Home page of BPDFamily.com, online relationship supportMember registration here
June 15, 2024, 06:24:14 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins: Kells76, Once Removed, Turkish
Senior Ambassadors: EyesUp, SinisterComplex
  Help!   Boards   Please Donate Login to Post New?--Click here to register  
bing
Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits. Practicing lawyer, Senior Family Mediator, and former Licensed Clinical Social Worker with twelve years’ experience and an expert on navigating the Family Court process.
222
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Request for overnight with BPD mom  (Read 374 times)
Concerns
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Posts: 126


« on: July 21, 2016, 01:43:36 PM »

So my BPD wife finally left the home. Sunday was the first night S4 was going to spend the night with her. I was very traumatic for he and I.  I was called an hour later with him freaking out, begging me to come get him, pick him up and take him home. He just wasn't having it. She told me she wouldn't bring him home and that I had to come get him. So I did.
When I got there, she was in complete dysregulation. Packing the groceries she had gotten for him saying she didn't need them anymore and for them to not goto waste, that he hated her, was telling her that she could invite her boyfriend over and everything would be ok but that he was going home. I put all the groceries back in the cupboards and told her that we would figure out a way to work it out.
So she called telling me that it was "over". She was going to kill herself. Get a gun put a bullet in her head. She didn't want to be here anymore. She would do it before she left her job so the life insurance would still be in place. She has been saying these things for a long time. An ongoing pattern when something goes wrong.
She chided me that I was loving this, that I would ask for child support now... .I probably will but that's another issue.

She wanted him yesterday. It got too late. She was busy training for her new work and decided not to take him. She informed me that she wanted him tonight. That she would come get him and he would spend the night. That "he would just have to deal with it". That she is his mother and he's gonna have to get over it. He had agreed to me spending the night in her new apt. so he would feel ok about being there. I had suggested she spend time in the apt with him during her days off, getting him used to being there, and bring him home to sleep at night. All were rejected. Flat no.

I just got news that day that our state had accepted my case through LegalAid for a pro-bono. I called him. There is no divorce or any orders in place yet. I could keep him and basically say he's staying with me until the court decides. But there is nothing stopping her from picking him up from daycare and doing exactly the same thing. I treading a thin line here.

But for tonight, the real question is imminent danger... .
How do I really know? She has been saying these things for years now. The difference? She's out of the house and in her own apt.
The lawyer said if anything happened to the both of them that the court would basically hold me accountable and ask me why I let him go if I knew he was in danger.
But is he really in imminent danger? Idk. What if the same thing happens tonight that happened on Sunday or worse? What's her breaking point? Would she kill him as well? It's
I would say fall on the safe side and deny her access to the sleepover but the court may see that as some sort of alienation.
He suggested maybe meet in a public place so she could see him. But she only wants to come get him and take him away with her.
She would threaten suicide before and I would have to leave him with her in the mornings to go to work.
It's like the "boy who cried wolf". How am I supposed to tread the line between dysregulated bluff and the chance the "wolf" might actually show up?
She has talked to him on the phone since. She has asked him to spend the night and he denies her.
It's this disconnect between her spraying trauma everywhere and just after we are recovering then acting like nothing happened. Like I'm just supposed to disregard all the self-murder talk and approach her as "his mother" who has every right for him to spend the night with her. She acts like nothing happened.

Logged
Nope
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Relationship status: married
Posts: 951



« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2016, 03:53:14 PM »

Are you allowed to record where you are? If you have proof that she is spouting off about suicide and putting a bullet in her head maybe you could get a TRO and then she couldn't get him from daycare? Just a thought.
Logged
ForeverDad
Retired Staff
*
Online Online

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
Posts: 18212


You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2016, 04:18:51 PM »

So my BPD wife finally left the home. Sunday was the first night S4 was going to spend the night with her... .I had to come get him... .When I got there, she was in complete dysregulation... .

So she called telling me that it was "over". She was going to kill herself. Get a gun put a bullet in her head. She didn't want to be here anymore. She would do it before she left her job so the life insurance would still be in place. She has been saying these things for a long time. An ongoing pattern when something goes wrong... .

She informed me that she wanted him tonight. That she would come get him and he would spend the night. That "he would just have to deal with it". That she is his mother and he's gonna have to get over it. He had agreed to me spending the night in her new apt. so he would feel ok about being there. I had suggested she spend time in the apt with him during her days off, getting him used to being there, and bring him home to sleep at night. All were rejected. Flat no.

LegalAid for a pro-bono... .There is no divorce or any orders in place yet. I could keep him and basically say he's staying with me until the court decides. But there is nothing stopping her from picking him up from daycare and doing exactly the same thing. I treading a thin line here.

But for tonight, the real question is imminent danger... .How do I really know? She has been saying these things for years now. The difference? She's out of the house and in her own apt.

Do you have any proof of her threats to harm herself or others?  Witnesses?  Recordings?  Texts or IMs?  That would support you to limit contact and parenting until the court decides, hopefully after she is evaluated.  There are psych evals (relatively quick) and custody evals (take months and expensive).  Understand that if a psych eval is ordered, you may be included in the order as well, especially if she contests it.

Even without independent proof you can still take the stance that "I'm concerned about your threats to harm yourself, I will limit your time with our child to ____ until the court or professionals decide how to handle our parenting."  Yes, she could still take him from daycare or preschool but you won't know until it happens or doesn't happen.

I believe threats of suicide can be one of two general categories:  (1) attempts to control, guilt or manipulate or (2) indication of mental stress, distress, depression or a number of other issues.  Understand that you are not expected to evaluate her and determine what to do, that is left to trained professionals.  Even if you were qualified in the mental health field, you couldn't properly evaluate because she's a family member.  So when there are suicide talk or threats then you call in the emergency responders or petition family court to assign professionals.  It may stress her out even more, but it will get professional attention which is good.  Be aware that she could deny it or even blame-shift and claim you're the one suicidal.  That's why we're asking if you've got proof of her making such statements.  (By the time I separated I had been quietly recording for a few months since I knew my ex would deny and make counter allegations.  I knew I'd need proof I wasn't the one acting out.)

In short, this is the time to stand up for what YOU decide is best for your son.  Beware of second guessing yourself, it could be self-sabotaging.  Yes, it's good to be aware, listening and informed but still YOU decide, at least for now.  Beware too of trying to be too fair, to nice, too whatever.  That can come back to haunt you because pwBPD typically don't or won't reciprocate our fairness.

I would say fall on the safe side and deny her access to the sleepover but the court may see that as some sort of alienation.

She has talked to him on the phone since. She has asked him to spend the night and he denies her.

Court will almost certainly NOT see you limiting her contact as alienation, especially not if you have documentation of her poor and distressed behaviors.  Until there are orders you both have equal rights as parents.  Yes, it's a bit of a free-for-all but it appears likely that when YOU set the rules she will likely acquiesce.  She doesn't seem to be as controlling and entitled as many other spouses described by other members here.

Time to learn now... .Your son does not decide what happens, he is not just a minor but a young minor.  Yes, take his reactions, concerns and worries into consideration but the decisions are yours.  (This is not a TV show where Erkel and his teen peers tell the parents what is best to do.)
Logged

Concerns
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Posts: 126


« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2016, 05:30:22 PM »

Hi, All. Thank you for replying. I do have proof in a number of forms. She was even hospitalized for suicidal ideation after a breakdown.
After talking with my lawyer, it is a toss-up. It's hard due to the "boy who cried wolf" aspect. I was excepted into a pro-bono program but it will take at least a month for the actual retainer but he is willing to talk with me. The main emphasis is the protection of the child. But there is nothing to stop her from taking him if she feels like it. So I have to walk a fine line between her possible dysregulation and perceived reality of her threats. 
Logged
puck

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 19


« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2016, 12:49:47 PM »

Hi Concerns,

What a difficult situation, but also a blessing that your ex is now out of the house so you can be assured of a sanctuary for you and your son.

Threats or indications of violence should be taken seriously, IMO. You have a duty to your son to protect him. If you have reason to believe that allowing your son to stay with his mother would be a threat to his security, in my jurisdiction you are required to protect your child.

As ForeverDad says, leave the mental health diagnoses to mental health professionals. Your legal responsibility is to act as a "reasonable person", not to be able to judge behaviour at the level of a forensic psychiatrist. Smiling (click to insert in post) Recuse yourself of the responsibility to discern intent behind suicidal threats--that's more than any of us should ever have to do--and shift it to your ex's shoulders. She is an adult who owns the consequences of her actions. If she doesn't accept responsibility and seek medical care, the natural consequence of irrational and threatening behaviour is to be evaluated as a potential safety risk under a court ruling.

My spouse was looking at websites about topics that suggested potential violent intent. I brought screen shots to my lawyer immediately and was advised that the onus on me was to have a "reasonable belief" of risk, not that a criminal action be in progress or materialise eventually. I hope the courts here don't prove me wrong, but the concept of natural justice shouldn't preclude a loving, rational parent from shielding a child from potentially witnessing the other parent's suicide.

Sending you and your son best wishes at this very difficult point. Please feel free to reach out by PM if you'd like to discuss more. Smiling (click to insert in post)
Logged
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2024?

Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Our 2023 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
12years
alterK
AskingWhy
At Bay
Cat Familiar
CoherentMoose
drained1996
EZEarache
Flora and Fauna
ForeverDad
Gemsforeyes
Goldcrest
Harri
healthfreedom4s
hope2727
khibomsis
Lemon Squeezy
Memorial Donation (4)
Methos
Methuen
Mommydoc
Mutt
P.F.Change
Penumbra66
Red22
Rev
SamwizeGamgee
Skip
Swimmy55
Tartan Pants
Turkish
whirlpoollife



Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2020, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!