Self injury advice

[mom2bkl]

This is one of those topics that is so difficult in the BPD world we all live in and it has maybe reared its ugly head again in our DD18. She called today wondering how bad a cut was to need stitches as she had dropped a broken glass on her leg and had gotten some cuts. I reacted calmly and asked her if she would like me to come over to her boyfriends to take a look at it. She said she didn't think so, she had gotten the bleeding stopped and would look around for some bandaids. About an hour later I hear his car drive up and she comes in with several bandages all together just above her knee. Me, being an eternal optimist, gives her regular empathy which I'm thankful that some distance between us has helped restore, dressed her wounds, put Triple Antibiotic ointment on it and they went on their merry way. BUT... .my hubby says no way in heck is that from a broken glass.

Now, my dilemma is... .what to do now? I did text her and say we love her very much and if this was not an accident that we are here for her to listen to her and help her direct her stress elsewhere. We would not judge her and understand so much more now and blah blah blah.

She texted back completely ignoring what I had said... .basically asking about the weather kind of statements. I take that as a yah... .I've been busted.

In the past her injuries have been because of avoiding things like a math test or a sport that she decided she no longer liked, etc... .but haven't had any for probably at least a year and a half. Any advice on how each of you handle self injury? She isn't a cutter... .is more an injurer... .like giving herself a black eye or hurting her ankle on purpose to get out of a sport. Okay... you're all sick of me by now... .but would love to hear how each of you handle this situation... .thank YOU!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Thursday]

Hi  Momtoblk,

Sorry to hear that your DD has returned to her self-injury.

Is she in therapy? If she is I would tailor a message to her around her being in therapy such as,

"I am concerned with the cuts I helped you bandage the other night. If those are from self-injury I hope you will  discuss this with your therapist. Talking to your T might help you figure out what to do besides hurting yourself when you are having difficulties.

My SD still cuts, although still very superficially and still tends to wear blouses that don't hide what she has done. She cuts on her shoulders and wears blouses that have the shoulders cut out so it's clear she does it so that she can "show the world" the pain she is in. Now that she is more regulated (we are in an upswing right now) I don't know if she is still doing this in the last month but before she found the job that has helped her to regulate it had gotten to be a regular thing after years of not self-injuring.

Every kid is different but with my SD it is best for her to understand that I know what she is doing (like you have done with your DD) and to remind her of options. In the long run, Momtobkl, you know if she is self-injuring, she really does need help! But when they are 18 and over, we cant tie them up and deliver them to the therapist office. My SD hasn't  been to therapy for several years. She does get a bit of structure from AA and she is sober, however, I do wish she would re-engage with her therapist. She owes him money which is her reason for avoidance. I think today we will gently remind her of her debt to therapy office.

Wishing you and yours the best.

Thursday

[lbjnltx]

Hi mom2bkl,

We are here to help each other.    

Re:  SI

Pre RTC I would encourage my d to talk about the feelings she was trying to cope with that drove her to cut.  I would be calm and tend to her wounds just as you were.  I would remind her that she is so very valuable and loved and there are skills she had learned to use in place of self injury.

She has not cut since going into RTC over 3 years ago.

If your d has not learned alternate ways to cope with the intense emotions that trigger self injury here is one that you might gently pass onto her... .

"I read somewhere that self injury does serve a purpose and that there are also other ways to respond to internal pain.  One of the things I read was  holding an ice cube for as long as possible.  I thought that was cool... .no pun intended."

[heronbird]

I can only say what I do, with my dd, I have learnt over time, to leave it.

There is no point because it just makes her lie because she feels so ashamed.

So, what I end up doing is like you, text her later, say I love you and thats it (less is more) if I felt like you did, then I would try to say what you did, I think you did it well actually.

Now you know what, she will probably feel comfortable to trust you again because you didnt press it.

You know what, if she did it herself or didnt, the main thing was that, you were there for her and you really made her feel loved, that will mean a lot to her.

My dd is always going to cut herself, its one of her strategies  she uses to cope  

I do think at 19 as my dd is, she should have learnt something else by now.

