Major Dilemma: PLEASE HELP

[bern4606]

Hello,

I am new here and am currently dealing with a major dilemma with my BPD girlfriend who is 7 years older than me. Around a year ago, I met a fellow teacher at my school and we have had a fulfilling relationship. I fell in love with her because despite having such a tough life, she has worked tirelessly at her job and is passionate about what she does. I have found that she can be a very understanding person and has accepted me for some of my flaws. A few months ago we have moved in together.

Unfortunately, I have come to realize that my BPD girlfriend is demonstrating some patterns of behavior that I am worried about. In the month of May, her father (a drunk, alcoholic, sexually abusive man) passed away. Since then it has seemed to have been an emotional roller coaster ride. During the summer, we had an active summer with happy memories of vacations. We enjoyed moving in together and exericising and experimenting with cooking. During the school year however, I have been noticing my girlfriend's mental state going down hill. During a school gathering, my girlfriend started to break up into tears suddenly and has been having anxiety attacks. Oftentimes, she comes home depressed and wants to spend her time watching horror movies. The past few weeks she has had many musical concerts in addition to her teaching job and has come home exhausted.

This afternoon, before we go out for a date night, my girlfriend said out of the blue that she wanted to get pregnant and have a child with me. As someone who is just a few years out of college and into my teaching career, I feel that I lack the maturity level to have a child. In addition, having grown up with a mentally ill mother myself, I cannot reasonably feel good about taking the risk of having a child with someone who is mentally ill. I feel that it would not be fair to the child. In addition, I think that having children should not even be thought about until we are married (a few days ago, she said out of the blue that she doesn't think she'll ever feel like getting married). I told her that we needed to really think about what we wanted and I asked her the tough questions: (1) why do you want a child? (2) would you be happy with me if we didn't have children?  We proceeded to our date night and she often started staring into space and looking all gloomy. When we got home, she seemed in agony and was wincing in pain. I could tell this was an agonizing discussion for her.

Unfortunately, I do not have many friends to reach out to. While I am really considering breaking up with my girlfriend there are many complications. While I enjoy the companionship that I have with my girlfriend and I have found her to be emotionally supportive, I realize that there may be a point very soon where all this has to come to an end.  (1) My girlfriend works at the same place at me, I currently love my job! Plus, I do not want any complications to where I have to leave my job as I have students that depend on me (2) our living situation. Most importantly, I believe in the inherent worth and dignity of my girlfriend. I want her to feel respected and I want to make whatever decision in a respectful way. My girlfriend, the hardworking, caring, compassionate teacher, deserves for once in her life to be treated respectfully. It would mean a lot for me for her to be happy. At the same time, I realize that I need to protect myself.

Please reach out and respond and give me advice.

[Turkish]

Hi bern4606,

Short answer: take a look at the lessons to the right of the board. Whether she's a clinical level BPD or not, the validation tools will help, and you can learn more about BPD.

Overall, it sounds like you have a good view of the situation, despite the complcations of dealng with her and your job. That you are standing by your personal values is good: you aren't ready for a child due to a couple of valid reasons. Too often, we find ourselves compromising our personal values to perhaps "rescue" our loved one with BPD. Doing so often results in resentment on both sides later on.

Her dad dying certainly sounds like a huge trigger, especially given what kind of man she says he was. He was like that, but was still her Daddy.

How do you communicate with her when she's dysregulating? Maybe this can help to start:

Communication using validation. What it is; how to do it

Other than the emotional dysregulation, how is it otherwise, do you feel safe?

Turkish

[bern4606]

Thanks for your reply.

Overall, I feel safe. My girlfriend has never been violent and respects my point of view. She knows the challenges that I have in my life. I get the feeling that she is just trying to make sense of her situations. While I cannot provide her with a child at this point, I feel that I can offer companionship and moral support. In fact, if she were fine with the idea of not having a child for the next few years and came to term, I would be happy continuing our living together and the companionship that we have. We have been supportive of each other. In fact, I told her today that I felt like we could continue to have a good relationship and that maybe we should find things in our lives that make us happy and have some extra-curricular activities.

At the same time though, I realize that if she were to walk away today and tell me that having a child is something that she wanted, I would respect that decision. I would say something to the effect of: "I appreciate the time that we have had together, maybe you are right that we are looking for something different. I will never speak anything of ill will of you"  While it would be sad to lose her, I would be happy moving on and realize that there are other fish in the sea (I think though, that I would just fly solo for a while and take time to work on myself)

We were able to have a conversation today where there was no yelling.  One thing that is a challenge for me is that I, myself, have slight Aspergers syndrome. It is sometimes hard for me to read emotions. But having read this forum, I have always operated under the principal of validating her emotions. I said to her that I see where you are coming from being that you are your age right now and respect that you have a desire to have a child.

My game plan right now is to be there for her and let her make her first move.

[OnceConfused]

Bern:

In her defense, I have to say that woman at certain age, will have that inner drive to have children (before it is too late), given that she is 7 years older so I assume that she is in her late 20 or early 30s. That biological clock coupled with the mourning of the passing of her father, might accelerate her thinking about having children sooner .

First of all, I think the marriage should be discussed and within the context of the marriage you all can talk about having children. You should not let the fact that you both work in the same school hinders your discussion and decisions about what best for both of you. You already crossed the threshold.

From a logical stand point, I would :

1. assess whether her BPD is acceptable to you or what behaviors she need to modify. Also ask yourself how you really feel about her, ie, is there strong potential for marriage ?

2. if she agrees to some changes or getting help. then

3. after several months, you all can set a date for marriage

4. after the marriage then work on getting pregnant.

[bern4606]

An update:

First of all thanks for all the advice. I think this is rational advice and I definitely believe in validating emotions. Unfortunately, it seems like our relationship is turning south. This week, there have many awkward pauses. We just don't seem to be connecting as we have the past year. She does seem to be entering the dissociation phase. I think me telling her that I was not ready to have a child really was a blow to her and she consequently feels weighted. I try to ask how her day is, but she often does not elaborate.

The course of action that I am taking is to be open to her and try to be there for her.

Unfortunately, I have been noticing quite a few issues this week. Last night, after a hard days of work, we decided to go to a movie.  She invited me along and I thought that it would be a quality time to join her. At the movie (I was teaching and then had parent teacher conferences), I started to feel a little tired sitting up and leaned on her. The next thing I know, she was waking me up. As a teacher who takes pride in the work that I do, I often find myself exhausted at the end of the day (in a good way). I have for years been known to even fall asleep at my computer while working at 10 at night. Anyways, on the car ride home, my girlfriend suddenly tells me: " I am disturbed that you fall asleep while watching movies with me and you don't do that at your computer." I told her " I understand that you feel this way, it is not you but I have a tendency sometimes to fall asleep." I felt very offset because it seems like that she does not trust me and that there are much deeper issues that she does not seem to be communicating. One thing that I know is that communication, openness and transparency is very important in a relationship.

Tonight, she was hanging out with her friend which I encouraged. I went to a coffee shop to do some work. When I came back, she seemed unenthusiastic. While we did rub each other for a few minutes, she suddenly said "I'm going to bed." When I asked how her day was, she said "ok" in a kind of stressed out voice.

Another behavior pattern that has been concerning me has been her patterns of decision making recently. Here are a few examples:

- A week ago, her car broke down and she needed a new car.  My gf is in substantial debt and has a poor credit rating. The next day, she decided to lease a car without giving thought to price comparison and shopping.

- After the "I want a child" conversation, she said that maybe we could get a pet. This weekend, she is going to suddenly bring home a cat. Around 5 months ago, we got rid of her cat when she moved in with me because she said that she was tired of her cat.

- This week, we found out that she owed $1700 in state taxes because she has never paid her state income tax. She is trying to find a lawyer right now.

I find this pattern of decision making to be erratic and concerning. This is definitely leading me to some major trust issues with her. I would not feel comfortable with her handling my money or having a child at this point in time. I would feel comfortable if she would consent to counseling and think about ways where she could stabilize her emotions and her decision making.

HERE IS MY CHALLENGE RIGHT NOW: I am really thinking hard about whether to initiate a breakup. I feel like at this point, if she were to suggest it, I would accept it and move on. The challenge right now is that we work at the same school. I love my job. I do not want a fallout. I cannot afford to leave my school and bail on the students that are sitting in front of me.

More importantly, I believe in the inherent worth and dignity of my girlfriend. She has been so good to me many times and we have had so many good times together. She is working hard at her job despite her emotional challenges. She does not deserve to be "dumped" in an impersonal way. It would mean the world to me if she could somehow find some sort of happiness and connection with this world. While I realize that I need to do what is best for me, I need to do things in a way where she is treated with the utmost respect and dignity.

[SurfNTurf]

Hi Bern,

I fully agree with Turkish; read the lessons, read as much as you can about BPD. Information is always a good thing.

Secondly, as a non-BPD person, I have to talk to you about losing a father who was alcoholic, abusive, etc. My father was a raging alcoholic, worsening with time as all addictions do. He was never sexually abusive, but was instead physically, emotionally, verbally, and financially abusive to the family and my mother.

When he had a massive stroke and was comatose in hospital, I stayed 24/7 to make sure he had good care. Not because I adored Daddy, but b/c I always have been the responsible adult in the home.

I went a little nutso for about a year after Dad died. Not b/c I missed him - for I surely did not miss his probable BPD/NPD behaviors - but b/c I missed WHAT COULD HAVE BEEN and what never could possibly be. It was after a lot of therapy that I learned once Dad died, we could never have that ideal father-daughter relationship.  We never could anyway, but still the finality is final.

Around this same time, though my bio-clock had long run out, I considered adopting a baby, I believed at the time I could construct a family that I wanted rather than the one I was born in to. I even thought "If I just won the lottery, I would adopt and also hire a nanny to  help." (I wasn't in a relationship as I am now.) I remain childless, btw.

So... .what I'm trying to say is, if your gf is BPD, grief for what might have been is still grief, and will make a mentally healthy person act strange for awhile, I can't begin to imagine what a BPD person might experience.

Over time, and with some grief therapy, I learned a lot about why I behaved/thought the way I did with my grief. I learned even tho a parent was an SOB, grief work still must be done.

You are among friends on this board, and be kind to yourself as you journey through the readings.

Take care.

[Turkish]

I usually run on about 6 hrs of sleep. I can doze in movies. Your validation sounds ok.

As for the other things, you're processing realities and trying to align them with your core values, which is what an adult would do. Of you can lead her out of where she is right now, accepting that she may or may not change and grow (some of this sounds like standard immaturity), then your r/s may work... .unless you grow to resent your role.

By the time my Ex had left, I had given her space to work on her debt and improve her credit score. I even encouraged her to start a Roth IRA. I won't go into the details of my r/s, but I grew to resent for for a number of reasons. pwBPD can be hyper-attuned to picking up on the emotions of others, even if sometimes reading them through a filter of distorted thinking. Resentment=abandonment.

Being a stable, validating presence, while not taking the emotional dysregulation personally, is a key to staying with a BPD partner. Take a look at the links at the top of the Staying Board for more.

For years, I rescued my mom frokm poor financial decisions. I thought it was my duty. I realized, however, that offering to rescue her carte-blanche, may have triggered her hidden shame, perhaps triggering her depression. When I stepped back, it helped her stand on her own more. (Though BPD, my mom isn't the Witch-Queen type, so that helped.)

You have a good heart, bern; it shows. Your frustrations, however, are understandable. The workplace issue adds complication. Aside from her (because she's an independent entity who may do what she does regardless of you, and is who she is), looking at you, and what you are willing to do, is paramount, without losing who you are.

SNT: my mom did the exact thing you once desired: she adopted me. Only after 40 years I came to the realization you once had, from a child's perpective in retrospect.

bern: the cat(s) story is interesting. What does your gut tell you about that?

[bern4606]

I always love information when I am making crucial decisions. I know that whatever decision is made has to be done with great thought and deliberation and should not be done in the heat of the moment.

After my girlfriend had a nervous breakdown a month ago, I said to my girlfriend something to the effect: "I understand that you are going through some tough times right now with the loss of your Dad and I hope that you can come to terms. I think that therapy would be beneficial for you and I would be happy to support you through it!" My girlfriend than accused me of saying that her emotions weren't valid. I told her that emotions were okay to experience and that I felt like that it could be good for her for some tools to understand them.

I personally think that a good honest therapist that cultivates a sense of self empowerment and mindfulness would be really helpful for my girlfriend to help her realize what a beautiful person she is. I would love nothing more for her to feel some sort of acceptance and connection with the world. It pains me everyday to see her run away from other people trying to reach out and help her (all what it takes is for one thing about someone to "trigger" her) and even running away from herself. One question I feel like asking is: "how can one love if they don't even have love for themselves?" I realize that I cannot alone convince her to go to therapy and that ultimately, there has to be some sort of desire for her from within. I would be willing to work with her through therapy and support her should she want to go this route.

SurfNTurf, you are to be commended that you made the decision to seek out help and therapy for you and it looks like you are in a better place. How did you empower yourself to go to therapy? How can we empower and cultivate a place for a BPD person to safely understand their emotions and come to terms with their grief?

[bern4606]

RE The Cat Story: My gut is telling me that my girlfriend is scrambling to develop some connection to the world and desiring to love something. Now that I have grown to be "old news," I think she wants something new in her life that she could love (and give the love that she never received). I think this cat story is showing her desperation for validation. What do you think?

[Turkish]

I think you may be onto something there. She discarding the old cat seems to bother you. Would you consider validating new kitty to see how it goes, or would it bother you more?

[SurfNTurf]

Hi Bern,

LOL - I went to therapy b/c I am an RN and recognized something was amiss, and it is what I would advise my patients to do! 

What I have discovered in my career is that healthy people tend to willingly go to therapy, periodically, in their lives, as a means to address whatever is troubling them. It's the people who REALLY need therapy that dig in their heels when suggested they get help.  I like to ask my patients, "well, wouldn't you see a medical doctor if you had a cough that won't go away? if you have some things on your mind that won't go away, why wouldn't you see a specialist?" That kick starts some of them.

My husb, I believe, is an uBPD'er. Just the thought of any type of counseling makes him suspicious. He thinks I've colluded with therapists against him. He has any and all manner of excuses.

Thus, b/c he is my husband and b/c I made the conscious decision to remain married, I worked on myself.  Boundary setting. Not rescuing. Letting his actions dictate consequences for him. Things I should have done a long time ago. As a result, we are getting on better than we used to.

I believe you are on the right track, there is a lot of good info here.