Flakiness and BPD

[guitarguy09]

I have a general question. My uBPDw tends to be kind of a flake on commitments for get togethers or just in general. She would drive my sisters nuts (and subsequently away) when she would make plans with them and then cancel for reasons like winter weather (we live in a typically snowy area), or one time where she wanted to ride the bus a decent distance to save money when we had a perfectly working car. She has also cancelled on other friends, and seems to like to find an excuse to get out of stuff when she thinks she can. However, whenever I bring something like that up, she accuses me of not believing her and being against her. Does this sound familiar to anyone? The most recent thing is that she wants to cancel our trip to see my friend and his wife a couple of states away because she's currently mad at him for suggesting that I can still have a good relationship with my parents (a different topic).

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[joethemechanic]

Yeah, mine drives me nuts by making plans and then backing out of them. I never know if she is going to follow through until she is here. It's really making life difficult.

[ATLandon]

YES! I've learned over the years to plan carefully and make absolutely certain that I can make sure I can commit to something (with or without my wife). She has very severe anxiety when it comes to being in groups of people, such as dinner parties, black tie events, or even just friendly/family get together. As a result I lost a lot of money on deposits and gifts for others that I had to cancel last minute because she freaked out and told me she never wanted to attend all along. Its frustrating to say the least.

[ATLandon]

Additionally, and perhaps off the wall a bit but this post reminded me of one of my favorite songs which perfectly sums up my relationship with my uBPDw, "Flake" by Jack Johnson.

"It seems to me that, 'Maybe,'

Pretty much always means no

So don't tell me you might just let it go

And often times we're lazy

It seems to stand in my way

Cause no one NO not no one

Likes to be let down"

[bruceli]

With pwPD... . always have a plan B.

[misssouthernbelle]

I have a general question. My uBPDw tends to be kind of a flake on commitments for get togethers or just in general. She would drive my sisters nuts (and subsequently away) when she would make plans with them and then cancel for reasons like winter weather (we live in a typically snowy area), or one time where she wanted to ride the bus a decent distance to save money when we had a perfectly working car. She has also cancelled on other friends, and seems to like to find an excuse to get out of stuff when she thinks she can. However, whenever I bring something like that up, she accuses me of not believing her and being against her. Does this sound familiar to anyone? The most recent thing is that she wants to cancel our trip to see my friend and his wife a couple of states away because she's currently mad at him for suggesting that I can still have a good relationship with my parents (a different topic).

WOW. You hit the nail on the head. I think this is the one thing that drives me the most insane! He will text me wanting to come over, but will talk himself out of it, or put it off until he can "muster up the courage" to do it, as he always reminds me how hard meeting face-to-face or talking on the phone is for him. Yet, he never comes through. I really contemplate whether he really wants to get over this "safe zone" of only texting people and not meeting face-to-face. I've offered to help - and he wants to come - but he never does.

Once I caught him in a bold-face lie one time, he used the "Thanks for believing in me" because he denied it to my face. Pity ploy and guilt trip. It's so hard to shut off your empathy to those, even though you know what they are.

Maybe one day he can get the courage up to see me again.

[RedRose15]

This happens to me so much and no matter how many times it does, i still get the feeling of disappointment, and it hurts.

It actually happened yesterday. We had nothing planned and I thought it would be nice to do something together.  I said do you want to go to the beach today?  He thought for a moment, then said yeah that sounds good.  I've just got to go out and do a few things first and I'll ring you in one hour.

Then about two hours later, he didn't ring, he texted me and said "Sweetness sorry, I hate wasting my life away, but I'm not able to do the beach, I love you".  No matter how many times he does this, it still hurts that he can be so unreliable.  How hard is it to be honest if he you don't feel like doing something or can't afford it, to talk about it with your partner.  It just makes me feel insignificant, like only if he's in the mood for me can we do something.

[djblazer]

My pwBPD has always been a huge flake. The worst part is, he often enthusiastically makes plans, informs everyone of the plan, gets a group of people excited about it, and then lets it drop, or just doesn't show up himself. Then he withdraws for a while until everyone forgets about it, and the cycle begins again. I always try not to believe him and get my hopes up, but I can't help being disappointed every single time.

[waverider]

What I witness is it is almost impulsiveness to a level that makes them unstable in commitments.

An inability to weigh up the pros and cons simultaneously, balance them out and come up with a considered opinion depending were the "grey" result is weighted. Rather they think of a pro... so impulsively lock a "yes" in, later a con pops into their head resulting in a "no", lack of empathy will not make them worry about the inconvenience to others.

With my partner it can go yes/no/yes/no/yes/no many times. I have learned to have a plan about what I am going to do, and be prepared to having to implement it regardless of what she wants to do (It's my life too). Also I have learned not to "debate" the merits of each individual decision, as it leads to a needless conflict, when it would probably be overridden anyway.

The worst area is she is always making a song and dance about needing specialist medical appointments, then when the day arrives, can't be bothered getting dressed so just doesn't go. Normally takes 3 rescheduled appointments before she turns up.

Just started radiotherapy for breast cancer. 5 days a week for 5 weeks, and tonight 3 days into the 25 she has just announced to me she's not going to any more. Temptation is to try to talk sense into her, but the reality is in the morning it may all be different again.

Complete lack of consistency in anything makes her effectively non functional. That why I dont push for therapy anymore, even when she wants to, as she just wont show.

[guitarguy09]

What I witness is it is almost impulsiveness to a level that makes them unstable in commitments.

This sums it up very nicely. My uBPDw is very impulsive. Last week she had me make a reservation for a nice dinner at one of our favorite restaurants (more expensive kind). Since then, she has told me she cancelled it, then it's back on, then she doesn't want to go, to it's back on again. I think we are actually gonna go now, but it just goes to show such a lack of being able to commit.

Thanks for all the responses! It's nice to know I'm not alone in this.

[guitarguy09]

joethemechanic - That's just it. Until we actually do something or literally is hours before, it is hard to know if we will actually follow through.

ATLandon - We haven't been married too many years, so I'm sure as the years go on I will have to accept that I will have to be able to follow through when my wife does not want to go. I want to keep my good reputation and not be looked at as a flake as well. Those are good lyrics in that song, so true 

bruceli - Learning that more and more!

misssouthernbelle - Thanks. I can definitely relate to the texting thing. It seems like my uBPDw will only text almost everyone except for her mom and a few close friends. When we were on good terms with my family, she would always insist that I call my mom, even if it was something she wanted to talk to her about. She would drive her dad nuts because he would love to get a phone call but she always insisted on texting him. Thank God that I have a good relationship with her side of the family so at least we have some family stability. Her dad just recently is finally realizing that she may not be able to help some of her behavior and has taken a compassionate view. Her mom has also taken a pretty compassionate view, and understands that she needs to seek help but needs to want to do it first.

RedRose15 - I totally get that. I get a lump in my stomach whenever I have to cancel plans we have made, no matter how serious or silly they are.

djblazer - Wow, it sucks when it affects a big group of people like that. It's like they like the feeling of getting everyone excited but then discover that they're not able to follow through at the end which is just a bigger letdown than if they didn't say anything to begin with.

[joethemechanic]

Those are good lyrics in that song, so true 

My little BPD Snowflake just said "Maybe" about plans for tonight. I texted her those lyrics and a link to the song.

I really think she does it to keep me from going out. It is a way of keeping me from making plans with anyone else or going anywhere where I might meet a woman.

[guitarguy09]

Those are good lyrics in that song, so true 

My little BPD Snowflake just said "Maybe" about plans for tonight. I texted her those lyrics and a link to the song.

I really think she does it to keep me from going out. It is a way of keeping me from making plans with anyone else or going anywhere where I might meet a woman.

Ain't that the truth! Mine loves to storm out and go somewhere at night, leaving me to take care of our little boy (about 2). It must be nice to just be able to take off whenever you feel like it.

[Wrongturn1]

I can soo relate to this flakiness problem.    uBPDw does this ALL THE TIME.  She frequently makes plans and then flakes out at the last minute, either manufacturing some excuse not to go, or just refusing to go b/c she does not feel like it.  What I find particularly annoying is that she wants me to be just as flakey as she is, expecting me to co-cancel with her if we have made plans with a group of people, or even worse, to last-minute cancel my own plans with others, even when those plans are as wholesome as church music rehearsal.  This crosses a major boundary with me as I make it a point to follow through with my commitments always (one of the major reasons I'm still married at this point and have not left).  So I have started making double sure to keep all of my personal commitments and try to find ways to keep my part of joint commitments even when she bails out at the last minute.

The likely issues here IMO are the BPD fear of judgment/invalidation and resulting aversion to social situations and black and white thinking.  If they are 95% in favor of following through on a commitment, oftentimes that 5% internal opposition wins out because to someone with BPD, anything less than 100% white equals black, if that makes sense.

[guitarguy09]

I can soo relate to this flakiness problem.    uBPDw does this ALL THE TIME.  She frequently makes plans and then flakes out at the last minute, either manufacturing some excuse not to go, or just refusing to go b/c she does not feel like it. 

That is so true. Not feeling like doing something is such an overused excuse by my wife. Like for instance, on Saturday if she's mad at my family, Saturday night or Sunday morning she might decide that she's not going to go to church because she's "doesn't want to do God any favors because he hasn't done any for her".

Good for you for sticking to your guns on commitments.

[waverider]

I really think she does it to keep me from going out. It is a way of keeping me from making plans with anyone else or going anywhere .

This is important, whether it is deliberate or not, the effect is the same. It sabotages our life, we can end up doing nothing, feeling resentment and then that comes out somewhere else.

The are two things to consider:

Firstly you do what you have decided to do without them.

Secondly dont rearrange your schedule to accommodate their impulsive plans, if you do and then they cancel/delay your whole day gets disrupted for no reason. Reduce the ripple effect. This is hard to do but it is important to focus on, or your life will end up in the pending basket

[Stalwart]

Absolutely have the same experience as everyone else here with her waivering committments, particulary when it comes to my family obligations. Her's not so bad.

I've learned to have the plan B and it's alright if she doesn't want to go. I'll validate her reason to the best of my ability and tell her "It's all right" but I'll also in some cases try to compromise. I understand you find it really boring and stressful because you don't like or know some of the people. I'm in the same boat with you not liking or knowing some of the people. How about if we only pop in for an hour or two instead of spending the whole afternoon or night. I really try and promote her mingling with my children and grandchildren and for the most part that works. I've validated her reasons for not wanting to go and also been able to tell her that I totally understand her feelings. It usually works. If not, I'm on my own and go anyway, tell her I love her and I'll be back soon, really hope you have a good day.

The other flaky thing that really embarasses me and urks me is being late for professional appointments we both attend, even when I know she is going to be late for a personal appointment she's made with other people I try to hurry her along. If we have to meet after my work at an appointment I continuously find myself making excuses for her being late. She has no regard for making some one else wait for her and I'm the opposite - I HAVE to be on time. But we all have our differences and I also recognize this habit isn't restricted to people with this challenge.

Love the person - hate the illness.

[waverider]

The other flaky thing that really embarasses me and urks me is being late for professional appointments we both attend, even when I know she is going to be late for a personal appointment she's made with other people I try to hurry her along. If we have to meet after my work at an appointment I continuously find myself making excuses for her being late. She has no regard for making some one else wait for her and I'm the opposite - I HAVE to be on time.

 So over this aspect, seams like I spend my life pacing up and down waiting. Even whens she's called the paramedics she insists they wait while she goes sit on the back step for a smoke. Like their time has no value.

There never seems to be any real reason I can see either. She is just like a time sponge

There is nothing I have found can change this, if someone has the golden answer please do tell. It makes everyone late. It is something I struggle to just accept.

[KateCat]

Just started radiotherapy for breast cancer. 5 days a week for 5 weeks, and tonight 3 days into the 25 she has just announced to me she's not going to any more. Temptation is to try to talk sense into her, but the reality is in the morning it may all be different again.

Complete lack of consistency in anything makes her effectively non functional. That why I dont push for therapy anymore, even when she wants to, as she just wont show.

My goodness, waverider.

It had never occurred to me that "empathy" could be an important tool in a person's fight against serious illness. But really, a lot of times people do soldier on through difficult treatments in part because they can "feel the feelings" of their medical team and their family members, don't they? They can appreciate what people are doing and feeling for them, and they can make an extra effort to hang in there.

I think you're doing everything exactly right and can only add my wishes that things will improve soon.

[LifeIsBeautiful]

My experience is that they can be late or cancel, but if you do it hells breaks lose. My schedule is now centered around hers and that's what she wants exactly.

[waverider]

My experience is that they can be late or cancel, but if you do it hells breaks lose. My schedule is now centered around hers and that's what she wants exactly.

The problem is you can't even to stick to this revised schedule as hers can be cancelled/changed at last minute, throwing this revised version into chaos. The result is your life become non functional as you struggle to do the things you intend to do.