Sucker-punched ... AGAIN

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Will I never learn? I want so badly to believe his lies and charade that I was totally caught off guard.

Twenty-five years of marriage, gave up my career to support him and follow him around the country from assignment to assignment, homeschooled the kids to give them some stability in their education, and suddenly I'm not what he wants. He emptied our safe deposit box, drained our joint accounts, cashed out our joint trading account, took all my jewelry out of the safe and opened his own secret accounts for his paycheck to be deposited into. Over the years, every time I wanted to get even a part-time job to help financially, he would say, "Honey, the kids are so much more important. We'll make do; concentrate your time and energy on educating and taking care of them."  When the youngest got his high school diploma two years ago, I immediately got a full-time job (low-paying, to be sure... .I've been out of the workforce for over two decades). After almost two years of working, he told me I needed to quit because it was hardly worth it. I was spending too much time away from the family and they needed me to be at home (all the kids work full-time and take college classes part time, so they're all still at home trying to save $$ for college and a car).  So I quit my job and went back to taking care of everybody else.

Absconding with our life's savings was three months ago. Sucker punch #1. After many tears and gut-wrenching discussions, he said he didn't want to divorce, he just wanted to show me that everything I possessed was thanks to him. And he's been loving and kind ever since.  Well THAT was a ruse to keep me off guard. Today delivered sucker punch #2. I just discovered he's applied for a Home Equity Loan on our house (joint owners) -- I don't know how, unless he forged my name on the paperwork. We only owe $16,000 and it will be paid for.  Now who knows what my share of that debt obligation will be?  From the research I've done today, it depends on the bank as to whether they'll accept a single applicant on a jointly owned property, so I don't know for sure if it's actually illegal or just morally reprehensible. Bank is closed today so I couldn't talk to anyone about it.

I also found text messages on his phone that belie everything he has said over the past couple of months (he's overseas right now, and left his cell). So he's telling ME that he doesn't want a divorce, that he's totally committed to our marriage, sends me emails with hints of a long future ("Let's go to Hawaii again!" or "I think we should downsize when the kids leave home in the next couple of years. What do you think of this house style?".  But in text messages to his friend dated January 2, he said that he's still planning on leaving me this month, but he is planning his moves very carefully to avoid suspicion. "Operational Security" demands secrecy, he said. He told his friend he wants everything to be in place so he can act quickly and leave me unprepared and penniless because I'm just a "lazy $$" bee-yoch who wants to lay around and do nothing all day while he works himself to death. He thinks because I have a college degree I can waltz right into a 6-figure job after being a stay-at-home mom all this time. Ummm, no. I get to start at the bottom all over again, Hon.

I talked to a lawyer after he emptied the accounts and took my belongings a couple of months ago. The advice I got was that he was within his legal rights to take everything that was in our joint accounts, and I can't touch his sole-owner accounts where he's stashed all of our life's savings. And unless there was a notarized itemized list of the contents of the safe deposit box, I can kiss all that goodbye, too.  Lovely. When I told BPDh that I had talked to a lawyer, he feigned horror, declared his plan had backfired, said he loved me more than ever and never wanted to get a divorce. And he's been sweet as pie ever since while deviously plotting my demise behind my back.

Ugh! Calling the lawyer first thing Monday morning (BPDh doesn't get back till the following week--he has no clue I'm onto him), and seeing if there is any recourse to stop the financial hemorraghing. Of course I have no money to pay an attorney, anyway, since our bank account is empty, but I can't go down without a fight. It's going to be messy and bitter and hostile, I can tell. For some reason, he wants me utterly and completely destroyed. I just don't understand it.    Thankfully, my dewy eyes are finally opened. Operational Security has been compromised, and I'm on high alert.

[ObviouslyOblivious]

Will I never learn? I want so badly to believe his lies and charade that I was totally caught off guard.

Twenty-five years of marriage, gave up my career to support him and follow him around the country from assignment to assignment, homeschooled the kids to give them some stability in their education, and suddenly I'm not what he wants. He emptied our safe deposit box, drained our joint accounts, cashed out our joint trading account, took all my jewelry out of the safe and opened his own secret accounts for his paycheck to be deposited into. Over the years, every time I wanted to get even a part-time job to help financially, he would say, "Honey, the kids are so much more important. We'll make do; concentrate your time and energy on educating and taking care of them."  When the youngest got his high school diploma two years ago, I immediately got a full-time job (low-paying, to be sure... .I've been out of the workforce for over two decades). After almost two years of working, he told me I needed to quit because it was hardly worth it. I was spending too much time away from the family and they needed me to be at home (all the kids work full-time and take college classes part time, so they're all still at home trying to save $$ for college and a car).  So I quit my job and went back to taking care of everybody else.

Absconding with our life's savings was three months ago. Sucker punch #1. After many tears and gut-wrenching discussions, he said he didn't want to divorce, he just wanted to show me that everything I possessed was thanks to him. And he's been loving and kind ever since.  Well THAT was a ruse to keep me off guard. Today delivered sucker punch #2. I just discovered he's applied for a Home Equity Loan on our house (joint owners) -- I don't know how, unless he forged my name on the paperwork. We only owe $16,000 and it will be paid for.  Now who knows what my share of that debt obligation will be?  From the research I've done today, it depends on the bank as to whether they'll accept a single applicant on a jointly owned property, so I don't know for sure if it's actually illegal or just morally reprehensible. Bank is closed today so I couldn't talk to anyone about it.

I also found text messages on his phone that belie everything he has said over the past couple of months (he's overseas right now, and left his cell). So he's telling ME that he doesn't want a divorce, that he's totally committed to our marriage, sends me emails with hints of a long future ("Let's go to Hawaii again!" or "I think we should downsize when the kids leave home in the next couple of years. What do you think of this house style?".  But in text messages to his friend dated January 2, he said that he's still planning on leaving me this month, but he is planning his moves very carefully to avoid suspicion. "Operational Security" demands secrecy, he said. He told his friend he wants everything to be in place so he can act quickly and leave me unprepared and penniless because I'm just a "lazy $$" bee-yoch who wants to lay around and do nothing all day while he works himself to death. He thinks because I have a college degree I can waltz right into a 6-figure job after being a stay-at-home mom all this time. Ummm, no. I get to start at the bottom all over again, Hon.

I talked to a lawyer after he emptied the accounts and took my belongings a couple of months ago. The advice I got was that he was within his legal rights to take everything that was in our joint accounts, and I can't touch his sole-owner accounts where he's stashed all of our life's savings. And unless there was a notarized itemized list of the contents of the safe deposit box, I can kiss all that goodbye, too.  Lovely. When I told BPDh that I had talked to a lawyer, he feigned horror, declared his plan had backfired, said he loved me more than ever and never wanted to get a divorce. And he's been sweet as pie ever since while deviously plotting my demise behind my back.

Ugh! Calling the lawyer first thing Monday morning (BPDh doesn't get back till the following week--he has no clue I'm onto him), and seeing if there is any recourse to stop the financial hemorraghing. Of course I have no money to pay an attorney, anyway, since our bank account is empty, but I can't go down without a fight. It's going to be messy and bitter and hostile, I can tell. For some reason, he wants me utterly and completely destroyed. I just don't understand it.    Thankfully, my dewy eyes are finally opened. Operational Security has been compromised, and I'm on high alert.

[david]

If he forged your name for the loan I would go to the bank and let them know. Also let them know you do not want to be held liable for any of the debt. I don't know the legal maneuvers but there should be a way to protect yourself. The bank may only allow 50 % of the equity to be loaned. That would be his 50 % of the equity in the house. Just thinking out loud because I am not sure.

[GaGrl]

Do you have safe copies of the texts? If not, get copies and protect them. You have a lot to do in a short time to protect yourself. Are you thinking that you might need to file for divorce first? Your lawyer's advice will be critical.

[livednlearned]

I'm sorry ObviouslyOblivious, how awful to have the rug yanked from under you like this.

I don't understand the lawyer's response, though. Is he talking about what you can do legally right now? It may be true that you cannot do anything legally to roll back all the things your H has been doing, but if (when?) you get divorced, you'll have to go through some kind of forensic process to detail where all the money and assets are, and then depending on the laws where you live, things will start to get carved up according to the law. So in terms of marriage, you have no recourse, but in terms of divorce, you do. Is that what the L is saying?

Once you file for divorce, it's often very difficult to scrape by until the financial settlement takes place. If your H can take out a home equity loan without you, then that means you can take one out too, as long as he has not taken out the limit. When I left, my L advised me to take half of everything, including a home equity loan in case my ex dragged things out for a long time. I also got a credit card in my name only in case he cut off any other cards ( he did ). The purpose of doing this was to make sure I could support myself and S13 until we mediated a settlement. For some people here, with BPD spouses involved, that can take years. Mine went surprisingly quickly and we managed to mediate. But my ex is extremely narcissistic and I think he was trying to prove something to his L. I also (stupidly) gave my ex the house, and I think his L said, "You better take this offer or you're stupid."

I wonder what your H is planning to do in terms of your house. Move out? I hope he isn't trying to figure out a way to have you removed. Is there a lot of equity in the house?

What were the items in the safety deposit box? Can you find receipts or track down where things were purchased to see if you can estimate an amount? If I were you, I would talk not only to an L on Monday, but find a forensic accountant as well. They'll do an interrogatory or discovery through the legal process. Another thing you might want to consider is a deposition. They can be expensive, but it will put your H's sworn testimony on record, and he can be cross-examined. If he lies under oath, then he's subject to perjury. Hopefully, things won't go to trial. Your H is hoping that you're going to roll over. It will cost a lot in legal fees to set a boundary with him, and it will minimize the amount you settle. But my experience is that being asserting and setting a boundary is worth the cost.

[catnap]

Photographs showing you wearing jewelry that was in the safety deposit box might be helpful in proving they existed.  Email all the texts to yourself.  Print them out--make multiple copies and place them in various safe places.  Make sure the L gets copies.  Do not forget to delete the texts you sent yourself off of your H's cell.  Also print out and save the emails showing he sent talking about your future plans as a couple. 

While you H is out of town, make copies of all important documents you can locate-mortgage, tax returns, life insurance policies, car titles, etc.  Again, make sure you have more than one copy and they can be hidden somewhere (a good friend, a safety deposit box in your name only, family) he cannot find them.  I agree on finding a forensic accountant as well. 

Would there be any advantage if you file for divorce first?  Is there a family member that can loan you money to get these things rolling before your H returns? 

[ObviouslyOblivious]

Thanks for the words of wisdom. You guys are awesome.

I will find out first thing tomorrow about the home equity loan limits. We have two houses, one we bought nearly 20 years ago that is almost paid off. Since we're renting it, it's considered a secondary home. The rules apparently vary between banks, but he might very well be able to take out the full equity on the secondary home, using the property itself as collateral. I don't think he has any intention of paying back the loan, and would instead let the bank take the house.  All to keep me from getting one penny. I wouldn't get the house, and I wouldn't get my share of the proceeds if we were to sell the house. Win-win for him. He's retiring next year so he couldn't care less about his credit. Mine is ripe for trashing.

Our second home, the one we live in (another state), we've had for only two years and purchased with a no-money-down VA loan. Most of our payments have been interest, so we've practically no equity in this house. He has already said he has no reason to keep paying this mortgage, and said he is perfectly fine with letting it fall into foreclosure. Again, my credit would be trashed along with his, and I'm the one just starting out on the job hunt. You can't even rent an apartment these days without good credit, and it would definitely tarnish my chances with potential employers. Since he's already verbalized it, I've no doubt that's what he's probably going to do.

My stbxBPD is definitely NPD as well. A regular picnic, isn't it? Fortunately, I've worked hard on building my own credit and (at the moment) have a good credit score and a couple of cards in my name only. They've only been used for gas and groceries for the family, but I'm going to pay them off in full this week so they'll be clear for any legal fees coming up in the near future.

Re: the current housing situation, in his texts to his friend he indicated that he was "leaving," so I think that means he is planning on packing a bag and going elsewhere. One of the things I'm going to discuss with an attorney tomorrow is an emergency pendente lite action so he can't just stop paying the bills as well. It's going to take some time for me to find employment, and our kids live here, too. He can't just throw us out into the street because he is going through a midlife crisis and wants his freedom (and his youth -- Lord have mercy, that's all he talks about any more... .the glory days of being a high school football player). 

In the safe deposit box was our life savings, our retirement investment that we scrimped and saved to purchase over a couple of decades: about $300k in gold and silver bullion and cash, as well as all my own personal jewelry: my grandmother's 8-carat ruby, my diamond earrings, some opals I got in Australia long before we were married, a diamond tennis bracelet I got as a gift from my parents, my pearl and diamond sorority pin, etc. The only reason he would take those things is to take a swipe at me. And yes, we had an itemized list, but it was in our safe at home, which has also been cleaned out. Sigh. I have been trying to recreate the list of what I think was in there, but apparently my recollections are of no legal value and don't constitute proof.

I've just discovered the Automatic Temporary Restraining Order, which enacts a financial "freeze" so he can't change insurance policy beneficiaries or move any more cash or access his safe deposit box or borrow any more against a joint asset until a judge evaluates the status quo. Closing the barn door after the horse has bolted, I know, but it might salvage something. Otherwise, the scorched earth policy currently underway will leave nothing left for a judge to divide. I'm not in it for the money, although it sounds like it. I just really hate the idea of being used up for twenty-five years and then discarded with contempt like a soiled tissue. It's demoralizing. My therapist had to remind me that I am a valuable person, a child of God, and I have worth, too. I'm so used to giving my time and energy to putting out fires and validating and meeting everybody else's needs that I overlook myself. 

Thanks again for the guidance. I'm just sorry you too have "been there, done that."

[livednlearned]

Where I live, you have to show that your monthly income is 3x the monthly rent. So it isn't just having good credit, it's having steady income. You need to find out tomorrow how much the home equity line is, and how much he has drafted from it. And if you can, go and do the same.

Get an aggressive lawyer if you can. When it comes to custody, I think aggressive lawyers can make things worse. I don't know... .mine is sharp and assertive. But when it comes to financial matters, you want someone aggressive because it's less likely to create trauma for kids in the center of a custody battle.

In my financial settlement, we just wrote stuff down on a spreadsheet -- it was a template that my L had me fill out. I never had to show any proof. But the way things were valued was based on what we could get on Craig's List. My ex had an impulsive spending problem and would buy original works of art. He claimed they were an investment, and wanted to have them appraised as high as possible. And then his L pointed out that the higher the value, the more we was going to have to give me in the settlement. Suddenly, the paintings were worth less than the frames. 

So it's a bit of a game, not an exact science when it comes to furniture, jewelry, etc.

I like the idea of the automatic restraining order. If you can add things to it, then maybe toss in there that he cannot sell any items pending legal action.

The transition from unhappy, yet somewhat stable marriage to happy, living free from abuse -- it is a bit of a bumpy ride to say the least. But I can't believe how much strength I gained from divorcing my ex. Even at 45, which is technically old, I feel like my life is the best it's ever been. 4 years ago, I thought it was the end of the world.

You'll get through this ok, OO. Get ready to find out how strong and resilient you truly are 

[ForeverDad]

I would suggest you get additional legal consultations.  Even if you don't hire the other attorneys - you would be able to choose the attorney you consider best for you and your situation - those consultations might provide you with additional strategies.  That's the reality, he has strategies, you need your own, better, strategies to counteract them.  His priorities are selfish.  Your priorities are for you, the children and justice.  Justice is hard to get in a judicial system that can be misused almost as easily as used.  So focus on benefits for you and the children.

His strategy is to hide assets and care less about creating debts or problems.  You can't afford to sit back and play defense.  As has been illustrated about football games, teams don't win on defense alone.

I don't understand the lawyer's response, though. Is he talking about what you can do legally right now? It may be true that you cannot do anything legally to roll back all the things your H has been doing, but if (when?) you get divorced, you'll have to go through some kind of forensic process to detail where all the money and assets are, and then depending on the laws where you live, things will start to get carved up according to the law. So in terms of marriage, you have no recourse, but in terms of divorce, you do. Is that what the L is saying?

I too wonder what the advice by the attorney was all about.  It doesn't sound right unless he was talking about what spouses can do during marriage.  Divorce ought to be something entirely different.  Find out how starting divorce changes the prior advice.

Remember, consultations with lawyers is Confidential.  You have a right to confidentiality and privacy.  You have no obligation to divulge to your husband that you've gotten consultations.  Just as he has never told you what consultations he may have sought.

It does sound like you'll have to face the fact that he's been actively removing whatever resources you have.  To counteract that you'll have to be proactive and not reactive.  Likely he is counting on you being your own worst enemy by sabotaging yourself with hopes and wishes.  Sadly too this is not a time to give him the benefit of a doubt.  Very likely you will have to seek in your filing that the accounts and safety deposit boxes all be reported and not be drained or raided.  Very likely too you'll need a forensic accountant or Special Master assigned by the court to find the assets he's trying to hide.

About his equity loan application, I too doubt he can get one on a jointly owned property without your signature, though I am not a professional and don't know the laws in your area.