Learning: Finding the Edge

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hi all,

So this is meant to be a personal inventory of sorts. I am interested in finding the edges where I am still emotionally attached and, if possible, working through them. You're invited to do the same.

I still feel very attached to the idea of committed relationship and emotional support. That's something I wanted for a long time and it's the reason I tried hard to make things work last time. For example, I need to get an operation (for the second time) and it would be so nice if somebody would take me and bring me home. I also found when I was very sick from the covid vaccine I was in dire need of some TLC and said my ex's name a lot in my fevers. My ex (not sure if this was just a fawn response) was willing to take on these sorts of roles, as I was for her, although she had massive trouble opening up and recieving it. I can't think of any counter-strength to bring to this edge except for time and working on myself and contributing to current friendships, spending time with people.

Another edge has to do with physical intimacy. I found that after she left me I'd so often have sex dreams about her and I think it was my minds way of wishing we could be connected. I think if I can manage to be physically intimate with someone else or several people it will sort of 'replace' her in that it will show that's possible with others and she's not so special. I don't feel ready for this yet, though.

A final edge is, I think, detaching from the whole BPD thing and trying to put a lot of that energy into relationships with other people in the world. How would I act if I never heard of BPD? I would try and meet others, I would go out to concerts and the theatre, I would be trying to enjoy my life. That life is still out there, if I can enter it.

I still have residual depression and a lot of fears connected to trauma but I think trying to navigate this edge means not getting caught in the past...otherwise, I feel they 'win', in the sense that my natural joyfulness and sense of adventure is suffocated or limited by fear (of failure, of betrayal, of simply being too hurt still). I mean recovering 'myself' is the strongest counter-edge I can think of.

None of these edges are easy or simple for me. I hope that naming them will help me to navigate them better. What about you? do you notice some edge or weakness, some 'might have been' or 'when I think of that I...' that keeps you in the loop of the past? Is there any counter-strength you can bring to this edge?

[poppy2]

Hi all,

So this is meant to be a personal inventory of sorts. I am interested in finding the edges where I am still emotionally attached and, if possible, working through them. You're invited to do the same.

I still feel very attached to the idea of committed relationship and emotional support. That's something I wanted for a long time and it's the reason I tried hard to make things work last time. For example, I need to get an operation (for the second time) and it would be so nice if somebody would take me and bring me home. I also found when I was very sick from the covid vaccine I was in dire need of some TLC and said my ex's name a lot in my fevers. My ex (not sure if this was just a fawn response) was willing to take on these sorts of roles, as I was for her, although she had massive trouble opening up and recieving it. I can't think of any counter-strength to bring to this edge except for time and working on myself and contributing to current friendships, spending time with people.

Another edge has to do with physical intimacy. I found that after she left me I'd so often have sex dreams about her and I think it was my minds way of wishing we could be connected. I think if I can manage to be physically intimate with someone else or several people it will sort of 'replace' her in that it will show that's possible with others and she's not so special. I don't feel ready for this yet, though.

A final edge is, I think, detaching from the whole BPD thing and trying to put a lot of that energy into relationships with other people in the world. How would I act if I never heard of BPD? I would try and meet others, I would go out to concerts and the theatre, I would be trying to enjoy my life. That life is still out there, if I can enter it.

I still have residual depression and a lot of fears connected to trauma but I think trying to navigate this edge means not getting caught in the past...otherwise, I feel they 'win', in the sense that my natural joyfulness and sense of adventure is suffocated or limited by fear (of failure, of betrayal, of simply being too hurt still). I mean recovering 'myself' is the strongest counter-edge I can think of.

None of these edges are easy or simple for me. I hope that naming them will help me to navigate them better. What about you? do you notice some edge or weakness, some 'might have been' or 'when I think of that I...' that keeps you in the loop of the past? Is there any counter-strength you can bring to this edge?

[Sappho11]

What a creative and constructive thread idea!

I still feel very attached to the idea of committed relationship and emotional support. That's something I wanted for a long time and it's the reason I tried hard to make things work last time. For example, I need to get an operation (for the second time) and it would be so nice if somebody would take me and bring me home. I also found when I was very sick from the covid vaccine I was in dire need of some TLC and said my ex's name a lot in my fevers. My ex (not sure if this was just a fawn response) was willing to take on these sorts of roles, as I was for her, although she had massive trouble opening up and recieving it. I can't think of any counter-strength to bring to this edge except for time and working on myself and contributing to current friendships, spending time with people.

