Getting divorced

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hello,  I am in the process of getting a divorce from my wife of 9 years.  We separated and agreed to work on our problems which included me going to counseling.  Boy oh boy have I learned a lot that I wish I knew years ago from my counseling.  I started describing my wife to my counselor and that she was on meds for depression and anxiety.  The counselor mentioned that she sounded BPD.  I had never heard of that.  I had only accepted what my wife had told me that she suffered from depression and anxiety.  Naturally, I started looking into BPD and the stories posted describe my life!  The symptoms describe my wife.  I believe her to be BPD but I am not capable of diagnosing her and neither is my counselor who has never met her.

It is apparent now, that she never made one attempt to work out our problems but she kept agreeing with me that we might be able to work things out.  She never looked back once I said I couldn't be with her anymore.  I know she has been with men since the separation and I firmly believe she is pregnant now.  After learning of the possibility of her BPD and reading up on it, I fear she may have been with other men the entire time we were married.  She was a very dedicated wife though and I really never suspected her of it until now.  Anyway, since the separation and she has been with others, I can tell by her behavior.  I can tell that she is cheating by the way she has acted.  This behavior is something I have never witnessed before in her.  I plan to ask her about this but I do not want to rock the boat before our divorce is final.

The strange thing about all this is that she is refusing anything in the divorce settlement.  I have had to beg her to take something.  I should mention we have 5 kids (are they all mine?).  She wants 50/50 custody and we have set up a deal between us that they will stay with me all the time but on paper it is 50/50.  She will watch them while I am at work.  I think this arrangement will not last.  Back to the settlement.  She really refused everything and says she will sign anything I have written up.  I have managed to get her to accept a car and half of the savings and $400 a month in child support.  The child support is simply put in for her to put towards her own place.  She finally came around and wanted half of the 401k which I don't mind giving.  After all, we were married the entire time it was built.  Why would she not want anything?  She constantly says I am throwing her out with nothing but I have offered everything (which I have documented through texts and email).  We agree that she is doing it so we can maintain the children's lives and home.  I constantly fear that at the last minute she is going to burn it all down and ask to sell the home, alimony and child support.  She keeps insisting she won't.  I kinda think she is getting exactly what she wants.  The ability to see her children on her terms with nights and weekends off.

Has anyone experienced this?  She threatens lawyers and a fight often but always backs down when I say go ahead and do that.  What is her game?  Looking back, I don't recall any lying or manipulation.  It really surfaced when I "abandoned" her.

Why do I think she is pregnant?  She has said things.  Things like, "In a month you are going to hate me and keep the kids from me."  Why a month is she going to start showing?  She is also putting on weight.  I have had 4 kids with her (1st was hers from before).  I can tell by the way she walks.  She also said that she has something to tell me but won't until after everything is final.  That same conversation she said that she could go after everything (alimony, 401, house... .) and that she hopes that one day I realize how lucky I am she isn't.  Everything she said implied that I was going to hate her.  She recently told me she was going to have her tubes tied.  I now believe that she is getting an abortion and tubes tied.  She now also talks about how great we are going to get along after the divorce.  This makes me think she is not going to tell me anything so I don't hate her.

Any advice?

[anonymous_in_NV]

Hello,  I am in the process of getting a divorce from my wife of 9 years.  We separated and agreed to work on our problems which included me going to counseling.  Boy oh boy have I learned a lot that I wish I knew years ago from my counseling.  I started describing my wife to my counselor and that she was on meds for depression and anxiety.  The counselor mentioned that she sounded BPD.  I had never heard of that.  I had only accepted what my wife had told me that she suffered from depression and anxiety.  Naturally, I started looking into BPD and the stories posted describe my life!  The symptoms describe my wife.  I believe her to be BPD but I am not capable of diagnosing her and neither is my counselor who has never met her.

