Looking back, were there early signs in your children?

[I Am Redeemed]

Hi.

I am just wondering if any of you with BPD children (or suspected, but undiagnosed) BPD children are able to look back and identify behaviors or other red flags that you know now were early signs of developing mental illness.

My son will be 5 next month. His father is undiagnosed but fits the criteria for not only BPD, but Paranoid Personality Disorders and some traits of Anti-Social PD. Mental illness (including but not limited to personality disorder traits) run in my ex's family.

My son has aggressive behaviors that are escalating. I just had to take him out of daycare today because I have been called twice in a row to come pick him up because he was out of control with hitting other kids and destroying things in the daycare when he was put in time-out. The director said she just can't handle him anymore, so I made the decision to seek alternative child care for him.

I've researched and found that his behaviors could be symptoms of various disorders. I am searching around for a child therapist to get him evaluated. I just am a little worried because of the history of BPD traits on his dad's side of the family.

Have any of you been able to look back to when your kids were little and notice early behaviors that were warning signs?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[zachira]

I don't know if I am exactly answering your question, though I hope what I have experienced may be helpful. There is a long history of many kinds of mental illness on both my mother's and father's sides of the family. My mother had BPD, and I have noticed that my sister and brother have struggled since childhood with emotional dysregulation that comes out of nowhere just like my mother did. My sister and brother are also extremely paronoid with no real capacity for insight, especially when emotionally dysregulating just like mom. I remember these signs of mental illness in both my brother and sister from when they were small children, around four or five years of age. I feel sad for you as you love your son and want the best for him. Kudos to you for seeking out therapy for your son. There are some really excellent child therapists out there, and early intervention can be key in getting the best outcomes for your son's future.

[I Am Redeemed]

Thanks, zachira, the emotional dysregulation is a huge issue that I am concerned about. I know kids this age can be prone to tantrums and have difficulty expressing emotions but hitting people, including teachers, pulling things off shelves, throwing things, especially after trying to help him find alternatives for expressing anger- I need to find out why he's doing this and what to do to help him.

I am not sure if this could be due to unresolved trauma from witnessing domestic violence, though we left before he was two years old. I'm sure the impact of his father disappearing from his life has affected him as well.

These traumas combined with the mental health history lead me to think we need professional support.

The teacher told me that the aggression comes out of nowhere,  but on further exploration I was able to gather from him that he lashes out when another kid has a toy he wants or if he perceives that another kid is going to take a toy from him. He also dysregulates when asked to do things like line up to go outside or to take turns washing hands. Once he dysregulates, it takes considerable effort to get him calm again and he cannot self soothe.

[zachira]

The domestic violence for sure could be a big factor as well as inherited problems with emotional dysregulation. Your being there for your son, staying close by while letting him know it is his job to calm himself down and staying calm yourself can help him to learn emotional regulation skills. I recommend reading" Beyond Consequences, Logic, and Control: A Love Based Approach to Helping Children with Severe Behaviors". Your son is lucky to have you.

[I Am Redeemed]

The domestic violence for sure could be a big factor as well as inherited problems with emotional dysregulation. Your being there for your son, staying close by while letting him know it is his job to calm himself down and staying calm yourself can help him to learn emotional regulation skills. I recommend reading" Beyond Consequences, Logic, and Control: A Love Based Approach to Helping Children with Severe Behaviors". Your son is lucky to have you.

Thank you zachira

I ordered "The Whole Brain Child" at my T's suggestion. I will look for the ones you suggested too!

[formflier]

Hey I Am Redeemed

Something I should likely write more about is my wife's teaching (1st grade) and the "niche" she seems to have found.

She appears to be excellent with acting out children.

So...kids that toss chairs..."table flippers"...kids that will literally start hollering and running around the school hallways, kids that just can't keep their hands off others (you get the picture).

She is now part of the crisis team at her school and her input is sought out at lots of district meetings.

So...imagine me sitting on the couch trying to keep my poker face on as my wife...yeah...Mrs FF...is talking to me about strategies to keep her amygdala under control.  ( I mean..you can't make this stuff up... )

She really focuses on getting to know the kid and trying to understand motivation...although broadly..most of the time the motivation is "attention", even if I have to do something negative to get it.

Then there is kinda a long process of taking less disruptive steps.

She has a thing in her room called the "calming corner".  All of her students get introduced to it..so it's a normal thing (even though most will never use it).

Then there is lots of redirection with positive praise when a kid goes to calming corner (even if it still kinda loud).

When there are unhelpful outbursts there is much less attention given or perhaps alone time (I would hesitate to describe this as  "punishment")   The clear goal is for them to get something desired so they seek out it out by doing the right thing.

Obviously I'm a fan of getting a T, but I think that something you can do right now is start talking about "calming" in a very matter of fact way.

Just like hand washing...being neat (or neater) at the table so it's not such a mess...good bathroom habits...etc etc.  It's just something we do.

Do you ever see this stuff (outbursts) at home?

Best,

FF

[I Am Redeemed]

Hi, FF,

He does do these things at home, usually when something doesn't go his way. He definitely does things for attention, particularly if I have something to do that doesn't include him (such as writing a paper or participating in zoom class). If you have never tried to write a research paper while a 4 year old is having a meltdown because he wants you to play with him, I don't recommend it.

Since he was a baby, I noticed that redirection or distraction didn't work for him. Once his mind locks on to something that he wants,  he doesn't let go of it and he will cry for thirty to forty-five minutes over not getting something he wants. Sometimes this includes throwing things. I try to remain calm and help him put words to his feelings, I had some short-lived success with teaching him to count to calm down, but the episodes keep happening.

I do think that the environment of this particular daycare was not conducive for him. Large room with the 2/3 year old class and 4/5 year old class separated only by a swinging gate, no quiet corner for an overstimulated kid to get a break.

[Stolen]

My youngest (now 21) was always "emotionally sensitive".  I never knew all these other words/traits/behaviors to apply, so that was my best description.  From an early age (single digits definitely) she would react to situations in ways that made you just rock back on your heels and wonder "why?".    A planned trip to Disney would result in a screaming, inconsolable fit on the floor.  She could never explain what it was that gave her the pain...   

Smart as a whip, now finishing college on the highest Dean's list.  But she seemed to lack any real childhood joy, and a real inability/desire to express herself. 

Her mother's enlistment of her  in Mother's secret Lesbian quest, and supporting plan to execute it, did little to settle her as she approached her teen years.  As Mother Dearest had virtually cemented her enmeshment,  I should not have been so shocked that my (gentle, healable) unfolding of an origami flower would be met with an on-the-floor screaming fit for me to "move out! just move out! by my then 12 year old daughter.

I have not seen her or heard her voice (or her sister's - 24) in over 4 1/2 years. 

So, yes,  there were signs.  And in hindsight, there were three prior generations of signs.   Stupid Me, I just thought it was because they were Italian...

[formflier]

D10 is emotionally sensitive.  I've had to adopt a completely different parenting style with her because she will get in an oppositional place.

It really doesn't matter..if I say go she wants to come, if I say come she wants to go.  Also sensitivity to foods and textures, sometimes to clothes.

In the past year or two she has gotten a lot better at being able to express her emotions (like saying I'm really mad) and advocate for herself and what she needs/wants.

Still...it's exhausting

Best,

FF

[I Am Redeemed]

D10 is emotionally sensitive.  I've had to adopt a completely different parenting style with her because she will get in an oppositional place.

It really doesn't matter..if I say go she wants to come, if I say come she wants to go.  Also sensitivity to foods and textures, sometimes to clothes.

In the past year or two she has gotten a lot better at being able to express her emotions (like saying I'm really mad) and advocate for herself and what she needs/wants.

Still...it's exhausting

Best,

FF

S4 has distinct preferences around clothes and food. There is only one style of shoes he will wear. He refuses to wear socks, ever, and will take them off if I even succeed in getting them on him. He resists wearing pants and jackets and is still fighting to wear shorts every day (it's still 65-75 degrees here, granted). Super picky about food and likes things you wouldn't expect (black olives, baked beans) while rejecting a lot of usual kid faves (hates cheese, spaghetti, mashed potatoes).

He refused to eat at daycare a lot because he didn't like what was offered. So of course that made him more irritable because he was hungry.

[formflier]

I will tell you that having my P has been invaluable in steering me into parenting "this type" of child.

You would think after doing 6 of them...you would have this stuff down.

I will tell you that D10 has been very humbling to me and also made me reflect back with regret on me being a judgmental azz in my earlier years about seeing kids act up in public and "those parents should."

Yes parenting matters...not letting us off the hook but there are extremes that come along and kids that are fundamentally "wired differently"

You know me..Mr Military...could you ever imagine me giving up good order and discipline around meal time...respecting the cook and trying all the food...finishing your plate...or having the unfinished plate show up for breakfast the next morning...(and I still advocate those things for "mid range" children...I've kinda given up using the word "normal")

Plus...once I started seeing the new methods work better (again..staying away from "fixed") and getting a good education on how eating disorders get formed and those kinda things...wow...whole new world.

For us macaroni and cheese is the king for D10...and then we add some multi-vitamins and then offer some rewards here and there "for trying" foods and oddly enough, once the pressure was off...from time to time she would/will try something and usually loves it, but then will skip it for several more weeks.

She has never said it this way, but my assumption is there is lots of "out of control" internal feelings, so giving her lots of control of yes and no in her world feels really good to her...so we try to give her space to do that.

So...to all the parents out there.  Keep up the good  and hard work!

Best,

FF

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders