Documentation

[thisyoungdad]

I am curious how other parents keep accurate documentation of the craziness they deal with? In a notebook? On the calendar? How much detail do they keep and what gets documented? That is my big question does every crazy thing get documented? 

I have been documenting things for 15 months now. It is not really organized but in a few different notebooks. It is very detailed.

I feel like for me, especially since we did the collaborative process, and even though my attorney has been so stern that I document EVERYTHING for this entire time, I wonder why? I feel like she keeps on being crazy with parenting (and forget co parenting I am letting that go) and there are no consequences... .well except my 3 year old really doesn't want to go to mom's... .doesn't want to leave me to go and then when she gets to my house runs to me and almost refuses to even say goodbye to her mom. That makes me sad, and her mom has to really work hard to get a goodbye which honestly makes me feel sad too. My daughter will say goodbye if I really encourage it as mom is trying to get her to do it. I feel bad about that though. It is getting more pronounced this difference. People are telling me it is really becoming clear who she prefers and I know this drives my ex insane with her "I am a bad mom" voices she deals with.

Anyone have experience on either? Thanks

[scraps66]

I have a journal dating back to 2007, it's approaching 400 pages and in an MS-Word format.  I have been thinking of switching to  just a notebook as I feel I'd probably record more with a notebook being easier to access.  Frankly, it may be a case that the several L's I've used felt that business was more profitable without using my journal, it's not been useful at all in court.  Not yet at least.  I am planning a modification of my custody order and the journal will come in handy for substantiating the changes I will demand.

[Nope]

Here is, in my mind, a problem with journals: can you imagine if the pwBPD kept one? It would be chalk full of horrible distortions about you, but that would still be the BPD's experience of those events. So clearly an experience of events is not necessarily fact. Unless you have provable facts to back up those experiences it all still largely falls under "he said, she said".

Even if (like in our first contemp filing) you spend the money and email your L every time something happens that doesn't mean the court will care. Our magistrate called all of our emails to the L after each incident "self-serving".

That being said, having a timeline of connected events may become useful later.

My fiancé's BPDexw once texted him after a particularly nasty phone call saying, "I'm sure you're going to write to your lawyer twisting everything I said. My lawyer will be hearing the truth from me about this." It'll be interesting when that one goes to court as we have it recorded.

[scraps66]

good point.  Corroboration is necessary to at least show that your BP acts in a certain way.  Lying, is an easy one to show as a pattern.  I have numerous e-mails from my ex's mother - also mentally ill, that show that one, there is a strong genital under current here, two, ex is a good example of waht can happen when raised around the mentally ill, and, three, her mother has documented, for me, jsut how bad her daughter is... .

[thisyoungdad]

Yes thankfully I never erase anything I get in email, used to be because of laziness. Now I am SO grateful. She has not sent too much recently that is really that bad, however if I were to take all of what she has sent over the past 16 months and along with my own documentation of situations that occurred either it would show a pattern or in some cases she admits to the behavior but blames me... .like "I made her dohit_" so I have a lot of stuff like that. She has done some crazy stuff in public but it was always around strangers so no help there.

[david]

I only communicate through email and documentation is one of the reasons why.

Sometimes I will receive an email from ex and I have learned to interpret what she is saying. I then write an email and send it to myself. I put it in a folder called predictions. So far I am about 85% correct in my predictions. Her use of projection really helps. I gave some to my atty and he was impressed. He couldn't understand her logic but my prediction was dead on so he figured I was on to something. We have two kids together so no communication is impossible. 

[thisyoungdad]

Yes having kids does make completely breaking away impossible. My lawyer also has mentioned she does not see or understand the logic with my ex all the time. That always makes me feel validated.

I have also become very skilled at interpreting what she is saying and I too am almost always right. People tell me not to make assumptions. I am not making assumptions, I am using my past experience and knowledge. My lawyer has stopped telling me to make assumptions about the ex, I think she see's I am almost always correct.

