She's out for blood... is this normal?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hi,

My wife split me black and filed for divorce 2 months ago.  She is OUT FOR BLOOD!  There is no rational explanation for this, obviously.  Is this normal for a uBPD to act?  Very vindictive?  I didn't do anything worthy of divorce, other than defend myself against her false accusations or get annoyed, when she was overly jealous or insecure. (i.e., she made me delete every female in my phone, facebook, etc.)  I am a good guy, who would never think about cheating, and never even looked at another woman, while I've been in a relationship, with her or anyone.  I don't go to stip clubs, hooters or anything else, yet she constantly accuses me of cheating... . OH and we lived to gether and ran a business out of our home and were together 24/7, even when we ran errands and to the gym, but she still accused me of cheating... . I'd like to know when that would even occurr, if I was that type of guy, because we also have a 10 month old that doesn't nap or sleep... . She's delusional... . So, is it normal for a uBPD to be vindictive like this... . she also filed a restraining order (false allegations, again) and cut my family, friends and me out of her familiy's life on Facebook, etc and it's like I never existed!

[kfifd196]

Hi,

My wife split me black and filed for divorce 2 months ago.  She is OUT FOR BLOOD!  There is no rational explanation for this, obviously.  Is this normal for a uBPD to act?  Very vindictive?  I didn't do anything worthy of divorce, other than defend myself against her false accusations or get annoyed, when she was overly jealous or insecure. (i.e., she made me delete every female in my phone, facebook, etc.)  I am a good guy, who would never think about cheating, and never even looked at another woman, while I've been in a relationship, with her or anyone.  I don't go to stip clubs, hooters or anything else, yet she constantly accuses me of cheating... . OH and we lived to gether and ran a business out of our home and were together 24/7, even when we ran errands and to the gym, but she still accused me of cheating... . I'd like to know when that would even occurr, if I was that type of guy, because we also have a 10 month old that doesn't nap or sleep... . She's delusional... . So, is it normal for a uBPD to be vindictive like this... . she also filed a restraining order (false allegations, again) and cut my family, friends and me out of her familiy's life on Facebook, etc and it's like I never existed!

[momtara]

Yes, it is normal.  Make sure you get the book "Splitting" by Bill Eddy.  It will help you deal with this exact situation.

[ForeverDad]

I see similarities to many experiences here... . demands, threats, accusations of infidelity, etc.  If that were all, yes, she might continue a cycle of extremes, love/hate or push/pull.  But one more factor really complicates that, having a baby.  For her your baby is a constant reminder of you.  If she is like my ex, the baby will be mostly a Golden Child, especially while young, while you are the Rejected Forever Painted Black One.

You have to stand up for yourself in the divorce and all other cases at court.  Appeasing her is unlikely to work, at least not for long.  So you need legal help to deal with her allegations.  Understand that if her first ones aren't successful, she can try again and again, the DV and child protective systems are designed to permit repeated allegations without consequences.  You need for the court to see ASAP that you are a normal father and that the continuing allegations are not just unsubstantiated but also part of a pattern of Blaming and Blame Shifting.

Mine might be one of the more extreme cases but for the past 8 years the agencies have never seen me as a bad parent, yet the allegations, the most recent one was just this past February, keep coming.  I've long since concluded that she simply has an internal need to keep trying to make me look worse than her.  In the long run it hasn't worked, but in the short term it certainly creates chaos and distress.

As momtara wrote, Bill Eddy's Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder is an essential handbook for both you and your lawyer.

There is a pamphlet we have here written by Bill Eddy, bpdfamily.com About Personality Disorders and the Family Courts, handy for giving to lawyers.  Be forewarned that a lawyer's first instinct is to settle and make deals.  Often there are no quick deals that will work with our High Conflict cases.  If there are any reasonable settlements to be reached, you and your lawyer will have to fight long and hard for them.  And tell your lawyer that this is her first salvo in an early battle of an extended Blaming and Custody War.  Only a very, very good settlement/judgment with firm boundary clauses now would have even a chance of reducing future allegations.

You're wanting to be reasonable.  Her perceptions and mental state are the polar opposite.  Understand that well right from the beginning.  You can be reasonable but for it to work you also must have firm boundaries and real consequences.  Appeasement can very easily become enabling, so walk that minefield carefully.  Even that may not stop her sabotaging and obstruction of your parenting, it may only slow her down a bit.  Try your best to help the court figure it out sooner rather than later.

Right now, try to get the best temporary order possible.  It will be hard to improve it later, temporary orders have a tendency to become final orders.  I had two temporary orders limiting me to being an alternate weekend dad, one was even issued immediately after the court confirmed my father-child contact had been total blocked for 3 months when the first order had ended.  It took years of court "baby step" adjustments to eventually get a realistic schedule.

She also filed a restraining order (false allegations, again) and cut my family, friends and me out of her family's life on Facebook, etc and it's like I never existed!

In court and with the agencies no one will care about her cutting you, your friends and your family out of her life.  The restraining order and allegations are another matter entirely.  Those are VERY serious and strenuously defending yourself against them cannot be emphasized enough.

[marbleloser]

RO have become very common when trying to exclude the stbx(usually male) from the childs life. Think about it. If you're a danger to mom or kid,you should not be allowed custody,right?

You're not the first,and won't be the last, to have a RO against you.

What you have to do is, fight this RO with everything you have. It has far reaching and long lasting effects if you plead guilty or are found guilty. You need an atty who will fight for you,and have this RO thrown out.

That's your first step.

Next,you're going to need to fight for your place in the childs life.She's going to try to exclude you altogether if she can.

Her getting primary custody means more money,so of course she's going to fight for that.

You need a gameplan and documentation. Keep every email and text. Never email or text a disparaging word to your stbx.

Start a journal of your activities with the child.

Your stbx is ahead of you. She filed first,so she's been planning for quite a while now. You need to catch up.

[livednlearned]

FD and marbleloser have good advice.

Often, these relationships end quickly and abruptly, and it's difficult to sit up and pay attention to what's happening. But you have to -- throw cold water on your face and get an attorney who will advocate for you. Your wife has already made it clear that false allegations are in her toolkit, so be very careful about being around her without an adult third-party witness. Past behavior usually predicts future behavior. Find out if you can record conversations with her -- some states allow it, some don't.

Interview a couple of attorneys if you can. You can often do a 30 minute consultation for $50 or $100 to find out how things work in your state. Go in with a list of questions, and maybe bring someone with you to help you take notes. It can be very emotional and overwhelming, and most lawyers don't have a bedside manner to hold your hand through the process. If you need help with the kinds of questions to ask, start a thread here. You'll get excellent suggestions and this will save you money, plus it will point out things you have probably not had time to anticipate yet.

Also, you'll hear "temporary orders" come up a lot in regards to custody of your son. There is nothing temporary about them. Many temporary orders become permanent. Anything that happens now and going forward will become status quo, and courts don't like to change the status quo for kids. Every legal document you sign is like a door closing that you can't open.

Start documenting everything. This is going to become part of your life for the next 18 years, so develop a system that works for you, something that you can keep up.

And hang out here a lot. No one here is a lawyer, but collectively, there is a lot of wisdom and experience about what it's like to go through a high-conflict divorce with someone who is BPD.

You're not alone.



LnL

[david]

I had many false accusations thrown at me starting in 2007. It stiil continues. I've been accused of physical, verbal, emotional, and spiritual abuse by my ex. I have also been accused of abusing our two boys. In 2010 she had me arrested for attacking her. I did not touch her or even say anything negative towards her. I spent two weeks in jail and lost my job. I now have a video camera and an audio recorder with me whenever she will be near me. She has tried a few things since that time but I immediately turn them on and she walks away. She doesn't get close anymore. When I pick the kids up at her place I turn them on if she is outside. The court order states she is to remain in her residence until I leave with the boys. Be very careful. Make sure you can protect yourself from the accusations.

[ForeverDad]

Although courts don't strictly follow this pattern, it is an observation which roughly simplifies which things matter more than other things... .

She may start out with allegations that you're a jerk, cad, loser, unfaithful, etc, expecting that will make you look bad and let her take charge of parenting.  However, these days the courts react more to (1) parenting behaviors than adult behaviors and (2) what is actionable.  So let her file a claim what a loser you are, you can defend yourself that not only is it not true but also it doesn't matter since it doesn't affect your parenting.  Yes, she will later make new allegations that your a bad parent, but you've shown that her first claims were focused on the adult relationship, not as much about the parenting.  Next, a lot of what she asserts that does touch on parenting may not meet the court's criteria for being actionable.

This is not to say it will be simple or easy, it won't be, but it gives you a general idea of what you're dealing with in court.  Women do have a little advantage in court when claiming DV, even just vague claims of feeling 'fearful'.  If she is emotionally convincing, even without documentation, it's possible the court might order you to be evaluated such as with psych evals.  There's nothing wrong with an evaluation, but if/when that happens try very hard to get the court to order BOTH of you get evaluated, otherwise it may be a very long time if ever before the court takes a close look at her.  To do that you may have to file your own case against her since right now you may be the only one alleged to be behaving poorly.

Don't forget that she may also complain about issues from a year ago or even further back.  In most cases, claimed past behaviors older than 6 months may be heard and then typically disregarded as 'stale', though it might apply for establishing a past pattern of behaviors.  So if (1) 'stale' or (2) not rising to the level of being 'actionable' for DV or child abuse, neglect or endangerment, then the court will likely dismiss a case of that sort.

Many lawyers are passive, focused more on making deals and settlements, not willing to press forward beyond the typical expectations of what the judge may rule, but you can't sit back and be passive.  Otherwise she'll eat you alive, or at least try to get the court to do that.  She may be so emotionally convincing and emphatic that the court may feel "surely there must be some fire here with all that smoke!"  So you need to stand firm, speak up with the truth, seeking the best order possible and meanwhile document your good behaviors and her poor behaviors.

I'm not saying settlements are bad, I've done some, but in many cases a settlement just postpones finding workable solutions or a better outcome for the children.

[ugghh]

I assume you have moved out, correct?

Yes sadly for those of us going down this path everything you describe is pretty standard behavior. All the advice you have already been given is both time-tested and on point.  I would add the following.

1) Get a digital voice recorder or two.  Never go near her without it being on.  This is for your protection against false allegations.

2) For me, I very quickly eliminated almost all verbal communications and will only communicate with stbx via email preferably or text if absolutely necessary.  Documentation counts.

3) If you have joint credit cards, etc. - shut them down.

4) Hire the best, most experience lawyer you can afford who has experience in high conflict divorces.  This is not a  pro-se type of case.

[Aussie0zborn]

Yes, this is very normal. Fight clean, fight hard. Don't make any mistakes. What can you do to let off steam when she king hits you from behind without retaliating in the same way?

[sanemom]

We are in a similar battle... . and it gets scary.  BPD mom thinks she has a plan with her crazy accusations.

A friend sent me this quote this week that may apply to you:

"Everybody has a game plan until you punch them in the mouth.  So you punch them in the mouth."  Chris Lehane

[livednlearned]

You have a complicated case, sanemom. It's hard what you're going through, especially having a BPD sufferer who has groomed her own negative advocates, and has them working against your H, with tragic consequences for your SD. That creates an additional layer of frustration that would be really hard for anyone. I imagine you must feel like the system is truly broken.

But this metaphor for dealing with N/BPDx and the courts would never have worked in my situation:

"Everybody has a game plan until you punch them in the mouth.  So you punch them in the mouth."  Chris Lehane

It's not who I am, and not how I think about conflict. I wanted to model a way of handling conflict that my son could emulate. He already has one example of someone who punches people in the mouth, so to speak.

I know it's a metaphor, but punching someone in the mouth is also an approach that can really backfire. My judge doesn't tolerate aggressive attitudes. Anything that looks remotely like aggression, or vengeance, or spite, or anger, that's an invitation to be put in contempt of court. People here need alternatives that help achieve goals and objectives, and well-planned strategies to get there. Being assertive, sticking to boundaries, documenting everything, learning when to tweak a strategy, managing emotions, focusing on the kids, and being persistent and patient. Learn everything about how the system works, try to be one step ahead. This is all just plain old assertive behavior.

[sanemom]

I think the metaphor from my friend was not to allude to an act of aggression, but rather to allude to an act that surprises the opponent.

In our case, taking back custody of DSD is something they do NOT anticipate us doing at all.  We are just saying "enough is enough" because BPD mom keeps running back to the decree when it suits her... . so now we will just go back to the decree to protect DSD's relationship with her dad because playing nice and letting BPD mom keep DSD is not working at all and is ultimately hurting DSD.  And the court-appointed reunification therapist supports this action and is willing to defend it to the judge.

[ForeverDad]

And the court-appointed reunification therapist supports this action and is willing to defend it to the judge.

This I think is momentous for sanemom.  "Upon advice of the reunification therapist, we are returning to the court order since it has become clear that deviating from the order as BioMom pressured didn't fix anything and, looking back, just made things worse."

[ugghh]

"Everybody has a game plan until you punch them in the mouth.  So you punch them in the mouth."  Chris Lehane

I actually made a similar statement to my attorney, telling him that by uBPDw / stbx needed to be punched in the nose - I quickly had to add "legally speaking, not actually" as I detected a look of panic cross his face.

For most of us we have spent years doing the walking on eggshells dance, trying everything possible to avoid upsetting our pwBPD.   THAT TIME IS OVER! As sanemom indicated, I also am not talking about taking overtly aggressive acts with our stbx.  I am simply stating that you have to radically change your way of thinking from avoiding conflict at all cost to being confident in speaking up for you need and firm in your resolve to achieve as many of those goals as possible.  You have to accept that your ex is going to be upset no matter what you do - that is not your concern, nor your job to worry about.   You have to focus on what is right for you.

Additionally, many of us tend to be very nice people - again time to change your frame of reference.  Asserting yourself and seeing your ex howl with emotions (screaming, crying, threatening, etc.) does not mean you are not a nice person.  Remember the airplane metaphor, before you put the oxygen mask on your child, you need to put your mask on first.  This is also why is so critical to have an experienced attorney to represent you - they act as a buffer between you and the ex, and they also become a sounding board/guide to stop you from giving away the farm to keep the peace.

I promise you there will be much gnashing of teeth and histrionics the first time you break the old patterns.  I also promise that it becomes easier and easier to keep at it as you feel the empowerment of detaching from the pwBPD.

[trappeddad]

Hope a CE can get to the facts in this case.    At least that is what I am depending on for my case