Not all of them try to come back

[heartbroken71]

Thus, she might surprisingly react violently or wrathfully to GOOD things: a kind remark, a mission accomplished, a reward, a compliment, a proposition, or a sexual advance.

This is interesting because my ex would tell me he did not like for me to compliment him or say sweet things. I found that really odd.

[mindful]

What I can't figure out is why I am so empty inside? She is not a very pretty lady, She is not sexually seductive. She is not anything but a needy person, but why am I so needy? IS that normal?

I should be happy to get rid of her, but I am not? I guess I need psychiatric help to over come this feeling of loss! I wish I knew why?

Confusedmale:  If traumatic things occurred within the relationship there is also the possibility that you have traumatically bonded to her or developed a betrayal bond. Heard of Stockholm Syndrome?  www.enotalone.com/article/4291.html  At this page they review a book about Betrayal Bonding if you think this applies to you.  When my precipitous separation occurred I was traumatically bonded.  I believe developing outside emotional support is so critical to lifting the FOG and being able to feel healthy anger and outrage--- and keep on moving on.  I was enmeshed---  and emotionally isolated.   Perhaps some therapy time would be good---  it might help you create a healthy shift for you. 

[juner]

I believe my former BPD friend and former co-worker has enough of a narcissistic streak - self-loathing mixed with cockiness - that she won't contact me again. Fingers crossed.

2010: Good to know how narcissism plays into the NC thing.

I've never heard of the inverted narcissist, but I saw some of those traits - anger over a kind remark was the weirdest.

For about two decades I have known this pwBPD and another woman, who is, IMO, a narcissist and someone I still observe because she now works in my office! We once all worked in the same place. Fascinating stuff. I think the BPD and NPD got along because there was no depth and no reflection on either side, so they both felt safe with simple cheery email exchanges.

If the NP got out of line with overly snotty entitlement or delegating work, the BP would lash out, satisfying the NP's need to provoke and the BPD's need to verbally let off steam, and the relationship would re-set. The symbiotic system only fell apart after NPD trash talked about the BPD and it got back to her.

Me - finally finally - standing my ground with my BPD friend and frefusing to fight, a reminder of a rigid childhood, could be seen as narcissistic injury. I'm the grownup and she's hurt. Disarmed, she no longer had the upper hand.

[letitgo]

Thus, she might surprisingly react violently or wrathfully to GOOD things: a kind remark, a mission accomplished, a reward, a compliment, a proposition, or a sexual advance.

This is interesting because my ex would tell me he did not like for me to compliment him or say sweet things. I found that really odd.

HEARTBROKEN: I totally forgot about this trait of my exN/BPD, but it really stood out to me as well.  When I would compliment, or show empathy/caring, she always felt I was up to no good, tricking/lying to her.  Very frustrating.

[Long Distance]

Letitgo ...

Maybe they get angry because when they are being "Nice" to us it was probably them being uP to "NO GOOD " ... Who really knows with these people - Best to not have them around at all -

Long Distance

[wils70]

2010: Are narcissists and BPds attracted to each other? My exBPDgf kept accusing me of being a narcissist.

The few times he'd rage at me outwardly he would say to me "it's always all about f'ing you".  At countless - and I mean countless - times when he wasn't "raging" but instead judging and criticizing me but dressing it up in a nice tone he would say to me "it's always all about you".     Truth is, which I now allow myself to admit, nearly all of the time it really wasn't hardly ever about me - we were always doing things he wanted to do, always watching shows he wanted to watch yada yada yada yet he could recall absolutely none of that more often than not.  I always was puzzled why he'd say in response to me having a different interest "well, perhaps we shouldn't be together".  I jest not, that was the standard response dare I even have a tendency to like something he didn't.

Hurtful at the time?  Absolutely.  Now, it's just starting to make me feel a bit angry at having sucked it up for so long.  Shame on me for that, but live and learn I guess... .

