20 something daughter may have BPD and we have struggled for years

[Parents! Get help here!]

First time posting about this.  Appreciate the feedback and support.

We have a 20 something year old daughter who has been a challenge for a number years.  I am sure like most, it is a long story but I will try to make it short.  I am curious if her story is like others here as she has no formal diagnosis yet.

Several years ago we began noticing one daughter was always lashing out at us and her siblings.  At the time we attributed it to some difficulties we had with a boyfriend we thought she was too young to have and how she thought she was treated because of it.  We believed we were being supportive but appropriately concerned parents and instituted boundaries and rules and for the most part she did abide by them.  She blamed us for this and for everything else that she perceived as being a slight to her.  She claimed we did not support her in any effort she made through highschool or college, that she never received praise for her work at school, accomplishments, etc while her other siblings always did.  I believe we made an extra effort to do so because of this very issue but she did not agree.

We traveled together often as a family.  Every trip had trauma associated with it.  We came close to canceling some trips the day before leaving.  We swore we would never go on another one almost every time we returned.  Cruises, international destinations, etc.  Fights over not picking her restaurant, who got which bed, what meal was ordered that she may or may not like.  Every detail was made to be a personal insult to her and showed a total lack of caring or feelings about her emotions.  We would travel to see her at school or during her international semester and she would get angry at the slightest thing.  We traveled to the other side of the world to see her and she got disgusted at us at a dinner and walked away from us.  We traveled a different time to see her and after another argument over something that seemed so trivial she blamed us for coming to see her because she never asked us to do it.  If we asked something, we should have known about it.  If we did not ask, we did not care about her.  We never did enough, we never cared about her.  We never did anything for her.  We supported her financially at a very costly school, sent her on overseas trips, paid for internships that never led to a job and while that was sometimes acknowledged, it was always the thing we did not do that made us horrible parents.  We have heard hundreds of times how we never supported her emotionally that we were always there for her siblings but not for her.

For the most part we all felt like we were walking on eggshells and did our best to avoid doing something that would rip open old wounds or start new ones.  We often just apologized because we saw it as the path of least resistance and one to peace but that peace would not last long.  There was always the next issue.  This summer she was home and stopped talking to her siblings because she thought one slighted her over a boyfriend she could never forgive her for it.  She has left the country (we paid for another opportunity for her) and she has now said she wants nothing to do with us because of all the pain we have caused her and because we always side with her siblings.  I do not believe that is true either.  It is impossible to get her to see that she has any role in this at all and she will only consider trying to work with us if we own up to being 100% responsible for everything.  She has not cut us off and I do not know if she actually will but I worry about that even though it is a relief not to be fighting all the time.

That is where we are now and that is the short story.  For many years we thought we could reason with her but we could not.  Trying to reason with her just made her angrier.  We thought we spoiled her and that is why she was like this.  Then we began researching BPD and seeing many of the characteristics.  Many fit, some do not.  She claims she cut herself when she was younger, I never saw that.  She is not sexually permiscuive and has never done anything with drugs other than maybe trying them in college. Her incredible emotional sensitivity and emotional outbursts and feelings that we never care about her seem to fit pretty well.  We all want to be involved in her life but just about everyone is ready to give up.  I would hate to lose contact with her and I have been told she has to want to change but I see no way that she will ever come to the realization that she at least has some role in all of this.  She is too old to force into therapy.  We tried family therapy and it did nothing.  Now that she is overseas, she will most likely just continue to think it is all our fault.

Sorry for the long post.  If you made it this far, thanks for reading.  After another difficult day emailing her back and forth, it feels good to just let this out.

[D20Something]

First time posting about this.  Appreciate the feedback and support.

We have a 20 something year old daughter who has been a challenge for a number years.  I am sure like most, it is a long story but I will try to make it short.  I am curious if her story is like others here as she has no formal diagnosis yet.

Several years ago we began noticing one daughter was always lashing out at us and her siblings.  At the time we attributed it to some difficulties we had with a boyfriend we thought she was too young to have and how she thought she was treated because of it.  We believed we were being supportive but appropriately concerned parents and instituted boundaries and rules and for the most part she did abide by them.  She blamed us for this and for everything else that she perceived as being a slight to her.  She claimed we did not support her in any effort she made through highschool or college, that she never received praise for her work at school, accomplishments, etc while her other siblings always did.  I believe we made an extra effort to do so because of this very issue but she did not agree.

