looking for tools to help with my next conversation w upwBPD gf

[truthbeknown]

"Should I use "Bettering" or the "Conflicted Board": The "Improving an Ongoing Relationship" board is for members looking to solve specific relationship problems, to be coached on the use of relationship tools, and to examine their role in relationship conflict."

I think i'm in the right place?

I have a meeting tomorrow morning on video chat with my gf and while i'm conflicted on whether to stay or go I really need some help in a few areas:

1. when we have done this in the past over arguments and I see her she is angry looking and that alone triggers me immediately.  It's part PTSD for being blamed by former BPD wife and so I already (when I see this) feel my tolerance level nose diving.  So question number one would be how do I keep myself from being triggered knowing that she is still mad and going to blame me or force me to validate her.  She likes it when I say, "I acknowledge that I hurt your feelings."   But according to one of the videos on here that can be validating the negative vs the real core issue.  So i'm confused how to validate without taking responsibility for hurting her when in fact she is projecting because she yelled at me or framed me as a person who thinks he is superior to her?

2.  I was the one who created a boundary about her behavior.  I want to talk about values without getting into blaming but if I say, " I value respect and since you were being disrespectful to me by referring to me as a superior being I ended the conversation because I won't tolerate being treated like that?"    So isn't stating my boundary still kind've blaming?

3.  We both had a short text exchange and I led the way by saying that my intended outcome for the conversation was to reconnect the friendship part of our relationship, peace and harmony between us.  She responded today with wanting the same thing. 

In the past she has held me emotional hostage after I put up a boundary by being short and not really wanting much contact until I acknowledge that I hurt her.  This feels like emotional blackmail so like I stated in point 1.  I'm a little confused where to go with this because it feels like I might trigger her if I don't validate this perception.  In the past as soon as I validate the way she wants me to she switches to like a "little girl mode" and smiles and wants to be playful.  It's weird because it feels like she is playing with me.   I've seen those movies where the psychopath holds someone prisoner and then even though they are in distress the person wants them to act like everything is okay and once they do it then the abuser is elated and joyful again.  I'm not saying she is that bad but it brings up a trigger to think (this person's got no empathy what the heck am I doing here?). 

I'll wait until someone responds because that is probably enough right now to go over.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[once removed]

I think i'm in the right place?

yes. Conflicted is for long term couples who have exhausted the tools, dont want to use the tools, or primarily want to vent. Detaching is also for members who are out of the relationship for at least a month, and have made the determination they arent going back.

She likes it when I say, "I acknowledge that I hurt your feelings."   But according to one of the videos on here that can be validating the negative vs the real core issue.  So i'm confused how to validate without taking responsibility for hurting her when in fact she is projecting because she yelled at me or framed me as a person who thinks he is superior to her?

think of the relationship tools in terms of a lifestyle - in terms of fire prevention, rather than running around putting out fires. the solution to a conflict is not "validate your partners feelings"...thats a small, sometimes important part of it. but generally, its important to make your relationship one that is a validating environment overall.

validation is about more than saying the right thing in a given moment. its about making a person feel heard. validation, and any of the communication tools need to be personalized, sincere, and authentic, or our partners will see right through them, and sense that we are talking down, condescending, speaking to them "like a therapist", or just trying to make the problem go away.

to your point, im not sure that "i acknowledge that i hurt your feelings" is validating the invalid. it is not agreeing with her feelings. it is not an admission of "wrong doing". it is acknowledgment, which is what validation is at the end of the day.

2.  I was the one who created a boundary about her behavior.  I want to talk about values without getting into blaming but if I say, " I value respect and since you were being disrespectful to me by referring to me as a superior being I ended the conversation because I won't tolerate being treated like that?"    So isn't stating my boundary still kind've blaming?

this might be a misguided idea of what boundaries are, and are not. boundaries, like the other tools, are a lifestyle that reflect our values, not the behavior of others. theyre not a specific response to be pulled out to use in a time of conflict. if you value respect in your relationship, you live it. you give it. you expect it. you lead your relationship in a direction of mutual respect. it might mean taking a time out when things have deteriorated.

yes, what youre stating is blaming, and its an emotionally loaded response. it essentially says "if youre snarky with me im cutting you off", and that does paint you as superior. more over, if you remain in the relationship, you will tolerate that. this is the risk when we have murky boundaries..they become more about a way to state what the other person shall do or not do, which we have little to no control over.

In the past she has held me emotional hostage after I put up a boundary by being short and not really wanting much contact until I acknowledge that I hurt her

what happened? what was the fight about, and who said what?