[Theo41]

I'm not an expert and not a lawyer but I do keep notes. Best way is to keep a file on your computer with an unsuspicious name. I'm an avid baseball fan so I have a file called "baseball rules" Notes are kept by date under this heading.  Example:

Baseball Rules : nov. 6, 13. Today Carrie came running to me because she was frightened by her mother... .

These notes are not excessively detailed but certainly good enough for me to remember what happened and also complete enough for the reader to know without supplemental verbal explanation.

A huge side benefit is that you feel good about having this ( it won't be forgotten ) and that it can be used to effectively communicate to anyone (such as a judge) exactly what is going on and how frequent it is.

The notes are very important to me. Nobody would believe any of this without them. My uBPDw is high functioning and acts very differently outside the privacy of our home most of the time.

[ennie]

I AM a lawyer... .and a step mom of kids with a BPD mom who has a DH who really will not document anything.  I have been with him more than 6 years, through the end of his divorce and a custody battle (the divorce began before we dated with her initiating, and it seemed like a done deal when I came into the picture... .but 2 years later, it was still going strong... .).  Here is my dilemma.  In order for me to be happy, I really need not to focus on all the details of what is going wrong all the time.  We have an adversarial legal system, so for those purposes DH does need to document, and if he does not,  do.  But if we do this all the time, it really impacts the way I see the world--embattled and as a victim of BPD mom's craziness, rather than feeling grateful for my life and for her role, thankfully small, in it.  It is a matter of where I put my attention. 

An example:  SD13 and SD9 are sick.  DH is having a work crisis, so I stayed home with the kids 3 days.  SD13 was due to have an overnight with mom; usually, DH and mom reschedule single overnights with the other parent if a child is really sick, though this is not in the parenting plan, so the kid does not have to transistion so much for a single night.  But mom is going out of town for pleasure the morning after her overnight, so does not want to reschedule.  Another issue is that she loves hospitals, so we know pretty much for sure if SD13 is sick that instead of having a good night's sleep, she will be spending much of the night in the hospital waiting room.  She has a bad cold, with a cough, but no fever or strange symptoms.  So really needs rest, not emergency room.  Plus, at the transition, BPD mom is usually mean and blames DH for illness and says mean inappropriate things to him in front of the kids in violation of the parenting plan.  I may have to do the drop off, so I may be the one dealing with her blame and anger (though she is presently targeting dad, not me).

I could document the mean stuff, even video it. This would create conflict with mom, and would also put me in a state if irritation at all the crazy stuff... .or, I could be grateful for her taking sick SD13, who really is a pain when ill (while SD9 is a joy).  I could be grateful that BPD mom loves illness and loves caring for sick kids... .I prefer fun creative projects, deep conversations with the kids, and parenting through their hard times.  Mommy loves cuddling in bed, feeding them soup, etc.  The kids love being with mommy when sick, of course.  So this is great.  The truth is, SD13 will probably come back more sick because mommy lets her have lots of sugar and takes her to the emergency room instead of resting, because all the drama is stressful... .but I need a break, SD13 is happy, mom is happy, so why not be grateful? 

Feeling so happy in my heart, the transition was no bother.  BPD mom was nice, SD13 told me she loves me as she got out of the car (this year she has been really clingy with mom and while she still acts like she loves me, hugging and requesting special time, she has stopped saying it perhaps because she is being disloyal to mom if she does... .).  I drove off to have my first day in 7 days where I have some time alone!  YAY!  I am not about to go sit down and write up the last 4 things mom did that we could document. 

So this is DH and my lives right now... .it is either a crisis with mom when we have the kids, where she is all yelling and threats and the kids are wigging out, parental alienation city... .in which case, we are spending our spare moments boning up on good parenting techniques, taking special time with each girl, taking them to counselors, trying to help them cope and us cope, putting loving time into them so they can be kids and process hard feelings another way that saying mommy is perfect, dad sucks, and I am going to run away... .then, the crisis is over and we both are catching up on work, dealing with work crises... .then there is a little time for a rest, and we want to do fun things, not document! 

I spent 2 years during that last custody litigation documenting and drafting statements, organizing testimony from people who call and tell us some new problem.  Now, when someone says, "I think BPD mom was drinking in the morning when she dropped off the kids, as I smelled alcohol on her breath," I might respond, "that is really concerning.  Did you call the police?  What do you intend to do about that?"

