Back into No Contact - For Good

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Plain and simple.
There has been hot/col behavior, breadcrumbs and recycling BS.
I am no longer participating.

I said a lot of very blunt, honest things I have been holding back.
Im done not holding her accountable for her actions.

I HAVE BEEN LIVING IN FEAR OF LOSING SOMETHING I ALREADY LOST MONTHS AGO
and it has had me acting like a scared child.
I have not been respecting myself, and I have been putting her happiness before my own.

Nobody is attracted to someone with no self respect.
That crap ended this morning.

[OKrunch]

Plain and simple.
There has been hot/col behavior, breadcrumbs and recycling BS.
I am no longer participating.

I said a lot of very blunt, honest things I have been holding back.
Im done not holding her accountable for her actions.

I HAVE BEEN LIVING IN FEAR OF LOSING SOMETHING I ALREADY LOST MONTHS AGO
and it has had me acting like a scared child.
I have not been respecting myself, and I have been putting her happiness before my own.

Nobody is attracted to someone with no self respect.
That crap ended this morning.

[SinisterComplex]

Plain and simple.
There has been hot/col behavior, breadcrumbs and recycling BS.
I am no longer participating.

I said a lot of very blunt, honest things I have been holding back.
Im done not holding her accountable for her actions.

I HAVE BEEN LIVING IN FEAR OF LOSING SOMETHING I ALREADY LOST MONTHS AGO
and it has had me acting like a scared child.
I have not been respecting myself, and I have been putting her happiness before my own.

Nobody is attracted to someone with no self respect.
That crap ended this morning.

 

[ConflictedWalrus]

A big +1 to SinisterComplex's thumbs up!

OKrunch, I've been tracking your other thread for a while.  The decision to go NC is a big one, but I think you're on the right track.

[capecodling]

I tracked your other thread also.  It was painful watching you get pulled back into her BPD web.  Have you been able to maintain no contact?   I am coming up on a month of NC and 2 months since breakup, best decision in this relationship I ever made.  Probably the only good decision in this relationship I ever made LOL

[babyducks]

Hello OKrunch

sounds like you had a pretty big and emotional break through.

how are you feeling today a couple of days later?  Still in the same place or there about?

what was it like to come to the realization that you had undervalued your own worth?

'ducks

[SinisterComplex]

Runchie, how are you doing?

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

[OKrunch]

I had to take a step away from everything to try and get my head clear. Although it felt good to finally be honest with her and myself about the things that I said a couple weeks ago, the thought that I have driven her further away has been plaguing my mind as well. I can't say that I've gotten much more peace in the last two weeks, but things have gotten easier. I still think about it all the time and my feelings about her and what I would like for our future haven't really changed. The major difference is the fact that I realistically see how very very dead it truly truly is.

We did have a further bit of contact earlier this week, initiated by her but continued by me and eventually she said that she still needed space, said "We are toxic" (then why do you continue to make contact?) . More hot cold bread crumb bologna. Major difference is now that it's come to be what I expect so it doesn't surprise me or hurt my feelings anymore.



As much as I know any new relationship would almost certainly follow the exact same patterns I have seen play out a dozen times already, I still greatly fear her moving on with someone else.



I've been very good about social media though, I haven't been checking that at all for many weeks now.



The gut feelings, or spidey sense as I have referred to it before, has only seemed to have gotten stronger. That is one of the biggest questions I constantly ask myself. How do I get over somebody when I can literally sense when they're having a bad day, and as much as I know it makes me sound a little crazy to say that it's happened far too many times for me to dismiss it. But again, I ask, how am I supposed to get over the love of my life when I feel her every emotion?



Distracting myself has gotten a bit easier. Ever since the Titan sub incident, I have been going down a deep research rabbit hole about the Titanic. Titanic was something I was wildly fascinated with when I was a child well before the movie came out, so it's been nice to distract myself with Tales of sadness and heroism over a century gone by.

Easy to stop and realize how easy we have it in the modern day when you don't have to worry about dying penniless, covered in lice, sinking below the frozen waves of the North Atlantic in April. So, Silver Linings I suppose!

My heart is particularly heavy today.
I miss her a lot, and I really wish we could see eachother happily.

[babyducks]

Hello OK,

Although it felt good to finally be honest with her and myself about the things that I said a couple weeks ago, the thought that I have driven her further away has been plaguing my mind as well.

