Please help me Interpret His Texts - Breakup, Heartbroken

[virginiawoolf]

I've been posting on the Staying board, because I am heartbroken and I WANT to stay with my uBPDxbf (2 year r/s). But I think he's really ended it.  I've come to Undecided hoping I could get the most open/neutral advice here. Hope I'm in the right place.

He's broken up with me before, but we've always gotten back together. I'm trying to figure out if this time is different... .I'm trying to figure out if this time is real... .And if there's anything I can do to change this.

What makes me really fear it is real is this: He is leaving the country in 5 days and will be gone, traveling, for 3 months. He's been pulling away for about a month and a half. Something really changed. It may be his trip. (He always pulls away before trips, but he hasn't taken a long trip like this since the beginning of our relationship, and that time was different -- he did not pull away, we were very close). He's said repeatedly he's afraid to leave me to travel (though he is doing it). More recently he said he doesn't see the point of increasing our bond, if he's just leaving.

I posted about this dynamic and our background in previous threads. Mostly in my intro thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=272817.msg12587243#msg12587243

I'm heartbroken. Though I know our relationship is troubled, I've never experienced love like this before. I wish I had discovered the resources on this site sooner.

I would really like your thoughts on this breakup. And, specifically on his texts. Is he sending mixed signals? (or am I deluding myself). Do you see aspects of BPD in anything here? Are there any emergency measures I can take now?

This first set of texts was from about 5 days ago, following a fight... .and him maybe trying to institute some kind of separation prior to his trip. NOTE: These texts went on for 2 days. I waited 4 days to respond to any of them (maybe a huge mistake, because I was so distraught following the fight in-person fight that preceded them). Also, when he speaks about his aunt's he's referencing a short getaway he's been talking about taking with me before his departure:

SATURDAY (following fight, in which he left my house, said that would be our final goodbye before his departure, and re-negged on our getaway.):

-I'm scared of leaving you. I don't think there can be right terms.

-[He called shortly afterwards a bit calmer, and said we prob would still go to his aunt's]

-I'm sure we'll end up going to my aunt's. I love you. I'm sorry. I'm really stressed about leaving in some ways. I'll talk to you tomorrow

-Let me just get back to you tomorrow

-Last night was great, btw... .I really enjoyed our meal

-[More texts about his aunt's showing he'd actually researched getting there, renting a car, etc].

SUNDAY

- I love you... .sending all of my love to you

-Love you. My knee is so messed up. I don't even know what the point of going [to southeast Asia to study martial arts for 3 months] is if it doesn't get better. Either way, I may end up not even working Thursday [meaning we could leave for our getaway earlier, which is what I'd been wanting]... .What are you thinking?

-I hope you are OK... .I love you

-Either way, next Saturday I'm doing a going away thing at my house

-I'm sorry for any way I've hurt you... .I really do love you

-You've  had multiple chances to respond... .What I wish I understood is why I am so worried about losing you even as a friend when I love you so much... .I don't find these feelings of anxiety to be pleasant... .I know you have them too... .But it's been ongoing for so long... .I love you... .But I shouldn't live in fear of losing you when I am just not able to be everything you want or I wish I could be. I really hope I contributed to your happiness in some way. I feel the  opposite and hate myself for it. But I already am so troubled as is I would really like to not hate myself.

-We should have gone out more... .we should have integrated each other socially, etc... .but I can't change that... .I also cant' hate myself for it... .It's what happened. It doesn't mean I never loved you. But I have a deep anxiety in me... .a deep self loathing... .I'm actually really bad at communicating too... .and while I am in love with you, I haven't been what you needed, and I haven't been what our love deserves.

-I'm sorry for it, but I tried... .I really tried ... .harder than for anyone else my whole life... .I can't expect you to appreciate this, but at least I'm telling you this. I'm not a bad guy. I'm unstable, I'm immature. I'm like every other guy I guess, but my heart is in the right place and it doesn't deserve to suffer because of what could have been or what I am missing out on or from not being what you needed... .I don't know... .I've been anxious all day... .I'm always anxious. But I know I will be here for you in the ways I can, and I think some of them really matter. I hope you can do the same for me.

-PS: you are one of my best friends, regardless.

Tuesday

I finally respond. I now so badly wished I had responded earlier. If I had, we probably would have been going to his aunt's  (though he seemed so on the fence about it... .which hurt). I know me not responding fast enough to calls/texts has been one of his primary gripes with me. It really has unhinged him in the past (when he's seemed more vulnerable). But somehow I continue to do this either accidentally (when things are going well), or because I feel paralyzed with hurt or fear (when things aren't).

I wrote: "Hey, I rally hope you are doing ok and I hope your anxiety has lessened. i know this is a stressful time. i took some space away from checking/ responding to texts because i needed to clear my head and feel calm. I am still working on this, but I'm feeling less overwhelmed. I would liek to have a nice goodbye with you. I am still thinking about [your aunt's]. Maybe we can check in a bit later today? How is your knee? Sending love and care to your heart and knee"

His responses:

-"I've been doing yoga everyday. My knee is still bad. IDK, it's upsetting. My anxiety is what it is. I'm ok... .I'm always sending you love and care... .I don't know about [going to my aunt's]. I don't think I'm gonna be able to work before anyway with my knee... .but also maybe it would be irresponsible of me to go... .I love you very much and very deeply... .I understand you not responding. But I think those texts were very important for me to write you. [NOTE: I'm still unclear on what exactly he was trying to say in those "important" texts, or what my takeaway should be... .any thoughts? ].

-I don't want to mystify the perfect goodbye but I also don't want a bad goodbye. So I would like to see you soon and before I go... .But I'm too unstable to lead us through this... .Blame aside, going forward as a positive collective is very important to me... .as I said you are and will always be one of my best friends.

-But I'm confused when I look back and think about how so much guilt and resentment was built up between two people who love each other so much... .and it leads me to blame myself... .cause that's how I think... .but that's not a positive route forward.

-I am for the last time messaging you here that I want to remain in each others lives... .how that is idk... .but it's very important to me... .deeply important... .and unconditional... .for me... .To me that is something I've said many times to us, thinking it would be assumed and appreciated... .I could see us together... .happy... .romantically... .but not right now... .not because of you... .but because I'm not ready to handle responsibilities that come with a romantic relationship... .which I come to accept and take responsibility for.

-But that should not negate all the love I am proud to take responsibility for when it comes to how I feel about you as another human being.

Wednesday

Again, I was paralyzed with fear about how to respond, so I waited until today. I REALLY didn't know what to write. I just wrote:

-Hey, thank you for the text. Hope you're feeling ok. I"m sure you have tons to do... .just let me know when you figure out when works best to meet... .want to make sure I leave time open... .

His responses today are colder and logistical. He wants to meet Friday at 9:30pm. (I'm already disappointed because Tuesday he had said he wanted to meet soon AND before he leaves. I was hoping we'd spend MORE time together ... .

If any of you can help me to get a handle on any of this I'd be so grateful... .I'm living now in such deep sadness and regret.

Thanks... .

[rarsweet]

That was a whole bunch of I, I, I, I don't know what I want but I want you to go along with it, keep hanging on until I figure it out.

[Notwendy]

Hi Virginia- It is painful to be going through this- someone you love is taking a long trip. I don't think anyone can interpret his texts as well as you can. None of us know him or the context of them, and even if we did know him, speculating could not be accurate.

I see in your posts that you feel regret- that if you had done something different- do or say or text or something, this would not have happened. Consider though, that your bf's actions may have more to do with him, internally, than anything you did or did not do.

[EaglesJuju]

Hi virginiawoolf,  

I am sorry that you are feeling heartbroken.     I understand how you could feel sadness and regret.  :)o not be so hard on yourself, there is no way that you could prevent another person's actions or behaviors.  

Some of the texts describe abandonment fears and push/pull behavior:

-I'm scared of leaving you.

-You've  had multiple chances to respond... .What I wish I understood is why I am so worried about losing you even as a friend when I love you so much... .I don't find these feelings of anxiety to be pleasant... .I know you have them too... .But it's been ongoing for so long... .I love you... .But I shouldn't live in fear of losing you when I am just not able to be everything you want or I wish I could be.

Some of the texts describe his self-loathing and unstable nature:

But I have a deep anxiety in me... .a deep self loathing... .I'm actually really bad at communicating too... .and while I am in love with you, I haven't been what you needed, and I haven't been what our love deserves.

So I would like to see you soon and before I go... .But I'm too unstable to lead us through this... .

Although I cannot diagnose him with BPD, the abandonment fears, push/pull behavior, self-loathing, and unstable nature are traits associated with BPD.  

