She has to go back...

[lbjnltx]

I would be remiss if I did not bring to light that the level of parental involvement in the prior RTC you describe is minimal.

When my d was in RTC this was the schedule of parental involvement:

4 Books family must read alongside child.

Weekly family therapy over the phone with her individual therapist.

Weekly family therapy over the phone with the group therapist.

Weekly calls home (monitored).

Once the privilege is earned: emailing home weekly.

Family weekend every 3 months where parents participate in individual and group with and without child, parents meet with educational director and experiential therapist,  (in our case it was the equine therapy director), consult with psychiatrist.

Monthly treatment team meetings and reports sent to parents.

Once earned:  off campus day visit

                     off campus overnight visit (in vicinity of facility)

                     home visit (short)

                     home visit (long)

The most common mistake parents make in RTC placement is looking for a local facility.  Looking for the best facility that can help our child/our family is #1 regardless of location (within reason). 

Sometimes we have limits on our options, limits dictated by funding, insurance, etc.  That is why I ask if the field is open for placement. 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Eyeamme]

Exactly! I think you got it! Hugs.

[raytamtay3]

Sometimes we have limits on our options, limits dictated by funding, insurance, etc.  That is why I ask if the field is open for placement. 

No, it isn't.

[Kwamina]

Hi raytamtay3

I am glad you got to talk to her case manager. Given the way her behavior is escalating, it is clear that certain drastic steps are necessary to help get her back on track. It is sad that things are the way they are, but given the reality of what's going on, some action seems highly advisable.

This is a horrible situation to be in, yet I still want to urge you not to be too hard on yourself. We all make mistakes and looking back at things it's always easy to say what we should have done better. You letting your daughter come back home was an act of love and also showed your hope for a better tomorrow. Unfortunately things didn't work out quite as you had hoped. What's done is done, the most important thing is that we try to learn from any mistakes we might have made and try to do better now and moving forward.

But DD needs to take responsibility for hers too.  I am no longer allowing myself (today - at this very moment anyway) to take on the guilt for something that she has done to herself.  She had the opportunity to come home and live the "normal teenage life" that she wanted. She chose to put herself in the situation where she has to go back out of home.  Yes she did make some progress. But she is not fully capable of keeping herself out of harms way with the risky behaviors that she still chooses to do.

You are right that your daughter has made some very unfortunate choices. All these choices are made within the context of her being disordered and that context clearly does influences her decision process. She is responsible for her choices but she didn't choose to be disordered. She's till very young and that she did make some progress is encouraging and hopefully she'll be able to get herself back on track once she gets the help she needs.

I now chose to put her back to protect her from herself again and I'm ready to deal with that guilt rather the highly potential guilt of getting a knock at my door that they found my beautiful little girl murdered, raped, beaten, etc. knowing that I did nothing to stop it... .

Sometimes guilt is fear in disguise. Sometimes we have to remind ourselves that it's best to do something anyway even when we feel guilty about taking a particular action. Our feelings of guilt, as strong and real as they may be, might not always be an accurate reflection of what's going on. Feeling guilty does not necessarily mean we are guilty, yet since it's your daughter it's totally understandable and natural that sending her away triggers such strong emotions in you. Making this hard decision of sending her away to get help, is an act of love too though.

Take care

[lbjnltx]

Sometimes we have limits on our options, limits dictated by funding, insurance, etc.  That is why I ask if the field is open for placement. 

No, it isn't.

Do you have options or is she placed according to the agency's recommendation?  Was the last RTC a county facility?

[raytamtay3]

Thank you everybody for always being so supportive and non-judgmental of me and our situation.

DD is spiraling for sure.  I received a text from her moments ago that she was on her way by bus to her father's in PA (we live in NJ).  I told her she did not have consent to do so. She said she had her father's.  I contacted her father who said she did ask to come over by bus but that he said no; that he would get her tomorrow.