I think what I would say, not as an attorney, but as a human being, is that it is important to fight for the kids when necessary, but it is equally important for you to offer them something a BPD parent cannot:  a life that is about much more than fighting, a life that has more peace than conflict, a life where joy prevails. And unless you are great at compartmentalizing, you cannon be plotting and playing at the same time.  Plotting erodes gratitude and joy, and you cannot hide that.  Documenting is part of the war, and kids need peacetime.  So my advice is to make a choice about what you want in terms of custody, and have a timeline.  If you are about to do custody litigation, have a goal and a limit... .how much time, money, and energy you are willing to spend to get how much more custody.  Make sure there is an end time.  Have a good parenting plan in the works, one that deals with details.  Document in advance of this battle.  When the battle is done, be prepared to have the BPD person violate some things, and be prepared to take some action.  After the first few months, have boundaries but do not engage in trying to get the BPD person to be perfect.  She or he is going to violate the plan in a million ways.  If your plan is good, for the big ones, SHE or HE should be documenting... .e.g., she has mandatory therapy, she must report to you.  Or she is supposed to include you in doctor's visits, she gives written notice.  So if she does not document, you have that as evidence even if you did not document, in case of later litigation. 

But get to a point where the war is over, at least for 6 months or a year.  And we have to be the ones to do that, because a person with BPD often cannot.  Pick your battles.  And then let it go. 

[thisyoungdad]

I just saw this, been off here for a while doing some self care. I got on tonight though not in a good spot at all and when I read this, especially with Thanksgiving coming up and dealing with the insanity of my ex, it was exactly what I needed to hear. I feel like I am backing down or giving in or something if I choose to pick my battles, but then again I suppose that the only reason there are battles to pick is because she has to keep that war going. Anyway thanks this was very helpful.

I think what I would say, not as an attorney, but as a human being, is that it is important to fight for the kids when necessary, but it is equally important for you to offer them something a BPD parent cannot:  a life that is about much more than fighting, a life that has more peace than conflict, a life where joy prevails. And unless you are great at compartmentalizing, you cannon be plotting and playing at the same time.  Plotting erodes gratitude and joy, and you cannot hide that.  Documenting is part of the war, and kids need peacetime.  So my advice is to make a choice about what you want in terms of custody, and have a timeline.  If you are about to do custody litigation, have a goal and a limit... .how much time, money, and energy you are willing to spend to get how much more custody.  Make sure there is an end time.  Have a good parenting plan in the works, one that deals with details.  Document in advance of this battle.  When the battle is done, be prepared to have the BPD person violate some things, and be prepared to take some action.  After the first few months, have boundaries but do not engage in trying to get the BPD person to be perfect.  She or he is going to violate the plan in a million ways.  If your plan is good, for the big ones, SHE or HE should be documenting... .e.g., she has mandatory therapy, she must report to you.  Or she is supposed to include you in doctor's visits, she gives written notice.  So if she does not document, you have that as evidence even if you did not document, in case of later litigation. 

But get to a point where the war is over, at least for 6 months or a year.  And we have to be the ones to do that, because a person with BPD often cannot.  Pick your battles.  And then let it go.  [/quote]

[livednlearned]

The most important documentation for me was email and to some extent, text messages. The second-most important documentation was that I entered lots of stuff into Google calendar. All of S12's school appointments, doctor and dentist appointments, time he was with his dad, different incidents that I wanted to make sure were recorded. There's also a way to send Gmail emails to Google calendar, so it helped me organize things chronologically. After the drama settled down, it started to just feel therapeutic almost. I'd get a raging email and then just shoot that sucker over to the calendar. Ta-dah.

Then, when it came time to go to court, or do a deposition, or try to make some order out of the chaos, I just printed out the Google calendar as an "agenda" and everything showed up in chronological order. Having your timeline in order, and knowing what happened when, in what order... .can be super helpful to your peace of mind. You have enough stress and anxiety already, so having all the stuff organized when you need it can go a long way.