Many times when a pwBPD is dysregulating their abandonment fears can become triggered. When my bf left he acted cold, indifferent, and pushed me away. My bf copes with abandonment by distancing himself from me, before I do it.

What happened the other times you broke up before?

[waverider]

You both have some behavioral traits in common

~Anxiety about feeling controlled

~Abandonment fears

~Catastrophizing (believing the worst)

This is handicapping smooth communications, allowing the other to assume the worst, and overreacting based on thier own dire expectations.

You cannot control the way he acts, but you can alter the way you react.

If he is a pwBPD then he will lack consistency what his plans are today will not be fixed in concrete, so whether he goes, or stays gone, misses you, or not, can't be predicted not directly controlled.

All you can do is work on these aspects of the way you interact, and maybe this may take the pressure of him (stop making it worse part of relationships). It will certainly make you feel better. Then whatever happens will happen. He has every right to do what he wants to do regardless of how much you feel like you need him.

If you bleed desperation and neediness all over him he is likely to take it as granted and things will get worse.

Ultimately you need to firm up on your own values and boundaries rather than being so reactionary which can result in being dependent on others. Its what we termLooking in the mirror

[patientandclear]

Virginia, I see a theme cropping up in what he wrote, about how he can't be what you want or meet your needs, and that makes him feel bad about himself, but that doesn't mean he doesn't love you.

I recognize this dynamic from my own relationship.  The BPD person in my life is very afraid that I want things that he cannot do. We are in very early stages of practicing that I can tell him what I like but if that isn't something he can do, or do right away, I'm not leaving him (apart from one or two boundary issues that are not part of the "I can't be what you need."

I hope that helps. I wouldn't put much stock in the idea that this is "over." It may take a while for him to settle his bad feelings.

[virginiawoolf]

That was a whole bunch of I, I, I, I don't know what I want but I want you to go along with it, keep hanging on until I figure it out.

Agh... .that, exactly that ^^, has been how it's felt for many portions of the time we've been together. But mostly in terms of his words... .In terms of his actions, he's been "leading"/"initiating" the relationship consistently. (except when he breaks up with me, sigh). Which is quite confusing. How can somebody go on like that for so long? (especially somebody who has throughout most of it been so needy and persistent).

I've been seeing his latest bout of withdrawing, however, as more definitively marking a real "end". Perhaps this time (meaning for the past month or so) because his actions and emotional responses have seemed to indicate withdrawal, in a way that hasn't quite happened before --even while we were supposedly broken up. (lately, he hasn't been initiating, seems to "care" less or not at all, see each other and communicate much less frequently). It eases my anxiety a bit to see that some of you think that there is maybe a bit more ambiguity in the situation than I'd been seeing.

[virginiawoolf]

Virginia, I see a theme cropping up in what he wrote, about how he can't be what you want or meet your needs, and that makes him feel bad about himself, but that doesn't mean he doesn't love you.

I recognize this dynamic from my own relationship.  The BPD person in my life is very afraid that I want things that he cannot do. We are in very early stages of practicing that I can tell him what I like but if that isn't something he can do, or do right away, I'm not leaving him (apart from one or two boundary issues that are not part of the "I can't be what you need."

I hope that helps. I wouldn't put much stock in the idea that this is "over." It may take a while for him to settle his bad feelings.

Yes, this is (and has been) so troubling to me. It's a theme in his texts above, but also throughout our relationships. In his other breakups with me he's said the same ("I make you so unhappy, I'm ruining your life, etc."  :'( :'(

It's hard for me to understand because he made me SO happy (EXCEPT when he'd break up with me; that would make me very unhappy, though I was careful not to expose him to the true extent of how sad I'd get). Moreover, this is probably the one relationship where I really haven't "asked" for anything. I loved him so sincerely just for who he was -- and had so few requirements or expectations in terms of the "Relationship". It's not like I had requirements/demands of him. I truly just let things flow.

It's just hard for me to understand how he could feel this way.

Then the more pragmatic (or perhaps insecure) part of myself questions it.

Specifically I wonder if maybe this is guy-speak for "I need to sow my wild oats". Or: I'm sleeping with others -- and it's an issue that you should be concerned about.

I'm also older than he is. I think that causes guilt for him too.

But then, I don't completely understand the guilt. This sounds horrible, but if it's possible I'd like to say without judgement: He has a big heart, but at the end of the day he is quite selfish. He just is, it's a reality. And he seems to be so oblivious to his selfishness. Can somebody like that actually be plagued by guilt in the way he's suggesting?

I sometimes wonder if when he claims to feel guilt/shame/inadequacy, what he really feels is: "I want to do whatever I want, but I don't want to feel like a bad guy, so I'm going to try to convince myself and the world that I feel incredibly guilty and shameful."

Is this something that happens, or could be happening here?

[rarsweet]

In what ways does he have a big heart? Whenever I hear 2 conflicting statements, I wonder which one is backed up by examples. Kind of like saying someone is an animal lover and then saying they hunt and wear fur... how much of our feelings are based on what we experience and how much is just what we've been convinced of? I have an aunt who was so hung up on a guy. She would say he drinks too much, I would say then ditch him, she would say well I really like him. This went on for months with her listing her issues, he drinks, he drinks alone, he doesn't have a job, he's a slob, he's impotent, etc. Finally I said " Brenda what exactly do you like about him, make a list for me". She had nothing . She had just convinced herself she liked him.

[waverider]

Be aware that generosity is often more about receiving praise and approval than actually giving out of consideration.

Does big heart =Big gestures, or does he quietly, and without notice, do very considerate things.

[mrwigand]

I'm so sorry you're going through this pain. I agree with what others have said in many respects. We can try to interpret these texts, but it may be an unfair exercise since we're not nearly as informed as you are, and also we aren't mind readers. It may be helpful to examine actions as opposed to words. I see the way he talks about you and himself, but do his actions match?

That being said I think it's a little unfair to avoid your question, so I'll tell you what I honestly think based on what I read.

1) He wants your sympathy. He wants you to see him as weak and in need of help and pity (his hurt leg), and also as someone who isn't really responsible for the mistakes they make.

2) And it seems like he wants out of the relationship. His insistence that you are absolutely still one of his best friend, etc., could be him trying to keep you at a comfortable distance until he tries to bring you back into his life again. This way he has some measure of control.

I don't know. That's what occurred to me, but I agree with everyone else that you should think more about how you're feeling, etc.

[virginiawoolf]

You both have some behavioral traits in common

~Anxiety about feeling controlled

~Abandonment fears

~Catastrophizing (believing the worst)

This is handicapping smooth communications, allowing the other to assume the worst, and overreacting based on thier own dire expectations.

Thank you so much.

It's interesting that you see the same traits in both of us. It's probably true.

I absolutely have abandonment fears. He's broken up with me too many times. I stopped feeling safe. It's effected the way I treat him. But I've always been able to forgive him

He is leaving. But the way he is handling his leaving is SO hurtful to me. He's spent almost 2 years making me feel that I'm his absolute priority. And now, just before leaving I feel that he's making time for everybody in his life except me. He almost seems to be rubbing it in my face. It's very confusing.

It's frustrating because I feel that I enabled this (new) dynamic by expressing TOO much love (I think he sense desperation). At the same time I seem to perpetuate the dynamic by withdrawing on my own. The past few weeks of me not responding to his texts/calls... .or not responding fast enough... .or responding too coldly. I've been too hurt by his pulling away.

[virginiawoolf]

2 nights ago he drunk dialed me at 3am. That hasn't happened in forever (and now I miss it). I answered but had clearly been sleeping. He didn't really say anything,  but got off the phone quickly. The next morning he wrote:

"I'll see you tomorrow... .I really love you and just wanted to say that... .sorry about the drunk dial... .I was thinking of you a lot... .I really love you and am going to miss you and I'm really sorry to wake you up like that... .I love you."

That made me feel nice, I guess.

Here is my true fear. I'm afraid to say it. And I also understand that it probably really doesn't matter in the end.

I MUCH prefer to think that all of this pulling away has been to deal with his own abandonment issues and fears of leaving/losing me. I'm desperately trying to convince myself of this. Is this even plausible?

One of the recent times he got upset with me he said he's done with love... .he's not ever dating again.

My deepest fear though, ugh, is that he slept with somebody else... .and then actually started to fall for her emotionally. I have no evidence for this whatsoever. Should I ask him?



I wonder what he is doing with all of the energy he used to invest into me. He was just always so persistent... .even when it seemed he didn't want to be. How could somebody so undisciplined suddenly develop the resolve to institute such distance. Could his fear be that powerful? Or is just some cliche womanizing dude?

[patientandclear]

VW--I completely identify with how you're feeling and especially with having to make room for the possibility that your guy is breaking up with you because he cares too much about you and that threatens him (very likely true BTW); and that he is putting someone else in your place and that's one reason you're not hearing as much from him (though I gotta say, his communication volume still seems pretty high).