[letitgo]

LongDistance: Exactly!  They're projecting, right?

[ReallyNow?]

Thus, she might surprisingly react violently or wrathfully to GOOD things: a kind remark, a mission accomplished, a reward, a compliment, a proposition, or a sexual advance.

This is interesting because my ex would tell me he did not like for me to compliment him or say sweet things. I found that really odd.

HEARTBROKEN: I totally forgot about this trait of my exN/BPD, but it really stood out to me as well.  When I would compliment, or show empathy/caring, she always felt I was up to no good, tricking/lying to her.  Very frustrating.

Wow... .and I thought I was the only one that had this happen to me?  |>

When my ex udBPDgf would drive on the highways down here in SoCAL I'd always say ":)rive Safely" or "Have a Safe Drive". Many times I'd say this during a rainy day (when traffic in California can be very dangerous). I meant this out of my desire to express deep caring and concern for her well-being. Afterall, I wasnt worried about her driving but rather those wreckless people around her out on the roads!

She ALWAYS got very angry with me for saying these things to her. She'd accuse me of saying that I didnt think she knew how to drive! And  eventually she wanted me to stop saying that to her or she'd hang-up the phone! Heck?

I never knew a person would get upset becuase another person wished them well!

[letitgo]

2010: Are narcissists and BPds attracted to each other? My exBPDgf kept accusing me of being a narcissist.

The few times he'd rage at me outwardly he would say to me "it's always all about f'ing you".  At countless - and I mean countless - times when he wasn't "raging" but instead judging and criticizing me but dressing it up in a nice tone he would say to me "it's always all about you".     Truth is, which I now allow myself to admit, nearly all of the time it really wasn't hardly ever about me - we were always doing things he wanted to do, always watching shows he wanted to watch yada yada yada yet he could recall absolutely none of that more often than not.  I always was puzzled why he'd say in response to me having a different interest "well, perhaps we shouldn't be together".  I jest not, that was the standard response dare I even have a tendency to like something he didn't.

Hurtful at the time?  Absolutely.  Now, it's just starting to make me feel a bit angry at having sucked it up for so long.  Shame on me for that, but live and learn I guess... .

Wils70: I can totally relate to the "it's always about you"/"perhaps we shouldn't be together" statements, and the anger you have right now.  I can relate to everything you said! 

It is a learning experience for you, for sure!  Hopefully you will take some time to learn from this so you won't repeat it... .we need to do this for ourselves.

[Long Distance]

Letitgo ... Yes they are projecting ... they want us to feel their pain that they endured growing up ... .YES they do love us ... But BPD Style ... .Not really what true love should be ... .They never take ownership of ANYTHING ... We let them off time and time again ... .Because we are to soft ... .and have no principals errected ... We had principals when we met them ... But they managed to slowly whittle them down ... .until we let all of those basic principals go and became scared to enforce them due To their reactions and hurtful actions and words ... Who wants to be treated badly = NO ONE ... .Most healthy partners would listen to your principals and Ideas ... They are not healthy and don't give a hit_ about our feelings and principals because they Have NONE ... Hence their behaviors ... ( They may say they do just so we buy into their master plan ... Which is to seek ... Love and destroy ... Over and over ... We think that they think we are special ... We are not ... Who in their right mind would treat someone who is special in that manner ... Unless you were a sadist or a _____ing nutter ) = Either description fits for them ... .WOW ... Who wants to be with a sadist and a nutter ( different if you have kids ) but if there are NO kids ... Then we need to ask ourselves ... Heck are WE DOING ? All for a few snipets of love now and again ... I will repeat this again ... IMO I think we can be just as pathetic as they are ... .until you change yourself and get out ... .Its not easy ... But that should be the end goal ... .

Peace and Love

Long Distance

[heartbroken71]

Wils70: I can totally relate to the "it's always about you"/"perhaps we shouldn't be together" statements, and the anger you have right now.  I can relate to everything you said! 