It is apparent now, that she never made one attempt to work out our problems but she kept agreeing with me that we might be able to work things out.  She never looked back once I said I couldn't be with her anymore.  I know she has been with men since the separation and I firmly believe she is pregnant now.  After learning of the possibility of her BPD and reading up on it, I fear she may have been with other men the entire time we were married.  She was a very dedicated wife though and I really never suspected her of it until now.  Anyway, since the separation and she has been with others, I can tell by her behavior.  I can tell that she is cheating by the way she has acted.  This behavior is something I have never witnessed before in her.  I plan to ask her about this but I do not want to rock the boat before our divorce is final.

The strange thing about all this is that she is refusing anything in the divorce settlement.  I have had to beg her to take something.  I should mention we have 5 kids (are they all mine?).  She wants 50/50 custody and we have set up a deal between us that they will stay with me all the time but on paper it is 50/50.  She will watch them while I am at work.  I think this arrangement will not last.  Back to the settlement.  She really refused everything and says she will sign anything I have written up.  I have managed to get her to accept a car and half of the savings and $400 a month in child support.  The child support is simply put in for her to put towards her own place.  She finally came around and wanted half of the 401k which I don't mind giving.  After all, we were married the entire time it was built.  Why would she not want anything?  She constantly says I am throwing her out with nothing but I have offered everything (which I have documented through texts and email).  We agree that she is doing it so we can maintain the children's lives and home.  I constantly fear that at the last minute she is going to burn it all down and ask to sell the home, alimony and child support.  She keeps insisting she won't.  I kinda think she is getting exactly what she wants.  The ability to see her children on her terms with nights and weekends off.

Has anyone experienced this?  She threatens lawyers and a fight often but always backs down when I say go ahead and do that.  What is her game?  Looking back, I don't recall any lying or manipulation.  It really surfaced when I "abandoned" her.

Why do I think she is pregnant?  She has said things.  Things like, "In a month you are going to hate me and keep the kids from me."  Why a month is she going to start showing?  She is also putting on weight.  I have had 4 kids with her (1st was hers from before).  I can tell by the way she walks.  She also said that she has something to tell me but won't until after everything is final.  That same conversation she said that she could go after everything (alimony, 401, house... .) and that she hopes that one day I realize how lucky I am she isn't.  Everything she said implied that I was going to hate her.  She recently told me she was going to have her tubes tied.  I now believe that she is getting an abortion and tubes tied.  She now also talks about how great we are going to get along after the divorce.  This makes me think she is not going to tell me anything so I don't hate her.

Any advice?

[ForeverDad]

A few thoughts here... .

She may be a lower conflict pwBPD. By that I mean that she's already moved on to the next relationship(s) and isn't trying to claim you are an evil monster.  (Typically all ended relationships are described as abusive since they can't accept any blame for the relationship's failure.)  This is not to say she won't come at you with talons and claws seeking blood in the future, just right now and thus far she has not been that 'triggered' to cast you worse.

Beware of being too fair, too nice, too whatever.  Why?  Because you risk putting yourself at a distinct disadvantage in the future.  Fathers (and even normal mothers) have an especially uphill struggle to improve things when opposed by a sabotaging, oppositional, acting out disordered spouse or ex-spouse.  Sadly, many courts still default to Mother Knows Best concepts from the past decades even though today the written policies are supposedly gender neutral.

For example, you wrote that you're okay with 50/50 time on paper but that you know she'll take less parenting time.  Believe me when we tell you that it can be very, very hard to change that later.  If that's really what you want to do, please add a clause that after one year has passed you can have the order adjusted to reflect the actual parenting time percentages.  If she will be watching the kids during the day while you're at work then have "parenting time" based on overnights.  In other words, give yourself a clear pathway to improving the order.  Lock your options in.  If you don't now, it can be hard later to get court to make changes without extreme circumstances.

What about legal custody?  Almost always it is joint legal custody unless things are really extreme.  However that can give her power to obstruct action if she wants to sabotage.  Since full legal custody is hard to get (courts seem to consider that it disenfranchises the excluded parent) you can get equivalent outcomes by getting Decision Making or Tie Breaker status.

Also, you must be the one identified as the Residential Parent for Residential Purposes.  Why?  That means the children attend school in your area and the schools will contact you first.  If she decides to move far away then you won't have to follow her or resort to court for fixes.

If any of the children are not yours then someone else would be the legal father.  Find out before you seal your deals.  I suggest you get DNA tests for yourself and the children.  Choose a laboratory acceptable to your local court so it won't have to be done again if it needs to be submitted to courts.  Also, have yourself tested for STDs, better to know than wonder.

Don't pooh, pooh the ideas and strategies you learn here, they may save you great expense and wasted time in court in the years to come.  we've been there, done that.

[anonymous_in_NV]

Could she be playing some game with me?  Is she laying low just to sneak something on me in the end?  Why wouldn't she want more?  I think it is because she feels so guilty.  She says that she is doing everything to maintain the kids' lives post divorce.  I believe that.  She repeatedly says don't eff with the kids in the divorce it is all she cares about.  I believe that.

Some say that pwBPD show no remorse or empathy.  She has always been remorseful or upset if she ever hurt my feelings.  She has said she feels sick to her stomach when I am hurt.  Remember, this whole BPD is new to me in the last 1-2 weeks if in fact that is what she suffers from.  So she could be playing me when she show empathy or remorse.

During the "separation" she repeatedly said she was a terrible person and that the breakup wasn't my fault.  She repeatedly took the blame and that I was a great man who deserves the world.  She even said I should find a girlfriend and sleep with her so things would really be over.  She was showing signs of guilt.  Is that normal.  Is it normal for UpwBPD to say it is my fault for how I am.  In the past, she admitted I would use her behavior against her and take the kids from her.  Is it normal for UpwBPD to be aware that their behavior is a problem?

The symptoms of BPD fit, but maybe she isn't one.  If she is low conflict, can I trust that she will follow through on her promise to raise the kids together civilly and in their best interest.  She also said she wanted us to be friends.

Has anyone been in the same situation where the UBPD is being so good about this? 

[GaGrl]

My DH's ex-wife (uNPD/BPD) engaged in blatant affairs throughout their marriage, from about 18 months into the marriage until she finally walked out of the shared household after 19 years.  :)H is 99.9% sure that his oldest child is not biologically his, and he made the decision not to know.  If you feel you need to know, do so and then act accordingly; if not, accept that the children are yours, are your responsibility legally, and then live your life having made that decision.

Is your STBW asking for 50-50 because she expects that to mean that she does NOT pay child support, i.e., that the amount of time she keeps the children after school would constitute her financial contribution?  What arrangements are you clarifying regarding other costs that need to be shared -- school and extracurricular expenses, clothes, medical/dental/ortho/vision expenses not covered by insurance, etc.?

If she is saying she will sign just about anything, then get as much locked in as possible.

[anonymous_in_NV]

I am so new to this.  What is DH? What is STBW?  Whether the kids are "mine" or not does not matter.  They are mine.  If she really is BPD, the part that is so confusing is why I seem to be getting out of this so easy.  What am I missing?  Why would she say "I hope one day you realize how lucky you are".  She says she doesn't want any new relationships, that she is too broken.  Throughout our marriage she has insisted that she would never want another relationship.  That she never wanted to put the effort in to somebody else the way she did me.

[Lilyroze]

 

I am in a private group for non's who deal with BPD family ex's, or spouses.

I find this very common  among many, when they feel guilty to say they are walking or you want out and they want nothing.

Maybe and hopefully not case here but usually due to cheating, moving on etc, if they sign right then no problem legally. But most come back and change their minds, and want all, most, half etc. They rage, cry, scream, change their mind constantly till this is all done. Usually high conflict which you will find here and reading up. The LC is due to quilt but changes when they project later, deregulate, or rage.

My stbxUBPD, was what I thought ill with disability.  I always took care of everything, when got to point he was getting at least better, started asking for some help for me, to move etc, because I was ill ( from stress no doubt... .). He deregulated, had a miraculous ( see eye roll here) recovery, went on to cheat, ignore kids, hurt them and myself and want a divorce on his 1000th new GF timeline.

His new girlfriend ( of many online before her) has many issues is harming her children( by making all about her), her husband ( seperated) has no idea, according to sources she has had problems for awhile, and many affairs as well. She thinks him doing his responsibilities is enmeshment... .I am astounded that there is no morals or integrity in many of these people. It is all about them I know she is NPD as well. "I want the fantasy, I want him, I want her, never about their kids, responsibility or morals".

I want divorce have no problem giving but wanted what was necessary to take care of children and myself and what I am due ( I paid for houses, most everything, got him out of debt). But wanted fair to him as well, he kept saying no take all, thinking he could go with GF. You are going to hate me. Then back to not doing what he agreed to, help finish anything, to wanting it all, to crazy proposals, to threats and scary threats.

I should note upon counsel ( legal and otherwise) I realized I have to stop caring and being so nice. What he is leaving me in is a mess, and what he thinks he is giving is what the law probably would give due to all I have done, paid for, needs done, how I have furthered his career and left him in good standing credit wise, paid off all his debts etc. 

He in fact should be doing more but will see probably won't have any idea I am really entitled to it and the mess he is leaving me in. Never would have bought the other home near his work, thought I had to care- take etc. What a mess. But all is good, I will be fine, and God will bless me through this as he will you. I will just have to have the faith and keep going for my kids and myself, be free of the situation and go forward.

Now after ranting, raging, hurtful things, threats, no help or cooperation, to me finding spying, he and his GF are so irresponsible in their fantasies should not have either of their kids, and more weekly raging... .

Now he called me  other day, being kind, romantic and talking intimate things which just are strange. I had to just get off phone. He then called in front of people in a public setting talking to me about his personal body parts, then giggling and trying to make small talk. Again... .had to get off phone. Have no problem being kind, compassionate, being friends but have to remind myself that is probably not case and will be raging within days.

I have to remind myself I didn't cause this, have done right by him, taking my responsibility seriously and won't let him or her off hook. Maybe they found out I am going to hold responsible, and know about spying etc.

Now I am trying to deal with legal things, find out how he is spying and could put him in jail with possible felony and he is being sweet. I am sure will be raging again in next few days with threats.

I guess what I am saying is be prepared, you have children that more then likely you will have to be the stable, responsible one for. Make sure you have a back up plan in place for their care while you are at work, in case she runs off to fantasy land. More then likely that crashes and burns with 4 months to 2 years, then they want back etc.

Get legal in order what you need, want, and what she wants and have her sign or she more then likely once quilt passes or her new crashes will want more then you will be able to give.

Good luck. Sorry   for what you are going through. There are so many books recommendations, tools, articles as well as posts that might help you.

Keep posting, many here can help you get through the tough times.

 

[ForeverDad]

DH is ":)ear Husband".  StbX has some variations but is basically "soon-to-be-ex".  Other abbreviated phrases are here:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=240790.msg683558#msg683558

[anonymous_in_NV]

I have been glued to this site since finding it.  Update:  She signed the papers which were completely in my favor.  She did get half of the 401k but I am ok with that.  She was "there" when I started it.  No alimony, peanuts for child support and I get house.  I am still paying for everything kid related though and happy to do it.  She says the child support I give her is my cheap babysitting cost.  Hello? They are your kids too and you said no daycare.  She says she lives for the kids, but she is so vacant with them.  I have said before that I think she is perfectly happy with our weird arrangement of her watching the kids at my house during the day.  She can leave after 2:30 and have nights and weekends alone.  Is it a pwBPD thing to just eventually want nothing to do with their kids especially if they find a replacement?  Should I expect one day for her to completely abandon the kids even though now she says she breaths for them?