I understand.  I think that's the way these intense bursts of emotions work, when we finally let go of what we have been hanging onto, there is a feeling of relief, but no intense emotion lasts, it burns itself out.    that's how it worked for me.   I went through a process of letting go.   it wasn't once and done.   it was a little bit at a time, here and there.

We did have a further bit of contact earlier this week, initiated by her but continued by me and eventually she said that she still needed space, said "We are toxic" (then why do you continue to make contact?) .

because it's not at all about logic.   it's not at all about thinking things through and reaching an understanding.  it's not about seeing and recognizing you as a full person with thoughts and feelings of your own.   it's irrational.  it's impulsive. it's about getting her core needs met in the moment.  it's about getting an intense need for attention met.    it's about finding an outlet for chaotic emotions through conflict.   it's about creating external drama to quiet the internal dialogue.

 

But again, I ask, how am I supposed to get over the love of my life when I feel her every emotion?

my first thought here OKrunch, is perhaps you are asking the wrong question?

why is it, do you think, that you feel her every emotion?  serious question.   what's the reason you feel her emotion?   

I'm going to suggest a different viewpoint.   maybe the reason you feel her emotion is not because of her being the love of your life.   

it says somewhere on this website that we have an unhealthy connection with an unhealthy person.    certainly, true of me.    what I found out was that hyper connection I had with my Ex wasn't entirely because of the love we shared but because our core wounds matched up so perfectly.    all of us have a wound somewhere, nobody gets through life without one.   for me,  my need to be loved, my need to have someone else raise my self-esteem and my low-grade bubbling depression was absolutely the flip side of the coin to her ability to project a false sense of self and high energy mania.    for a while we lined up like ducks on a pond.   if that makes sense.

perhaps the way to turn down the spidey sense is to figure out what is driving it, all the parts that may be driving it.     what do you think?

'ducks

[OKrunch]

Figured I would pop in for an updated.
Not much news, but she and I did end up hanging out 2 weeks ago, for one night.
She was interested, then changed her mind and backed off, then later that same night she decided to come over, then almost left again when she was in my parking lot. She did end up coming up to hang out and we had a nice night. Hung out, talked happily, and we did get intimate.
One major difference is that I have not chased, contacted or otherwise been clingy in any form.
We have continued to chat since. the Day after she had some "I shouldn't have come over" vibes, but I just let her speak her mind and move past it.
She came by my work the other day to srop some stuff of mine she found while cleaning the shed.
She had a pretty rough weekend last weekend, and was in a salty mood earlier this week. She does still complain an awful lot about many things. Money, Work, Car, House, Dogs, Parenting. she is frequently stressing.

I made it known I was free and had time to hang out this coming weekend, but I did not directly ask to hang out.
Her coming over 2 weeks ago was her Idea, and If she wants to again, she will ask, like she did before.

Biggest takeaway for me in the last few weeks is that I am not having the repsonse Ive had in the past.
If i dont see her again, whatever. If she wants to be wishy washy, whatever.

Its not effecting me in the larger picture, so it is what it is.

I have been doing well. Finally got my car all reapaired, and now aiming to start squirreling away money through the winter.
It will be a YEAR since the breakup on Sept 22nd, and that is rapidly approaching.

I hope you are all doing well.

[Rev]

Figured I would pop in for an updated.
Not much news, but she and I did end up hanging out 2 weeks ago, for one night.
She was interested, then changed her mind and backed off, then later that same night she decided to come over, then almost left again when she was in my parking lot. She did end up coming up to hang out and we had a nice night. Hung out, talked happily, and we did get intimate.
One major difference is that I have not chased, contacted or otherwise been clingy in any form.
We have continued to chat since. the Day after she had some "I shouldn't have come over" vibes, but I just let her speak her mind and move past it.
She came by my work the other day to srop some stuff of mine she found while cleaning the shed.
She had a pretty rough weekend last weekend, and was in a salty mood earlier this week. She does still complain an awful lot about many things. Money, Work, Car, House, Dogs, Parenting. she is frequently stressing.

I made it known I was free and had time to hang out this coming weekend, but I did not directly ask to hang out.
Her coming over 2 weeks ago was her Idea, and If she wants to again, she will ask, like she did before.

Biggest takeaway for me in the last few weeks is that I am not having the repsonse Ive had in the past.
If i dont see her again, whatever. If she wants to be wishy washy, whatever.

Its not effecting me in the larger picture, so it is what it is.

I have been doing well. Finally got my car all reapaired, and now aiming to start squirreling away money through the winter.
It will be a YEAR since the breakup on Sept 22nd, and that is rapidly approaching.

