Do I dare stonewall the GaL?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

My ex can only have supervised visitation at this point. No one in my family is willing to do it. She has suggested three people from her family, none of whom I am comfortable with. I will deny all three of them.

The last option is to pay for someone to supervise.  It is at least $50 per hour for this service. I have already payed out almost $1500 for the ex to take a drug assessment and a psych eval. The judge did not give me child support at the first hearing as he did not want to impose "undue hardship" on my ex. Meanwhile she is living rent free, feeding, buying cigarettes,  and supporting the replacements weed habit.

The GaL is insisting that I should pay half of the cost for the supervised visits. To be blunt I think that is bullhit. My ex abandoned the kids and left them with me. I have been paying for everything to this point. She has not complied with the court order. Although she has done some of the things ordered she has failed to do them within the time frame in the order.

From my perspective she makes enough money and if she wants to see the kids she should be the one to pay for it.

I want to tell the GaL that I will not pay for visitation unless the judge orders me to. The GaL has framed it that it is "in the best interest of the children" that they have parenting time with their mother. So the risk of stonewalling on this issue is that when we return to court the GaL will tell the judge that I am not acting in the kid's best interest.

What should I do?

[papawapa]

My ex can only have supervised visitation at this point. No one in my family is willing to do it. She has suggested three people from her family, none of whom I am comfortable with. I will deny all three of them.

The last option is to pay for someone to supervise.  It is at least $50 per hour for this service. I have already payed out almost $1500 for the ex to take a drug assessment and a psych eval. The judge did not give me child support at the first hearing as he did not want to impose "undue hardship" on my ex. Meanwhile she is living rent free, feeding, buying cigarettes,  and supporting the replacements weed habit.

The GaL is insisting that I should pay half of the cost for the supervised visits. To be blunt I think that is bullhit. My ex abandoned the kids and left them with me. I have been paying for everything to this point. She has not complied with the court order. Although she has done some of the things ordered she has failed to do them within the time frame in the order.

From my perspective she makes enough money and if she wants to see the kids she should be the one to pay for it.

I want to tell the GaL that I will not pay for visitation unless the judge orders me to. The GaL has framed it that it is "in the best interest of the children" that they have parenting time with their mother. So the risk of stonewalling on this issue is that when we return to court the GaL will tell the judge that I am not acting in the kid's best interest.

What should I do?

[ForeverDad]

From my experience and what most others have stated, a GAL is usually a lawyer.  Lawyers prefer to make deals and settlements.  So I suspect the GAL is seeking a deal by "splitting the difference".  When a parent is acting-out disordered, then it's an unfair split.

I want to tell the GaL that I will not pay for visitation unless the judge orders me to.

Sounds reasonable to me... .GAL's idea might be more reasonable only if ex also pays half the child care expenses.

If you have the children and you're paying all their expenses, it would seem that you should not have to split the costs of supervised visits, especially not if she has income and she's still taking advantage of the marital home, etc.  Framed that way, I think it would be appropriate to state the reasons why you believe their mother has sufficient resources to pay for her own visitation.

You might try offering to discount your share of supervision costs against her child support obligation.  Courts hate to tie anything to CS but the fact is she's unlikely to ever pay so why should you pay half of SV and she ignores her CS payments?

Or you could agree to pay half of SV up to $XXX per month but only when her CS payments are up to date.  (Does she pay CS?)  Courts won't tie SV to her paying CS, they are seen as separate issues, but I think you could tie any payment obligations for SV to CS.

And there's nothing wrong with leaving some issues for the judge to decide, that's what a judge is for.  GAL sees you as the responsible parent, expects you to cooperate (=bend) more than your ex and a judge may not see it that way if a decision/order has to be made.

[papawapa]

I asked for CS at the initial hearing. The judge denied it at that time. I applied for and received state funded medical insurance for the kids. The county will be at the next hearing in November asking for her to pay support. I also recently started a new job and have enrolled me and the kids in the insurance offered through my employer. I am fairly certain the judge will at least order her to contribute  to the cost of insurance at the next hearing.  Here in MN child support is automatically deducted from paychecks by employers so as long as she keeps her job I wont have any problem collecting CS. But if the judge orders her to pay half of out of pocket expenses for medical care I know I wont get that from the ex.

This whole thing just really bothers me that I have the kids full time, am paying for all of their care and have had to pay for everything the court ordered the ex to do. To me it is a matter of principle. If she wants to see the kids then she should be willing to pay for it.

[livednlearned]

This whole thing just really bothers me that I have the kids full time, am paying for all of their care and have had to pay for everything the court ordered the ex to do. To me it is a matter of principle. If she wants to see the kids then she should be willing to pay for it.

I completely agree. The only snag is that if you turn down three free supervisors, taking a stand might make you look like the unreasonable one. Like FD said, provide the court with financial reasoning for your thinking so you appear as someone willing to solve problems.   

My L wanted our consent order to say that neither parties would consume alcohol prior to or during time with the minor child and I was pissed! N/BPDx is a serious falldown passout alcoholic. I barely drink alcohol. My L kept saying it would make me look unreasonable if I took a stand, that it was common for both parties to have to agree to the same rules, etc.

I dug my heels in on that one. I could just imagine N/BPDx filing a motion for contempt against me because S12 reported that I had a glass of wine with Thanksgiving dinner. Fume!

[papawapa]

Thanks for the input Lived. That was another thing I was going to ask, if I should explain my reasoning for not agreeing to the exes suggestions. She has suggested two of her sisters and her mother.

For one I dont feel that any of them are capable of being neutral or unbiased. For two the ex is supposed to be sober when she sees the kids which is a huge issue since she is a pot head and stoned   every waking moment. Her one sister is a pathological liar, her other sister is also a pot head, and her mother has one of the exes brothers and a nephew living with her and they are both pot heads too that sit outside and smoke dope.

But my biggest concern has to do with my replacement. My kid's therapists have made it clear that he should have no contact with the kids as he was dating their sister before the ex and the kids got to know him as their sisters boyfriend. My son's therapist told me that she "would bet her license" that the court will order no contact between the kids and the replacement. He doesnt let my ex go anywhere without him and I dont believe any of the three people she has suggested would not let her see the kids if he were present.

[Waddams]

Can you document the drug use?  Or is there anyone that would be willing to testify on your behalf as to the drug use?

If not, still object to them and state the reasons why.  Ask the court to order they be tested and shown to be clean before the court allows them to be supervisors.  That way, even if the court says no and orders that they are good as supervisors over your objections, you've got your concerns documented in the record.  If anything happens in the future, you'll have prior record to stand on.

[sanemom]

Do you think she will even pay for half?  I mean, if she won't even pay for her half, you may not have anything to worry about... .

[livednlearned]

Thanks for the input Lived. That was another thing I was going to ask, if I should explain my reasoning for not agreeing to the exes suggestions. She has suggested two of her sisters and her mother.

For one I dont feel that any of them are capable of being neutral or unbiased. For two the ex is supposed to be sober when she sees the kids which is a huge issue since she is a pot head and stoned   every waking moment. Her one sister is a pathological liar, her other sister is also a pot head, and her mother has one of the exes brothers and a nephew living with her and they are both pot heads too that sit outside and smoke dope.

But my biggest concern has to do with my replacement. My kid's therapists have made it clear that he should have no contact with the kids as he was dating their sister before the ex and the kids got to know him as their sisters boyfriend. My son's therapist told me that she "would bet her license" that the court will order no contact between the kids and the replacement. He doesnt let my ex go anywhere without him and I dont believe any of the three people she has suggested would not let her see the kids if he were present.

I would focus on this issue and make it your top priority. Express your concerns that the family members are also habitual drug users, and the stuff about the replacement. Maybe explain why there is no one else (free) that you can recommend, and that it has been suggested that your ex will require a paid supervisor.

Then, you ask the court to appoint so and so to be the supervisor, and ask that the court order the ex to pay for the service. If she does not show, then you are not stuck paying for the service without anyone using it.

[catnap]

Where I live, only the parent can see the children during supervised visits.  Son's exgf was ordered drug tested (she was required to arrive 15 minutes early for the testing) by the visitation facility prior to being allowed to visit.  Result: She never once did the supervised visits.

Since your ex has a drug history, I do think asking the GAL to recommend that she have to be drug tested prior to each visit.  If she fails, she has to pay for the missed visit.  You are willing/or can afford to pay for X number of visits per month.  This might be a solution if you feel that she can't pass the drug testing.  At least if you have to pay, you know she was sober, and qualified personnel was watching her interact with the children.

[papawapa]

The court order clearly states that both of us are supposed to abstain from all alcohol and drug use. The GaL acknowledges that my ex is not supposed to see the kids unless she is sober. We both had to take drug and alcohol assessments and follow any recommendations from the drug counselor. I have taken and passed four drug tests and today set up random testing. I have been sober since we last had court in June. I know from bank and phone records and talking to her family members that she is still using. I did not get a copy of the exes drug assessment but I am sure that she was recommended for random testing as well. The GaL said that if the visitations go through this supervision center that the person conducting the visits is trained to spot whether someone is sober. In my eyes that is not enough.

The ex is supposed to be sober and the only way to know for certain is if she can pass a test. It really pisses me off that the ex is being treated with kiddie gloves. She hasn't complied with the order, yet the GaL is still pushing for her to have parenting time. It's like she can go on doing whatever she wants and still gets to see the kids. It is a joke.

[ForeverDad]

Been there, done that - behaved myself while ex didn't yet too often I feel... .The misbehaving parent gets few consequences and the behaving parent gets little credit.

[sanemom]

The misbehaving parent gets few consequences and the behaving parent gets little credit.

Can we put that quote at the top of this board?   

[catnap]

papawapa, I really wish the courts would treat both parents equally. 

The GaL said that if the visitations go through this supervision center that the person conducting the visits is trained to spot whether someone is sober. In my eyes that is not enough.

Call and ask the supervision center if they do before visit drug testing.  If they don't, ask what criteria they use to guarantee that a parent is not been using, as the order states she has to abstain from all drug and alcohol use. 

I realize state to state or county to county things can be different, but some visitation centers do offer the service.  I wonder if your jurisdiction has the option of having the parent request it.

www.parentchildaccess.com/OtherServices_and__Feeshtml.html

Below are examples of why a drug test may be administered:

    There are court orders.

    A judge makes a verbal order or ruling.

    A mediated settlement.

    Rule 11 agreement (Texas)

  When an attorney or parent of a minor makes a request.

[livednlearned]

The GaL said that if the visitations go through this supervision center that the person conducting the visits is trained to spot whether someone is sober. In my eyes that is not enough.

That is absurd! If people could spot sobriety, cops wouldn't need breathalyzer tests. Not sure if you're talking about sober in terms of alcohol, but I noticed with N/BPDx that at half a glass of wine, he was impaired. Both S12 and I could tell he had something to drink well before he reached the legal limit. His demeanor changed, he became a victim, started to wind up and get angry about small things, his vocabulary immediately changed and he would start cursing. I can't imagine anyone other than us knowing that he was impaired -- you have to know people extremely well to spot that stuff.