How much to conceed without forsaking the kids?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

She is not happy at all about my asking for a divorce, having seen a lawyer, etc. 

She has upped the chaos level in such a polished way that the kids can't even see who the real monster is.

I can never tell the kids (S11, D9, S9)  the real reason "I don't love Mommy anymore."  It 's hard to say that I  thought she was going to kill me (3 yrs ago) and I stayed in to protect them. S9 has some serious physical and I am sure mental issues d/t her.  The other two just look at me and are furious.

She knows too much in the legal world.  I don't want to move out: they would be exposed to unopposed her.  Sleeping on the sofabed in the basement, however is getting a bit rough.

Her past psych history is impressive--should I leverage it to get her to agree to my terms?   I want her out, she can have an apartment nearby. I would even make a schedule where she can be with them after I leave to work until I get home.  I'd give her a week on and a week off.

[gary seven]

She is not happy at all about my asking for a divorce, having seen a lawyer, etc. 

She has upped the chaos level in such a polished way that the kids can't even see who the real monster is.

I can never tell the kids (S11, D9, S9)  the real reason "I don't love Mommy anymore."  It 's hard to say that I  thought she was going to kill me (3 yrs ago) and I stayed in to protect them. S9 has some serious physical and I am sure mental issues d/t her.  The other two just look at me and are furious.

She knows too much in the legal world.  I don't want to move out: they would be exposed to unopposed her.  Sleeping on the sofabed in the basement, however is getting a bit rough.

Her past psych history is impressive--should I leverage it to get her to agree to my terms?   I want her out, she can have an apartment nearby. I would even make a schedule where she can be with them after I leave to work until I get home.  I'd give her a week on and a week off.

[livednlearned]

Hi G7,

Have you asked her for a divorce before? If so, what usually happens when you mention it? If I remember correctly, you two have a history of marriage counseling, and she has seen a number of therapists?

What did your lawyer recommend you do?

The kids are probably furious because divorce can feel very destabilizing to them, there are so many unknowns and they are still at an age where they see things in terms of how things will impact them. And they won't be able to imagine a peaceful home (at least half the time) since you're both still living together. Do they respond to validation? I wish I could have a do-over and take more time to validate my son -- he now suffers from anxiety/depression and I think I tried too hard to be the strong parent and ultimately S14 ended up stuffing his feelings.

Do any of the kids see therapists?

[ForeverDad]

I had confrontational exchanges and so I wanted fewer exchanges with 7/7 for my son who was then in kindergarten.  However, I recall my Custody evaluator told me children under 10 would do better with a 2/2/3 schedule because the children would not be away from you as long.  When my son was nearing 12yo the court's decision stated the prior schedule (equal time 2/2/3) should continue for summers, I told my lawyer I preferred changing to alternate weeks since it would reduce in-person exchanges.  His retort?  ":)o you want the court to think that it is okay for your pre-teen to be away for you for longer?"

Beware of expecting hopes, entreaties and warnings to reveal information will work.  Maybe Leverage will work but beware of not revealing information to the court.  Hiding the other's bad history often isn't a good strategy.  I'm not saying that Leverage won't work, maybe it will, but don't count on it, it's astounding how the misbehaving parent can twist court around it's little finger.

[gary seven]

My 2 S are in therapy;  the youngest,9, also has a P and is on meds.   She herself thinks she isn't BPD, rather bipolar. ... which we all know "responds to meds" where BPD doesn't.

I'm cautious about moving too fast before school ends.  I did take the next step for a personal psychological eval and an eval for parental fitness with a forensic psychiatrist.   

[ForeverDad]

I would be concerned about revealing your results to her or her lawyer, even if good.  Why?  Not only would she brush it aside, the big issue is that she wouldn't have been scrutinized, only you.  However, I understand you wanting to have some documentation that you're reasonably normal but it might be best to keep it in reserve for now.

If it becomes a matter in court or some other agency, then you both should be tested or evaluated.  I would recommend you try your best to get any testing or evaluations done on both parents.  Don't let her pose as the victim or target by allowing her to avoid scrutiny.  The longer she avoids scrutiny, the harder it will undo the damage she will have done to your parenting.

My story... .When we first appeared in family court, she had made an ex parte petition (one-sided act-first, review-later) to block my parenting.  I got a call from CPS while I was driving to work.  When we had the hearing the rep from CPS stood up and stated "We have 'no concerns' about FD."  Silence about Ex.  Why?  She didn't have any allegations filed against her.  Eventually I did file to counter her allegations in her petition but a couple hearings later hers was withdrawn and mine was dismissed evidently as not 'actionable'.

What works better is when both are evaluated.  Eyes wide open on all involved.  My case was not making progress until two separate joint evaluations were made.  The first was a 4 month Parenting Investigation by the court's own social worker.  The recommendation was that my parenting move up to equal time from my court-ordered temporary alternate weekends.  Since social workers didn't have authority to comment on custody, a Custody Evaluation was recommended.  My CE's initial report summarized, "Mother cannot share 'her' child but Father can... .Mother should immediately lose her temporary custody... .If Shared Parenting is attempted and fails then Father should get custody."

That's the advantage.  It's not enough to show you're reasonably normal.  That's only half the story.  The light needs to be on both.

Most people want to hide their past poor behaviors and pwBPD are certainly no exception.  Would she be able to hide her past psych history?  Generally individual incidents or events older than six months are viewed as 'stale' or not actionable by courts, but if it is concerning and presented as history or patterns of behavior that may work better in courts.

[gary seven]

  The longer she avoids scrutiny, the harder it will undo the damage she will have done to your parenting.



FD:  She is expert at hiding behind since she is such a high functioning BPD.

It's not enough to show you're reasonably normal.  That's only half the story.  The light needs to be on both .

The half of the story is what I am watching.  Recently a serious event went down while she was watching the kids on a recent three day weekend.  The target was my S9, but the chaos inflicted to perpetuate the chaos since I told her I wanted to be divorced.  The kids' T thought it was an "ironic" that this went down when I was not home.

Most people want to hide their past poor behaviors and pwBPD are certainly no exception.  Would she be able to hide her past psych history?  Generally individual incidents or events older than six months are viewed as 'stale' or not actionable by courts, but if it is concerning and presented as history or patterns of behavior that may work better in courts.

I have a  backlog of behaviors documented, but understand it is what is happening in the now that counts.

I see the point on "stale."  Certainly at the height of the past "insanity," I did all I could do to scramble and work and get the kids fed and clothed.  She went into Suzy Homemaker mode last summer, but I think my damage is done.   I read Splitting and am starting Don't Alienate the kids. 

The kids T and my T do not want to be part of any subpoenas/court proceeding with a divorce. 

I will have to do this on my own.