It never rains but pours

[Yepanotherone]

Hello all , as per the usual , life is never dull here ! BPD DD 17 is just out of hospital ( again ! 7th time in 16 months ) long story , won't bore you all with details but suffice to say my DD is now protected with a restraining order against ex boyfriend , overdose attempt swiftly followed a horrible break up , boyfriend taken to jail etc etc
Anyway I digress ... .My dilemma is this ... My DD just came home on Thursday , has a couple of her friends staying over this weekend , and one of these friends is about to be evicted from her home . This friend is 19, asked me if she could come live with us but in all honesty there is absolutely no way ! She's a nice enough kid and I feel for her , I really do , but our house is pandemonium as it is with our BPD DD , my oldest is about to go back to uni , and aside from the financial practicalities , I don't want another troubled teen under my roof ! We have enough going on with my DD . My husband is saying absolutely not , I've already told this girl that that's not going to work , but my BPD DD is going to push and push . And I just don't know how to get out of this in a nice way without being perceived as the biatch from hell ! I'm a complete soft touch but having this girl under our roof will NOT be good for my DD !
She's been homeless in the past , comes from a rough background , self harms etc etc , I feel so awful for her but not to the point I'm willing to put a roof over her head . What should I do ? How do I say no nicely ? How do I explain to my BPD DD that this isn't a good idea ?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Lollypop]

Hi there Yep

I was wondering how you were getting on. I'm sorry to hear about your troubles but it sounds like this latest event had a silver lining with the influential BF now out of the picture. This is good news.

I remember a post recently about a parent trying to help his daughters ex-boyfriend by becoming very involved in his problems. I think the daughter found it difficult to cope with at times, unsurprisingly!  

This is a good example of getting caught up in the dramas.

The "old" me would have turned it around to me "I just can't cope with this right now" and then I would be the one that would be blamed because I described the reason as my failing.

To be honest, I think I'd use the DEARMAN technique.  Have you ever used it?  I've found it very useful on two particular occasions of conflict.  It can help you talk to you daughter clearly so she hears.  

Here's the link to Adopt a Problem Solving Model: https://bpdfamily.com/parenting/07.htm

Here's an extract:

Attitude is everything so before you begin it is important to remember to interpret things in the most benign way possible; to accept that there is no one or only absolute truth; recognize that everyone is doing the best they can in this moment; and to ask everyone to try harder.:

1   Define the problem so that everyone agrees with the definition

2   Begin the problem solving discussion with something positive

3   Be specific/focused

4   Express your feelings

5   Identify your role in the problem

6   Deal with only one problem at a time

   7   Summarize what the other person is saying (empathy)

8   Be mindful  
9   Sty commited

I've no idea if this is helpful to you or not but this was mine. My younger son did NOT react well to me having this conversation and didn't speak to me for a week but it needed to be said. I told him he may not understand right now but later he would see that I was the one that was behaving like the responsible grownup.
Describe: I know that you're deeply in love with your GF and I remember how lovely that first love is. I know that you're having sex with your girlfriend and both of you feel that you're ready for this, but she's underage and it's illegal.
Express: I don't think you're emotionally ready for this kind of relationship and it's way too intense. I feel really concerned about you both getting caught and, importantly, that she may get pregnant. You're only 15 and neither of you want a pregnancy.
Assert: I would like to know that you are using protection.
Reinforce: If you've decided to take the step to have a sexual relationship then you need to take the responsibility that comes with it. Practicing safe sex, using a condom and taking the pill is part of it.

There is a way to at least be able to speak to them both calmly and clearly. You know where your responsibility lies and that's with your family.

Is the friend really going to be evicted?  Why?  Where are her parents?  :)oes the school and social services know about her situation?  Maybe there's a way you can point her in the right direction and not take on the responsibility.  Assertive but supportive.

Good luck.  I hope I've helped. Let us know how you get on.

LP

[Gorges]

I am not sure you can get out of this without looking bad to your daughter but you just can't take this on right now.  There is a season for everything and you will know when the time is right for you to take on a challenge.   My DD is out living on her own.  My son is very easy.  My house has been a haven for a few of his friends who don't like their own homes.  But, I am strict with them about our house rules.  I can do this for them because it is a win-win for everyone.  Their families get a break and know they are in a safe calm place.  My son is benefitting from the friendships.  I was never able to do this with my daughter because it just didn't FEEL right because her friends were her "partners in crime" so to speak.  It was never an easy road with my daughter and she continues to be a miserable sometimes.  But, it is her journey and she is doing okay (no major problems, she supports herself, there are rays of hope).   I think it was my firmness that gave her the strength she does have.

[Yepanotherone]

Hi guys ,
So many thanks to you both for replying . LP I used the DEAR approach to broach my DD about this issue and low and behold she agreed with me that it would be a bad idea ! I was quite taken aback . Then literally 2 hours later , she had a quick change in tune and complete turn around when her friend asked if she could come round to stay the night " she's suicidal mum and if she does something tonight it's on you !". Urgh !
Anyways, I've stuck to my guns and I hear this girl is going to stay with a friend of a friend . She does have parents and family , her mum is a professor in psychology for goodness sake ! And her dad lives locally and is apparently " a millionaire "... .Hmmmm. There are a lot of vague stories being told I fear . Anyway, I mentioned this latest drama to my DD's therapist and she gave me some contacts for my DD's friend to seek help , youth in crises type contacts so that was useful and I passed this info on to my DD's friend. The therapist was in complete agreement that I have absolutely no cause to feel responsible for this girl .
Of course the guilt is still there , how can I be so heartless as to not put a roof over this girls head ? But I know in my heart it would be an absolute disaster for so many reasons !

Interestingly , one of my dearest and oldest friends has just been diagnosed with BPD . She was diagnosed with bipolar around 15 years ago . With all my readings about BPD in this last year however, I've been suspecting that she presents more like BPD . My friend had recently started to suspect this herself and asked her psychiatrist , and BPD diagnosis was confirmed . She is devastated but in the same breath , shows such a level of insight , wisdom and maturity because she has lived with the signs and symptoms of these mental health conditions for so long . I was messaging this friend with our latest dramas about this girl wanting to move Into our home , and she always gives me such amazing advice . And it means so much coming from her because she knows from her own experiences what my DD is going through , why she's behaving and acting out in the way that she is, and what I'm like as her mom in reacting to my DD. She validated my fears and feelings of guilt but straight off the bat recognized that I'm being emotionally blackmailed by my DD and her friend . She urges me to hold strong on my boundaries and not allow myself to be pulled into this.

[Lollypop]

Hi there Yep

Well done for how you've approached this and accepted you can't fix. There's a long term solution out there for your daughters friend and it's not you!  

I've been on the other side. My BPDs told everybody how terrible we were and somebody took pity on him and offered him some space in their home (garden shed!). We were made to be the bad parents. He was 20 though. What these "kind" people did, just like me, was only to delay his development.  This was all pre dx.

I'm sorry to hear your friend has been diagnosed with BPD. I'm sure there's a lot Miisdiagnosis going on and it's certainly complicated so it's no wonder.  I know a few where there child has been diagnosed as bipolar and as you know in the uk, BPD is only just starting to be talked about,  I hope your friend gets on ok and treatment she needs.

I was so surprised the first time I used DEAR itoo. BPDs26 straight away agreed that it was perfectly acceptable to pay towards his living costs. We negotiated and agreed an arrangement... the technique is actually DEARMAN,

M = Mindfulness (don't get detracted by their answers, just repeat in calm voice)
A =  appear confident
N = negotiate to find a solution if your demands aren't met

I found it way too hard to deal with the MAN the first time, my anxiety levels were so high so just attempted the DEAR. It worked for you too.

I'm not surprised that your daughter soon changed her mind. She's pushed and pulled emotionally, just as you were. Maybe she was being emotionally blamed herself?  Anyway, it's a brilliant example of how we have to stay firm ourselves, demonstrate better communication and they will learn themselves.

It took my BPDs 6 weeks to hand over the money without doing his resistance speach and dance (hilarious!).  Now he just moans about hard it is to manage his money BUT doesn't moan about the fact he contributes towards his living expenses.  My BPDs used this technique yesterday for the first time too, to ask his boss to pay him on time and he text me to say "thanks I'm getting paid!".

I'm pleased as punch it worked first time. It's in your toolkit!

Hopefully this situation is going to go ok for everybody

LP

[wendydarling]

Hi Yep

That's GREAT I'm so pleased your DEARMAN response was a success, your DD heard you and can see that you care for her friend by providing her resources to help herself, passing responsibility back to the friend. LP makes an excellent point your DD was pushed and pulled by her friend a second time round. You’ve a great example of what success feels like to refer back to, I’d write it down and keep it to hand.

You must be so relieved the Exbf is out of the picture after all the chaos caused. How are you feeling and coping - a 7th admission - you must be exhausted.  Any progress with meds, DBT? Thanks for your PM Yep. My DD is approaching 12 months DBT, it’s flown by so quickly. Good news over a year since her last hospitalisation, over a year since last cutting, over a year since daily drinking – she chooses if she feels safe to go to social events/parties/pubs. When crises do occur (last was Nov) she is managing them with the help of the MH team. She gave up work at Xmas to spend 6 months focusing on recovery and find a life/work that fits for her. I can see she is less anxious/depressed but that maybe the latest meds and that life is just less stressful not working and she’s using her skills. She says DBT is coming to an end soon, she is concerned about this, me too - her eating disorder is way out of control. What next? In her favour she is open and forthright about the help she needs. She’s doing great and I’m proud of what she’s achieved, it’s a long and painful journey as we know and I was reminded of last night reading …… DBT is the equivalent of a burns patient having surgery.

Sorry to hear of your friend’s recent dx, she’s doing the right thing being honest and reaching out will help her manage her recovery, she's not alone. She’s lucky to have you as a friend and you her with the support you can provide each other if that’s what works for you both.

Pineapple cider sounds scrummy and very well deserved! (for anyone reading – refers to another thread).

There is hope.

WDx

[Yepanotherone]

WD, I'm so glad your beautiful daughter is doing well , that's so encouraging   she's obviously a very strong cookie !
My DD is doing not too badly since being discharged a couple of weeks ago . She's completely off all medications ! She absolutely point blank refuses to take them and has been refusing for around 8 weeks now . Even while in hospital she told the Doctors " no more ! I'm done with meds '. The doctors really want her on lithium but my stubborn wee princess is digging her heels in . We shall see what's going to happen with her not being on any meds but her philosophy is she feels they haven't helped her one little bit , and that since starting on them , she's been in hospital 7 times ! She said she feels she can think more clearly now that she's off them all. We shall watch this space .
She is still going to her substance abuse therapist who is using a lot of DBT with her , unfortunately she lost her place with the DBT psychologist after this most recent hospitalization but is back on the waiting list again and it shouldn't be too long before she gets a regular slot again. We've also started with a new family therapist who works with us at home . It's an evidence based " functional therapy " approach which is very goal focused. We've only had 2 sessions so far but already I can see it will help a lot .
Her moods seem to be fairly stable right now. She's steering clear of drugs , hasn't been in touch with any of the toxic unhealthy guys she was involved with before , and hasn't self harmed since beginning of March . Her skin is getting a chance to heel thank goodness though she's given herself some horrific permanent scars. We did have a bit of a tiff last weeken when she wanted to go to an all night party ! She stormed out in a temper but did return home after she'd walked off her frustration. She doesn't have a phone right now ( I locked her iPhone away some months ago, and she broke her flip phone in temper when she was dysregulated only a couple of hours
Before she took this last overdose on 10th March ), and I restrict her computer/ social media time. She's not getting to drive right  now either . All these boundaries are a major bugbear for her and every now and again she'll start up again with her arguing "when am I getting my phone and car back" , but we hold firm with our " when we can trust that you will use them responsibly " replies .
Driving and social media are like toxins to her, she just can't seem to keep herself out of trouble when she has readily available accesses to them , so it's our way of trying to keep her on the straight and narrow for now until she gets better and more consistant with applying her dbt skills . I know she's still looking for a boyfriend , I'm not convinced she can recognize good guys from bad ones and I don't think she really cares too much If they are good for her or not , and the risky promiscuity is still a temptation for her ! At least she's not inviting strange guys back to our home right now ! My husband plans on putting in video cameras following our home getting vandalized by that ex boyfriend of hers !
I'm still having to push her daily to get her schoolwork done , but she's still working part time and is fairly consistent with that . Her choice of friends are a bit to be desired but we try not to judge too harshly . She'll be 18 on her next birthday and honestly it feels like we are having to impose boundaries on her as if she was a 12 year old ! But she gives us no choice !
Oh ! And she is now on probation after her drug bust in December . So that should hopefully also keep her on the straight and narrow. Her probation officer is a very decent fellow who will be meeting regularly with her . He's familiar with BPD too which helps

[Gorges]

You are doing a lot for your daughter. Don't give up!