Communication between parents from child's viewpoint

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hi everyone,

Really have to give a quick background before explaining the issue at hand.

Basically, divorced from high functioning BPD.  Countless lies, broken promises, nastiness and unreasonableness has occurred since the split (and before but that's another story).  For example just in the last 12 months ex has accused me of sexually abusing our child, ex and her father have both threatened to have me killed, and ex has lied on oath in our property settlement proceedings (the outcome being that ex got everything as well as a lump sum payment from me).  I'm starting again in the red while she has the house, contents, cash, everything - it's a long story but it's the pits of betrayal and unscrupulousness.  Fair to say I've been through hell but keep a smile on my face for my child, who lives with me nearly 50%.

When the property proceedings began, ex informed me that from now on she only wanted communication from me via email or text.  I have respected her wishes, even if being tempted to call her and say "how can you do this (lie and ruin me financially)?"  Basically as usual I feel like I've done the right thing by her even while the wrong thing is being done to me.

My child asked recently why his mum and dad don't talk, and I explained to him that mum asked me not to talk to her.  He asked why and I said I don't know.  (Both truthful answers).  He said it was nice of me to do what his mum wanted.

My son and I have a very close bond.

Fast forward to the issue.

As my son had a medical issue, my ex and I recently attended a medical appointment with our son, together.  Afterwards my son said to me "I've worked something out", and basically based on the time my ex and I were in each others company, he concluded that his mum makes more of an effort to get along with me than I do with her.  It's true his mum was more of a conversationalist with me than I was to her, although I wasn't rude at all.  But the background was that just days before she had "won" the property case (winning is very important to her and the ends justifies the means) and was likely feeling quite satisfied and upbeat with it all, whereas I wasn't in the place to be overly friendly because of what she has done to me.

The problem is that all of sudden my son seems to think it's me that's caused the problems, and as far as he's reasoned, "mum was nice to dad at the appointment".  I feel for my son as he's still just trying to make sense of the split and his parents' dynamic.  I don't blame him for anything but at the same time I didn't know and still don't know how to respond to his comments and feelings.  He's only 10yo and not old enough to be told everything that has happened.  I don't know if I'm being overly-sensitive but it seems like the first time he's actually questioning me and it's quite unnerving.  I love him more than anything.

I think that now she has won and screwed me over, my ex may now re-open the lines of communication but after everything that's occurred I'd prefer to leave it as no verbal communication. But that's puts me in a bad position when our son wants more than anything for us to "get along" and be "friends".  She is such a manipulator that she might now be going for the "See? I'm the good one." to create questions in his mind about his dad.

I just don't know what to do or how to approach this.  Any thoughts are very welcome.  I'm a little beat up at the moment to be honest. 

[Concord]

Hi everyone,

Really have to give a quick background before explaining the issue at hand.

Basically, divorced from high functioning BPD.  Countless lies, broken promises, nastiness and unreasonableness has occurred since the split (and before but that's another story).  For example just in the last 12 months ex has accused me of sexually abusing our child, ex and her father have both threatened to have me killed, and ex has lied on oath in our property settlement proceedings (the outcome being that ex got everything as well as a lump sum payment from me).  I'm starting again in the red while she has the house, contents, cash, everything - it's a long story but it's the pits of betrayal and unscrupulousness.  Fair to say I've been through hell but keep a smile on my face for my child, who lives with me nearly 50%.

When the property proceedings began, ex informed me that from now on she only wanted communication from me via email or text.  I have respected her wishes, even if being tempted to call her and say "how can you do this (lie and ruin me financially)?"  Basically as usual I feel like I've done the right thing by her even while the wrong thing is being done to me.

My child asked recently why his mum and dad don't talk, and I explained to him that mum asked me not to talk to her.  He asked why and I said I don't know.  (Both truthful answers).  He said it was nice of me to do what his mum wanted.

My son and I have a very close bond.

Fast forward to the issue.

As my son had a medical issue, my ex and I recently attended a medical appointment with our son, together.  Afterwards my son said to me "I've worked something out", and basically based on the time my ex and I were in each others company, he concluded that his mum makes more of an effort to get along with me than I do with her.  It's true his mum was more of a conversationalist with me than I was to her, although I wasn't rude at all.  But the background was that just days before she had "won" the property case (winning is very important to her and the ends justifies the means) and was likely feeling quite satisfied and upbeat with it all, whereas I wasn't in the place to be overly friendly because of what she has done to me.

The problem is that all of sudden my son seems to think it's me that's caused the problems, and as far as he's reasoned, "mum was nice to dad at the appointment".  I feel for my son as he's still just trying to make sense of the split and his parents' dynamic.  I don't blame him for anything but at the same time I didn't know and still don't know how to respond to his comments and feelings.  He's only 10yo and not old enough to be told everything that has happened.  I don't know if I'm being overly-sensitive but it seems like the first time he's actually questioning me and it's quite unnerving.  I love him more than anything.

I think that now she has won and screwed me over, my ex may now re-open the lines of communication but after everything that's occurred I'd prefer to leave it as no verbal communication. But that's puts me in a bad position when our son wants more than anything for us to "get along" and be "friends".  She is such a manipulator that she might now be going for the "See? I'm the good one." to create questions in his mind about his dad.

I just don't know what to do or how to approach this.  Any thoughts are very welcome.  I'm a little beat up at the moment to be honest. 

[marbleloser]

I'm going through the same thing.Parental alienation is a real thing,unfortunately. I put our kids in therapy,in part,because of this. You might think about doing the same. Above all else,just have a great time with the kids when you have them.Let them make their own decisions concerning this.It's difficult,I know,but our kids love BOTH parents and they feel caught in the middle as it is.

Let her be the negative one.You be the positive one,for your kids sake.

[mamachelle]

Hi Concord,

I feel for you. I too have noticed that when pwBPD have a win or are energized, they are on top of the world and can appear completely happy and content. They can radiate confidence and good will to others all while completely forgetting/stomping on your feelings. Yes, they forget. Yes they lack empathy. It is so hard when you can not discuss this with your child, who, as your S10 is obviously sensing her enthusiasm and happiness. I don't know when it starts blurring into sociopathic behavior but what you describe certainly feels that way.

There are no easy answers but sometimes it is better to just let questions like that pass if possible. It's not really ignoring, but sometimes the answering of the whys and the wherefores open wounds and seem almost to come from the other parent directly to you.

In fact it is most likely that it is some form of PAS with your ex feeding this stuff to your S10 who then repeats it back to you as a question.

Kids at this age ask a lot of questions. They want answers. However, there is no law that you have to answer them especially when you don't have an answer. I think your answers have been good though. You should look at trying some mindfulness and meditation exercises to learn about dealing with your emotions with her and how your S10 is inadvertantly triggering the same pain. There are some great resources sprinkled throughout the boards here. Not sure how much self work you've been able to accomplish given what you have been through. Posting on the boards here is a good start though.

In my case, I am a non married to a non. We've been married 6 years. Both of us with BPD ex's. Our kids from previous marriages live with us full time at this point. I have 3 SS now 8, 10, and 15 and 2 DD 13 and 16. We also have one child together. S2 Both of our exes live in different states. BPDbio mom is pretty low functioning but does have her Sons in the summer for 6 weeks as well as a few disney weekends throughout the year and school vacations. My exBPDH does not see or have contact with his DD anymore, (thank goodness) except for occasionally contacting them through FBook.

In my 3 SS case, communication "from their viewpoint" between the parents is very little- it has degenerated quite a bit as the boys have grown older and she has moved away. They talk through texts, emails, a few phone calls. SS10 has become something of a go between between parents which is not good as he suffers from possible enmeshment with her. Sometimes I am the go between. I don't think this is the answer, but I do think limiting your contact with her is completely reasonable. My NonH gets physically ill when we have prolonged contact with her. This could be at a birthday party, school event, or trick or treating. Even though he has 90% custody and pays no child support, she has won this in that she does not parent or contribute to their upbringing at all putting all the respsonsibility on us. As a Dad, he finds it very difficult to stomach that she has her entire life free for the most part and he can barely find a few hours here and there to complete work for his job as a professor, write (he's a writer) to get his tenure, or just go see a movie with me... .  

I agree with marbleloser that getting S10 into therapy is a good idea. However, I have recently seen a number of posts about BPDmom's controlling the therapist and using it to their custodial/emotional advantage so proceed cautiously in this area.

You yourself should also be looking at therapy. I think it would help you immensely with processing all that has happened.

I hope this helps a bit. 

[DreamGirl]

My child asked recently why his mum and dad don't talk, and I explained to him that mum asked me not to talk to her.  He asked why and I said I don't know.  (Both truthful answers).  He said it was nice of me to do what his mum wanted.

Nobody has to be to blame - that's the beauty of our world after a relationship with someone with BPD.

It is no longer right and wrong. Black and White. The world gets to be full of color now.  

For me, as a rule of thumb, I always make the issues between the parents mutual.  

I might have responded - "Ah honey, sometimes we just don't get along. We both sure do love you though. Does it upset you that we don't talk?"

The antidote to the other parent's alienating efforts is not to allocate blame to her, which is in turn an alienation effort on our part. The antidote is to tell him that it's OK to love and want to be a part of both his parents lives. That's all a kiddo wants.

He doesn't want or need to be in the middle.

I know you don't want to be nice to your ex-wife. I've plastered on a smile a time or two in front of the kiddos, when all I wanted to do is scowl and stick my tongue out at her actually.

If I'd have been caught being stand-offish toward my stepkiddos' Mama and was challenged with "you should be nicer to Mommy because she was so nice to you... "

I'd simply respond, "You're probably right, we should all try to get along, I'll work on that... .  "

-DG