[truthbeknown]

yes. Conflicted is for long term couples who have exhausted the tools, dont want to use the tools, or primarily want to vent. Detaching is also for members who are out of the relationship for at least a month, and have made the determination they arent going back.

think of the relationship tools in terms of a lifestyle - in terms of fire prevention, rather than running around putting out fires. the solution to a conflict is not "validate your partners feelings"...thats a small, sometimes important part of it. but generally, its important to make your relationship one that is a validating environment overall.

validation is about more than saying the right thing in a given moment. its about making a person feel heard. validation, and any of the communication tools need to be personalized, sincere, and authentic, or our partners will see right through them, and sense that we are talking down, condescending, speaking to them "like a therapist", or just trying to make the problem go away.

to your point, im not sure that "i acknowledge that i hurt your feelings" is validating the invalid. it is not agreeing with her feelings. it is not an admission of "wrong doing". it is acknowledgment, which is what validation is at the end of the day.

this might be a misguided idea of what boundaries are, and are not. boundaries, like the other tools, are a lifestyle that reflect our values, not the behavior of others. theyre not a specific response to be pulled out to use in a time of conflict. if you value respect in your relationship, you live it. you give it. you expect it. you lead your relationship in a direction of mutual respect. it might mean taking a time out when things have deteriorated.  

Well, I guess i'm not understanding then because she framed me negatively after I just flew in to see my kids in another state and made the effort to reach out to her I felt disrespected by her picking a fight with over having a different opinion then her.  I think she took my words as invalidating her choice about something when I was just stating something from my experience.  I know pwBPD can be ultra sensitive so it's difficult when i'm tired and just trying to have a conversation with my beloved to guard everything I say.   It's hard to predict what she will be sensitive too and what she won't.  So she said, "you know you think you are so superior to everyone" and I said, "okay, listen, i'm tired and I'm gonna go now and we can talk more about this tomorrow."  First she said, "okay have a good night"   Then my phone died and she called several times and sent me messages "I guess you blocked me!"     As soon as my phone came on again I sent her a message clarifying that I didn't block her that my phone died.  She argued and texted that that's not possible and she doesn't believe me.    I was so upset by this and really didn't want to confront her until after the weekend so I sent an email (because she wasn't answering I thought she blocked me as a reaction to thinking that I blocked her) and I basically said if she thought I was such a superior person and someone who would go to the extremes to block then maybe i'm not the right guy for her?   obviously I was hurt but I ended by saying if this is not true then lets talk on Monday after i'm done visiting my family and I will have more time to address your  concerns.    She reacted negatively (which I can see now was a mistake on my part to vent my hurt feelings) and pushed our conversation off until this weekend (one whole week).  I tried to reach out several times through text and she was very short with me.   I have seen her do this to her mom, her dad, her sister, and a friend that she worked for.  In all cases when she feels unheard or mistreated she punishes by cutting off communication.  She must have forgotten that I have seen her do this to them?  Anyway, today we talked I was going to really try hard not to trigger her and to talk about things we both could improve on and she started out the conversation saying " i'll be brave and break up with you.  Nothing you say is going to change that so now I just need to vent."  I listened for 30 minutes before she let me talk.  We wound up talking for 2.5 hours and by the time it ended she started to feel safe with me again and said "I wish you were like this last Friday when I called you superior".  I said, "I'm not perfect and have told you that since we met and I'm wondering if you can cut me slack for things that you find that I do wrong? "   It took her awhile and she smiled and then said, "but I already broke up with you so we can't fix this now."  I tried to defer by saying "well can we agree to be kind to each other and keep the door open for future conversations?"   She agreed but wanted to know why. She wanted to know what I would say to her.  So I told her what I had planned on telling her.  She cried some more and said "I hate you" which I know means "I love you" in her way of saying that.  So apparently now we agree to talk in a couple of months after we both get through a tough time.  What a wild ride.  

yes, what youre stating is blaming, and its an emotionally loaded response. it essentially says "if youre snarky with me im cutting you off", and that does paint you as superior. more over, if you remain in the relationship, you will tolerate that. this is the risk when we have murky boundaries..they become more about a way to state what the other person shall do or not do, which we have little to no control over.
I didn't see this post until after the conversation but I didn't say anything like that to her.  I mostly talked about my behavior and re-enforced that I know she was scared and hurt by my email.  I later got to explain why I was scared and hurt as well.  she seemed to soften up.  However,  she was doing more projection then she has done in a long time.  She uses things that I tell her when she allows me to give my perspective on what I see.  So mostly she has been in a place where she would welcome my perspective so she can work towards improving things with us.  Somehow she was picking up that I might not "keep her" and so the attacks and projections came out (I believe).  I'm not saying that I didn't contribute to this last week.  Again, I was tired, in a place where I was already rejected by my kids and I had just gotten there to see them.  My ex had already created drama and now my gf was framing me the same way I told her my ex does. So that is why I was hurt.  So i'm cutting myself some slack because I was triangulated between a lot of dysfuction and I guess I was hoping or expecting to have a gf that would support me emotionally during this visit. Instead it felt like she needed to steal the show.   I totally vented this to her in my email and I admit I think I was so frustrated that I started emulating her behavior.  Darn- this is so hard!    I love her but don't know that this is a healthy relationship for me.   I think the behavior could get worse if we lived together?  she seems like she will always be the one to want to dominate me when she feels threatened and since that is so sporatic, I would have to be a total "yes man" to please her and to remain in the relationship?   I'm exhausted but wanted to fill you in on what happened.