My daughter has me a hostage of guilt

[Muriel]

I'm 52yrs old and five years ago ( approx ) my daughter now 34 yrs made an attempt on her life. I have been a hostage every since.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Rapt Reader]

Hello, Muriel &

I'm so sorry for all of the pain and trauma you have been going through with your daughter; my own son (38) was diagnosed with BPD in April 2013 after a Suicidal Ideation landed him eventually in an Intensive In-Patient 21-day Dual Diagnosis Program. I know how stressful and difficult having a child who seems to be self-destructive can be... .

You say that her attempt was 5 years ago... .Did she get diagnosed with a disorder at that time? Did she receive any Treatment? Is she in any ongoing Therapy at this time? Does she realize that she has a problem, and is she willing to get help for it?

I'm sorry that you are a hostage to her troubles; how does this manifest? Does she live with you? If not, do you see her often? What are the behaviors that are causing you problems? We parents on this site know what you are going through, and I'm very glad you've found us, Muriel 

Have you had the chance to check out the links to the right-hand side of this page? The TOOLS and THE LESSONS are a wonderful resource to get a better handle on your daughter's behavior, with good advice on how to make things better for both of you... .Please tell us more of your story, so we can help you, OK? 

[lbjnltx]

Hi Muriel,

Are you afraid to hold your daughter accountable or say no to her because she might harm herself?

Been there... .it stinks.

There are ways to communicate, set limits, and support without enabling.  It takes work and it can be done.  We will help you learn if you are willing to invest.



lbj

[Muriel]

Well first Id like to say that I am mentally exhausted. I can really just force myself to even talk about this. Due to an indicent where a co-worker made an allegation against my daughter my daughter quit her job and nearly put an end to her life due to a minor (not in her mind) incident that could have easily passed. My daughter after quitting her job was unable to manage her finances and I allowed her to move in with me and my new husband (I was widowed). Immediately upon moving in the trouble began... .my husband and me made too much noise, our food smells, we didn't go out enough, I put meat and vegatables on the same shelf in the fridge, I lay on the couch I should go to bed, she has nothing we have everything, all the troubles in her life are my fault, I was a horrible mother, I am histonic (thats a projection is I ever saw one), her reasoning is flawless while we are near retarded, she doesn't leave the house unless under very specific circumstances (no traffic, only certain areas etc... .) in the mix of all this my daughter decided she was unable to work and that she would pursue SS (which may be appropriate) but it is a long and arduous task which leaves me with much of the responsibility (my husband helps but you can imagine how he feels about all this). when my daughter moved in we made sure she had all she needed  a ps3, an iPhone a TV, cloths i felt she was set to start over at that time. My daughter has since sold all of those things. My daughter steals from me and my husband I can't list all that has gone missing. My daughter has not spoken to her only sister for over two years over a shoe discount. My daughter has no friends in reality but puts a fake online persona and plays a game called something war? for which she begs me constantly for money to buy stuff on, she cries when she loses a battle and loses things associated with the game. If I do not give in to her demands she sits in the living next to me and cries. She has threatened me. Now thats a fraction ... .when I finally had enough and told her she needed to leave she said (more than once) you really do want me dead don't you? because you've always hated me. This women is 34 years old. What I've said here is a minute fraction of my life. My husband and I now live to keep peace and wonder between ourselves how to escape this... .If i move and leave her here (because she will not leave) and she hurts herself or someone else how would I live with that. If we stay we have no life. Yes she needs help but I don't think I have to say that I have done all I can to make that happen. Please don't tell me to set boundries because when you are dealing with someone who has no personally boundaries... .your boudries

mean nothing to them

[Muriel]

Guess that seems like a huge amount to say for someone who is so tired but believe me that's a fraction of the problem. My daughter has created this facade for the public while she has lost that facade with me ( she used to keep that facade with me to) since she

Moved back in. I once believed she was strong, successful and extremely capable. The reality is that was all false and what I see is a very weak scared person who will stop at nothing to get what is wanted while caring nothing for the people who want to helps feelings. I truly believe if I was dead she would feel nothing save the loss of what I would have been able to give her. I do not come to the conclusion with out years of proof. I would also say she would feel justified in my death because everything I see as fact ( by proof in word and action) I've come to find about her ... .She states verbally about me. So everything that's true of her she make as if it's true if me. My actions bare out my intent but that means nothing. My years of love and support are nothing more than what I should of done ( and I fall miserably short) while she is responsible for nothing. I was told by my daughter that since I am not rich her

Life has been miserable and if I was successful she would have not problems. I work for DHS and have for 34yrs she has wanted for

Nothing in her life. We are not rich but we are not wanting for basics. Trust me when I say that all she says she believes ! There is no discussion or pointing out the facts or asking questions as to how she came to these conclusions! It is fact for her period end of discussion. As for getting help the answer is no ... .No discussion she simply tells me I'm the one that needs help I should go get it she will not do anything!

[Muriel]

About two years ago my daughter told my sister that she would stab me to death and stand and wait for the police to come get her. She threatened to run my sister over. When my sisters son needed a place to

Live and I allowed him to stay here my daughter my out

Life so miserable that I had to ask him to leave ... .She destroyed his property, pushed and threatened him ... .She eliminates anyone who she views as possibly compatition for what she

Might get. For example I

Often cooked for

My daughter when she first moved in ... .She refused to eat it. It would lay on the stove until I threw it out ( I am dirty and don't follow safe cooking practices) the minute I cook and sit down to eat with my husband she comes in and says ... .Must be nice to sit down and eat. So what do I do? The next day make a huge point of cooking for her and encouraging her to sit and eat ( many

Many times) only for her to start a convo on religion or politics and then berating and insulting us when we engage in the convo and express ANYTHING that she isn't in agreement with. Recently she broke her computer so for her to play her game my husband gave her a tablet... .It didn't hold a long enough charge so I bought her another now she has two and my husband gave her his old phone to use also to play the game! Now she has three devices to use and what is her reaction ? She calls the devise The POS she was given to shut her up. Our internet is giving us trouble in her mind somehow it's a conspiracy to prevent her game play. She won't help me clean cook or anything! She complains about the area where we live and since it was our choice it's our fault she insults people loudly using racial statements and recently when my husbands son was visiting she loudly voiced she was sick of the little F... .er when was he leave ( he is 13). She complains we are murders for eating meat while we are eating. She loudly used the work

Spic (spelling?) in a phone convo in the house and my husband is Spanish! I could go on and on

[Muriel]

I get on a roll ... .Plz excuse all the errors

[Muriel]

I have gone to therapy groups they said place boundries

[Muriel]

I've been drawn into a codependency with that sucked attempt.

[Muriel]

I have to bottom line all of this. My Daughter made a serious attempt on her life. My daughters thinking is not ration or reality based. My daughter is making all of our life miserable. My daughter has made it clear she has every intention of killing herself if things do not go her way. Her death/ my miserable life are the choices I'm left with.

[Muriel]

I've tried everything to get her help and I'm told repeatedly unless she does want it or does something to be forced to there is only me leaving her which would trigger her possible suicde ... .I could live with that? I'm miserable now how miserable would I be then? And all hope would be gone for her to fix her

Life !

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Muriel]

I want her to be happy and healthy... .I've always told my children that it is a parents one wish in life is that they are confident in their children's ability to do well when we are gone. It is so true it's all I want is for my children to be happy and self sufficient. I hate to say it but my daughter scares me for her and for us.

[Muriel]

It really hurts to see my daughter so unhappy I would do anything to help her fix this. But o live miserable and the fact is it helps nothing.

[Muriel]

Once not long ago my daughter told me I only do anything for her because I want her to care for me when I'm old ( now that got me thinking some scary thoughts) I immediate took steps to insure I would never be left alone with her.

[Muriel]

I feel like she believes that because the fact is she doesn't do anything pleasant unless she sees gain... .I state that on the fact that the minute it becomes apparent she isn't going to get what she wants the pleasantness ends and all hell breaks out:

[Muriel]

Fact she refuses help

Fact if I leave she could end up dead

Fact if I stay my

Life is miserable

           This can't end well there is no good solution !

[Muriel]

I

Won't lie I've got a bit of the old poor pitiful me thing goin... .I've worked hard. Done all I could and then some, my friends and family are sick of hearing me whine about this and are at the point where they feel I enable her and am at least responsible for her continually being allowed to continue abusing me and frankly I can't disagree! But again I have no good choice here!

[Muriel]

One of

My friends knows my daughter pretty well and she is astonished at this situation because my daughter seems so capable and confident! My friend sees no hint of any of what I describe. Amazing no one does accept or family. Like Jekyll and hide one face for us and one for the world!

[Rapt Reader]

Has your daughter ever been diagnosed with a disorder? I know she refuses to get help, but after her suicide attempt did any professional get involved (like in a hospital, etc.) and do some sort of evaluation on her?

