DD19 back home refusing PHP

[Daisy123]

Hi folks,
My DD19 came home on Tuesday, did an intake assessment on Weds. The intake person told her that she needed 6 weeks of PHP at 7 days a week. DD came downstairs in a fit telling her father that she won’t attend this PHP that has DBT and is well known in the city (Chicago’s Insight Therapy program). The agreement when in rehab was- refuse treatment and the phone goes off. Now she wants to explore another PHP, so I said, that I was putting thru a call to her family doc to get a referral for the PHP. We expect her to be in treatment by Friday. If she chooses to go, she can have her phone. If not, she understands the consequences. She called her therapist late Wednesday night in hopes that therapist could recommend her to another PHP. My husband is at his wits end, he said that tight feeling in his chest is back and so is the stress. He’s usually my rock, so I listened to him with as much compassion. He just kept saying that he wants her to go away. Now I’ve woke and need to ready myself for work and feel as if I am wearing lead boots. I, too have a mental illness, bipolar depression. So I just need to find the strength to get off to work. I am struggling. We have a time bomb ticking. Tomorrow I take her phone if she refuses and I am
Planning on staying home tomorrow because husband says someone’s got to be here to make sure DD doesn’t lose it and have a violent fit. Dread, exhaustion... .

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123

Oh Daisy123 I'm so sorry to hear this and the awful stress you and your husband are under, has he seen a Dr?  You've been clear as mud what's expected and the consequences. We are here with you Daisy123. Do you have a therapist supporting you and your husband through this?  I ask as I know 1hope has found it so very helpful providing confidence, support navigating the way forward, she's in a similar situation with her 19DD not engaging in treatment at the moment, you may have read some of her posts.

I'm routing that your DD has a change of heart.

Big hugs to you  , perhaps catch you later after you finish work.

WDx

[Daisy123]

Thank you Wendy, for your kind words of support. Reading about1hope and her finding her way through treatment refusal is comforting. It reminds me of just how many different paths we, parents, must take in order to not just survive, but thrive in these extremely difficult circumstances. I have a therapist who is rooting me on and helping me remain firm on my boundaries.

Eat in the kitchen
No drugs in the house
Seek treatment or phone goes off.

She is quite stubborn and her brain shuts down into black and white thinking.
I’ve had some good news, Family Connections will be holding a their 12 week course about an hour and a half away. So I’ve decided to take it with or without the husband. At least one of us can get some support and training. And I’m afraid I’m really good at using shaming language. So I look forward to learn how better to listen and think more clearly before I speak.

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123

I'm glad you gained some comfort from 1hope's posts, I've found it so helpful following other's progress, thanks everyone  . That's great news you're attending Family Connections, do you have a start date? You've reminded me that Yepanotherone joins the teleconference programme that starts in March.  

Are you managing your bipolar, depression ok with all the stress?  It took a good two years for my 29DD to get her meds right for depression, anxiety, psychosis. And while she's managing her BPD very well following DBT she's recently raised she's believes there is more, that she is bi-polar, what she's feeling doesn't fit BPD. She's seeking out an assessment, time will tell.

Remaining firm on your boundaries, if you've not come across this yet, here's an interesting workshop on Boundaries and Values and Boundaries - examples

I hope you get some time this weekend for you

WDx

[Daisy123]

Hello again, Wendydarling,
I’ve taken up your suggestion to read up on boundaries. Wow! I’ve much to learn. The biggest takeaway about boundaries is remaining true to one’s values. Setting boundaries takes some getting to know one’s self! I’m
Exploring what it is I value most; compassion, respect and not sure about the rest. Kindness, perhaps? More importantly, boundaries are not so much about changing another person or making them do what you want. Both of those have something to do with boundaries. Boundaries are also an expression of how you treat others. So if I value kindness, I must treat myself with kindness as well as treat others with kindnesss. In return, my expectation is to be treated with kindness. If one doesn’t, than I can choose to defend my boundary- in a kind, perhaps, firm way. It all depends on the situation. I value self care, therefore I will care for myself and expect my daughter to do the same. Seek treatment because it is what helps you take care and heal. I am expecting my DD19 to get care and I will reinforce this boundary with consequences, both positive and negative. I know I will need to remain flexible as a healthy boundary (as I’ve learned from that post) is flexible. Much more to learn about myself, my boundaries and my values. Thanks, Wendydarling for sharing and sending me into that direction.