We traveled together often as a family.  Every trip had trauma associated with it.  We came close to canceling some trips the day before leaving.  We swore we would never go on another one almost every time we returned.  Cruises, international destinations, etc.  Fights over not picking her restaurant, who got which bed, what meal was ordered that she may or may not like.  Every detail was made to be a personal insult to her and showed a total lack of caring or feelings about her emotions.  We would travel to see her at school or during her international semester and she would get angry at the slightest thing.  We traveled to the other side of the world to see her and she got disgusted at us at a dinner and walked away from us.  We traveled a different time to see her and after another argument over something that seemed so trivial she blamed us for coming to see her because she never asked us to do it.  If we asked something, we should have known about it.  If we did not ask, we did not care about her.  We never did enough, we never cared about her.  We never did anything for her.  We supported her financially at a very costly school, sent her on overseas trips, paid for internships that never led to a job and while that was sometimes acknowledged, it was always the thing we did not do that made us horrible parents.  We have heard hundreds of times how we never supported her emotionally that we were always there for her siblings but not for her.

For the most part we all felt like we were walking on eggshells and did our best to avoid doing something that would rip open old wounds or start new ones.  We often just apologized because we saw it as the path of least resistance and one to peace but that peace would not last long.  There was always the next issue.  This summer she was home and stopped talking to her siblings because she thought one slighted her over a boyfriend she could never forgive her for it.  She has left the country (we paid for another opportunity for her) and she has now said she wants nothing to do with us because of all the pain we have caused her and because we always side with her siblings.  I do not believe that is true either.  It is impossible to get her to see that she has any role in this at all and she will only consider trying to work with us if we own up to being 100% responsible for everything.  She has not cut us off and I do not know if she actually will but I worry about that even though it is a relief not to be fighting all the time.

That is where we are now and that is the short story.  For many years we thought we could reason with her but we could not.  Trying to reason with her just made her angrier.  We thought we spoiled her and that is why she was like this.  Then we began researching BPD and seeing many of the characteristics.  Many fit, some do not.  She claims she cut herself when she was younger, I never saw that.  She is not sexually permiscuive and has never done anything with drugs other than maybe trying them in college. Her incredible emotional sensitivity and emotional outbursts and feelings that we never care about her seem to fit pretty well.  We all want to be involved in her life but just about everyone is ready to give up.  I would hate to lose contact with her and I have been told she has to want to change but I see no way that she will ever come to the realization that she at least has some role in all of this.  She is too old to force into therapy.  We tried family therapy and it did nothing.  Now that she is overseas, she will most likely just continue to think it is all our fault.

Sorry for the long post.  If you made it this far, thanks for reading.  After another difficult day emailing her back and forth, it feels good to just let this out.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[snowwhite]

Keep posting and reading here. There is much good advice and support. I am sorry you have been through this. From what you say, you have tried every way to let her know her value to you.

[incadove]

Keep posting and reading here. There is much good advice and support. I am sorry you have been through this. From what you say, you have tried every way to let her know her value to you.

Yes - like snowwhite says, you know you have done everything you could.  I think maybe holding onto that yourself, and reducing how much you react or respond to her accusations, may help.  If she gets no response, or simply a repetition to the effect of "I believe I have supported you and we've already been over this, I'm not going to discuss it further", maybe that would extinguish the accusations.  Then if and when she sends some other message or does anythign positive, react strongly in a positive way to that?  Perhaps easier said than done, but if reasonable behavior gets a stronger reaction than unreasonable, maybe that will help reinforce it.

Good luck, and I hope you find some things to try that are short of cutting contact completely.   

[Lollypop]

Hi D

I'd like to join the others in welcoming you.

My eldest DS26 blames us for all his problems. It's hard to stomach and even more difficult to validate complaints like "you smacked me when I was 6". But it is what it is and, for me, there's no amount of reasoning that will alter his viewpoint at this time. He moved back in with us at 24 and he's very soon going to be 27. He's planning on moving out soon (phew!). My DS sees himself as a victim.

This is about trying to find a way to have a relationship, despite the problems. It can be done through better communication and validation. The skills can be learned here if you want to know more. It doesn't have to be so black or white. There's a grey area in having some interaction and a relationship of sorts.

We all want the same thing: to be loved and understood.

How often do you speak and text with your daughter currently? How are the conversations?

LP

Ps. I did everything to make things better for my DS. This isn't healthy. I learnt that I was just hindering his development. We are in a much better place than we were. He's functioning and soon to be independent.

[D20Something]

Thank you for your words of support.  I can relate exactly to the smacking comment.  When she was a young teenager, she was in an argument with my wife in public.  My wife elbowed her in such as way as to not draw any attention to what was going on.  This is the one and only time that I can every remember either one of us physically touched any of our children.  To this day she brings up the incident that she has a parent who "punched" her.  We can not have a discussion about trying to improve our relationships with her without hearing that.

Until fairly recently we kept in fairly close contact with her.  While at school we would speak a few times a week.  She would never really keep us up to date on what she was doing.  Some part of that is that she probably feel that her siblings include us too much.  I suspect that makes this worse because even though she is the one distancing herself she feels that we do not care.  She won't include us in many of the details of her life, unless she needs something.  If we ask, she wants to keep it private.  If we do not ask, we do not care about her.  In reality, her siblings could probably use some more distance from us which makes the situation worse with her.

She spent most of the year overseas.  She had a few jobs which paid very little and we supported her about 90%.   All we hear is how much better she manages her life than her siblings.  The truth is we probably have supported all of them more than we should have.  We paid for her housing, travel and most of her living expenses.  I made sure she had good housing, health insurance, etc. We did so because we wanted her to be happy but part of it was probably due to our need to try and show how much we care about her and want her to be happy.  Looking back, it did nothing.  We kept in touch a fair bit.  We tended to get along with only some fighting until we all went to visit her and it was a horrible week.  She felt we never picked her restaurant, her activity and we were told we should never have come to visit.

She came home for a few months and blamed us all for not making a big enough deal for her homecoming.  She kept talking about no party, no cake, etc.  I continue to hear that.  It got worse and she completely stopped talking to her siblings and even left without telling them she was leaving with no known return date.  She has stated she won't talk to them until we all acknowledge the mistakes we have made.  Everyone else has had it, I continue to want to think it can be better but am coming to the realization it can not.  This has been a long time in the making.  I have read about the way to deal with this but it is a hard path to follow.  We both come from very close families which has probably made this happen to some degree but also makes it worse to live through as well.

[Lollypop]

Hi Do20

I hear you and yes it is very hard to find a way to come to terms.

As was pointed out to me last week, maybe when my DS is fully independent his attitude and behaviour will change. I'm not holding my breath.

I had a plan that I found helpful for me to focus on that moved him forwards towards financial independence. It helped me keep to my priorities and not sweat the small stuff. We couldn't provide an endless stream of money and had used up our savings trying to "help". Things didn't improve until we set that limit. To behave like an adult he needdd to be treated like one. This kind of approach seemed alien to me but I Hadn't appreciated his limited mental reasoning skills. My DS learns by his mistakes. Actually that's how we all learn.

LP

[D20Something]

I will not hold my breath either.  I have tried to find some solace in the idea that we want her to be happy.  She seems happier if we do not have as much to do with her yet I feel happier with a connection to her, even if it makes us miserable!  I am trying to frame some of this as "at least she will be happy".  I have not been able to understand that why, if we are so horrible and make her so miserable, she still has had any contact with us.  This time does seem different in that she may actually distance herself at least for now.  My concern is that the more distance we allow there to take place, the more it confirms to her that we do not care and she is not part of the family which makes her distance herself more, etc., etc.  A cycle I have to realize I can not fix.

[Feeling Better]

Hi D20Something

I have read your posts with great interest and can definitely relate to them, so you know that you are not alone there.

My 35 year old son who has undiagnosed BPD traits has lived in different countries since he graduated from university at the age of 21 so the times that we have spent together have been few and far between but our relationship has deteriorated drastically over the past five years.

Like your daughter he expected the grand homecoming every time he returned home, he did get it the first few times but then him going off somewhere and coming back again became the norm and we didn't realise he still expected the big welcome home.

My son is the youngest in the family, he has two sisters, one of whom he hates, he says that she is evil and wants nothing to do with her or her family. He says that I sacrificed my relationship with him for the relationship with his sister.