I hope you are all doing well.

Hey Crunch!

Sounds like you are finding some acceptance and emotional/mental space for yourself.  A year is a milestone for sure.

I like to say that in the second year, we have a real opportunity to compare "how far" we've come or rather how me may have evolved. Instead of comparing ourselves to "before vs after" the breakup - we can compare ourselves to ourselves "year 1 vs year 2) after the breakup. 

That helped me anyways.

Thanks for the update.

Rev

[OKrunch]

Not even sure if I should be on the detaching board anymore, but things certainly aren't getting back into a relationship. We have been in contact for a few weeks now, we have hung out a few times. That being said, things are kind of stagnant. It seems to be no interest in advancement of anything on her end. I'm sure she's still figuring her own crap out, but I don't really want to be relegated to a booty call.
While my emotional response to anything regarding her has faded almost to nothing, I don't really want to be in limbo forever. I've not shut the idea off of Just backing off and seeing if she follows.

My therapist always said she is like a cat.

Kind of in a weird spot right now and don't really know how to proceed.

The few times we have hung out, it has always been in the evening. We just kind of hang out and sometimes hook up. I have expressed to her more than once about wanting to go out during the day and do things. Go hiking, go walk around the seaport town. Stuff we used to do.
She never really directly answers me.
So she's not saying no, but we still aren't doing anything other than hanging out in the evenings occasionally.

I feel like if I continue to ask it's going to seem like pressure, and furthermore I told myself I'm not going to chase. She was the one who reached out a few weeks ago, and she was the one who invited me over again last weekend.

So as I said things feel like they're kind of at a stalemate, or like a plateau or a dead zone. Hard to explain.

Advice on how to proceed?

[once removed]

Not even sure if I should be on the detaching board anymore
...
Advice on how to proceed?

yes. stop winging it, man! 

reread your posts. think of where you were a year ago, or even months ago. you have an opportunity for a different outcome - even in the worst case scenario, a better outcome than then.

Detaching is a board for people that are deep into grieving and/or done with the relationship. in other words, people that either would kill to have this opportunity, or that think its a terrible idea.

on one hand, the relationship looks a lot the same. contact here and there, seeing each other here and there, you pushing, her pulling. and yet, the opportunity to reconnect, and reconnect on a healthier plane, has never been better.

she wants this OKrunch, but the trust isnt there. to go back into this, she would have to go back on her word (she swore back then that there would be no reconciling) and go against that distrust. i dont think thats likely to happen without a game plan, and a different approach. by and large, you are still taking the same approach. you can do that, and things might improve, and they might stay where they are, where things continue at this pace until they come to a head (that could go for quite a while), blow up, time is lost, and youre in pain again.

my advice? post on the Bettering board. learn the tools. work this. get support - these are challenging relationships, and you dont have to do this alone.

[capecodling]

I think you’re right that this doesn’t really sound like you’re asking about detaching, what you seem to want — and this is me taking a bit of an intuitive leap — is to go back to the honeymoon. phase you had with her at the beginning.   I know that’s probably an oversimplification, but reading between the lines i think if you are honest with yourself that’s what you really want.

I am sorry to be the one to say it like this, but I think you know that isn’t coming back.  I also think you may be lying to yourself a bit by saying that you’ve pulled back and don’t care anymore.  You will likely feel the full weight of the trauma bond once you detach from her completely.  But, hey, I don’t need to be right just to justify where I am and the decisions I’ve made.  I hope, for your sake, that I’m wrong because the world doesn’t need another person who has been beaten down to their core by a BPD / NPD breakup.

[jaded7]

I think you’re right that this doesn’t really sound like you’re asking about detaching, what you seem to want — and this is me taking a bit of an intuitive leap — is to go back to the honeymoon. phase you had with her at the beginning.   I know that’s probably an oversimplification, but reading between the lines i think if you are honest with yourself that’s what you really want.

I am sorry to be the one to say it like this, but I think you know that isn’t coming back.  I also think you may be lying to yourself a bit by saying that you’ve pulled back and don’t care anymore.  You will likely feel the full weight of the trauma bond once you detach from her completely.  But, hey, I don’t need to be right just to justify where I am and the decisions I’ve made.  I hope, for your sake, that I’m wrong because the world doesn’t need another person who has been beaten down to their core by a BPD / NPD breakup.

I agree with this. Nothing I've ever read or any video I've watched has said that a relationship in this state comes back to the honeymoon phase...unless the person has done serious DBT work for years. Which hasn't happened here. In fact, no DBT work has been done and you're in the same toxic, cyclonic, back and forth state as before with even worse intermittent reinforcement now, and even less mental resilience as a result of the long-term purgatory you've been in.

For your sake, I would wish for you a happy relationship full of understanding and support. I would wish that for everyone here. But you've been pulled back into it and are now flailing, which is a horrible place to be.

With all the things my ex did and said to me, I too wanted her back and still do. My intellectual mind knows that what she did was wrong and abusive. My little me inside still wants her love, and my adult self still wants to "take care of her". BUT...I do have my self-respect intact. Whatever she thinks of me, if her stories she tells about me are true in her eyes, she can't deny that after being treated horribly, lying to me, ditching me over the holidays, yelling at me and calling me names, etc...I had enough. I have not called her, texted her or emailed her. I will not beg for her to come back, and I have not opened myself up to further twisting of the truth and lying should I reach out to her. I have, at least, that.

She once, when we were on a trip together over New Year, pulled up her computer after we had dinner and were just relaxing. She said "oh, my ex just emailed me". I said "oh?" not knowing what to say. She said "he sends me an email every year around Christmas". I said "does he want to get back together with you?" She replied "yes". I said what are you going to say to him, she said "nothing, I just delete it".

For years this guy has been emailing her, and she deletes it. She thought it important to share that with me, for some reason. I don't want to be that guy.

[jaded7]

Plain and simple.
There has been hot/col behavior, breadcrumbs and recycling BS.
I am no longer participating.

I said a lot of very blunt, honest things I have been holding back.
Im done not holding her accountable for her actions.

I HAVE BEEN LIVING IN FEAR OF LOSING SOMETHING I ALREADY LOST MONTHS AGO
and it has had me acting like a scared child.
I have not been respecting myself, and I have been putting her happiness before my own.

Nobody is attracted to someone with no self respect.
That crap ended this morning.

This is what I was referring to Crunch. This is back in June.

[OKrunch]

I'm not looking to return to the honeymoon phase. That would be an unrealistic expectation. The honeymoon phase is literally nothing but brain chemistry at the start of a relationship with a new person. I know enough to know that that is absolutely an unrealistic expectation, and would not be genuine anyway. For me I guess what it boils down to is the fact that we always orbit back to each other. I have tried dating other people in this past year. I have had success in doing so, but other people just don't measure up.



Insofar is what I said about not caring what the result is, obviously I have a preference as to what the end result would be. I'm also acutely aware of the several things she has done that has made it so I can't trust her. On top of that she continues to be aloof and dodgy.



What I will say is that I do not have any expectation that this will turn back into what we tried to have in the past. It's a possibility, but it's a highly unlikely one. But at the end of the day I love who I love. I miss my dogs and it was wonderful to see them.

Intimate relations with anybody else pale in comparison, so that's kind of a driving Factor as well.



What I can tell you is different, is that I'm not chasing. I'm not telling her that I love her and that I miss her and all these things. Because right now I don't love her, she hasn't earned that. But it would be a lie to say that she isn't the person that I want to spend my time with.



Take this upcoming weekend for example. She Knows my availability and she knows that we can probably hang out this weekend.  I am not going to ask.

As I stated before I definitely have my preferences as to how I would like things to go, but the ball is very much in her Court and I'm not going to stop or stifle my own life while I'm waiting for her to make up her mind.

And while I realize the honeymoon phase coming back is an unrealistic occasion and is not going to happen, I will say that if her and I are going to be seeing each other and spending time together, she needs to put in an equal amount of effort in doing so as well as an equal amount of effort in being emotionally available. If these things do not occur,  I will fade away and take my attention elsewhere

[capecodling]

I have tried dating other people in this past year. I have had success in doing so, but other people just don't measure up.

This is classic trauma bond at work here.  It makes it difficult / impossible to connect with others while you are in its clutches.  This is your mind playing tricks on you.  Man, I don’t know what to tell you, I think you are so deep in the trauma bond it is clouding your thinking.  If she was able to show up for you, she’s had a year or more to do that.  I was waiting for mine to show up for me too, but she couldn’t — or she would have already done so.  I hope against all odds things work out with you and this woman, but she needed to be in DBT (and many more things) by her own choosing 5-10 years BEFORE she met you, for there to be a chance.  I just don’t want to see you throw many more years away waiting for her to show up.   If every other woman “pales in comparison” to her then you’re interest in her isn’t just going to fade away, man.  You’re going to tell yourself that it will, but a year from now you’ll be just as trauma bonded as you are now, if not more, unless you adjust your thinking, bro.

[OKrunch]

This is classic trauma bond at work here.  It makes it difficult / impossible to connect with others while you are in its clutches.  This is your mind playing tricks on you.  Man, I don’t know what to tell you, I think you are so deep in the trauma bond it is clouding your thinking.  If she was able to show up for you, she’s had a year or more to do that.  I was waiting for mine to show up for me too, but she couldn’t — or she would have already done so.  I hope against all odds things work out with you and this woman, but she needed to be in DBT (and many more things) by her own choosing 5-10 years BEFORE she met you, for there to be a chance.  I just don’t want to see you throw many more years away waiting for her to show up.   If every other woman “pales in comparison” to her then you’re interest in her isn’t just going to fade away, man.  You’re going to tell yourself that it will, but a year from now you’ll be just as trauma bonded as you are now, if not more, unless you adjust your thinking, bro.

I'm not waiting for her. I'm living my life, and I'm not stopping new relationships or opportunities in my life on her account.

Do other women measure up? Not yet.
Do I miss what good we had? Definitely
Will I just lay down for more mistreatment?
Hell to the no no no.

This is very much a "balls in her court, she can crap or get off the pot" scenario.

Insofar as the trauma bond is concerned, my therapist has told me many times I'm past that and I trust her professional opinion above all others. She knows me well and knows my situation well.
I definitely was trauma bonded, but I worked thru that.

I'm doing well by myself. But at the end of the day the heart wants What It wants.
It's not in me to force myself to hate someone that I care about just because they are still on their own personal journey.

I'm perfectly contented with my life as it is, and I know I only add value to hers.
If she chooses to be alone and fight the ride by herself, that's on her head not mine.

[capecodling]

Hey man, look I hope what you say is true and that you are free of her clutches, just because I made the decision to leave mine doesn’t mean that I need for everyone else to make the same decision.  I’m just having a hard time buying it.  The title of this thread is “back to no contact for good” and yet here you are in contact with her again.  I don’t know your situation the way you do, but on the surface it reminds me of my own cycle of charming and getting back with her and being discarded again.  “The heart wants what the heart wants” can be true, but have you considered why your heart seems to want someone who treated you so poorly and continues to not value you?   Personally I would call that: “the trauma bond wants what the trauma bond wants” and I still have many moments back in that space so i’m saying that for myself too.

[OKrunch]

Hey man, look I hope what you say is true and that you are free of her clutches, just because I made the decision to leave mine doesn’t mean that I need for everyone else to make the same decision.  I’m just having a hard time buying it.  The title of this thread is “back to no contact for good” and yet here you are in contact with her again.  I don’t know your situation the way you do, but on the surface it reminds me of my own cycle of charming and getting back with her and being discarded again.  “The heart wants what the heart wants” can be true, but have you considered why your heart seems to want someone who treated you so poorly and continues to not value you?   Personally I would call that: “the trauma bond wants what the trauma bond wants” and I still have many moments back in that space so i’m saying that for myself too.

You make good points here. Full reply incoming

[OKrunch]

Hey man, look I hope what you say is true and that you are free of her clutches, just because I made the decision to leave mine doesn’t mean that I need for everyone else to make the same decision.  I’m just having a hard time buying it.  The title of this thread is “back to no contact for good” and yet here you are in contact with her again.  I don’t know your situation the way you do, but on the surface it reminds me of my own cycle of charming and getting back with her and being discarded again.  “The heart wants what the heart wants” can be true, but have you considered why your heart seems to want someone who treated you so poorly and continues to not value you?   Personally I would call that: “the trauma bond wants what the trauma bond wants” and I still have many moments back in that space so i’m saying that for myself too.

this is all ringing quite true, as I have been being ghosted once again. She only seems to call when she is lonley or wants sex.
It's a matter of respect, or lackthereof.
Im not here to be a sex toy on demand, or to hang by the phone waiting.
Nothing about this scenario has been balanced or fair for many months.
Done asking how high when she "blesses" me by asking me to jump.
come correct or eff off.
those be the choices.

[once removed]

I have been being ghosted once again.

What happened?

[OKrunch]

What happened?

Conversation fell off, she got to the point where her responses were short, or even one worded.
I wasnt blowing her phone up, and I sent a "Hey hows it going" yesterday, after not having talked for a day or two.

Nothing in response.
We each have our "free weekend" where our kids are with their other parents, on the same week as eachother, which is this weekend.

Two weeks ago, we hung out. Two weeks prior to that, we hung out.
I guess i built an expectation that we would again this weekend, but instead shes ghosty.

I havent reached out except the one time yesterday. Just leaving it alone.
Ive said before im not chasing her, and I wont be.

There are severa reasons she could be out of communication.
Some of which are benign, and unrelated to "us"
others which could be less good for "us".

But trying to guess will not help at all.

[OKrunch]

Long story short: I dont feel respected. I dont feel like she genuinley cares how I am doing, or is interested in the conversations that used to flow so easily and for hours.
She is out of "Give-A-Crap" and I need to match that energy.

This is unbalanced.

[once removed]

She is out of "Give-A-Crap" and I need to match that energy.
...
This is unbalanced.

youre not going to reconcile, or likely form, or frankly even successfully detach from a relationship by playing "he who cares the least wins".

remember, this is not a competition. you are attempting to court her. she isnt trying to match your energy, here.

I guess i built an expectation that we would again this weekend, but instead shes ghosty.
...
There are severa reasons she could be out of communication.

is the issue here that youre frustrated again by your expectations, and the fact that things arent moving at a faster pace?

[jaded7]

Conversation fell off, she got to the point where her responses were short, or even one worded.
I wasnt blowing her phone up, and I sent a "Hey hows it going" yesterday, after not having talked for a day or two.

Nothing in response.
We each have our "free weekend" where our kids are with their other parents, on the same week as eachother, which is this weekend.

Two weeks ago, we hung out. Two weeks prior to that, we hung out.
I guess i built an expectation that we would again this weekend, but instead shes ghosty.

I havent reached out except the one time yesterday. Just leaving it alone.
Ive said before im not chasing her, and I wont be.

There are severa reasons she could be out of communication.
Some of which are benign, and unrelated to "us"
others which could be less good for "us".

But trying to guess will not help at all.

I found myself in this exact position, Krunch. And it sucks. You know she's free, she knows you're free, she's not communicating, you're afraid to communicate in case it pisses her off, you want her to want to spend time with you, it's not matching what happened previously in similar situations, if you ask her what's going on she may or may not reply, if she does reply it might be non-committal one word, or it might be "you're too NEEDY!"...and on and on.

Completely stuck and, worse, fully, 100%, dependent on her mood, energy, whatever.

If someone wants to communicate with you they will. If someone want to hide from you they will.She would get 'secretive' in a way that felt deceitful and manipulative...one word answers that didn't makes sense.

 Mine would go DAYS without communicating, the first time I asked her why she wasn't communicating- it was so weird, up to that moment we used to text freely throughout the day, she initiating it most of the time, call a couple times if we couldn't be together, share our day-and she EXPLODED at me telling me I have a "mental problem and I'm controlling, get mental health help!"

This was because she had texted early Sat morning that she was going early to the market we always went together to after my work at around 11am, saying her son had a lot of homework. I texted her a couple times, called once, and didn't hear from her again until Sunday afternoon when I asked why she wasn't communicating. Now, it was strange since when her son previously had huge projects to work on, taking 10 or 11 hours a day, she still would call and text and send updates and photos of the project. But, now, her son has a lot of homework and...she can't text or call.

Set up. I do not miss the wondering and trying to figure it all out.

[OKrunch]

Well the hot cold cycle that started in June has ran its course.
We are back at square one, and not talking again.

With the argument that occured yesterday morning, it was made quite clear all this past 2 months was, was her being single, lonley and horny. she scornfully told me she is "blissfully unattached" right now, which I found odd.

She never expressed any emotional interest, and was pretty cold and aloof the entire time.
Had the first chat with my therapist in a while yesterday afternoon.

I explained to her that I felt used, strung along and devalued, much like I did back in Janurary when she basically pulled the same thing. Lasted about the same length of time then too. a few weeks of good contact, sex, and then it fades over about a month until she tells me to piss off again.

I explained to therapist that everything felt dead, and emotionless from EX, and this felt like that last gasp.
Therpaist was shaking her head, and I asked "What, you really think shes going to circle back AGAIN? It feels pretty damn dead at this point"
Therapist replied "she always has, and I believe to some degree she always will"
To which i replied that I thought this time It would be many months if not a year before she tried again.
Again my therpist disagreed and said I should keep my guard up and that she would likely temp check again between Halloween and Thanksgiving, which i found to be quite a shocking assesment.

Moving on, to ME.

Unlike in past "disconnection" phases, I am waking up calm, whereas in the past ive woken with my stomach already in knots.
I am looking at it a lot more rationally this time around, and while my mind still (as always) is swimming with questions and trying to figure out WTF she does and why, its a lot less obsessive.
I just want peace.
I am trying to look back and see that there never was peace, at least for any duration longer than a month or two.
Things i need to figure out
1.) why does she have such specific power to flare my emotions?
2.) why am i so attached to the idea of her / us? when history has shown me i should be the opposite.
3.) She has said so many contradictory things, its hard to seperate fact from fiction at this point. I need to see through, and see all of this for what it actually is.
4.) Why am I so attached to being attached? I hate being single, and In the past I have always flourished most when I am in a relationship, Why is that? and How can I flourish when I am alone, so that I am my best, and attract the most compadible person for me, rather than grasping to the corpse of a relationship that has blown up in my face several times.
5.) Taking off the rose colored glasses - Even after ALL the things she has done to hurt me, when i let my mind wander, it always goes right to happy memories of her, how beautiful I think she is and so on. Despite all she has done to kick me while down and to shove me out in the cold (literally) without a care for my and my sons wellbeing.
Why do i continue to glorify someone who has treated me so poorly?

My goal moving forward is that of improvement.
I need to have my behavior exhibit the self respect i feel in my heart.
My actions have not matched my feelings, and I have been letting depression and sloth run my life for a year now.

Sept 22nd is the one year mark of our second breakup.
it is time to get off the damn pity potty and live my life.
Live my life for me and my son, not constantly worrying what actions will put her path back towards mine.

[jaded7]

Well the hot cold cycle that started in June has ran its course.
We are back at square one, and not talking again.

With the argument that occured yesterday morning, it was made quite clear all this past 2 months was, was her being single, lonley and horny. she scornfully told me she is "blissfully unattached" right now, which I found odd.

She never expressed any emotional interest, and was pretty cold and aloof the entire time.
Had the first chat with my therapist in a while yesterday afternoon.

I explained to her that I felt used, strung along and devalued, much like I did back in Janurary when she basically pulled the same thing. Lasted about the same length of time then too. a few weeks of good contact, sex, and then it fades over about a month until she tells me to piss off again.

I explained to therapist that everything felt dead, and emotionless from EX, and this felt like that last gasp.
Therpaist was shaking her head, and I asked "What, you really think shes going to circle back AGAIN? It feels pretty damn dead at this point"
Therapist replied "she always has, and I believe to some degree she always will"
To which i replied that I thought this time It would be many months if not a year before she tried again.
Again my therpist disagreed and said I should keep my guard up and that she would likely temp check again between Halloween and Thanksgiving, which i found to be quite a shocking assesment.

Moving on, to ME.

Unlike in past "disconnection" phases, I am waking up calm, whereas in the past ive woken with my stomach already in knots.
I am looking at it a lot more rationally this time around, and while my mind still (as always) is swimming with questions and trying to figure out WTF she does and why, its a lot less obsessive.
I just want peace.
I am trying to look back and see that there never was peace, at least for any duration longer than a month or two.
Things i need to figure out
1.) why does she have such specific power to flare my emotions?
2.) why am i so attached to the idea of her / us? when history has shown me i should be the opposite.
3.) She has said so many contradictory things, its hard to seperate fact from fiction at this point. I need to see through, and see all of this for what it actually is.
4.) Why am I so attached to being attached? I hate being single, and In the past I have always flourished most when I am in a relationship, Why is that? and How can I flourish when I am alone, so that I am my best, and attract the most compadible person for me, rather than grasping to the corpse of a relationship that has blown up in my face several times.
5.) Taking off the rose colored glasses - Even after ALL the things she has done to hurt me, when i let my mind wander, it always goes right to happy memories of her, how beautiful I think she is and so on. Despite all she has done to kick me while down and to shove me out in the cold (literally) without a care for my and my sons wellbeing.
Why do i continue to glorify someone who has treated me so poorly?

My goal moving forward is that of improvement.
I need to have my behavior exhibit the self respect i feel in my heart.
My actions have not matched my feelings, and I have been letting depression and sloth run my life for a year now.

Sept 22nd is the one year mark of our second breakup.
it is time to get off the damn pity potty and live my life.
Live my life for me and my son, not constantly worrying what actions will put her path back towards mine.

I've posted a few things on your thread Krunch, and I've followed along. It's been painful to witness the torment you've been going through. I see myself very clearly in your struggles with her, and I recognize the thinking and confusion.

I think the questions you are asking are very, very important. I'm glad you posted them because they will be the questions that many of us ask. They are very generalizable to relationships with pwBPD.

And I believe they are indicate a new phase for you. These are very important questions to explore. Why does she have so much power over you (us)? Why, when we know exactly what has happened and the horrible things they called us/said to us AND did to us, do we still 'need' them?

The answers will lead us to the deeper issues.

I KNOW that in my case, and maybe yours, it was a deep-seated NEED to be loved. A feeling that this person held the key to my happiness in life. A feeling that them loving us will free us from the self-doubt and fear that we aren't good enough.

Mine comes from my childhood. No question about it. I know this.

I hope you can keep looking into these questions and find some answers.

[OKrunch]

I've posted a few things on your thread Krunch, and I've followed along. It's been painful to witness the torment you've been going through. I see myself very clearly in your struggles with her, and I recognize the thinking and confusion.

I think the questions you are asking are very, very important. I'm glad you posted them because they will be the questions that many of us ask. They are very generalizable to relationships with pwBPD.

And I believe they are indicate a new phase for you. These are very important questions to explore. Why does she have so much power over you (us)? Why, when we know exactly what has happened and the horrible things they called us/said to us AND did to us, do we still 'need' them?

The answers will lead us to the deeper issues.

I KNOW that in my case, and maybe yours, it was a deep-seated NEED to be loved. A feeling that this person held the key to my happiness in life. A feeling that them loving us will free us from the self-doubt and fear that we aren't good enough.

Mine comes from my childhood. No question about it. I know this.

I hope you can keep looking into these questions and find some answers.

I just need to get her of the darn pedestal and see clearly.
it takes me all of 5 min to forget the bad things she does, and go back to reminiscing.
Same with the way she has ejected my son and I over and over, and I just think how i miss my "stepdaughter"
I have gotten into a cycle of allowing abuseive behaviors, and allowing them in exchange for a slim, fleeting chance at anything ressebling reconcilliation.

My best friend said "If she was the right one, she never would have thrown you and your son out on your butts, TWICE"

I just hope I can get to the point where I dont see her as this flawless perfect thing, and I can put myself before her.

Self respect is attractive, and i honestly think that plays a huge role in why she faded off again.
I was too invested.

[OKrunch]

Trying to get back in the swing of things in a life entirely without her contact or input.
The last blowout we had could have been avoided, granted she opened with "Ive thought about it and I dont want to hang out again."
This is where i should have just said "Ok, you do you, see ya around"
And I did not.

Now, I didn't "Beg and plead" either, but I did continue the conversation longer than i shouldve and I made it clear I would prefer not to lose touch again, which i think honestly weakens my position.

The fact of the matter is this though, I have said numerous times, I want her to choose me entire.
Not keep me a secret, Not to be 2nd option.
I reitterated this when we spoke, and I dont think I am wrong in setting that boundary.
I have determined that this secret mode, every once in a while booty call type dynamic is NOT healthy for me.
It keeps me attached, and prevents me from moving on.
She has said almost the exact thing when explaining why we shouldnt talk anymore.
So its contradictory. She recognizes the same reason I see this as not healthy,
But at the same time, I will be dead honestly surprised If I get through Christmas without hearing from her again.

She may pretend a lot better than I do, but she is NO BETTER at letting go than I am.

She reacted poorly when I told her I felt like I was being used for sex and validation.
She balked at my use of the word "Used", and got defensive about it. However later in the conversation said "Geeze, I just wanted to get laid. You always blow everything out of proportion"
Which is basically an admission of "using me for sex"
She got defensive about it because it smacked a bit to much of Truth for her comfort level.

Here is my biggest takeaway from this weekend.
I HAVENT CHANGED MUCH.
I still need to get my fitness, diet (im not overweight, I just eat like garbage) and other personal aspects of my life in order.
I still continue some of the behaviors that caused attraction to dip in the first place.
I failed at quitting smoking, I dont  work out, and I spend far too much of my attention in distraction activities like gaming or reading.
I am not being productive enough with my time.
If i can fix these issues, my financial situation will be better, I will be more physically fit, and generally in better mental health.
Thereby becoming the best and most attractive version of myself.

Goals:
Get set into workout routine on a solid, everyday consistant basis by Halloween.

Be better at meal prep for health and financial reasons. Being lazy is expensive AND unhealthy.

Finally, fully, quit smoking.

Retool resume, decide on future career path.