Another edge has to do with physical intimacy. I found that after she left me I'd so often have sex dreams about her and I think it was my minds way of wishing we could be connected. I think if I can manage to be physically intimate with someone else or several people it will sort of 'replace' her in that it will show that's possible with others and she's not so special. I don't feel ready for this yet, though.

I feel the same way and relate to every single point you mention. Before I got together with my ex, I'd been living like a monk for the better part of a decade, and thus for the vast majority of my adult life. Add to that that I don't have any living relatives, and that my friendships tend to be built on an understanding of physical distance... in short, I hadn't enjoyed as much as a hug in literal years. This mirrored my childhood and teenage years, which had been similarly devoid of physical affection... so when my ex came along, with his physical neediness, it was completely intoxicating. Imagine wandering through a desert for your entire life, and suddenly you set foot into an oasis where everything is overwhelmingly abundant...! That's what it felt like initially, from an emotional standpoint.

And of course, the realm of physical intimacies was something else altogether... I'd always known that I had a stronger propensity towards sexuality than many women, and that I had been completely suppressing it (usually for lack of an appropriate partner). So when that became a daily part of my life, I realised just what I had been missing out on – a huge aspect not just of life, but of myself. It was devastating to have that ripped away from me.

And like you, in vulnerable moments, I ardently wish I had someone to recuperate with – even if it's just sitting and snuggling on the couch in silence. Who wouldn't want those things? It's human nature.

None of these edges are easy or simple for me. I hope that naming them will help me to navigate them better. What about you? do you notice some edge or weakness, some 'might have been' or 'when I think of that I...' that keeps you in the loop of the past? Is there any counter-strength you can bring to this edge?

There is! It's realising that these things are part of the human experience in general; they aren't tied to your ex in particular, they can and will be had with other people, too, even if that is impossible to imagine right now. Statistics are in your favour – eventually, you will meet someone who will make your heart jump, who you'll look forward to seeing and experiencing all of those things with, you will have a spring in your step again, and the excitement will be intoxicating... barely anyone ends up alone and bitter. You're bound to couple up again. It's simply an overwhelming mathematical likelihood.

What helped me a lot was this very realisation; that those edges had virtually nothing to do with my ex as a person. Yes, he was a good-looking, physically needy man who was willing to have sex with me. It sounds terrible but that was the factual extent of his upsides. Everything else around that "love story" had been created by me – all the great moments, the excursions, the travels, the special moments, the gifts – he had done very little to contribute to these things other than loaning me his presence. So then I realised I would be able to re-create them again – with someone else and more worthy of my affections.

To be honest, the final building block in my emotional healing was when I began to learn the violin and developed bit of my crush on my cute violin teacher. That was the undeniable a-ha moment of "See – you are able to feel all of those things again with someone else". The current situationship with the Pianist is helping, too.

There's so much to love about you, poppy, and there will be someone who'll appreciate you the way you deserve 

[poppy2]

I feel the same way and relate to every single point you mention. Before I got together with my ex, I'd been living like a monk for the better part of a decade, and thus for the vast majority of my adult life. Add to that that I don't have any living relatives, and that my friendships tend to be built on an understanding of physical distance... in short, I hadn't enjoyed as much as a hug in literal years.

Hi Liebe Sappho,

Yes, I've read a lot of your posts, including in my other "grief" thread where you describe your life and I could emphasize so much with the situation you describe. I think, in a way, these vulnerabilities made us susceptible to being "received" by somebody who, really, wasn't capable of carrying through on any of their promises: not of intimacy, nor of reciprocal support. I also could relate a lot to what you described as your ex's house or family as being a "drawing card" for you, in terms of a kind of belonging that you have longed for. I don't think I'm quite at the point of seeing these things as strengths (as you wrote in the other thread), I'm more melancholic about it but that doesn't mean I'm overwhelmed by it. That was my idea of naming the "edge"... the point at which one can fall into a dependent or unhelpful relation, and so knowing when to step back from that. Observing the edge and living alongside it until it shifts into a new edge or potential... like a long-term dancing class, moving and shifting and resting.

These needs are not necessarily attached to my ex (who has no respect for me at all!) in reality, but rather what she brought out. And I agree with you: these needs are human nature, and wanting them is normal. I'm perhaps less proactive than you in "getting out there" to get my needs met but that's okay, I am sure it will happen too.