I think that like you, we thought that we did too much for our son, we also thought that we had spoiled him, always happy to help him whenever he needed it, always there for him, expecting nothing in return because we knew there would be nothing in return.

Contact when he was living abroad was like yours with your daughter, we were never included in any details of his life although we tried very hard to show him that we were interested but nothing was ever forthcoming.

I most definitely get where you are coming from with the hoping she is happy scenario. I like to feel that way too about my son, that at least he is happy away from us, but my gut feeling is that he won't be, his demons will follow him wherever he goes, he thinks it's us, he blames us for everything that is wrong in his life and I cannot see any change to that in the near future.

So my heart goes out to you but do not give up, your daughter needs you, if only she knew it x

[incadove]

Feeling Better, D20Something that idea of 'want him to be happy' really resonates with me, that's actually the central part of the 'metta' meditation and I use that a lot when a relationship is going negative.  It starts with wanting yourself to be happy!  Then wanting someone close, then someone who you're having difficulties with, and just focusing on the intention of that person to be happy. 

So, I'm thinking now I am hoping you will be happy!  And you Lollypop!     

At least, to be in a centered place and knowing you tried your best.  Because it sure sounds like you have.

[D20Something]

Hi D20Something


My son is the youngest in the family, he has two sisters, one of whom he hates, he says that she is evil and wants nothing to do with her or her family. He says that I sacrificed my relationship with him for the relationship with his sister.


Very similar here.  She has a poor relationship with both of her sibilings.  She rarely spoke to one and at least kept in contact with the other often sending texts about roomates, etc. at school.  Not surprisingly most were about how horrible the roomates were, how they did something to slight her, etc.  I get the sense the same can be said about boyfriends although she has never kept us informed about those relationships.  They seem to end on very bad terms with the same amount of hurt and very similar accusations about what the BF is doing or not caring.

It has always been amazing to me that she keeps some contact with us and I have tried to find some comfort that she must want some type of relationship with her siblings and parents.  This summer she totally cut off the one sibling she used to keep in touch with.  We tried hard to encourage their relationship.  We sent them on a number of trips together.  There was always, always a huge issue/fight that would happen.  Again, we just thought they were spoiled and did not appreciate the opportunities they got but we are learning differently now.

[adoptivemama]

I'm right there with you. My daughter is 19 and just returned from an overseas trip that was not what she expected at all. She was kicked out of her first host home, and the second one was trying to kick her out too. They fell fast from a very high pedestal when they didn't treat her as she dreamed of being treated. She idealizes each new adventure and parental figure, and they always disappoint. It's hard for me to get her to seek closure with people because she's quick to write them off.

You must be so worried about your daughter since she has cut you off. The jealousy with siblings is very familiar to me too. My daughter imagines that she is the "cinderella" and her step brothers are treated like princes. She really seems to see a whole different version of reality.

Keep reading up on BPD. It's good to know you're not alone.

--AnotherMama

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[jones54]

D20something,
I understand your pain. I will not repeat my long suffering story(you can read my thread) but I have a 32 year old daughter who blames me for everything that is not right with her life. She has a younger brother age 29 (married and happy) who she has nothing to do with and has always felt we treated him better. Yes, in years past when we traveled together it was terrible. No fun at all. She was terrible. I do see something in your threads that reminds me of myself. Often we do not see the codependency we have in ourselves. We are happy when they are happy. I have suffered with that for years. My daughter knows that and will manipulate me to make me feel bad since she feels bad. I have to fight this and understand she is an adult and I cannot make her happy, only she can. My daughter has severe addiction issues, be thankful your daughter does not because it only compounds the situation. I also feel we are the helicopter parent generation. We have done way more for our kids than our parents ever did for us. We have hovered over them way too much and that has not been beneficial to them to be responsible for themselves. I have come to the point that I am no longer willing to accept my daughter's behavior. So I have decided to step back. Your daughter may do this anyways but she is an adult. This is painful to all of us because we want a good relationship with them. I know exactly how it is for you. We go to get together with them and look so forward to it because we love them so much. But then we arrive, we only get slapped in the face. This has been repeated so many times. I say to myself, if I acted this way toward my parents what would they have done? Not what I have always done... .just keep getting slapped in the face again and again. Hang in there.