Will my H and I have to financially support her forever?

[Parents! Get help here!]

Hi D 19 with BPD. Recent DX in the last one yr. Was told she may have bipolar but I knew she did not over a year ago.
Anyway, I am asking what your experiences have been on the job issue. She has never had a job and says that she will never get a job as if you are doing your job you will miss out on everything else? Also says she does not want to work her whole life and then die!.  She says that WE have to support her forever as she did not choose to be born,so again it is our fault. I want her to learn hard life lessons that we all need to learn, ie have an interview,get a job and get appraisals and for her to be accountable to others... .etc... .

I really do not want to support her after she graduates university. She is doing part time ie 3 courses per term and doing well. So my question to you all is, is there hope they can be independent of me financially. I have worked so hard and so has my H, can we not get a break?

I am so worried about this and I know that it is still early days as starting a DBP program in January so hopefully that will help. 
I really would like your thoughts on this.
thanks

[please]

Hi D 19 with BPD. Recent DX in the last one yr. Was told she may have bipolar but I knew she did not over a year ago.
Anyway, I am asking what your experiences have been on the job issue. She has never had a job and says that she will never get a job as if you are doing your job you will miss out on everything else? Also says she does not want to work her whole life and then die!.  She says that WE have to support her forever as she did not choose to be born,so again it is our fault. I want her to learn hard life lessons that we all need to learn, ie have an interview,get a job and get appraisals and for her to be accountable to others... .etc... .

I really do not want to support her after she graduates university. She is doing part time ie 3 courses per term and doing well. So my question to you all is, is there hope they can be independent of me financially. I have worked so hard and so has my H, can we not get a break?

I am so worried about this and I know that it is still early days as starting a DBP program in January so hopefully that will help. 
I really would like your thoughts on this.
thanks

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[juju 6850]

Hi,

I'm 21 years old and was diagnosed with BPD, depression, and anxiety a while ago. I'm in my last year of a pretty well known college and have maintained good grades, but I've always avoided applying for jobs. I only recently realized that this was because I'm extremely scared of rejection (a BPD symptom), and I really don't want to deal with any potential rejections from companies. However, I don't expect my parents to financially support me forever. I realize I have to work eventually, and I'm working on building up my self esteem to believe I can do work well and that job rejections are normal and not a personal attack.

I think it's really manipulative and unfair for a child to tell his or her parent that it's the parent's fault for having kids... .Your job is to provide a supportive environment and guide her so that she can grow up, find her own way in life, and discover who she is as a person. Financially supporting her forever isn't healthy and won't actually help her grow. Wanting you guys to financially support her is selfish, and giving in to that would just be positively reinforcing her to be selfish and mean to you guys. You mentioned she's getting good grades, so she's capable of working! And work doesn't have to be boring. She should find what she enjoys doing and pursue a career related to that.

 I did a DBT program around 1.5 years ago, and it honestly helped me so much by teaching me a lot of skills I could use to cope with my BPD symptoms. I think it really works if you're motivated to actually try your hardest in the program. I hope she'll find it helpful!

[please]

Dear dear unsaidpromise,

I thank you for your insightful response to my post. I do agree that she is very scared of "putting herself out there" as you have noted. Yes I feel she is capable, and yet when we try to discuss it maturely with her she yells. I know it is her fear that is really yelling. And I do believe she wishes to have a good productive life and maybe over time with more mastery of skills that she is /will learn through DBT, she will be independent of us. That is all I want for her, to be able to live the life she wishes but on her terms by her own means.

I am so grateful for your reply. It is so full of hope and gives me a lot of comfort.
XOXO

[ArleighBurke]

":)etaching with Love" is the phrase we use.

You could make her financially independent tomorrow if you wanted - just stop giving her any money/support. But you worry that she will fail, be on the street, resort to crime etc. It makes sense - you are her parents and want the best for her.

So how do you balance support, while "forcing her" to learn for herself... .? Tough question!

I would suggest slowing down her support - removing it over time. Because with anyone, they will only find a solution when they are motivated to do so. If she finds she doesn't have enough money to party all the time, or buy clothes (or whatever) she will try to fix that. Her first try will probably be to emotionally maniupate YOU into giving it to her. When she realised that it doesn't work, she may get a job, or budget better or something.