ME TOO! We had an argument once (only one we really ever had) because he was on a rant about how "two people are not meant to be together forever" and my feelings got hurt and he told me "who said I was talking about us? Stop thinking of yourself for just one minute". Well, when the man you love is telling you that he did not believe two people were meant to be together forever how else are you suppose to take it? His theory is that relationships last in 3's... .3 days, 3 months or 3 years. His longest relationship was his marriage of 3 years. And he up and left and has not spoken to her or his daughter since.

I always was puzzled why he'd say in response to me having a different interest "well, perhaps we shouldn't be together".  I jest not, that was the standard response dare I even have a tendency to like something he didn't.

I think this is common with them. My ex didn't really push what he wanted to do so much, he always told me he wanted to do what I wanted to do as long as we were together. But he pushed his ideas and beliefs on me. He had crazy consipiracy theories about stuff and that was the catalyst to him leaving, I did not agree with the ideas.

In the beginning my ex was so loving and wanted to constantly be together. He said he wanted us to get to the point that we were "completely comfortable" with eachother. Then after he left he told me "I never wanted a relationship, you shoved one down my throat". I couldn't believe it because I was the one wanting to take it slow and he bulldozed! I guess once we got to that comfort zone he said he wanted he bailed.

[182RG]

I heard some with stronger NPD traits never come back... Once the wall is up, they are gone for good.

The ex-wife is a strong, high functioning BPD.  I am painted black for life... .and I thank GOD every day for that!

[182RG]

I find it confusing because I was extremely kind, hard working, together, smart, and stable in comparison to her previous bfs. 

They seem to gravitate away from the "better" ones, and gravitate towards the "bad boys"... .even the ones who treated them poorly or in a more aloof way.  Also, they like the attention from old bfs who call and message them... .it excites them.

The more you love them, and the better you treat them... .the more dangerous YOU are to THEM.

[sugarmommanomore]

My uBPD boyfriend finally admitted on July 27 that he does not want to be in a relationship, that he does not want to be exclusive, and that he is harboring thoughts of returning to "baby momma number 2". None of this came as a surprise to me, as recently I have discovered many examples of emotional infidelity (long im webcam conversations with other women, posts about "missing someone special" on his facebook wall, text messages on his phone saying "we need to talk," etc. etc. etc.) I questioned each of these items, in turn, and received only vague excuses and explanations. I have been nothing but generous, supportive, helpful, and loving for the past 4 months. He has become progressively more cold, stubborn, selfish, withdrawn, malevolent and antipathic. The first inkling I had that he might have BPD came after a blow up 2 months ago when I consulted a psychologist about my relationship difficulties. Prior to that time, I thought he may simply be depressed or, perhaps, cyclothymic. He has extracted considerable resources from me under false pretenses (10 K over 4 months), but is unable or unwilling to do anything to achieve restitution. I feel used, abused, and discarded. Since he admitted that he does not want a relationship, he has asked to remain friends (to which I responded that he lacks the skills to be a friend) and he has phoned each day. I am struggling emotionally.

[sugarmommanomore]

It truly seems that the more you love them and the better you treat them, the more they reject and despise you. He still pines for a BP ex-gf who alternately loved and left him.

[2idealistic]

I find it confusing because I was extremely kind, hard working, together, smart, and stable in comparison to her previous bfs. 

They seem to gravitate away from the "better" ones, and gravitate towards the "bad boys"... .even the ones who treated them poorly or in a more aloof way.  Also, they like the attention from old bfs who call and message them... .it excites them.

The more you love them, and the better you treat them... .the more dangerous YOU are to THEM.

