between a rock and a hard place

[Zabava]

Hi everyone,

Just had an interesting experience.  I talked to my BPD sister about Christmas (see my last post) and as I feared she was very offended by my trying to set boundaries around how long a visit would be and when.  Basically she accused me of being a bad person for not visiting her and her kids.  She feels that no one loves her and she is being left alone at Christmas because that is her "role in the family." 

After I hung up with her my mum called to say that my sister was being mean to her.  She said that she hadn't been invited to my sister's place till the last minute and now she was stuck having to change her plans.  Both of them want to be the centre of attention and both of them treat me like a free therapist.  They both hate me for moving to a different city and yet they both try to make me feel bad for not wanting to spend time with them.

How do I stop triangulating with them?  How can I get them to confront each other?  My sister always laments being the scapegoat, but I also suffered from being the compliant child.

Want to go NC but I'm afraid I couldn't live with myself.

Sorry to vent.  Can anyone relate?

[Notwendy]

One of my boundaries with BPD mother is that I don't discuss other family members' personal business with her. She often triangulates- calls me to vent about a sibling. My response to her is a polite " this is between you and sibling mom, I don't want to be involved in this".

It takes a while for this boundary to set in. You don't have to say anything about the boundary to them- ( that would cause a reaction)- you just have to do it. Each time they start to talk about a person- your response is the same " That's between you and them... ."

Eventually they don't get the result they want from you- the triangulating. They may still do it with others who are willing to participate in this with them, but so long as you aren't participating in it, you aren't

I do talk to sibs about mom. Part of this is that she isn't consistent in what she tells us- tends to lie. Because she is elderly and alone and we are next of kin, we cross check facts to know how she is doing.  We also talk to each other for moral support. But as far as I know, we don't participate in triangulating with her "against" each other.

[Harri]

hi there.  NotWendy suggested a great way to phrase your request to not get between your mother and sister.  Keep repeating as needed, and if necessary, add "If you continue, I am going to hang up the phone" and if it continues, hang up the phone.

I know it is easy for me to write that but much harder to do it.  I know because I had to do similar things with my uBPD/? mother and enmeshed father and brother (both my parents are dead now though).  It was hard and scary and I was nervous but I had learned that it is what I had to do.

when you first start setting boundaries and saying no, after so many years of going along, biting your tongue, being enmeshed, it is very hard to break those patterns.   You will feel anxious.  :)o it anyway.  It is also pretty much guaranteed that when you start changing your patterns of behavior and how you interact with the two of them that the conflict will increase in some way.  they will get upset.  :)o it anyway.  They may try harder to triangulate.  :)o it anyway.  Eventually they will get the message as long as you are consistent and firm.  

More importantly, the more you say no, stick to your boundary and are consistent with it, the more comfortable and less anxious and scared you will feel.  it takes time though.  So prepare yourself and practice saying No out loud if you need to.  Learn about the disorder, not so much to help them but to put their behavior into perspective so that you do not take things personally.   Learn about projection, splitting, boundaries.

with time it will get better for *you*.

As for getting them to confront each other?  I don't think you can or should even try.  You can't control what they do and you definitely will not be able to help them while you are caught up in triangulation and they are busting your boundaries.

Does that help at all?  What are your thoughts on this?