She told me she needed a break from NJ.  Said how she has no friends now in NJ "because you bugged out and nobody wants to talk to me anymore".  I'm guessing the "friends" she's made in the past 3 months since coming back from the RTC, were all in on whatever has been going on, and bailed when they saw her crazy mom  finding things out. Well good. Why were 18 - 20+ year olds hanging with a 16 year old anyway?

DD has not talked to her father more than twice since coming home. He said he's called her and she's always getting him off the phone in less than a minute saying she's out with friends. She must sense something is up and the cycle is repeating. She is going to try and get him to feel sorry for her again knowing that the only time she bothers with him is when she's in trouble with me. It's unreal. I'm not angry or upset that she's going to see him. I'm upset that I'm going to have both her and him now guilting me when I send her back. She has him listed as "sperm donor" in her phone.  It's still amazes me how the cycles repeat!

Her therapist at the RTC had said that with DD, if she does something wrong, she gives up and will keep upping the anty figuring why not, I F'd up anyway. So sad.  :'(   This illness blows.

[Kate4queen]

I think you are doing exactly what needs to be done, and you should be proud of yourself for being so strong for her when she cannot be.

[infiniteeyes]

Hey there

My DD also runs to her dad when the going gets tough despite her animosity towards him. The sperm donor bit did make me chuckle a little 

Fortunately for me though her Dad is on the same page as me although he sees her as being manipulative rather than having a mental illness. I guess he hasn't done his research!

I know its difficult but try to see the silver lining. At least you know where she is and maybe its for the best that she puts some distance between herself and her "friends". Also this gives you a good opportunity to get things organised for her return to RTC next week?

Yes your therapist sounds spot on - She will up the anti until something gives.

It makes me wonder if your DD wants to go back. Deep down perhaps. I wondered the same thing with my girl too. She knew that if her behaviors continued she would be sent away. That was made very clear to her and yet she continued and in fact worse. I suppose that sounds logical to me. I don't think our DD's see things so clearly. Not yet, but don't give up hope.

Is there not anything you can do for yourself over the next day or two? Treat yourself, catch up on some well-needed (I'm sure) rest. Try to gather your thoughts and carry on. Best foot forward.

Thinking on you, you're doing fantastic 

[raytamtay3]

Thanks again everyone. I agree that this weekend would be a nice respite for everyone in the house. All I wanted to do was come home early from work today and take a nice nap and be held with my Dh as he and I had discussed before learning of my DD leaving. But when I got home I was met with anger from DH when I said I was not calling tbe police when he said I should becauseshe shouldnt be allowed to continue to do what she wants, i.e, taking off to PA. I tried to explain how exhausted I am and he just smirked and walked away. I then went to take a nap alone while he chose to use the sofa (he gets passive aggressive - yeah me), and i just woke up.  I totally understand how frusterated and angry he is with Dd seeing her attack me and everything Wednesday night. But I need this brake too. Anyway, we have video cameras in our home. Common areas only. DH reviewed it when he got home and heard Dd saying she was leaving for a week. Well that isnt happening though, and I will be contacting her and her father about bringing her home Sunday. Next week is a meeting to discuss options (RTC) with her CM. Its not when DD will be going I dont think. It takes more time than that.  

[Kwamina]

Hi again raytamtay3

Is your daughter with her father now and have you spoken to them?

Great that you've been able to schedule a meeting with her casemanager to discuss options for RTC

I too understand your husband's frustration and anger, yet it's still unfortunate that you also had to deal with that on top of what's going on with your daughter. How are things now between the two of you?

Was this the first time you got into a physical altercation with your daughter or has this happened before? Do you generally feel physically safe around her?

Dealing with threats of suicide also ins't easy. I know from previous posts you made that your daughter at least in the past used to cut herself and expressed thoughts of suicide in her journal. Has she ever explicitly threatened suicide before as she's done now?

[raytamtay3]

kwamina - First let me begin by saying how flattered I am that you took the time to read our struggles! Thank you for that. Dh and I are doing better.He went fishing today with his buddy, and Im very happy he did as it allows him the opportunity to blow off steam, and as it turned out, his bass pro idol who lives kind of near us,  was on the river too! So he got the opportunity to  even talk to him! Pretty cool. Dd and i have communicated via text, but it was only after I textd her bff to check to make sure she got there ok, with DD texting me that if I wanted to know something about her, to text her. My ex, her father, is being his normal... .not very nice self... .causing even more problems which is the normal cycle. I decided not to allow myself to get swepped up in the dysfunction, and tried to have a calm day by taking my anxiousness and anxiety out on my house, which is pretty damn clean right now, which Im loving. Lol. Thanks for checking in. Dd will never admit what she has done, and will continue to deflect and act like she is mad and offended I should accuse her of such a thing. I know what I heard.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[raytamtay3]

Im not a very supersticious (sp?) person, but for the love of God, there were 666 views on this thread, that I had to post again ( or could have just read my post), as I cant take any chances! My sad attempt at humor.  

[Kwamina]

Great that both you and your husband haven gotten the chance to at least somewhat relax after those turbulent few days. Awesome that he got to meet his idol, I hope he wasn't too starstruck  Also awesome how you managed to use your anxiety in a productive way resulting in an ultra clean house

Sorry to hear your ex is not being very nice. Fortunately this situation is temporary and hopefully your daughter will soon be getting the help she needs.

PS.

I understand, you gotta do what you gotta do to maximize your chances! It were just 666 post reads though and not actual posts but still nice that you made another post Your personal post count is now already at 652 though and getting very close to that dreaded number

[raytamtay3]

What a day. Too long to type, but DD is home safe tonight. Trying to decide on a punishment for taking off to pa without my consent. DH thinks I should ground her. Thoughts? And also, if u agree, for what duration?

[raytamtay3]

Hi again raytamtay3

Was this the first time you got into a physical altercation with your daughter or has this happened before? Do you generally feel physically safe around her?

I forgot to answer this question.  She got physical with me once before, prior to her going in to RTC.  She pushed me around. Had never swung at me like last week. She was swinging at me and pushing me around. I thought I blocked all of her hits, but my DH looked at the vide and said she got at least three punches to my face and head. She also pulled out my hair and the horrible marks are finally fading from my neck.  I did take pictures of my neck.  I didn't have any visible bruises on my face, but the right side of my head and jaw hurt.  I have never gotten in to a physical altercation ever in my life.  I felt like I was hit by a truck the next day... . 

She took picture of what she alleges I did to her mouth (fat lip).  I know for a fact I did not connect when I went to block her punch.  Have it on video too.  The older she gets, the more conniving she gets and the more afraid I get of her, to be honest.  She blacks out when she rages.  That scares me.

[Kwamina]

I can see why this type of behavior from your daughter would scare you so. BPD rages can be very scary and that she blacks out and doesn't remember what she does is concerning (and scary) too.

As far as grounding her, I agree that it is important that she understands that there will be consequences when she acts out like this. I am not certain if grounding her would in the long run also be the most effective strategy here, it might be but it's a difficult decision. Considering the bigger issue that's going on, perhaps it would be more effective to focus on getting her back to that RTC. Have you been able to talk to her? Perhaps after having talked to her it will be easier for you to decide what would be the best next move.

[raytamtay3]

We haven't spoken about what happened.  Just casual conversation.

I just had a very disturbing conversation with her CM though.  Prior to her coming out of the RTC, I specifically asked him if I would have to go through the same thing (calling the police on her to build a case) if things didn't work out.  He said no... .Now he just told me I do.  I can't go though all this crap again! I am beside myself.  :'(

His supervisor wants to meet with my daughter, my husband and me this week.

[raytamtay3]

I cannot believe that due to my own stupidity, we are back to square one! I am so stupid!

I told her she was grounded for taking off to PA without my permission, and she said no she isn't. That her father gave her permission. That I'm looking for any excuse to start with her. How she's begging me to stop.  That I'm trying to make things the way there were before she went away the first time. That I busted her lip and that she has pictures to prove it. WOW I cannot believe I have to go through all this again!  She's blowing up my phone via text.  Saying she knows how I know how she goes ballistic when she gets grounded for things she didn't even do. Still contending her father said she could go there. He's telling me he said he would pick her up Saturday and not to take the bus Friday.  He called me every name in the book when I had asked him to at least pick her medicine up on Saturday after he claimed he didn't get my message but than later said how he was on his way to my house until DD said she already had her medicine and I called him out on his lie... .I'm back in the twilight zone between the two of them!

[raytamtay3]

I cannot believe that due to my own stupidity, we are back to square one! I am so stupid!

I told her she was grounded for taking off to PA without my permission, and she said no she isn't. That her father gave her permission. That I'm looking for any excuse to start with her. How she's begging me to stop.  That I'm trying to make things the way there were before she went away the first time. That I busted her lip and that she has pictures to prove it. WOW I cannot believe I have to go through all this again!  She's blowing up my phone via text.  Saying she knows how I know how she goes ballistic when she gets grounded for things she didn't even do. Still contending her father said she could go there. He's telling me he said he would pick her up Saturday and not to take the bus Friday.  He called me every name in the book when I had asked him to at least pick her medicine up on Saturday after he claimed he didn't get my message but than later said how he was on his way to my house until DD said she already had her medicine and I called him out on his lie... .I'm back in the twilight zone between the two of them!

UPDATE: Spoke to DD and gave her a reprieve from the grounding stating that going forward, she is to check with me first before doing such things. The only reason I reneged is because of her damn father apparently telling her it was ok (even though he denies it - I do not trust him that he didn't). Now they both know they are to check with me first. Now it's been made clear. Jesus fargon Christmas. Why do you have to spell out every single thing to these people? It's exhausting!  My DH agreed that this once, it's ok to let it go.  I feel like I need him to tell me how to handle some things now because I feel I keep screwing up.  She should still be grounded for assaulting me. But I did tell her that if she ever puts her hands on me again she will be arrested and she responded, ok.  Not in her typical yeah whatever tone either. I believe she knows she did wrong. Or at least hope so.

Back to square one. Holy mother of God please help me survive this for the next year and... .9 months (18).

[raytamtay3]

Do you want to hear just how screwed up I am? I'm sitting here wishing I never said anything about what I heard to DD! That none of this would have happened if I didn't open my mouth? How I really damaged our relationship now. How maybe I didn't hear what I thought I heard? Me, me, me... .Do you see just how people with these disorder make us second guess ourselves and make us feel like we are the disordered one? WOW.  Venting here... .

Someone, please, tell me I what I wrote about what I heard (which is 100% truth) has to be what I suspect was going on. Tell me I'm not crazy? Tell me that no, I shouldn't have to apologize to DD (she's demanding an apology now).  I'm literally going insane here. I honestly don't know how much more I can take.  I wish I wasn't such a nice person like people tell me I shouldn't. It would make my life so much easier if I wasn't. Ugh.

I want to run away. 

[Eyeamme]

Listen to me. No really you gotta hear this. You have got to give yourself a break. You are doing the best you can. I know what you are going through. My daughter is 34 years old and I have been going through this for over 25 years. I bet you are doing what I did. You just can't listen to her and it is impossible to do anything but keep the peace. I know.

It took me until now to be able to hold my ground. It resulted in losing my daughter and grandkids. It is ok though because I have me back. You need to really get your mind around that your daughter is sick and you are struggling. You need to take care of you.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[raytamtay3]

Thanks Eye.  

As smart as I think my DD is sometimes, she's also pretty dumb. I just googled her name... .And she posted a video on instagram mouthing the words to some rap song holding about 8 $20s in her hand 24 hours ago.  I know I'm not the crazy one.

You know what. You are right. There comes a time when you just have to let go. It's not really given up on them. It's just resigning to the fact that I tried with her and until she realizes she has a problem, nothing I do is going to change it, and I need to protect my sanity. I'm done. I just can't do it anymore.  Come on 18!

[Eyeamme]

You can do this. Listen to music, take a walk, talk to a favorite friend. You will get through this.