I have no doubt that she would be in the running for SSI or SSD, or whatever (what does she use for Health Insurance at this time?). Would she apply for any financial, housing, food stamp or other help?

Does your State or County have a program she can enroll in? Then she could move out on her own and give you the peace you deserve? Have you or your daughter looked into that?

I'd say that getting her diagnosed (or using a previous diagnosis at the time of the suicide attempt) and into some sort of program so she can move out of your house would be helpful for all of you... .You can offer to help her get set up, but let he know that you won't entertain the idea of her staying. You can do the research, talk to professionals, and get your ducks in a row before even talking to her about it.

You can use the communication tools & techniques I mentioned in my first post (found here: COMMUNICATION: Validation) and here: COMMUNICATION: S.E.T.- Support, Empathy, Truth). These are two communication techniques that would help you have that conversation with her in a way that would not push all of her buttons. I highly recommend checking out the Workshops at those links before you try to talk to her about this situation if you can... .I'm so sorry that you are having to deal with this!

[Muriel]

After my daughters attempt the focus was her wrist/arm she was in the hospital for weeks and had three surgeries to correct the problems the best they could truthfully she has maybe 30% use of her hand almost no feeling in three fingers either. Before my daughter was released from the hospital she was required to go for eval on the psych wing and they observed her talked to her and let her go with no f/u after two three days. They did meet with us and her but truth is at that time of course I was in a state of shock I had no clue how or why that happened back then. I was told by her and the people doing the eval that she said she had been drinking and not thinking rationality she fooled them easily and j can't blame them Im her mother and had no clue. She has no diagnosis.

[Muriel]

When you apply for SS in the state of nj you are put on public assistant insurance and yes in order for her to apply for SS she has seen SWrs and counsellors she has convinced them that she has anxiety which is possible that she does but she also won't go to them because they have sick people there and she won't be around sick people:

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[thefixermom]

My heart goes out to you as fully as it can.  I have experienced many of the things you list but not all of them with my DD38 at one time or another.  I am fully detached now because the time came where I had to return to my own life or lose my marriage.  Even without that threat, I was ready to live in peace and tranquility and joy again. Taking care of my DD did not help her get better.  I have accepted that if she loses her life so be it but I think since she can act well around others that she does not truly have a will to die. Sometimes they just know it works to control us that way.  I hope and pray that never comes to pass but I came to a place that it's best that at least one of us be happy than both of us sick and miserable.  I will  never let my DD move back in with us unless she is (heaven forbid) diagnosed with a stage IV illness and is bedridden.   She is not going to move in and take over our lives again.  But that being said, I know the sacrifice you are making and why you are making it, having been there myself for many years.

[lbjnltx]

Hi Muriel,

I'm glad you are here telling us about your life and the struggles you live with daily.  There is a lot to deal with and please trust me when I say it can be done.  I've lived through all the things you are living with now and come out the other side stronger, wiser, more compassionate and empowered.  It will take a lot of effort on your part and it will take as much time as it takes.  What's the alternative?  More of the same and that is not acceptable.

You can take your life back and a bi product of that can also be helpful to your daughter.  I'm going to start with this:

Please don't tell me to set boundries because when you are dealing with someone who has no personally boundaries... .your boudries

mean nothing to them

This requires a different perspective Muriel.  Our boundaries are about us... .not them (your daughter, a sister, a salesman, a stranger).  Our boundaries are the line we draw between what is ok with us and what is not.  If verbal abuse is not ok with you what are you going to do to when someone verbally abuses you Muriel?  This is what I did... .I told my daughter during a time of calm that I won't accept verbal abuse from her any more.  I told her that if she rages at me that I will let her know that I am leaving the room and we can continue a conversation we when are both calm.  And then I did it.  If she followed me and banged on my door I would get my car keys and leave for awhile.  If I came back and she started again I would leave again.

I set boundaries around threats of violence and threats of self harm and suicidal statements as well.  If my daughter made threats of harm against me I told her I would seek outside help to keep myself safe... .call a neighbor, call her Dad to come home, and if necessary call the Sherriff's Dept.  If she threatened self harm or suicide I told her the same would happen. Later on... .when she made suicidal statements I would ask her ":)o we need to call 911?" and ":)o you need to go to the hospital?" Her answer was always "no". An interim option could also be ":)o you need to speak with a crisis counselor?"

There are many ways to begin to turn this around Muriel and if you are anything like me you will need to have the safe space that  boundaries provide in order to learn those ways.



lbj