lying and BPD

[SlyQQ]

Have read quite a few posts it seems to some extent people in relationships with there BPD are not familiar with " gaslighting " I believe it is very important to familiarize yourself with this technique if you are to have a real chance of surviving a BPD relationship

[Infern0]

Yup.

Second guess everything you are told and trust your gut instincts.

If you think it's BS it probably is.

[Lucky One]

Have read quite a few posts it seems to some extent people in relationships with there BPD are not familiar with " gaslighting "

I believe it is very important to familiarize yourself with this technique if you are to have a real chance of surviving a BPD relationship

Trust only a Few

But I also think the pwBPD in our relationship think we gaslight them. At least mine does.

You'll be amazed, with what she comes up with.

Gas lighting, is more than lying.

Definition:

"Gas lighting is the systematic attempt by one person to erode another person's reality, by telling them that what they are experiencing isn't so - and, the gradual giving up on the part of the other person"

The Gas Light Effect      Dr Robin Stern

[maxen]

just to say, that gaslighting implies a level of intention that the pwBPD almost surely does not have. mine 'gaslighted' me, but the motive wasn't to derange me, it was because she couldn't face the issues i raised. i also wouldn't agree with her, but i did it strenuously which was conterproductive and which proved to be an irremediable mistake. the communication skills available here may help to contain this feelings = facts dynaimic: Communication tools (SET, PUVAS, DEARMAN).

[EaglesJuju]

Before I started seeing a therapist, gaslighting was a huge problem in my relationship.  Everything was so distorted, I did not even know what reality was.  I actually started believing what he was telling me.  I was so enmeshed in his alternate reality, all my instincts were superseded. It was like Back to the Future 2, when Doc and Marty figure out they are living in an alternative 1985.  I was living like that.  It really is crazy making behavior. 

[vortex of confusion]

But I also think the pwBPD in our relationship think we gaslight them. At least mine does.

It would make sense that they feel like we are gas lighting them. Ultimately, I think they gaslight as a way to bring us into their fantasy world. It is self preservation for them. They seem to have an altered perception of reality. When we call them on things, that is questioning their perception of reality so it only makes sense that they would feel like we are trying to question their reality and get them to see things differently. It is battle over whose perception of reality is correct.

"Gas lighting is the systematic attempt by one person to erode another person's reality, by telling them that what they are experiencing isn't so - and, the gradual giving up on the part of the other person"

Yes, they are trying to get us to see the world as they do. I know that there were times in the beginning of our marriage when I knew things were off. I would say something about it and would get all sorts of excuses. After a while, I started feeling bad for even questioning such things. My husband would get up a lot earlier than me and get on the computer and look at porn and take care of his "needs". I would ask him why he didn't wake me up. He would tell me that he was trying to let me sleep. He twisted it around so much that I felt like a very horrible and very lazy person because he was so concerned about letting me sleep. The truth is that he wanted me to stay in bed and not question him so he could do his thing unfettered. If he convinced me that he was being a nice and doting husband, then he wouldn't feel bad about looking at porn instead of waking me up or spending time with me. I was so convinced that I was a lazy, uncaring, demanding wife because I questioned him about some things that I fell down the rabbit hole of trying to do better and be better and take better care of him.

[Lucky One]

But I also think the pwBPD in our relationship think we gaslight them. At least mine does.

. It is battle over whose perception of reality is correct.

"Gas lighting is the systematic attempt by one person to erode another person's reality, by telling them that what they are experiencing isn't so - and, the gradual giving up on the part of the other person"

I fell down the rabbit hole of trying to do better and be better and take better care of him.

This is also THE TRAP - doing better and better for them. I've also been ensnared in this. I wonder if they get us to do this , with devious intent or whether it's just a by product of human nature, to do better, if our partners are not happy with us.

[vortex of confusion]

This is also THE TRAP - doing better and better for them. I've also been ensnared in this. I wonder if they get us to do this , with devious intent or whether it's just a by product of human nature, to do better, if our partners are not happy with us.

In my case, I think there was no intent on my husband's part. His only intent to was to follow his impulses without any regard for me.

I think the doing better part is human nature. I think most normal people try to do better if they think they can. I think most normal people are aware of their flaws and try work on them. And that is where we fall into the trap. We think they are like us. If both people acknowledge their failings and work on them, the net result would be an improved relationship. The net growth would be personal growth as well as growth within the relationship. I didn't realize just how messed up my husband was until it was way too late to do anything about because we had been married so long and have 4 kids. I am trying to put my finger on when things changed but it all happened so gradually that I can't really pinpoint when things got to this point.

[Lucky One]

This is also THE TRAP - doing better and better for them. I've also been ensnared in this. I wonder if they get us to do this , with devious intent or whether it's just a by product of human nature, to do better, if our partners are not happy with us.

I am trying to put my finger on when things changed but it all happened so gradually that I can't really pinpoint when things got to this point.

I'm trying to do the same. It also happened gradually. By that I mean it got worse and worse - slowly - almost unnoticeable - over quite a few years.

Actually this could have gone back right to the beginning. 38 Years ago. 32 years married.

Just didn't see it before.

Sorry - to hear about yours.