This will be a painful process - for you AND her. You will have to be strong seeing her miss out on a few things while she learns. You will have to be strong to resist her accusations that you are unloving/uncaring parents. But if you set the rule, and DO NOT WAIVER, she will learn and adapt.

What are the finance and living arrangements at the moment? What *could* you do to lower her support?

[qcarolr]

My BPD DD is now 31. She has several other severe issues that interfere with her ability to work. BPD is kind of an umbrella that hangs over it all. You know your DD better than anyone. If she is working at school, and having success there, I would hesitate to change your routines yet. DBT is a good program and worth it for your D to try. If she is willing to put effort into that, she will gain what she needs to grow into her independence. At 19 she is still young. It was after she turned about 27 that my DD's attitudes began to shift toward owning her part in life events. My DD resisted her treatment -- she self-treated with street drugs until recently. Pushing her with ":)etachment with Love" seemed to push her into homelessness and more serious drug abuse. Be cautious finding the best balance for your DD. Love and firm boundaries are my preferred approach.There are some good tools in the sidebar.

I did some DBT training even though my DD would not go to her's. She was not dx'd until age 23. I wish I had known about BPD and a resource like this site when she was 17.  The group I attended was a parent/teen group for 10 weeks. I was referred by the therapist working with my granddaughter who was too young. I sure learned a lot about myself and could apply many of the tools in many of my relationships, including with DD.

The good news is that in 2016 she was pushed into 3 different treatment situations by the courts and became ready to stop the drug use. She still struggles with so many things yet her intense raging has gone away. It is clearly frustration now and she is able to take ownership and express her appreciation for all that her family does for her. She is not financially independent yet. She did get approved for some federal disability benefits in 2017, which is very helpful.

She is becoming physically independent though, in another state. We have had several good visits and talk everyday. I also enjoyed being a grandma to my new grandson over the holidays. He turned 5 weeks today. We also are raising a granddaughter who is now 12. GD has always lived in our home - sometimes with a mom present, sometimes not. The relationship between gd and DD is improving as well.

I hope this opens the perspective for you a bit. Hang in there. Things can get better, especially at only 19.

carol

[Lollypop]

Hi please

I’m in a rush - sorry I’m flying this morning but I couldn’t pass by and not respond.

I totally understand and my DS did not want to grow up either. We tried too much too soon, our expectations were too big - this was pre-dx. Independence has to be achieved though and we changed our approach. We’d been trying to force behaviour changes and not realising that we had to play our part so he had the motivation to change - step by step.

You have very understandable fears for your futures and I totally get it. Your daughter is doing well at her course and her success will help her confidence. It really is one step at a time.

My DS has found his own way to work and it wasn’t conventional. He works outdoors in a physically active job that needed technical skills and training. At 27 he’s now living in a half way arrangement but we haven’t given him any money since he was 24. I like to look at it as being a slow developer - he’ll get there in the end. Patience, good relationship, communication skills and treating him like an adult (not telling him what to do) were required.

Hope this helps. There’s hope. Advice: the future is unknown and worrying about is wasted energy but you can nudge slowly along without knocking her far off balance. Baby steps, sometimes steps backwards and not losing perspective - a long game played slowly.

Of course she doesn’t want to grow up! She’s ok as she is. She’s going to be reluctant.

If you’ve any questions ask away!

LP

[wendydarling]

Hi please 

It's also one step at a time for us. It's great your DD is preparing to engage in DBT - for my 29DD the amount of effort required was the equivalent of a full time job 24/7. 12 months ago she chose to give up work to focus on her recovery and I supported her choice. To be honest it was a NO BRAINER, work was scuppering her efforts in learning how to manage her BPD, depression, anxiety... .

Through DBT my DD has learnt about herself and what is important to her and realistic for her in the future, she works at her own pace, there is no rush, she is the driving seat. I hope your DD finds that too. What gives me peace of mind is in the future if things get tough she's now able to reach out for help having been through the medical route of DBT, she has trust. She's also reconsidering her career path, she wants to work helping others who have struggled like her, pay back time. 

As you say your young DD is scared and you understand why, can you validate her feelings, how scary this is for her? My DD asks for double validation (following DBT), single she does not hear!

For the moment your DD is in college an environment she can manage with, where my DD was 10 years ago and 10 years later I'm emotionally supporting (and financially as she lives at home) my DD is building a new life that works for her.