[mom2bkl]

Thank you for your responses... .sadly she is not in therapy but I appreciate your affirmation that we reacted appropriately. She did text me back later and say "Mom, I promise it was an accident" ... .I just responded by saying, "I believe you. I'm sorry you were hurt. Let me know if I can do anything."

I will continue to be watchful and calm... .thank you again. I want to believe her but I know better... .but am still hoping it really was an accident and that we can continue to move forward in this journey!

I'm doing lots of research on validation these days between storms... .so we can be ready for the next tornado:) Hugs to all!

[heronbird]

Mum2

Haha you sound just like me and your dd sounds like mine. Hey you know what, if its a lie its a lie, you are not a fortune teller so you can just accept it, it does not matter, and see, I told you you did good. I wasnt just saying that to make you feel good.

Did you hear about Valeries book, Overcoming BPD, you will like that. I read 6 books on BPD, this was so helpful, I learnt good tools and techniques from that book. I am sure you will find it useful.

Its strange, years ago, my dd came in and had those really short shorts on, ( I hate them) I saw a big thick cut really high up, I was shocked and so upset, she saw my face and said in horror "What what whats wrong!" I had to pretend like nothing was wrong, but it was so shocking. After that, I learnt to hide my face and feelings, its so hard but I learnt.

Recently, she shared with me that one time when something really bad happened she was so upset she did something really silly and bad, she then told me about the cut there, she hadnt even remembered that I had seen it that day, but felt comfortable to share that at that time. I didnt judge her, just said how sad she must have felt and Im glad she hardly does that now, it must be so hard blah blah blah

Now a days, if she wont tell me things, I am pleased rather than wanting to know what happened. Too much happens in their lives to be honest, and we have enough to deal with without knowing everything.

Hope things get better for you soon

[Being Mindful]

Thank you for your responses... .sadly she is not in therapy but I appreciate your affirmation that we reacted appropriately. She did text me back later and say "Mom, I promise it was an accident" ... .I just responded by saying, "I believe you. I'm sorry you were hurt. Let me know if I can do anything."

I will continue to be watchful and calm... .thank you again. I want to believe her but I know better... .but am still hoping it really was an accident and that we can continue to move forward in this journey!

I'm doing lots of research on validation these days between storms... .so we can be ready for the next tornado:) Hugs to all!

Hi mom2,

If your gut tells you that it wasn't an accident then I would caution you in telling her that you believe her. Our BPD kids can read us like none other. You don't want to be caught in a lie with her. If you are uncertain, just leave your belief out of your response. Does that help?

[vivekananda]

hi mom2bkl   ,

... .Okay... you're all sick of me by now... .but would love to hear how each of you handle this situation... .thank YOU!

Not possible, never get sick of you   or talking about BPD... .it's easy to turn off a computer isn't it? 

... .

... .If your gut tells you that it wasn't an accident then I would caution you in telling her that you believe her. Our BPD kids can read us like none other. You don't want to be caught in a lie with her. If you are uncertain, just leave your belief out of your response. Does that help?

I would agree. I don't think saying that you believe her isn't really validating her. As I understand it, a validating statement would have been something more like: "Ahh, that's good, I am glad you feel ok." Validation is about acknowledging the emotions, not the behaviours and while 'feeling ok' is a lame word for the emotion she would be feeling, it would suit the purpose.

By the way, I love lbj's cool advice!

cheers,

Vivek    

[Rapt Reader]

If your d has not learned alternate ways to cope with the intense emotions that trigger self injury here is one that you might gently pass onto her... .

"I read somewhere that self injury does serve a purpose and that there are also other ways to respond to internal pain.  One of the things I read was  holding an ice cube for as long as possible.  I thought that was cool... .no pun intended."

Hi, mom2bkl... .and also heronbird & Thursday (since you are all dealing with the same thing). I agree with Vivek  that lbjnltx's advice is really "cool"    

But, seriously, if you guys ever get the chance to conversationally mention lbj's tip to your daughters, they just might remember it the next time--if there is a next time--they feel the need to self-harm.

I so wish I'd known of this advice when my own son was hurting himself; I know that from time to time I would've been able to have a calm conversation with him at a self-reflective moment where I could have lovingly mentioned the idea of the ice. I would've memorized the sentences lbj gave you, to have on the tip of my tongue at the exact right time.

What she wrote, and how it would be said is non-judgmental and very loving and understanding of their feelings; it's very validating actually, accepting that at times they feel internal pain and need a way to express it. I've read on this site that there are other parents who report that this is something their child with BPD actually does to relieve their pain.

I'd try it if I were you guys... .Can you let us know how that goes?  

[heronbird]

I dont know how you can say you dont believe them when they are adamant they didnt do it, would you be willing to have an argument with them then?

My dd would be devestated if I insisted I knew she did it and it wasnt an accident, its best to wait until she comes round and few days later or maybe longer, she will tell me when she is ready. She is too ashamed to be honest with me about that, it just reminds her she is a failure.

I mostly find she tells me eventually anyway, and is more open and honest that way.

[lbjnltx]

I dont know how you can say you dont believe them when they are adamant they didnt do it, would you be willing to have an argument with them then?

My dd would be devestated if I insisted I knew she did it and it wasnt an accident, its best to wait until she comes round and few days later or maybe longer, she will tell me when she is ready. She is too ashamed to be honest with me about that, it just reminds her she is a failure.

I mostly find she tells me eventually anyway, and is more open and honest that way.

One of the ways that I am true to myself and my values is to be just that.  I won't lie to appease another lie.

Expressing this can be a delicate thing indeed.  My d didn't lie about cutting and she did lie (rarely) about other things.

I would say "I have a difficult time believing that" or "I'm concerned regardless".

We can nod our heads to acknowledge that we have heard them and not respond and we can also say "I see.  We can discuss this again another time."

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Being Mindful]

I dont know how you can say you dont believe them when they are adamant they didnt do it, would you be willing to have an argument with them then?

My dd would be devestated if I insisted I knew she did it and it wasnt an accident, its best to wait until she comes round and few days later or maybe longer, she will tell me when she is ready. She is too ashamed to be honest with me about that, it just reminds her she is a failure.

I mostly find she tells me eventually anyway, and is more open and honest that way.

Hi Heron,

I don't say that I don't believe her unless I have actual proof. I just won't lie that I believe her when I have doubts.

[Thursday]

About holding ice as an alternative to cutting;

My SD was told about holding ice by her therapist. She tried it several times and told me it didn't work. My thought is that since she was cutting for the attention of people who would see the cuts later (this was the sensation she was seeking- the concern, the drama when people would see the cuts and be horrified, they might tell a parent who might invite troubled SD over to help... .anyone else have experience with their BPD kid seeking out and finding adults to draw into their circle?) holding the ice didn't do much that helped. About a year after the therapist's advice, I suggested that when she felt like cutting she should use a red marker on her skin instead of a knife. I meant a washable Crayola marker but SD, who was willing to give this a try, used a red sharpie.

It was a shocking and  stunning thing to see, how much her pain was revealed with that permanent red sharpie. She could see it too and it took a lot of scrubbing effort to get the marks off.

After the last time DH saw cuts on her shoulders (that blouse she wears with holes for the shoulders might as well have been a sign with an arrow) DH reminded her of the sharpie idea. She told him she would never do that to herself again (the sharpie marker) because it was too embarrassing.    Real cuts, apparently, are not embarrassing which leads me right back to my idea that she cuts so that people will see the cuts, be concerned, ask about them and/or make some drama to get her mind off of whatever is bugging her. I see her return to cutting recently as a way to get her Dad to quit focusing (read nagging her) on  getting a job. Now that she has a job and is doing well, so far, so good, no more cutting for now.

Response to lying- When she was a teen and lived with us, her Dad typically bought her lies, even the really ludicrous lies. It created a lot of friction in our relationship, regretfully. It came to a head when she stole RX meds from my DD, then lied, then insisted that she didn't and swore on her dead mother. I asked her, in the moment, what this swearing on her Mother meant and she told me it meant she was telling the truth. Later, she confessed. I have always treated her lying in a very straightforward manner. I've told her "What you are saying to me is hard for me to accept as the truth" and then I would let her know where the holes in her story were. We did a lot of talking about human nature, that it is human to try to cover up when we are ashamed of our actions.

She has, over and over and over again told me that I am "magic" which means I see through her cr*p where others don't. I think she appreciates that I can be truthful with her and that I don't accept her lies as the truth. She has a level of respect for me that I don't see her having for her Dad. One thing that has helped him is to understand that when she pulls the wool over his eyes with success she does lose respect. And it creates an unhealthy place in their relationship. So, he now tries to keep himself in questioning mode instead of blindly accepting that what she says is the truth.

I am always reminded of what her addiction counselor told me about her lies, that when she was living a more exemplary life she would not have a need to lie and not to be too worried about the lying. It is true, as she has embraced her sobriety she does have less to lie about and thus lies less. She still lies though, don't get me wrong!

And again, I have the "luxury" of being a step-parent, one step removed and thus in sometimes a much easier position to parent this difficult person. Coming to this from the outside looking in gives me a lot more freedom to "see".

Thursday

[lbjnltx]

Creating a free zone to lie adds to their shame and our own. 

Like Thursday... .my dd16 knows I know the truth.  This is why she rarely lies.  If I ask her a question that she doesn't want to be outright honest about ... .she replies  "maybe" in a somewhat comical way.  This is our sign that we can talk without judgment.  ie:

Me:  Did you finish that past due English assignment?

d16: Maybe

Me:  How much is left to finish?

d16: I'm almost done.

Me:  What will it take to get it finished today?

d16:  Just doing it.

Me:  Ok, let's get it done.  How can I help?

d16:  Will you bring me something to eat?  I work better when I'm not hungry.

[mom2bkl]

I find it very interesting the stating of believing versus not believing that we can do. I concur that I probably shouldn't have said, "I believe you" but definitely the rest that I did. I don't think saying "I have a hard time believing you" would be beneficial in our case... .it just seems to amp up the dysregulation as she frantically would try to convince me. She knows whether its true or not and knows we are on high alert because we love her.

I am going to suggest the "icing"... .as it could definitely be an effective tool if she chooses to use it. I loved what was said about them coming back later and sharing a confession! I had that exact thing happen as I was working with her on pumping up her resume and job searching... .she said she had a confession... .that when she was called into a store a few months ago she just didn't go to the interview! I asked her why and she answered she didn't know... .and that was that.

I am understanding more and more (after watching the validation video) that when I don't understand the pressure she is under as it looks like NONE to me... .just the mere fact of getting dressed up for an interview, knowing what to go to school for, what kind of job to get, how to save money... .SOO many more issues are wrapped up together... .and hence the injuries! We did lots of talking about breaking things down into little chunks yesterday and had such a good day! Learning, learning, learning is my best allie right now... .and you are all helping me so much!

[mom2bkl]

Well... .the truth came out today.  Phone call saying... .mom I have something to tell you but I don't want you to freak out I assured her I would not be freaking out (Heck at this point nothing can be shocking!) It wasn't a glass that cut my leg.  I was so thankful for all the pieces of advice I received here... .as I was able to stay totally calm and reassure her that she was very brave for telling me the truth and for telling her BF the truth.  She said he cried for an hour and that is all she needed to know to never do that again.  I know that will probably pass but was thankful for the opportunity to practice validation and remind her that if she ever is ready for therapy that now her BF who has been amazing will back her up in that.  It is moments like this when all the illusions are pulled away and I am reminded what a horrible illness this is... .but also that there are tools that can be used to minimize the effects and little by little I think she is actually learning to use these tools.

Stay strong everyone... .and keep learning... .and keep supporting our pwBPD and each other.  Today the sun shines:)

[Rapt Reader]

It is moments like this when all the illusions are pulled away and I am reminded what a horrible illness this is... .but also that there are tools that can be used to minimize the effects and little by little I think she is actually learning to use these tools.

Stay strong everyone... .and keep learning... .and keep supporting our pwBPD and each other.  Today the sun shines:)

Hi, mom2bkl 

This is great news! You and your daughter have come such a long way in a short time... .I'm so glad you shared this!

It sounds like you have done really well, and your daughter is so lucky to have you and her boyfriend as a support system. This is certainly something to celebrate and relish... .another step forward in her recovery process. Thanks so much for giving us this update!