rough going

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Hi family,

So it's been an unusual 2 weeks... .he came over for dinner one wk, over again last week, stayed over an hour, very nice, sat close, no overt physical stuff... .brought me a like- new fawcett for the kitchen sink, said he would install it for me, would help me trim my tree outside, it's hitting the roof, and more things he will do... .

Then last nite at coffee, he says---i have a big favor to ask you---"we are going out of town June #-&, six days, and i was wondering if you could watch the dog"... .I was shocked, this is the first time he said "we are going... ."
I had told him in February, couldn't watch our dog, it's too hard for me to give him back, also, am not facilitating his love life... .!
The dog only likes me and him, and one friend, who now refuses to watch him.   the dog has started biting people... .he is afraid to even leave him at a kennel.

I lost it, I said I couldn't, and also, when will he be getting all his things from the house, backyard and carport. I said, it needs to be in 3 months... .

It looks to me he was buttering me up so I would agree to watch the dog again... .using me.  I feel like cra@.
This morning I texted him, saying i was misinterpreting the messages he was sending me, and i was sorry I did that.

He said he was sorry for doing the wrong things.

anyway, I don't get it, back to who knows where... .

does anyone have any thoughts.

Thank you,  ju

[juju2]

Hi family,

So it's been an unusual 2 weeks... .he came over for dinner one wk, over again last week, stayed over an hour, very nice, sat close, no overt physical stuff... .brought me a like- new fawcett for the kitchen sink, said he would install it for me, would help me trim my tree outside, it's hitting the roof, and more things he will do... .

Then last nite at coffee, he says---i have a big favor to ask you---"we are going out of town June #-&, six days, and i was wondering if you could watch the dog"... .I was shocked, this is the first time he said "we are going... ."
I had told him in February, couldn't watch our dog, it's too hard for me to give him back, also, am not facilitating his love life... .!
The dog only likes me and him, and one friend, who now refuses to watch him.   the dog has started biting people... .he is afraid to even leave him at a kennel.

I lost it, I said I couldn't, and also, when will he be getting all his things from the house, backyard and carport. I said, it needs to be in 3 months... .

It looks to me he was buttering me up so I would agree to watch the dog again... .using me.  I feel like cra@.
This morning I texted him, saying i was misinterpreting the messages he was sending me, and i was sorry I did that.

He said he was sorry for doing the wrong things.

anyway, I don't get it, back to who knows where... .

does anyone have any thoughts.

Thank you,  ju

[juju2]

If someone would shed lite

[juju2]

I feel like a big fool.

I really thought he was getting closer to me, the two weeks of coming over, giving me things, etc. All leading up to the "big favor".  So, it's about what he wants, how to manipulate whomever, to get that.    I forgot that part of him  I am stupid.

I guess to some extent I do the same thing, I am nice as a default, to get by.  At work, I have to be nice to have it be a good situation for me.  I have to be kind, cordial, etc.  It feels like manipulation when someone you care about is being nice, pushing your buttons, leading me down a path.  It's almost like a spider drawing you in to the web.  You keep getting sucked in, you are following the direction they intend you go.   They use whatever it takes, what they want from you is the most important thing!

I got a huge lesson these last two weeks how hurtful it is to be manipulated.  I dont want to be a person who manipulates.  Higher Power, keep me free of manipulating others.

Thank you for listening family.  j

[juju2]

So, after this last incident, I asked him to remove all his things from our home.  It was a hard thing for me to do, am not going to keep getting used.  It's become a boundary issue.  He has three months to remove everything.  That makes it august 25.  I read on another thread how they hate success.  I get it.  He couldn't even allow him and i to have a budding r/s.  Stomp it, destroy it, do whatever it takes to show that his life doesn't work.

Even do, even so, I love him.

[juju2]

So, after this last incident, I asked him to remove all his things from our home.  It was a hard thing for me to do, am not going to keep getting used.  It's become a boundary issue.  He has three months to remove everything.  That makes it august 25.  I read on another thread how they hate success.  I get it.  He couldn't even allow him and i to have a budding r/s.  Stomp it, destroy it, do whatever it takes to show that his life doesn't work.

Even do, even so, I love him.

[pearlsw]

hi juju2,

these kinds of limbo situations are so hard! it is hard to know if you two will get back together or not. it is not easy to be in sync with another person. you had expectations and hopes and that is where the pain comes from. he had other ideas in mind perhaps.

i am not sure he was trying to stomp and destroy, do you really think so, is it perhaps just that he is moving on with his heart? is that friendship meant something else to him than to you?

it is not so easy to give freely, especially when you still have such strong feelings for someone.

wishing you peace, pearl.

[juju2]

Possibly, very true Pearl.