[Kwamina]

I think it might help to not focus too much on the results of your actions but more on the process through which you try to achieve the best results as possible. You cannot control the outcome of your actions, you cannot control how your daughter or anyone else will behave or respond, but what you can control is what you do yourself, the process. Just keep doing the best you can do with the knowledge and skills you have, sometimes this will lead to the desired results and sometimes it won't. We cannot control the outcome but we can control the process of our own actions through which we try to achieve results. We have no guarantee that we will get the results we want, but by focusing on the process we will be able to maximize the chances of achieving desired results.

[raytamtay3]

Things have been relatively calm since the big blow up late week.  What's really odd is DD is blaming her friends for them not talking to her now... .not me anymore.  She had text me last week when she was on her way to PA saying she had to get a way from our town for a while so she can see her real friends in PA because she no longer has any friends in our town after I "bugged out".  She has been home every day and night since and I can tell she is going stir crazy (I must say, I am very tense when she's in the home just waiting for her usual badgering. Monday night it was badgering about wanting to get a puppy who will give her unconditional love and how it would keep her off the streets too).  However, she was talking with me last night asking about when the Youth One Stop Program is going to start as she wants to begin it and "not be one of those people who sit around doing nothing all day". She also called me today asking if I could give her the number to our Dr. to talk to them about alternatives to the birth control she currently uses as she feels like she's going crazy since being on it.  She's taking the initiative in other words, which is great.  

We are suppose to set up a day to meet with her CM and supervisor next week.  I decided against this week because I have my son, and I don't want him exposed to what could potentially be a rage when DD finds out we contacted her CM about what happened last week. He's already seen and heard too much in his 8 years.

[raytamtay3]

nevermind

[infiniteeyes]

Hey Raytamtay3

Good to hear things have been relatively calm. Do you think perhaps DD had got a notion that you were thinking of sending her back? And that is why she is "behaving"?

Either way glad things have calmed down for you. Although your post "nevermind" has me wondering?

x

[raytamtay3]

Although your post "nevermind" has me wondering?

x

Nah - was just having an emotional day and decided not to post about it. Thanks!

[raytamtay3]

Hey Raytamtay3

Good to hear things have been relatively calm. Do you think perhaps DD had got a notion that you were thinking of sending her back? And that is why she is "behaving"?

Either way glad things have calmed down for you.

I'm not sure but whatever the reason, I'll take it!

[raytamtay3]

So it seems as if the few friends DD had are jumping ship on her as others before her have, and from what's she's told me, which is little, it isn't even because of what went down between her and I.  Although DD says it was a domino affect due to my "bugging out" that got the wheels in motion.  Turns out the girl who DD had befriended when coming out of RTC for the past two months (out 3 but was friends with this girl for two), is airing all of DD's dirty laundry to her other friends.  Basically telling them how DD used them.  I do feel bad that DD's illness affects her friendships, but it's true, she does use people.  She told me so herself. Hell we all know she uses me!  There is only one friend (transgender doll I love) that has stood by her side, but she lives in PA.  

Now DD has her sites on getting her permit... .she wants to take a driving course as an x-mas present.  :)H is against it saying how she cannot use my car and that she will try and wear me down to use my car when she gets her license, or try and steal my keys to take my car.  Why does EVERYTHING have to be an issue? I've already told DD she cannot use my car.  I was actually considering this as a gift, but now DH has me second guessing this. And I'm sure once again DD will blow a gasket as I "never get her what she wants for Xmas".  Mind you previous requests have been a tongue ring, tattoo, etc.   Uh, no.

DH is also upset because DD is using candles in her room and he has a phobia of candles and told me either I tell her to get rid of them, or he will throw them away. She's been trying to set up her room to look really nice.  Never ending. I did buy her some flameless scented candles for Xmas.

It's just so stressful trying to keep the peace. And I'm so sick of second guessing myself. Truth be told, sometimes I'd rather just separate until DD is 18 and I she can legally leave the house so as to avoid the constant tension between DH and DD. I understand how he feels. I get it. But I also feel put in the middle all the time.  I just don't need the added stress.  Just venting... .