with me if that is the way she is feeling.  I also got a call from my other dd37 last night who said dd35's ex called her and told her that my dd35 is out of control and he knew she was sending me these texts.  According to her ex, she called his new girlfriend and basically came between them... .  lots of drama and not something I'm willing to get in the middle of again. 

I had this gut feeling that all of this was coming from the stress of her relationship with her ex.  I know she has lead him to believe that she had been abused from 5-16 and that is the "reason" she is like this. 

Thanks again to all of you on this board - it is so very helpful to hear from others who experience the same things... .  and it definitely helps me keep my sanity!   

[vivekananda]

It feels good to have our progress recognised, doesn't it? I am glad you are able to work with your T, there is much we have to learn eh? Keep up the good work 

It is my experience that my dd32 spins out whenever a personal relationship becomes stressful in someway or another. And that's life, especially with BPD eh? 

Take care suchsadness. Keep us up to date about it all, what you experience teaches us all about ourselves, so let us know how it goes.

cheers,

Vivek    

[JulySky]

Suchsadness:  I agree completely with Vivek anada who said that your daughter "needs that (claims of abuse) for an excuse for why she is the way she is ... .  "

You also mentioned that things were okay last week because she needed you.  I noticed that when we, and so many others, scrambled to make order out of chaos, our daughter was calm and satisfied, until the next emergency.

I don't recommend our approach lightly to anyone, but we were forced into it because our three other children demanded it:  We are done. I'd relent, but they won't have it.

I don't think I would have been on board with the other kids' pleas, except for the fact that I gently told our sick daughter that she'd have to start trying to take care of herself (with our help paying for apartments, school, attorneys, facilities, lawsuits, and therapists she hated.)  She looked at me through her blank eyes and said she was my child and I would always have to take care of her. That's what parents are for.

Years ago, after over-grooming until she gave herself folliculitis and slash eyebrows, stealing my bank card, check book, cash and jewelry, and throwing a perfume bottle at me, she said I had doll's eyes. I feel terrible for her.

And I'd make excuses, too, but I'd blame a full moon, not the people who once loved her.

[vivekananda]

gee Julysky, it sounds like you have been through hell... .  

I will always feel that sense of responsibility towards my dd, but I am very careful to try to understand the difference between enabling and supporting. It is so easy to try to fix things, when really if we dd that, we would be disempowering them. Also, when things didn't work out the way they'd want them to, they could so easily turn and say, 'see, it's all your fault!'

We go from walking on eggshells to walking a tightrope sometimes. I'd rather the tightrope, it just takes skill to get to the other side.

cheers,

Vivek    

oh, and I feel reasonably comfortable now explaining my dd has a mental illness - but a full moon sounds like a nice alternative!

[bjewels11]

I understand how you feel.  My daughter also has made false accusations.   At Christmas basicly she accused me of the same.  I try to keep documentation and records of what she has said and done.   My daughter has a child and I do not see the child alone becasue I am scared of the crazy things that she will say.   At Chrismtas the baby was crying and I started feeding the baby because she was crying and she accused me of trying to kill her child and choking her.   Thank God my family was present to say no that is not what is going on.   

[suchsadness]

Thanks for sharing and giving me support through this latest situation... .  

bjewels11  - isn't it just so sad that we get accused and blamed for things without even realizing that we are bad people?  It all comes out when they are stressed or needing to blame others for their behaviors and treatment of others, at least that is my experience.  I can always tell when something is going on with my dd35 because I get used as a whipping post 

JulySky - I can only imagine the strength it took to finally say you were done with it all.  I'm sure your mother's heart is still in it, but I can definitely see why you have to be done.  That is what I kept saying (I'm done) last week when my dd35 was saying these horrible things about how I caused all her childhood abuse - that I never saw and she won't discuss with me, in her words "EVER".   I'm sure because it is all "false information" that she has told her ex to explain her actions, behaviors and personality disorder.  My mother's heart strings were pulling at me last night, as I re-read the texts between us from last week (I should listen to what my T told me and delete them I guess).  I started crying all over again, and that along with reading the book "I Don't Have to Make Everything All Better" that says to validate their feelings - I drafted a text to my dd35... .  with no intention of sending unless I thought more about it, shared with my husband, and discussed with my T.  My dh read it this morning and said I shouldn't send it and that I need to stop apologizing to her over things that didn't happen.  I said even if they didn't happen, and I know that for a fact, and she believes they did or her perception of her childhood is as she is saying... .  that makes me sad and I am sorry for that.  In the past I have told her that I am sorry for the choices and mistakes I made in life that caused her pain.  My dh gets upset when he keeps hearing me apologize... .  so what do you do?  Today I think the best thing to do is to listen to what you guys are saying on this topic and let my dd35 take the lead on the no contact threat... .  and let it be.  It feels good to post today and helps me clear my mind... .  thanks everyone for listening   

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[ForeverDad]

I will just comment on one aspect - whether you should write a letter to her of some sort, apology or something else.  Personally, I would advise against putting anything in writing about alleged child abuse since she is likely to take such a letter and use it out of context sooner or later, over and over, as justification of anything and everything.  For example, if you wrote apologizing for anything that 'may' have happened, she may try to use it against you whenever her ever-changing moods turned her against you.  Putting anything in writing is just too risky in too many ways and would only complicate dealing with her in the future. IMO

[vivekananda]

hi such sadness,

I think it is wise to carefully reflect and wait.

Forever dad is right to suggest you never accept responsibility for something that didn't happen.

After reading Valerie Porr's book and others here, I took my time to draft a 'sorry letter' - it took about 4 mths time all up before I sent it to here on her birthday, last Oct, with a gift of a heart necklace. This s what I said.

"d, I never understood how you could have so much pain. I knew you were sensitive but I failed to understand exactly how that felt for you.

I know I must have said and done things that hurt you because I did not properly understand. It was never my intention to cause you pain. I am so sorry.

What can we do now to improve our relationship? What can I do to make things better?"

This was sent after about 8 mths of more or less n/c. She thanked me for the letter and the gift. We have met since then, a couple of times for coffee. She is still mentally ill, so things are as they are. But I think it was a good thing to do for us. pwBPD are up and down all the time. Oh and she believes she has been subjected to a lifetime of abuse both emotional and physical at my hands, so she has said to others, while dh stood by complicit.

So, I would think you need time to sort out your thoughts. Reread up lots on validation and boundaries. Talk with us. You can write a 'sorry letter' and not send it... .  if you do write one, put it aside for a while. You don't have to do anything but take care of yourself. You can even draft one and post it here for us to comment on - I did that.

cheers,

Vivek    

[suchsadness]

Thanks ForeverDad and Vivek .  Yes, I am coming to the realization that a sorry letter is probably not the thing to do at this time - especially regarding her alleged abuse.  The sad thing about it is that she is accusing me "of bringing men into her life from ages 5-16" - but there were no men, other than a 3 year relationship with my second husband.  My T wonders if she made some bad choices in her adolescent years and I was blamed because I moved her to a different city, thereby "causing" her to be at that place at that time.  Wow - makes me wonder how many other things she is holding against me just because EVERYTHING was my fault!  It is also very sad to think that she really may have had something happen to her and she held it in for years... .  but the fact that she won't even give me any details about who, when, etc... .  makes me think even more that she has made this whole thing up as an excuse for her out of control behaviors with her ex.  Who knows!    What I do know is that I'm not writing any letter.  ForeverDad - good input as far as not putting anything in writing that can be used forever against me.  Thank you so much for responding to my post.