I guess what hurts is the manipulation.  The gifts, time spent, he upped his participation in my life.  I know that when I do things like that, if I do x,y,z, I may get Q.  What I want is Q, and i will work on this person until it's clear they are going to give me it.

It feels bad to be that person being manipulated.

I more appreciate honesty.  Guess he is using what he knows works.  I did text him an apology that i misinterpreted events of the last two weeks.  I was owning my part.  I too don't know what the future holds, just go on. 

Its cruel to manipulate, that is what i learned these last two weeks.  I see he has done this behaviour most of our r/s, and maybe I needed to see what our r/s was really about.  Even if it hurts to see.

[juju2]

I think each of us here is so special.  We know we are dealing w someone who has a serious mental illness, that come out strongest towards the people the are closest to.  That's you and me.

It take a certain kind of person to be in the line of fire willingly.  Willingly.

Thanks

[SunandMoon]

Hi juju

Well done on finally putting a time limit on your ex moving his things out of your house.

Do you think you have been avoiding doing that because you expect him to come back? Or because it is a way to keep him tied to you, even if he's just coming back to pick up a tool? Is worth examining... .

Either way, I think this is a healthy choice for you. Good not to be surrounded by all his stuff and also have the opportunity to make your home your own, at last. If I remember correctly, his stuff takes up a lot of space in your house and garden. 

It's it possible to take the dog to live with you permanently? If he is starting to bite, he might be feeling abandoned or not getting much care. It might be nice to have him living with you and going on walks.

I don't think you need to apologise to him for misinterpreting his actions. I think he's probably been quite deliberate.

[juju2]

Thank you Sun.  I just want to he responsible for my part.

He is a master manipulator.  I wish he would just cut to the chase, let me know what is up.  I am not in to that anymore, i dont enjoy or need to be manipulated.

I guess this is the final chapter.  I am not going to he his "friend"      his stuff is going.  So there is absolutely nothing tying me to him or vice versa.

It will he a new chapter for me.  The final chapter has started.

Thank you for your feedback, this community has carried me.

[formflier]

Hey Juju2,

That certainly was a bold request on his part.

So... .did you ever ask him to define who "we" is? 

I totally get your thought about not facilitating his love life.  And if that is actually what he was asking you to do... .that is shocking.

Finding it hard to wrap my head around the thought process that would lead him to ask that, especially since it had been addressed before.

 
FF

[juju2]

Hi f.

i guess he thought i had become more friends, something.  Also, he may have just found about his friend K. not being able to watch the dog.  This is typical of being w a person who only cares about themself, what do i want now.? 

"We " is him and the lady he is seeing.  Otherwise, he says peoples names.  Like, P. came over to show me his new motorcycle... .

He also has stopped his service work, in twelve step; his main client called, the three weeks of work he did, there are things going wrong, he has to go back, the client wont pay for his errors.  One is in the kitchen plumbing, making the kitchen unusable, its the sink.   

I believe he isnt thinking real good.

  He texted me the next day from coffee," i am sorry i did the wrong things."

And then, "i just want you to be happy too."

oh well.  I give up.   I am not doing any more.
Am thinking about changing my phone number... .

[juju2]

Also, he is getting worse in his disorder, ive noticed his behaviour getting worse.  He still hasnt seen his new grandbaby, he dented his truck, hit it w a wheelbarrow.  He is just barely making it.  He lost his guys he mentors, that is a sign that you arent doing well... .

My friend who knows my story w him, she says for me to get out of the way.  Let him hit his bottom.

i dont know what i am even doing for him.  Really.

Appreciate being able to share.  I feel better, i feel like its going to be o.k.

I am in service, i have this community, have a very good career, i will go on.  My family, they love me, warts and all.   We just celebrated our younger dtr. graduated w honors, microbiology.  It was myself, my ex hus, his g/f, both our kids and their s.o.  it was the best time i have had in months!

Thank you family!

[juju2]

am in the 5th stage of grief.

it is ok, it is being at peace.  My life matters, am coming out of a coma, it feels like waking up, slowly, seeing the blue sky, flowers colors, happy faces.   This must be what it feels like to start being healthy.  Being able to smile, ask someone else how they are doing.   

i have acceptance that i care deeply for a very ill person, who can give limited.  Its good to finally get, the person i love, maybe never loved me.  Maybe he did.  Now, who knows.   He is on to the next, best, thing for him, trashing things, people,  as he goes.    Its his journey.  His responsibility, or not.   Mostly, not.   I see he is about not having responsibility.  A life avoiding responsibility is a sad life.    I see a lot of magical thinking on his part, different scenarios that might happen... .
Meanwhile, life is happening, and he is doing whatever he has to, to get results he wants.   A life out of control.   Self will run riot.    He is the last person to know.

its 4 a.m., i cant sleep.  Perhaps i too can make peace with whatever tomorrow holds.

My friends, thank you.  Thank you for listening.

[formflier]

am in the 5th stage of grief.

it is ok, it is being at peace.  My life matters, am coming out of a coma, it feels like waking up, slowly, seeing the blue sky, flowers colors, happy faces.   This must be what it feels like to start being healthy.  Being able to smile, ask someone else how they are doing.   

i have acceptance that i care deeply for a very ill person, who can give limited.  Its good to finally get, the person i love, maybe never loved me.  Maybe he did.  Now, who knows.   He is on to the next, best, thing for him, trashing things, people,  as he goes.    Its his journey.  His responsibility, or not.   Mostly, not.   I see he is about not having responsibility.  A life avoiding responsibility is a sad life.    I see a lot of magical thinking on his part, different scenarios that might happen... .
Meanwhile, life is happening, and he is doing whatever he has to, to get results he wants.   A life out of control.   Self will run riot.    He is the last person to know.

its 4 a.m., i cant sleep.  Perhaps i too can make peace with whatever tomorrow holds.

My friends, thank you.  Thank you for listening.

Both of your last posts strike me as very healthy... .very accepting (radical acceptance) and of course very sad... .lots of grief there.

Obviously appropriate grief.

What can you do today to take extra special care of you and hopefully get a good nights sleep tonight?

FF

[juju2]

Thank you f. 

the caring that is shown here, carries me.

I will go to my sponsor's house, we get together on sundays. 

Have to get out of self pity, that is what it feels like i am in.   Radical acceptance, guess that includes me too.

with appreciation,  j

[formflier]

Have to get out of self pity, that is what it feels like i am in.   

Could I suggest you nudge this a bit.  Without getting into specifics... .I would guess that much of what you pity yourself for is true and valid.

In other words there has been quite a bit of misfortune and you feel that.

I'm hoping that feeling can move you to action to care for your feelings... .to care for you.

Best to you... .

FF

[juju2]

thank you.

our pattern is he texts me monday or tuesday, it is his turn to set up coffee, i guess i will deal w that if it happens.   I really see that he is unaware of his behaviour.   Like someone in a blackout drunk, what the heck has he said and done?  ignorance is bliss.

writing here has helped me.  I may be strong enough to resume a text friendship.  I am not making any decisions right now.  Just two weeks ago, he was making plans w me to build the guest house in back!  Which of all that went on was manipulation.  Is it manipulation if that is all you know?

its like he doesnt want to be with me, yet he doesnt want to not be able, at a whim, to see me for whatever reason.  Toxic.  Toxic behaviour.
I just chalked it up to he doesnt know what he is doing.  i have been such a doormat, he just does not know how to treat me well.  Even now.
And i thought i was doing better... .

[juju2]

What i see from ten years of abuse, neglect, bad behaviour, is i have something in me that says its o.k.  that is what i am in the process of changing.

There was a hansel and grettl sprinkling of bread crumbs that kept me hopeful.

Crumbs.

My kids were the first ones to see, its not right.  Interestingly, both of them have s.o. who treat them very well.   Not what i modeled.  Thank G-d.

I know that this too shall pass.  I am getting better, thanks in a large part to this healing community.

Sincere thanks,  j

[juju2]

The other thing i want to share, a respected member shared w me, to sever the ties.  So, am finally strong enough to request that within 3 months, all of his personal items need to be removed.

Thats a huge step for me, you guys supported me in this.  I feel like a new person!

[formflier]

  So, am finally strong enough to request that within 3 months, all of his personal items need to be removed.

Thats a huge step for me, you guys supported me in this.  I feel like a new person!

Yes!  If you remember out talks about "disentangling"  I'm proud of you for this step.

FF

[juju2]

Thank you f.

Lets see what happens.

I was doing too much again, got my hopes up, and now i am back to oh well.

I still care.  That is the problem.

[juju2]

Everything has an ulterior motive.  Thats the hard thing to get.

It becomes my issue when i start to believe.

Being w pwBPD is an eye opener.  We know what they are about, SELF, SELF, SELF, and are surprised, when they are all about themself!

I am surprised.  i have fooled me again.

[CryWolf]

Hey Juju, how are you doing?

Wether, he had had ulterior motives or not.

Take a step back and look from a different view. Look how far youve come since the initial break up. look at all your accomplishments you have achieved. Look at all the people youve helped, including myself. Dont let this one person make deter you from all the good youve accomplished for yourself.

Please keep your head up 

[juju2]

Thank you, C.W.

Appreciate that a lot!

this community helps me so much.