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123  

Yes, wow - after sending you the link I re-read the whole workshop  , including the link to family systems.  There is so much good stuff in there, nice summary Daisy. When we speak of boundaries we are really speaking about our personal values and our need to get them in focus and live with more conviction. This is a lifestyle, not a quick fix to an interpersonal squabble. Boundaries often get misunderstood with enforcing boundaries which govern our behaviors, with trying to enforce rules that would govern the behavior of others. Interesting you mention kindness as a value, my DD and I were talking values, she's chosen kindness - I asked how she'd chosen that - she said BPD killed her kindness (I think she was referring to during her 2+year crisis) and DBT helped her regain kindness and it feels so good. That was a tear jerker for me. With all the life changes we make here through our learning it seems like an  appropriate time to revisit our values. I found getting values down to the top 3 HARD, at the moment my top 3 are strength, honesty and love, that's my first cut. Anyone else want to join in and share theirs?

WDx

[Yepanotherone]

Hi there Daisy   I too am doing the family connections course , just started last night . I’m doing the teleconference one . I hid myself away in the bedroom in the basement so that I wouldn’t be disturbed! I don’t want my DD to know I’m doing it . I’m not sure why I haven’t told her . I might figure that out as the course progresses !

[Yepanotherone]

Oh and ps ... .I too used “ shame “ talking frequently when I didn’t know what I was dealing with . I’ve managed to reign it in and take more time to think before I respond but when in the throws of things , I’ve said some pretty shameful things to my DD . It comes mainly from fear and sheer frustration “ in the moment “ and it was my way of trying to get her to see sense . Of course we all realize at some point in the proceedings, that what makes perfect sense to us makes absolutely no sense to our BPD loved ones and they interpret what we say and put a spectacular spin on it ! 

[Daisy123]

Hello Folks,
Yep-so glad to hear you are in family connections! Would love to hear all about your meetings. I will begin March 22. I am actually meeting with people and am surprised at the short wait. Been on a list since November 2017.

Follow up on DD19-still refusing to go to PHP, we still have her phone. All in all, it is surprisingly calm at home. I must admit, I am a wreck. Can't focus, hard time getting up to get off to work.

I've thought a great deal about my values and establishing boundaries. The one I am having most difficulty is surrendering the the fact that I cannot do this for her. I see her in pain, she is suffering, eating out the entire kitchen, sleeping most of the day and getting up to do a chore or two in the home. I watch and am overtaken with the sad fact that there is absolutely nothing I can do for her.

I am working on accepting that all I really have control over is my own behavior, how well I take care of me, so that I am better off at interacting with her. DD19 reads me so well. She'll ask when I slip into that sadness of acceptance, "what's bothering you?"

There is nothing I can do but, just watch, listen and speak.

I've thought that an expectation of getting to treatment was something that she could make happen. I may just have to accept that she is not ready yet.

I just hope she doesn't fall back into using drugs again.

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123

I'm sorry you are zero'd out, you've been through a very stressful and difficult time, can you take this moment of calm to breath, your DD is. I'm guessing giving up her mobile has given her some relief, you deserve that too. Thing is often when we get depleted we can be all consumed and it's hard to get up and do something that brings us relief, a massage, a gentle swim, something that takes us completely away from our normal surroundings. There are other things we can do to change the dynamics at home, look at bluek9 - she hired a housekeeper, it's taken the pressure off, if you and H are working a bit of help a couple of times a week may make all the difference, it'll also change your DD's perspective perhaps. Small incremental changes, slowly.

I understand the pain you see in your DD - takes our breath away, I've seen my DD's pain, it's heartbreaking and it's very scary, we were going through attempts, harm - fuelled by alcohol, hospitalisation cycles, never knew what was coming.

When I first joined here, I read all the tools and lessons (in my own good time, as we do   and I have learnt from parents some tools shout out to us, yes I'll master this, is appropriate to my situation and that's very important we all have a starting point here, then we've learnt more additionally along the road, they've made a huge difference too.

I'd like to share with you and others this, it was the resource here that helped me in my early days, calmed my DD and gained her trust when she was in very scary place all alone, desperate. My DD is a quiet pw BPD. I do think you are right working on values and boundaries Daisy123, trying out different tools can help us too, reach out.

Listen with Empathy I cry everytime I watch  

1.14 | How to be more Empathetic to the pw BPD in our life

My DD reads me well too, they can be the most perceptive people we know, my DD feels my feelings. "What's bothering you" is she taking this opportunity to connect with you, communicate real stuff?

Small gentle steps, for now if DD is at home is she away from drugs? My DD stayed home to stay away from alcohol and just be.

WDx

[Daisy123]

Hi folks,
Thanks for all of the support and advice. I watched the video, ‘Listening with Empathy’ very powerful! Making that a priority- listening with empathy is now on my list of top 5 things to do, with it nearing number one. Again, this is a reminder of where I have power. It so easy to feel powerless in this disease.
Last night, my DD got hold of our computer and FB friends and found someone to get high with. At first she rolled out a lie-that she was meeting friends to hang out. I offered to give her a ride and she said that an Uber was picking her up- she’s no money to pay for an uber. So I sat her down and said, “If you are going off the wagon, I’d just have you tell me the truth.” She told me the truth - that she was meeting up with a boy named xxxx to smoke weed and promised to call me from his phone. We’ve taken her phone and said she can have it back when she begins a PHP. That promise came when I said that “I needed his name
And address just in case something goes wrong and you don’t come back home.”
She went out at 11:00 at night, texted me his phone. Thank goodness I had a friend over. She was wonderful and sat with me till DD returned at 1:30 in the morning. Dd thanked my friend for sitting with me, took her meds and watched tv. I went to bed.

So after 3 weeks of hemming and hawing and several phonecallls later, my DD plans to do an intake assessment at a PHP that does DBT and Acceptance therapy. The appointment is at 9 a.m. so I am not holding my breath. DD suffers from nightly nightmares and often awakes feeling awful from them. I asked her to imagine waking tomorrow feeling awful- what was her plan? This is one reason she has difficulty getting anywhere. I’m not going to hold my breath, but have taken tomorrow off work on the chance that she’s able to get herself up and get to this intake assessment.
Keep us in your thoughts. Maybe Monday will be the day she takes the next step to healing.
She’s had no phone or computer for the last several weeks and somehow managed to get the computer to work for her last night.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123

It's a great video isn't it and the workshop.

You certainly are both in my thoughts, I hope your DD makes the assessment and sorry to hear about the nightmares as if they haven't enough to cope with, has she been suffering them for long? Is this a different PHP to the one you chose?

I'm glad you had a good friend with your when your DD went out, it's a nerve racking time, she came home safely is a success for her and I hope she's able to rack the successes as time goes by. Does she go to any drug/alcohol follow up appointments since discharge?

Good luck for Monday.

WDx

[Hyacinth Bucket]

Good luck Daisy! Will be thinking of you tomorrow. Let us know how it goes.

[Daisy123]

No luck She didn’t make it yesterday, made
another appt. today, slept through that appt. she’s still in bed and it’s after 2 p.m.
Plan B is for DD to return to therapy- although it’s not DBT, twice a week. She’s been with this therapist since she was 14 and was just diagnosed with BPD this November. I had a good cry. I’m just really sad she won’t go into a PHP with DBT. I had hopes that perhaps she’d go into recovery.
Thanks for all of your support.
I’m off to Family Connections- my first class Thursday night.

[wendydarling]

Hi Daisy123

I’m so sorry she didn’t make it. It is sad, you see your DD desperately needs help and help is there. I can imagine you sitting there waiting, it’s upsetting. You are doing your very best Daisy123 she’s lucky she has you rooting for her you have her best interests at heart.  

Plan B.  It’s a positive she’s in therapy. I spoke to my DD about her opting for treatment and thinking back to when she was 19 might that have been an option she’d have considered if she’d been diagnosed. She said that she wasn’t ready, at that age she was ‘ant-therapy’ in the sense she wondered how people sat and talked about themselves with someone, it certainly was not for her. It took the crisis for her to accept she needed help. What I’m trying to say your DD may feel differently with time, there is hope.  I’ve learnt to manage my expectations I work at my DD’s speed, change my approach.

I hope the family connections programme goes well and look forward to hearing about it. I’m wondering whether to sign up myself.

How are you manging juggling all this with your job?

WDx