On top of the confusion about BPD, and before I realized that she possessed all the characteristics and traits, my self esteem was just shattered because she returned to the one physical affair that I found out about--a motorcycle-riding, video game expert, who lives with his mother and is 15 years her junior--in addition to the two virtual affairs--a married exbf from 20 years prior; and a single, local cop with a rep as a player--and I just struggled with why I didn't stack up:  two graduate degrees, a mid-level six-figure income, and lots of emotional and financial support as she worked through the year of her separation and divorce from her husband who (she said) cheated on her, and will go off to prison (fact) for multiple white collar crimes.

This complete incongruency about what a woman in her position should have been looking for (sure, I'm not nearly as physically attractive as I was 20 years ago, but who is?) versus what she seems to be seeking and has chosen confuses of course, but also devastates me on so many levels.

[David Dare]

Thanks, everyone, for all of your input.  I just wanted to state that I don't want my ex back.  If she was to contact me to try and rekindle something she would fail.  I'm more than an object, I'm a human being!  And, for what it's worth, if she did try to contact me I'd be able to handle it a lot better now, which is saying something.  There was a time when I probably would have gotten sucked back in, or had a panic attack and freaked out, but her influence over me has waned.

[trife]

I find it confusing because I was extremely kind, hard working, together, smart, and stable in comparison to her previous bfs. 

They seem to gravitate away from the "better" ones, and gravitate towards the "bad boys"... .even the ones who treated them poorly or in a more aloof way.  Also, they like the attention from old bfs who call and message them... .it excites them.

The more you love them, and the better you treat them... .the more dangerous YOU are to THEM.

Truth.  My uBPDstbxw had an affair with a sleezeball whose wife left him because he had numerous affairs.  He's a known womanizer, player and brags about all the women that want to sleep with him around the area where he lives.  In the midst of their first fling, I asked her if she knew why he is divorced and she told me "he had an affair"!   

And guess what?  After a year apart spent in a reconciliation with me, she rekindled the relationship back in June when I was out of town for the weekend.  He can keep her.  I guess she's more comfortable knowing she'll be done wrong than with a man who truly had her and her kid's best interests in mind.  Go figure. 

[David Dare]

Granted my ex is udBPD, but I would bet money that she is, and, if not, some other form of cluster b.

I wanted to throw this out there because I keep reading on the boards about how they always make attempts at coming back into our lives.  I have been 8 months NC and firmly believe she's gone for good.  However, the moment she tries I will admit to it here and correct myself.

Okay, so I was wrong!  She contacted me, after nearly 11 months NC, and I am now correcting myself.  Dang, I thought for sure it would never happen.  Still learning... .

[left4good]

DD,

Is everything good?  I'm sure even though you thought That it probably wasn't going to happen, its still not a complete shocker to ya! 

Lemme guess... .a text saying "omg, DD, I was in my car and heard this song and I swear it was about you!"  Or "hi"

Left

[David Dare]

All is neither bad or good.  Just kind of spacey.  I am super tired after working 3 straight doubles, and then this happened.  Check the "Confession" thread I started for details.

No songs involved, at least that I know of.  Just Facebook.  I see no rhyme or reason to it right now.  Whatever the reason, I'm sure it's a twisted one.

[OverBoard]

My situation was a bit different. Yes, I 've read all the post in this category and find bits and pieces that did happen. Yet, here... God Help me. Two year live in with me in my home. Yes... all wonderful, loving, I was the only one, no one loved her as much as I did, bragged about it to everyone, I was not like so and so, this was so much better and loving... etc. All the BPD/NPD/bp stuff. I won't go into it... I'm posted all over this board.

But as to "do they come back"... mine did 4 times of MY exiting her from our home. Legally. Yes, law enforcement was involved. The time before this one was in February 2010. Gone until April 17. Each time she called, begged, pleaded or showed up at the door wanting us, needing us, loving us, didn't want to be without. I tried to be strong, but couldn't. I loved her. We talk, apologizes, she'd admit she had problems, didn't want to repeat alllllllll her former marriages or relationships that were sabotaged... etc. Agreed on new venues put in place, said she loved me and didn't want to think of me with anyone else and she didn't want to start over or be with anyone else... .so on and so on... Promises were made, agreements, etc on both our parts. I was to understand MORE, she was to be "part of" more... .

Come July. Same stuff has been happening 3-4 weeks after her return you could set your watch by it. The same lies, deciet, online affairs, with ONE major difference.

>>The times before when she came back she was unemployed. NO income. She borrowed from one "pocket enabler" friend I learned about. She had no where to go. No where. Family lived out of state 3k miles and were the burnt of all her problems emotionally. The friend offered a plane ticket, she refused... said she wanted us... to stay. She did.

NOW this time she found a full time job in her field. A lark. Began the end of June and by July she was a tyrant. No responsiblity, spending checks like water, wouldn't help or be part of, blamed how she would always make more than me, how much she was loved at the job (they adorrrrrrrrrrrred her... and she was playing the male boss... a divorced millionairre to boot... if not actually f****ing him) mind you, she had a resume filled with lies, a background that would choke a horse and be denied ANY job... .but they forgave her and she snowballed the company as well).

Fast forward: homelife became worse! We argued. Told her that I felt her getting BACK to work would help. She'd feel more independent, have her own money, be able to become part of the home instead of feeling obligated to me or it... (per her therapist to become "part of", that the drinking would subside, the depression, etc. Nope. Didn't.

Push came to shove and I had to move her out on July 12. Done. Over. Finances were in hell, I was in hell and she seemed to gain MORE momentum... if possible. EVERYTHING was thrown at me now.

Will she come back. She says NEVER. She said I did her the biggest favor. She has money, a job, after a short hotel stay found someone to move in with... (oh lied about that as well... .she is hooked up) and "does NOT need me for a thing, nothing, ever"... .she texted me one night, "you do know i'm not coming back don't you"... she has not asked to this time. Not even close. Actually, since she in "control" mode and possible found a new victim or several as history serves, she has NO need for me... she was caught too many times, truths found out and when that happens, they NEED a new unsuspecting victim... someone to play. She played me out. I knew the tricks, the games, the lies, deceit, contacts, all her ins and outs by living with her. Game over. New game.

Before the NEED to come back was based on no money, no job, no place to live. Now... she met all those needs. Has her "power" as she calls it and behind the curtains developed a "new" persona for others... blackened me and all I did for her... said she no longer loved me as well. It's over. Control.

Yet... .there is always a fine line. She is riding high. Her world is perfect for her world right now. Very limited contact... very limited in text only. She is living only a few miles from me and still working... on her 4th month and a perm employee now... .history has it 6-8 months at a job is her limit... too much responsiblity or demands she exits... .she is in her late 40's... and history may very well repeat itself... but as for coming back? Hard call. She'd have to loose everything again... .job, place, screw someone the wrong way, need a safety net... .hard call.

She wasn't going to come back the last time, she was, with the help of an enabler friend out of state was going to find a place... then... she turned the tables and ended up here. But again, no job. This time? She is self serving... I know that about her. Her world is HER world right now. She can and does keep her demons at bay with work and a new social life... .remember, she can be "anyone" she wants to be at this point. Paint a brand new picture, gather victims to serve her NPD and deny her BPD... what will get her... is her BP... in time.

If I were to put money on it... I would say: Yes. Not yet... but yes. She can NOT handle the fact I may be moving on as well eventually... was this a bad ending? Yes. This time. So final since this time I physically moved her out 100% vs the other times of her leaving with everything still here in the house... clothing, furniture etc. This time I cleaned house and moved it all out. So... another differerence.

Since she has not attempted to come back, no mention of it, has stood firm on the fact she never will, it's over, done, she is moving on, ... key words... but to a BPD? they can mean the opposite... she is trying to convince everyone and herself... she is... but... who knows.

Again, I will bet money on it it will be in the middle of the night at my door, a call from an ER room or someone telling me to go get her... if she ventured into bad territory.