The answer could be: both.  If by chance he IS connecting with some other woman, it could be as a pressure release valve from all the super activated feelings he obviously has around you.  I have zero reason to think you're right that there could be someone else, and I know how that idea comes creeping in from reading all the stories around here and from our own self-worth anxieties.  But still, it is possible, and you're smart to realize that.

In my case, my spidey senses that the man I care about wBPD was seeing other women were always right.

And yet.  It can be true that he feels very deeply for you and simply cannot figure out how to do that, how to discharge the responsibilities of a real relationship, like he very honestly told you.  So he might be having a much shallower connection to relieve his feels of guilt and panic and loss and hurt.

Unfortunately these things are not mutually exclusive.

[virginiawoolf]

VW--I completely identify with how you're feeling and especially with having to make room for the possibility that your guy is breaking up with you because he cares too much about you and that threatens him (very likely true BTW); and that he is putting someone else in your place and that's one reason you're not hearing as much from him (though I gotta say, his communication volume still seems pretty high).

The answer could be: both.  If by chance he IS connecting with some other woman, it could be as a pressure release valve from all the super activated feelings he obviously has around you.  I have zero reason to think you're right that there could be someone else, and I know how that idea comes creeping in from reading all the stories around here and from our own self-worth anxieties.  But still, it is possible, and you're smart to realize that.

In my case, my spidey senses that the man I care about wBPD was seeing other women were always right.

And yet.  It can be true that he feels very deeply for you and simply cannot figure out how to do that, how to discharge the responsibilities of a real relationship, like he very honestly told you.  So he might be having a much shallower connection to relieve his feels of guilt and panic and loss and hurt.

Unfortunately these things are not mutually exclusive.

Thank you so much, patientandclear. Your approach to thinking about things this way makes me feel much calmer right now (if that's possible). It's less black and white. I think I do need to focus on the fact that in spite of anything he does in fact feel very deeply toward me. When I get into modes of doubting that, things become very difficult for me. A shallower connection would bother me much less.

His history is that in terms of "friendships" he has deep connections. In fact they seem to be somewhat a "stand-in" for him for romantic relationships -- as well as for family (bc he's not close w his). In terms of romantic relationships, so far as I know, they are almost exclusively fleeting, shallow connections. If I'm to believe what he tells me, I've been a huge exception to that rule. Along with another woman from about 6 years ago who is now one of his best friends (lots to talk about there... .it has complicated our relationship in some ways)

[Svarl1]

Difficult situation VW... .

For what it's worth, the style of his communication reminds me a little of myself near the beginning of my relationship.

To me, he appears to be almost trying to convince himself of a certain twisted narrative in order to reconcile some of his disharmonious beliefs, feelings or behaviour.

In my own case, I had entered a relationship that i didn't really want to be in, however I wanted a GF in order to prove i was loveable / acceptable / whatever.

I wanted to be able to leave the relationship, but didn't want to see myself as a heartless b***ard.

I wanted to believe that adults are free and individually responsible, and at the same time realised I had a deep-down belief that a needy person can't EVER be abandoned, no matter what.

Overall I was very self-obsessed, insecure and cowardly.

Now the main difference i noticed:

Your guy appears to be making the running - instigating - which is something i didn't personally do. That makes me think he has rather more commitment or at least genuine affection for you. If he didn't then I don't think he'd make that much effort, unless his inner self-narrative demands this behaviour from him.

So my hunch is that he is internally conflicted, unsure of his values in some way, and so drives himself to try and satisfy various incompatible self-images or something.

If so, then he may be aching to speak to someone and yet perhaps feels unable to raise things with you in a direct way. Maybe he perceives insecurity in you, even though you haven't 'asked' for anything in your relationship.

One reason for his lengthy trips may be to 'run away' from his conflict for a while and focus on something like martial arts which seems more straightforward to him than relationships.

I would recommend that he uses meditation or some other technique to acknowledge any such conflicting feelings or beliefs in a non-judgmental way. Then they will gradually lose their tension and he should hopefully 'act them out' less in his words and behaviour.

The way you describe he is at the moment, to be brutally honest he doesn't have sufficient integrity to be in a proper relationship.

If and when he finds such integrity, you also need to accept that although he'll behave more consistently he may - or may not - be the man you'd like him to be.