While DD lives at home, I do not give her money, she's never asked, she knows my boundaries and my values. I have paid for her transport to therapy and for medication and health costs, eyes, teeth etc. When DD was working she paid rent etc. That's the healthy line we are working back to in 2018 since 2015, her taking back responsibility for her. Slow and steady.

So in answer to your question will you and your H have to financially support her forever, no you won't unless you choose to.  Understanding what emotional dysregulation means for my DD and how to support her live independently, yep I'm on the way and she is too.

WDx

[please]

Thank you all,
I want this to all be done and she is on the other side.
How do you all deal with the blaming? When is overwhelmed about something ie today it was going to the dentist and 'it was traumatic!" and so I was calm and said yes I understand it was hard for you well then she gets into that I am no there for her. As I mentioned that when she said she did not wish to go to get her cavities fixed in the near future that I was up to her. Well that was the wrong thing to say! How to I validate that yes I know she is upset ( I did say that and that I understood it was stressful) well she kept going on and on the I said well it is up to you what you do. Then it was into the blaming again.That she is allowed to be mad at me as I had her! and that I am not allowed to be upset with her when she gets angry as she has been dealing with me as a bad parent for 19 years ie her whole life!
Well She has had a bad holiday: her beloved cat died in front of her ( 3 yo with either heart or seizure issue). She got into car accident yesterday ( not her fault- really she got rearended). She was lying to me and got caught and was "scared" that I would hate her for lying. It took a lot out of me to be calm last night (second bad accident since Xmas 2015). I told her that it will take me time ( I don't know how much) to trust her again and get over it but that i loved and will always love her and do not hate her. Well today she said that SHE cannot trust me her whole life and that I had no right to not trust her. AAAAAHHHHH Need to get out. So sorry to vent. She really seems to think that it is my fault and that it is OK . If she told me what was upsetting her instead of turning it around to blame her for her whole life... .maybe that would help 
I am so lost.

[ArleighBurke]

Yep - that's BPD!

I don't think a BPD understands "unconditional love" - that is too long/term for them. Their immediate feelings dictate life. So from her point of view: I do these silly things, I don't love myself, so how can YOU keep saying you love me?

It sounds like you have read a little about Validation. Have you also read about SET?

[please]

QcarolR and Lollypop, wendydarling,and Arleighburk,
Thank you all for your insights. I see my child in all of yours!
I really feel she is able to anything,but the fear gets in the way. When she has success she cannot hold on to it. Did your kids feel that too? I think she has progressed well since Dec 2015 ie going to school, got rid of a terrible "friend" who was abusive to her, has a few friends and a sense of some community at school, and I tell her she has worked hard and she is doing well- I acknowledge her hard work- but her focus is only on how bad her life is and how bad I am .  H just gets upset with her and escalates things so I have to take over all the time.

She keeps says she will never get a job and at age 14 I thought it was a stage and now at 19 it feels very upsetting to me. But I keep hope as she goes to university and says she want so do research. She has a lovely boyfriend ( whom we have yet to meet- who picked her up in a different city last night after the accident and brought her home-2 hr drive). And the one response from the pt with BPD was so helpful, it showed me that they CAN improve with help and understand and get skills to be independent. She is really looking forward to DBT and I find that she really is craving professional help so the motivation is there.

Is it common for her to say when very angry at me and thatI am not giving her what she needs emotionally (she says I never have) that she will kill herself? She is scared of blood and cannot take pills and hates physical pain so I am not really sure what she would do. I tell her I can sense the overwhelming discomfort and try to distract her and ask her what she feels she can do to calm down. but then she still says I am supposed to take care of her. I don't know- I am rambling now.
thanks

I don't know how to validate her I guess as I keep getting it wrong. then it just shows her how "bad I am" and so she can say " see how bad mom is- she cannot help me" and then it is a self fulfilling prophesy.

I just saw your reply Arleighburke, I will read more on SET thanks

[ArleighBurke]

Putting blame on everyone else is common BPD. It's much easier to blame others than take responsibility for ourselves.

I wonder if "I'll kill myself" is a version of "I will abandon you before you can abandon me".

And with regard to Validation, SET, and anything else you do: I used to have the subconscious belief that if I could learn these techniques and master them, then suddenly my conversations with my wife would make sense, we would communicate effectively and life would be wonderful. Nope. All these techniques are about "making it better" - not "making it good". Even if you are perfect, she still has a mental illness. So you may *never* feel like you get it right - even if you do.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders