What has been your experience with your borderline as they get older (50+).

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

What has been your experience with your borderline as they get older (50+), do you see them getting worse?

I am curious to know, and maybe to better understand, does your significant other, seem to get worse as they age, also do you think you may see other comorbid PD traits, like overt narcissism?

Also, after so much time has passed, over a decade, when your borderline dysregulates, do you see teenager, childlike behaviors in them when they are 'interacting' with you, and I mean an augment, over the top heated discussion… an "attack" for lack of a better word… developmentally arrested type social / executive functioning… like it seems you are all of a sudden, like seconds to minutes, interacting with a petulant, very angry, and slighted sixteen year old, in a fifty three year old's… grown woman's body?

This suspected hermit/queen type borderline, and what I think may be "overt narcissism", in my own ubpdw’s case, is undiagnosed, and I'm very doubtful… that she probably never will be… and she seems to be sliding down the spectrum, to a point of _____ .

No introspection, lacks simple empathetic functions… very ridged, control – punish, extreme black and white thinking, & splitting.

Thoughts, experiences ?

Red5

[Red5]

What has been your experience with your borderline as they get older (50+), do you see them getting worse?

I am curious to know, and maybe to better understand, does your significant other, seem to get worse as they age, also do you think you may see other comorbid PD traits, like overt narcissism?

Also, after so much time has passed, over a decade, when your borderline dysregulates, do you see teenager, childlike behaviors in them when they are 'interacting' with you, and I mean an augment, over the top heated discussion… an "attack" for lack of a better word… developmentally arrested type social / executive functioning… like it seems you are all of a sudden, like seconds to minutes, interacting with a petulant, very angry, and slighted sixteen year old, in a fifty three year old's… grown woman's body?

This suspected hermit/queen type borderline, and what I think may be "overt narcissism", in my own ubpdw’s case, is undiagnosed, and I'm very doubtful… that she probably never will be… and she seems to be sliding down the spectrum, to a point of _____ .

No introspection, lacks simple empathetic functions… very ridged, control – punish, extreme black and white thinking, & splitting.

Thoughts, experiences ?

Red5

[Cat Familiar]

Interesting topic, Red.

Now that I’m being mindful, dysregulation is no longer something I deal with, though my husband is frequently “moody”.

I’ve seen a few photos of him as a teenager with that same downtrodden expression and I have to feel sorry for his parents—no one wants to be around someone in that state.

Is it getting worse with age? Doubtful. In some ways it’s getting better as he has been going to therapy and it seems he has a bit more awareness and self control. (A bit)

However age is having an impact as he struggles with back issues and other aches and pains, but much of that could easily be attributable to inactivity, as a downward spiral. But it does trigger victimy thinking.

When he’s in the midst of feeling sorry for himself, self flagellation for whatever fault or flaw he’s thinking about, or anger and hopelessness about the environment, politics, whatever—it can be like dealing with a snarky teenager.

[ct21218]

So the literature says that some symptoms often 'burn out' with age.  I think that often relates to some of the addictive behaviors and impulsivity. My exhusband turned 50 and he is remarkably similar to the 35 year old I met years old.  He is sober, BUT the lying and manipulation is still in full force.  The anger has calmed down, but he still ends up in bad situations because of poor choices.  He bought some guitar equipment from someone recently and ended up selling it.  Turned out the gear was stolen and he needed to come up with around 2k to stay out of jail.  There is always some self imposed crisis or emergency. Not my responsibility to fix

[Stillhopeful4]

No introspection, lacks simple empathetic functions … very ridged, control – punish, … extreme black and white thinking, & splitting.

Hi Red,

I can relate.  When I first found out about BPD, 5+ years ago, I was (and still am) convinced my uBPDw is a BPD Waif.  I can say my W isn't 50, but she's not far from it and I have noticed things get worse the past 2 years.  For example, at the begining of our relationship my wife wanted to always hang out with her friends and when I would get upset because she did it too often she would say "you never let me hang out with my friends".  No I never said you can't but do you need to let that consume you?  So the past 6 months I've been trying to get healthy.  We had a day it was her acquaintances baby shower, I barely know the girl and it was my sons opening day for soccer.  I said I'll go to his game and you can go to the shower.  She was fine with it THAT DAY.  Then for 6 months, even in with T and at home...all I hear is you choose him (my son) over me.  I was like what?  Yes, I choose to go to his opening day game, like I have gone to for 12 years instead of going to your kinda friends baby shower.  She insisted it was because I didn't want to spend time with her and it had nothing to do with anything or anyone else.  It was 2 hours on a Sunday afternoon.  SMH

Yes, at times, many times in the past 3 months, I do feel like I'm standing in front of a pubescent teen pitching a fit and throwing a tantrum.  

SH4

[Red5]

Is it getting worse with age? Doubtful. In some ways it’s getting better as he has been going to therapy and it seems he has a bit more awareness and self control. (A bit)

I think the 'going to therapy' part is the key to some semblance of sustainment, the "fork in the road".

I guess its like most any other disorders, or even a disease, if emotional, psychological - mental talk therapy is not sought, then there is zero chance of any introspective soul searching to take place… so the spiral, or "flat spin" will continue.

Another point, as the non becomes aware, and starts to learn, it may even exacerbate the borderlines ever degrading "homeostasis"… sans therapy.

I spoke with my own ubpdw for about 1.45 hours the last evening on the phone… the subject of
therapy" came up… as in 'mine'… she referred to it as "psychobabble"(?), and "pointless".

Red5

[Red5]

I can relate.  When I first found out about BPD, 5+ years ago, I was (and still am) convinced my uBPDw is a BPD Waif .

Hello SH4!

I came across this book a while back, and I even found it as an audio book on youtube… the title is "Understanding the Borderline Mother "… Helping Her Children Transcend the Intense, Unpredictable, and Volatile Relationship [authors: Christine Ann Lawson, & Heather Auden].

...convinced my uBPDw is a BPD "Waif"

In the groups here… under - 'Library: Book Club, previews and discussions' -… the link is found there.

*In chapter 3 (tape 4)… is "Understanding the Borderline Mother 03-The Waif Mother"...

Go to the link, select 'ALL' and go to the bottom, you will see the link there.

Link ~> https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=53779.0;all

Very interesting, gave me some measure of insight, I think this disorder, as most are, are generational… passed down in the family.

The more we can understand this, the more we may be able to cope, and sustain our own mindfulness in the face of such relationship calamity.

Red5

[Red5]

So the literature says that some symptoms often 'burn out' with age.  I think that often relates to some of the addictive behaviors and impulsivity.

There is always some self imposed crisis or emergency.

I have read that too ct21218, I read that as the borderline ages, past 50, to 60 and beyond, by then, udx, and untreated, the borderline will have "pushed away" most everyone that was in their lives, spouses, children, immediate family, even long term friends… hence "symptoms burn out with age"… because they are now alone… and this is so sad to me.

My own udx wife, her own D34 went NC with her for about a 3.5 year period after we married, and after D34 remarried… udx wife had an issue with FB posts between D34, and new MIL, and issued a firmly worded email, and FB posts to all who crossed her (feelings equal facts)… D34's exact words to me a while back in regards to the subject event, "I was just done with her Red, just done"… this occurred long before bpd epiphany (me)… and to this very day, eight years downrange… udx wife still thinks she was right, and D34 was wrong… ridged, uncompromising, black and white, no quarter.

The only thing that ended D34's NC, was udx wife's stage iv cancer dx… back in oh' sixteen.

Self imposed crisis or emergency… again, an across the board concurrence… "how many times" has my own ubpdw "created" seemingly unnecessary drama, in the public, or at home, with Foo, in the workplace, the neighbors (hurricane Florence) doesn't seem to matter, I've understood this to be "supply"… and any supply will do, either positive, or negative energy… borderlines seem to feed off of this (control)… always have to have something brewing… something (someone) roasting on the "spit"… it surely gets old, and as well frustrating.

Three elements I've observed that are always present… *victimhood,  *entitlement, *no presence of introspection.

Red5

[GaGrl]

DH married his now-ex very young -- she was almost 18, and he was almost 23. Add to that their different cultures, and it was difficult and volatile. He thought that she was simply immature and that things would stabilize once he got her to the U.S. and in a "good, Christian marriage." (Note -- she is Buddhist. So...magical, unicorn thinking on his part.)

The early years were full of jealousy (her of him), yet infidelity on her part, rages, public violence and arrest when he was posted to Germany (she refused to go with him). He is 90% sure that their son is not biologically his. Denigration, dissatisfaction with anything and everything, yet needing to stay in the marriage.

Mid-point in the marriage -- she lost all friends, one by one. Still can't keep friends. Relatives distanced themselves. Infidelities continued -- one was so flagrant, with an enlisted man on post, that DH lost his command. They almost divorced over that. The children became aware of what her affairs really were (too many uncles). DFCS became involved while DH was posted elsewhere. Defiance (it's nobody else's business but my own what I do). Toward the end of this period, she was arrested for DV, involving a gun, with one of her affair par tners. With kids moved out of house, she left to live elsewhere.

Next phase was brutal. She became involved in the sex industry (Asian Massage parlors) while trying to pretend that it was a legit business. Delusional. Met a nice fellow and is still with him -- although when she caught him visiting an AMP (same way she met him), she threatened to shoot him. Wouldn't divorce DH but told him she'd agree if he wanted one -- DH deep into depression and then had daughter and toddler granddaughter living with him. She had no friends, dysfunctional BF, kids that barely interact with her, rages directed at other than BY began to subside, but manipulations increased.

Now -- still manipulative but DH and I have boundaries of concertina wire and adult kids are pretty resilient also. She and BE are roommates, but she has a guy on the side and is manipulating for financial purposes, and BF has told oldest daughter he is about to bail. So who knows if she is better, now that she is n her early 60s. She is overly dependent on the BF, so if he bails, it could get ugly. She no longer drives and is phobic about being in the interstate. Her ability to manage basic finances has deteriorated (bills, taxes, legal docs, etc.). she is attractive but is clearly aging -- this has eroded her self-image, as she depended on her looks and seduction abilitites. She has tended to morph from Queen to Witch to Waif within an hour. She will never seek nor accept therapeutic help. She will be a difficult elderly parent.

Long story, but it's been a long journey.

[empath]

Over the past 20 years or so, my h had steadily become worse. Our youngest child is now a teen and thinks he acts like her friends with their drama. His church friends/supporters can't figure out why he isn't at church or leading them. When I talk to him, he complains that our kids don't talk to him; they are hurt by his actions and he hasn't been there in their crises.

So, he is in his apartment with his roommate who describes h as his 'soul partner'.

Recently, I was trying to get him to take ownership of a situation, but he was very resistant to doing anything and preferred being a victim. He likes therapy, though. Now, he's doing some t dealing with some of his trauma.