I envisaged this thread as a kind of personal inventory: but not where I list my strengths, rather my weaknesses as a way of holding space for them, and maybe therefore also holding the future for them as well. To be able to say: that's where I was then, and now I am here (in the future) And I wanted to invite others to do that too, to feel okay to show weakness or need without necessarily trying to resolve it into something (doesn't work: those quick fixes are what these BPD-non relationships are all about, after all!)

To be honest, the final building block in my emotional healing was when I began to learn the violin and developed bit of my crush on my cute violin teacher. That was the undeniable a-ha moment of "See – you are able to feel all of those things again with someone else". The current situationship with the Pianist is helping, too.

I've been really happy to follow your journey and I think that getting out there and taking control, yourself, of certain situations with all their limitations is a great way of processing or simply no longer caring about the past. It's nice to be reminded this will happen to me too, there are maybe some people in mind or events where I could meet people. It takes time, that's okay. Also, you seem to get hit on more than me hahah at least that's my impression from the threads (and a compliment to you!), but the LGBTIQ community is also much smaller.

he had done very little to contribute to these things other than loaning me his presence. So then I realised I would be able to re-create them again – with someone else and more worthy of my affections.

"loaning" him your presence is such a great description. I also feel my ex "loaned" me my presence, too! in the sense of trying to mirror the idea of supportive, intimate conversations without really being able to eventually back such things up. What a strange world it is.

There's so much to love about you, poppy, and there will be someone who'll appreciate you the way you deserve 

Thanks a lot for saying that. I perhaps don't share so much of those "good sides" on the boards but I am also slowly or partially recovering my good self-image after the things that have happened to me. Before these toxic relationships I was a bit of a heartbreaker, actually  In the sense that I was free and people seemed to gravitate to me (flattering but annoying as well). I'm trying to re-find and encourage that person in myself. Thanks for the support! 

[Ad Meliora]

Hi Poppy,  I think this is a good thread to start, and like Sappho I have a lot of the same "edges" or needs.  As Sappho points out, correctly, many of these are shared human needs.  The need for intimacy, the need for emotional support and love.  The need for physical (and mental and spiritual?) connection with our fellow human travelers.  We all have different ways we'd like to see those needs met and manifested in our lives and in the lives around us.

I didn't know how I was going to survive on my own, first after the split with my BiPDex and really after my BPDex.  I realized with the former that I stayed in that relationship past the expiration date because I feared my needs wouldn't be met--the ones you identified.  I like having someone to help me when sick.  My BiPDex was there when I went to surgery too, a traumatic experience.  I had no family in town.  My answer to my BiPD ex break was to jump into a relationship with my BPD partner, and that just made me feel worse over the year and realize I was ultimately on my own (emotionally) anyway.  In a way, that helped when it came to end it.  I had realized I could essentially live on my own for a year if I had to. I've gone another 15 months since then now.  Sure, I still have those needs, but it helped me realize I don't have to be so dependent and needy with a future partner.  I can avoid some of those co-dependent traps that tend to form.

It hasn't been easy, but one thing I learned to do this summer (it may sound silly here) is to talk myself into things, give myself a "pep-talk" when it's something I think I can't handle on my own.  Here's an example.  I have some Catios or Cat shacks I've built in my back yard to keep my pets in while I'm gardening or working on things outside (so they don't get lost in the city here).  One was badly in need of repairs and I deferred those repairs from the year before because I (naively) thought maybe I'd have someone in my life by then to give me a hand with things.  No go.  I also hate to ask friends and neighbors to always come by and help me with my "heavy lifting" projects.  I tend to keep some beer around just in case I need to bribe them into helping me though...  So I've found myself without help in this project several times and cats eager to get outside to their dwellings.  The shack that needed repairs was the size of two standard washing machines stacked on top of each other.  Made of wood framing and chicken wire with a shingled roof.  The base structure was rotten, but the top had been restored. I needed to cut off the top and replace the base.  No one to help, cats meowing in the porch, I said to myself, "Ad, are you the strong-man here?  You're the strongman, you can do this."  I cut the chicken wire and set some sawhorses  close.  I steeled my core and hugged this washing machine sized structure as tight as I could and lifted it of the rotting base then shuffling it to the sawhorses.  
   I did it.

So I've used this a couple of times now.  Namely when it comes to lifting or carrying or some other "feat of strength" but it could be for anything.  Point is I never would've attempted this on my own when I had a partner, and maybe I shouldn't have in some cases.  But it gave me some confidence, as well as pride, as I could do these things on my own, and have success.

When it came to put the top back on after I made a new base I found myself in the same jam.  This time I looked at the problem and used some creative thinking and a technique I have used before (borrowed from the Egyptians).  I put planks between the sawhorses and the new base.  I put broom handles under the edges to act as rollers and was able to quite easily roll the upper part back onto the new base.  A lot less labor involved, just more planning and time to reach the end goal.  Point is, I used that gray matter between my ears a bit and something that mankind is known for: primitive tools.  I felt an even greater sense of pride after the second success.

Summary:  Your needs are a lot like mine (and Sappho's) and like everyone's.  We are all looking for the best ways to meet those needs.  When pushed and tested a person can find the likely have more strength and resilience inside them than they even knew.

[poppy2]

That's a lovely story. Thanks for sharing it!

Can I ask what kind of pets you have? it sounds like you might have a menagerie of sorts...

Best wishes
poppy

[ILMBPDC]

So this is meant to be a personal inventory of sorts. I am interested in finding the edges where I am still emotionally attached and, if possible, working through them. You're invited to do the same.

I have been thinking about this stuff lately too - partly because of him reaching out last weekend and my emotional reaction to it, partly because I am trying to figure out why/how I manage to end up in these dysfunctional relationships so I can work on that.

I have to be honest that there is still a small piece of me that is bonded to him. I haven't figured out if its truly because of him/the BPD or if its a fluke because of the trauma I went through in my previous relationship that made me bond more tightly to him and the BPD didn't help.  In all of my 47 years, I have never held onto a person for this long after a relationship ended and I hate that I can't seem to fully release him.

I still feel very attached to the idea of committed relationship and emotional support. That's something I wanted for a long time and it's the reason I tried hard to make things work last time.

And like you, in vulnerable moments, I ardently wish I had someone to recuperate with – even if it's just sitting and snuggling on the couch in silence. Who wouldn't want those things? It's human nature.

I honestly think this was a big part of why I even got into the relationship with my BPD. I had been single and lonely for so, so long (nearly 10 years) and he was the very first person who had even showed interest in that time, coupled with the love bombing where he espoused how important family was and talking the future and how much we had in common... it was so easy for me to ignore the red flags. I wanted a relationship and someone to support me so badly that I was willing to put up with nearly anything for it (plus we had so much in common, which made it seem so perfect in some respects that it was easy to choose to overlook some of the not-so-great things. Granted I now know a lot of the "in common" stuff was mirroring, but not all of it).

So I am trying to work on the fact that I am lonely and vulnerable and just want to be loved. It's definitely human nature but it makes it so hard - for one thing, it is way too easy for someone with a PD or nefarious motives to take advantage of that, and I have first hand experience in both. Which makes me not want to date at all. Which makes me even more lonely, ad nauseum. 

LOL I feel like I am just babbling in this response and I'm not even sure it fits your question to begin with so I will end here.

[poppy2]

I have to be honest that there is still a small piece of me that is bonded to him. I haven't figured out if its truly because of him/the BPD or if its a fluke because of the trauma I went through in my previous relationship that made me bond more tightly to him and the BPD didn't help.  In all of my 47 years, I have never held onto a person for this long after a relationship ended and I hate that I can't seem to fully release him.

I agree completely. I also feel partly bonded and was today even asking myself - am I bonded to my own projection? did that person even exist? because it felt so real, I think the memory of that stays. I've also never experienced something like this before, I've never in my life expended as much energy over a breakup as this one. I also wonder if it simply comes from the wound they leave behind them.

But I also find it comes and goes in waves. I often don't care about her. Maybe you and I should try a releasing ceremony?

So I am trying to work on the fact that I am lonely and vulnerable and just want to be loved. It's definitely human nature but it makes it so hard - for one thing, it is way too easy for someone with a PD or nefarious motives to take advantage of that, and I have first hand experience in both. Which makes me not want to date at all. Which makes me even more lonely, ad nauseum. 

LOL I feel like I am just babbling in this response and I'm not even sure it fits your question to begin with so I will end here.

I found this all very good babble! When I had more energy, in the months following the breakup before I became depressed, I really thought of getting a dog... to try and heal the attachment wound that the r/s created. I wish I had the money I really believe it could work, that way, the basic need for company and care is there, and I could then be more discerning as to who I let into my life romantically.

[Ad Meliora]

I found this all very good babble! When I had more energy, in the months following the breakup before I became depressed, I really thought of getting a dog... to try and heal the attachment wound that the r/s created. I wish I had the money I really believe it could work, that way, the basic need for company and care is there, and I could then be more discerning as to who I let into my life romantically.

Maybe put a pin in that thought for now and a dog may be on the horizon.  Two cats, to answer your question.  Pets do help.  Unconditional love.  No mind games, they tell you what they want when they want it, and then sleep the other 18 hours of the day...

[poppy2]

Maybe put a pin in that thought for now and a dog may be on the horizon.  Two cats, to answer your question.  Pets do help.  Unconditional love.  No mind games, they tell you what they want when they want it, and then sleep the other 18 hours of the day...

[ILMBPDC]

I agree completely. I also feel partly bonded and was today even asking myself - am I bonded to my own projection? did that person even exist? because it felt so real, I think the memory of that stays.

A few weeks after my final discard, I came across something that said exactly this - that they were mirroring us and that's who we fell in love with. It was a literal shock to me - that the person I loved so dearly, that I found so irresistible was...me?  I have such major low self esteem I had a hard time wrapping my head around it. I still have a hard time with the whole part about the person we saw and knew so well wasn't real (in the sense that it wasn't really him, on the other hand it was really me)...its like a horror movie. Or maybe just a suspense movie.  Either way its something that you almost need to suspend reality to believe. But it is real.

I've also never experienced something like this before, I've never in my life expended as much energy over a breakup as this one. I also wonder if it simply comes from the wound they leave behind them.

Yep, me neither. This is the part I am currently working on - why I am still so bonded to even the idea of him. I know people say that the love bombing acts like a drug in our brains- that its like being addicted to heroin - and maybe that is part of it. Part of why we can't let go like we were able to in the past?  I don't know, I just wish it would end.

But I also find it comes and goes in waves. I often don't care about her. Maybe you and I should try a releasing ceremony?

Good idea   I've done some Somatic Experiencing therapy which was interesting - the idea is that trauma gets trapped in the body and by working with a Somatic Experiencing therapist you help your body release that stored trauma.  I can say it has helped me become aware of my body and notice when I am trying to push down emotions.
I've also been on a journey with psychedelic therapy this year and that has helped a ton.  It really helps you bypass your ego to work on your issues.

I found this all very good babble! When I had more energy, in the months following the breakup before I became depressed, I really thought of getting a dog... to try and heal the attachment wound that the r/s created. I wish I had the money I really believe it could work, that way, the basic need for company and care is there, and I could then be more discerning as to who I let into my life romantically.

I have 2 big dogs and a cat. My dogs have been a big part of my recovery - there's nothing like their unconditional love. They don't care about anything except being with you (and eating). They are definitely beneficial but they do cost a decent amount of money to take care of. Maybe a stuffed animal for now?

[poppy2]

I still have a hard time with the whole part about the person we saw and knew so well wasn't real (in the sense that it wasn't really him, on the other hand it was really me)...its like a horror movie. Or maybe just a suspense movie.  Either way its something that you almost need to suspend reality to believe. But it is real.

I agree. It's almost like we need to wear a wristband that says: don't worry, they had a shifting sense of self, you never could have planned for that. It's very hard to wrap your head around, for sure.

Yep, me neither. This is the part I am currently working on - why I am still so bonded to even the idea of him. I know people say that the love bombing acts like a drug in our brains- that its like being addicted to heroin - and maybe that is part of it. Part of why we can't let go like we were able to in the past?  I don't know, I just wish it would end.

For me I would say, I am bonded because of hope. The slow process of accepting who she really is doesn't cancel out the hope but it does make me not want to attach it to her. 

I have 2 big dogs and a cat. My dogs have been a big part of my recovery - there's nothing like their unconditional love. They don't care about anything except being with you (and eating). They are definitely beneficial but they do cost a decent amount of money to take care of. Maybe a stuffed animal for now?

Sounds great! Say hi to your dogs for me! I love them. I'm sure they can help so much with their unconditional love. I've got some stuffed animals And who knows, maybe the dog will come into my life when i'm least expecting it, and hope then to have enough money too.

Hope you're doing well today ILMBPDC!

[ILMBPDC]

I agree. It's almost like we need to wear a wristband that says: don't worry, they had a shifting sense of self, you never could have planned for that. It's very hard to wrap your head around, for sure.

No, there's no way to plan for something like this at all.

For me I would say, I am bonded because of hope. The slow process of accepting who she really is doesn't cancel out the hope but it does make me not want to attach it to her. 

Hope is a factor - in some way I still hope he changes, though rationally I know that is a silly hope and even if it happened it doesn't erase the hurt he caused. I am trying to shift my hope to other things - hope for my future (without a man!), hope for my daughter's future.
But I also feel like there's something else - I can't put my finger on it. I can tell myself all day how we wouldn't have ever worked out, that he's not worth it, that the person I loved wasn't real...but it doesn't change the little blip in my heart when I hear his name unexpectedly.

Sounds great! Say hi to your dogs for me! I love them. I'm sure they can help so much with their unconditional love. I've got some stuffed animals And who knows, maybe the dog will come into my life when i'm least expecting it, and hope then to have enough money too.

They wagged their tails at your "hi"   I hope some day you can get a dog (or whatever pet fits you!), they really are the best.

Hope you're doing well today ILMBPDC!

Hey, thanks for asking. I'm ok. Ok that's a lie . I'm stressed - my life is a big ball of anxiety right now and its not even to do with Mr BPD.  I need to find a forum for majorly stressed out, possibly burnt out, middle aged women with depression.

[poppy2]

But I also feel like there's something else - I can't put my finger on it. I can tell myself all day how we wouldn't have ever worked out, that he's not worth it, that the person I loved wasn't real...but it doesn't change the little blip in my heart when I hear his name unexpectedly.

I can really relate to this. For me, the little blip in my heart is fear, actually.. based on the cruel way I was left, without closure or explanations. Can I ask, are you in the same boat? maybe we both feel this way cause we never got to the point where we no longer wanted to continue. At least, I think that's the case for me.

They wagged their tails at your "hi"   I hope some day you can get a dog (or whatever pet fits you!), they really are the best.

Ooo so cute. Thanks a lot for sharing that can I ask which breeds you have? I had a Cavalier king Charles spaniel as a kid. I saw you wrote big dogs.. are we talking great Danes?

Hey, thanks for asking. I'm ok. Ok that's a lie . I'm stressed - my life is a big ball of anxiety right now and its not even to do with Mr BPD.  I need to find a forum for majorly stressed out, possibly burnt out, middle aged women with depression.

Hey, I hope you can find that forum. In the meantime, maybe you could make a new topic here, trying to list the stresses and anxieties. I think there's a nice community of people on bpdfamily, I've certainly posted about things that don't have to do with BPD.

[Erfanovich]

No, there's no way to plan for something like this at all.
Hope is a factor - in some way I still hope he changes, though rationally I know that is a silly hope and even if it happened it doesn't erase the hurt he caused. I am trying to shift my hope to other things - hope for my future (without a man!), hope for my daughter's future.
But I also feel like there's something else - I can't put my finger on it. I can tell myself all day how we wouldn't have ever worked out, that he's not worth it, that the person I loved wasn't real...but it doesn't change the little blip in my heart when I hear his name unexpectedly.
 

Hi, want to say something about the hope part. Went to therapy today and this was one of the subject we talked about. The trauma is build of hope, because this is how we, empathie,  caring people are. We hope there will be chance, hope they will chance down the line or when we chance things are going to work and finally they will see we are the best for them. Hope for chance. But the bad news is: nope, they will not chance, and no, they will never see us as the best for them. And still we think we are (i do...). We know the ex BPD the best, and they know it. Altough we have a lot of pain, questions and grieve. They know we know them, every tear,  every lie, every blink of eye, everything we know.

All we've been trough has a emotional load (nice and bad things)  because we loved them, true unconditional love. I am proud of that! I loved her, all of her and accepted her shortcomings. All of it. My exBPD was 45, and when she slept next to me she was sleeping like a little girl. Her knees at her chin, so innocent. I gave her a Kiss on the forehead everytime, every night qhe I was awake.  Even when she slept she murmured "thank you" when I did that. I will never forget these moments. These moments madenit almost impossible to realize she was a wolf in sheepskin and so hard to me.

 All that is gone, I lost my innocence, my way of loving and way of caring like I did for her. For me my mind tells me I am only able to love again when I am with her. Its the trauma, and the hope she will chance and see me finally as the best for her.

It will not happen... and I have to accept that. We all have...

[ILMBPDC]

I can really relate to this. For me, the little blip in my heart is fear, actually.. based on the cruel way I was left, without closure or explanations. Can I ask, are you in the same boat? maybe we both feel this way cause we never got to the point where we no longer wanted to continue. At least, I think that's the case for me.

Yes - I think we have had pretty similar experiences, based on other posts of yours I have read.  I agree a lot of it was that we never saw it coming. Usually in relationships you can just tell its not going well or there's some indications - but in this is was just a cliff in the dark - I never saw it coming. And I never had the really bad experiences others have had that would have at least soured me a little on him. Looking back, I can definitely see that I wasn't treated well, but it the grand scheme of my relationships it wasn't the worst by any means. I was ready and willing to put in the effort and he just...stopped. Boom, then end. Told me "you are an awesome woman but I am not responding to you anymore" (because I told him I was feeling used, he got very hurt and that was that) Who the hell does that?

Ooo so cute. Thanks a lot for sharing that can I ask which breeds you have? I had a Cavalier king Charles spaniel as a kid. I saw you wrote big dogs.. are we talking great Danes?

I have a 12 year old Staffordshire Terrier (one of the so-called pitbull breeds, he is really just a big baby despite the reputation)  and a 6 year old Lab-Terrier-Springer Spaniel mix. They weigh between 65-75lbs (maybe 80, my girl's kinda fat) , so, not the biggest dogs, but still considered "large" and nearly impossible to move if they are sleeping in your spot  And definitely bigger than a king Charles spaniel LOL

Hey, I hope you can find that forum. In the meantime, maybe you could make a new topic here, trying to list the stresses and anxieties. I think there's a nice community of people on bpdfamily, I've certainly posted about things that don't have to do with BPD.

 

I feel like my issues  are so varied and not related to BPD that it seems weird to post here this is a "quick" overview: Juggling work and grad school, my daughter (23) broke her leg in Aug and I've had to do a lot more taking care of her (and she has BPD as well, though usually well- managed she sometimes has emotional spirals), my division at work was bought by a new company so there is stress about that transition (and if I'm going to get laid off), my mother was diagnosed with a rare illness and is pushing to move in with me - oh and she is a covert narcissist and I have a lot of issues from childhood because of her and there is no way I can live with her but I get constant guilt trips about it. Plus dealing with my own mental health - namely lifelong depression plus PTSD (diagnosed earlier this year, due to both childhood and a relationship with a psychopath a decade ago) and anxiety (only showed up when I went off my antidepressants). Oh, and for some reason I am struggling with getting older (47), feeling like I am running out of time (to do what?  unsure).   A lot of this is mental health related tbh
Anyway, yeah, the BPD ex was just icing on the cake.

[Ad Meliora]

A few weeks after my final discard, I came across something that said exactly this - that they were mirroring us and that's who we fell in love with. It was a literal shock to me - that the person I loved so dearly, that I found so irresistible was...me?  I have such major low self esteem I had a hard time wrapping my head around it. I still have a hard time with the whole part about the person we saw and knew so well wasn't real (in the sense that it wasn't really him, on the other hand it was really me)...its like a horror movie. Or maybe just a suspense movie.  Either way its something that you almost need to suspend reality to believe. But it is real.

Hi ILM, I just saw I deleted a part on "Pyschedelic Therapy". I'd like to hear more about that.  I've heard there's been some major breakthroughs in that work, curing long-standing emotional pains and eliminating PTSD, etc... Anyway, what you say above here.  Yes.

I was thinking how I would say something about this in the update, but couldn't find the words to explain it.  Our BPDex's triggered something in us, we thought we finally found someone who loves us like we wanted to be loved, deserved to be loved and could even be our "true love".  It's a mirroring effect, I'm sure, but a deep and convincing one.  We love them so much because we want to be loved by ourselves?  See, how do I even write it?   We need the love of ourselves, but not in a narcissistic way?  We want to see ourselves being loved the way we should be loved?

It's so real, that it is unreal, and truly could never be real from a person who is disordered.  Even without the exact words I think THIS, this is at the crux of the relationship for me, the main problem I tried to solve on my own for a year.  The problem without a solution except to work on one's self.  To focus on one's healing.  To truly learn to love and accept yourself so you can truly love and accept another person without being consumed by them or overrun by them.  So when you are complete, it will be easy to see the holes in the person with disordered thinking and, unless you want to become their caretaker, avoid that in the future.

[ILMBPDC]

Hi ILM, I just saw I deleted a part on "Pyschedelic Therapy". I'd like to hear more about that.  I've heard there's been some major breakthroughs in that work, curing long-standing emotional pains and eliminating PTSD, etc... Anyway, what you say above here.  Yes.

It is interesting - it allows you to bypass your ego and delve deep into your psyche. It can be tough, but I have been able to start to peel away the layers of my own childhood trauma and recognize that it wasn't my fault. What is interesting is that rationally I am aware that it wasn't my fault but I don't know if I ever believed it deep down. With psychedelics, I have been able to not only acknowledge it but also start to believe it. And to get angry about it, which is unusual for me (I have a tendency to not get angry about things and I've come to realize that this is a coping mechanism to "keep the peace" as a child but it allows me to get taken advantage of as an adult). I still have a long way to go but it has helped a lot in my case.

I was thinking how I would say something about this in the update, but couldn't find the words to explain it.  Our BPDex's triggered something in us, we thought we finally found someone who loves us like we wanted to be loved, deserved to be loved and could even be our "true love".  It's a mirroring effect, I'm sure, but a deep and convincing one.  We love them so much because we want to be loved by ourselves?  See, how do I even write it?   We need the love of ourselves, but not in a narcissistic way?  We want to see ourselves being loved the way we should be loved?

I think you are right. Almost everything I have read regarding my own issues comes back to lack of self-love/self-worth/self-esteem. I am depressed and anxious because I lack self-worth, I get into relationships like this because deep down I feel unlovable and when anyone shows me love of any kind I latch on, I feel like there will never be anyone else. My rational brain knows better but my broken inner child doesn't. The BPD Love Bombing stage made me feel worthy for the first time in my life and losing that was as painful as ripping off an arm. My biggest takeaway from discussing this repeatedly in therapy is that I need to be able to give this to myself and not look for it externally. Its not easy

The problem without a solution except to work on one's self.  To focus on one's healing.  To truly learn to love and accept yourself so you can truly love and accept another person without being consumed by them or overrun by them.  So when you are complete, it will be easy to see the holes in the person with disordered thinking and, unless you want to become their caretaker, avoid that in the future.

Yes, this exactly! 

[grumpydonut]

Very interesting, L.

It sounds like you and I struggle with very similar things, so I'm interesting in your take on psychedelics.

My therapist is actually apart of an Australian study on psychedelics atm, so I might ask if I can trial them too!

[ILMBPDC]

My therapist is actually apart of an Australian study on psychedelics atm, so I might ask if I can trial them too!

I joined my state's Psychedelic society and attend a weekly meeting with a number of the members who are in recovery (mental health or any type of addiction) and its really interesting how much psychedelics make a difference in people's lives. 

Looks like there is Aussie Psychedelic Society,  maybe check it out?

[grumpydonut]

I'll ask my therapist next time I'm in. I don't think the use of psychedelics has been approved in Aus yet (my impression was that this was the point of my therapist's research) but I'll definitely ask.

[ILMBPDC]

I'll ask my therapist next time I'm in. I don't think the use of psychedelics has been approved in Aus yet (my impression was that this was the point of my therapist's research) but I'll definitely ask.

Yeah its not technically approved in the US either (I take that back, ketamine is legal in a clinical setting) but there are some states and cities who have decriminalized (shrooms at least) and there are research trials happening all over. Maybe you can get in on a trial?

[lichtermeer]

Dear Poppy,

the way you're reflecting yourself and the situation seems very calm and collected.
I absolutely get the physical part. I had my first time with a woman with my bpdex and of course it's the only comparison that we have in cases like this.
Plus: Don't forget that the relationship to her got you on natural drugs. Your hormones got addicted to her chaos, which made physical intimacy to her feel like using substance. After a toxic relationship the brain needs about 6 weeks - as I heard- only for normalizing the hormone balance- not to let alone the mental aspects.

You crave connection and a stable relationship and this is actually a good trait. I suspect that you are loyal af! But like many others said so often in this forum, and as you know already, the relationship with yourself comes first. And the way you're setting your goals to heal and take care of yourself is the only and absolute right way. You are so loved already.