Mom showed up at the door, I didn't handle it well

[ProudDad12]

Well, it happened. I was at home on a conference call for work (lots of upper management on the call), and my mom showed up at the door! (Context for anyone unfamiliar with our crap, we've been NC with my FOO for several months after they crossed many lines. They've been escalating trying to get us to break NC.)

By the time I realized what was happening, she heard the conference call and knew I was home. She proceeded to alternate knocking and ringing the doorbell. Meanwhile I'm panicking, and texting my boss to ask if he can cover for me on the call. Luckily I had notes prepared that I sent.

And then it happened... I broke NC by using our doorbell camera to tell her I didn't want to talk. And then she said just enough to coerce me into continuing. She was begging to come in, crying, apologizing, panicking any time a car came down the street because she was embarrassed. Asked if she could go to the back door to talk if I wasn't letting her in so people wouldn't hear her. Without getting into detail and not nearly doing the situation justice, I spent 2 hours talking to her on the doorbell camera, trying to get her to leave but still finding myself talking about things that have been on my chest for 4 months. Not near everything, but at least things like we can't heal if they don't give us a break.

In any event I said way more than I probably should have. And she said a lot for her part. Wanting to apologize, telling me how upset everyone is, etc. How everyone is hurting and loves us. Hitting all the strings. Not getting my point that it's not about words but keeping it from happening again. Still not understanding the implications and consequences of what they've done. The line between her actual emotions and manipulations are so blurred that I don't even know what's real from her and what's not. And I don't know what to believe from her anymore. But your mother begging and crying at the door is a rough image to ignore.

I feel like an idiot for caving and talking, showing them this works. I feel like a horrible person for "making" my mom stand outside in the cold and talk through the camera. My wife is worried that they will try it again now since they know it worked, and is upset that I even considered letting her in. And despite everything that has been done or said in the past few months, it tore me up watching my mom through the camera, wringing her hands and being pitiful. I don't know what else I could have done. She wasn't being violent, and I couldn't take the idea of calling the police on my crying mother. So instead I caved and talked through a doorbell until I was able to get her to leave. And even as I type this I feel like I need to start recapping things that have happened just to provide context so I don't come across as the awful person I feel like. This is some messed up stuff.

Off topic, we also had to take D7 to the Dr this evening after falling off her scooter. Turns out Doctor thinks her hand is broken and is sending us for X-rays tomorrow. Fun day!

[Methuen]

Oh, I'm so sorry this happened, and that you are suffering this pain.

I really don't know what to say, except that I feel for you, and am thinking of you.

I think if it was me, I would treat it as if I ran into a black bear in the woods and just play dead (hide under the couch and maybe she eventually goes away if she gets no reaction).  

Last summer I had an escape plan: if my mother showed up at the back door and let herself in, my runners were waiting for me at the front door, and my bike was in the bushes.

 

[TelHill]

PD,

I am sorry this happened and what an inopportune time. I know some electronic doorbells have silencers or volume controls. Also, some home wifi-enabled security cameras have facial recognition features where you are given a signal if a certain person is at your door. Am sure you know about wirecutter.com where they review these items and their features. Perhaps move your phone conference location to another area of your home where conference participants cannot hear loud knocking on your front door? I don't know if this helps.

My mom tried getting me to break NC by calling repeatedly and coming to the door when I lived in the same town. I know how it feels. My thoughts go out to you and your family. Hope your D heals soon from her injury!

[Panda39]

ProudDad12,

I'm sorry you had to go through that...that she put you in that position, it sounds miserable.  This was a complete surprise, you reacted how you reacted don't beat yourself up.  

Maybe now you can look at this event as a learning tool and think about a plan if something like this should happen again.  If you are surprised by your family what are your options?  If you have a plan I think it makes it easier to react not get stuck in a 2 hour drama fest with your mom.

I think if it was me, I would treat it as if I ran into a black bear in the woods and just play dead (hide under the couch and maybe she eventually goes away if she gets no reaction).

This description made me giggle but I agree with the concept.  Maybe part of your future plan is to not respond to the door or if confronted somewhere else you leave.  I know it's hard to do when your mom is blowing FOG full blast, that's why coming up with a plan in advance can help.  What else might be part of your plan?

Hang in there,
Panda39

[ProudDad12]

Thank you everyone for the support. I've said it a hundred times but its nice being able to talk to people who "get it".

I like the black bear image too! And that's not far off from what my plan was if they showed up when I was home alone (kids being home would change things). I could theoretically get away with it too, because I have a company work truck that I often keep at the office, so my personal truck in the driveway doesn't necessarily mean I'm home. So I figured I'd just go to our bedroom (farthest from having to hear knocking) and wait for them to leave. However, my guard has been down for a few days and when I realized I screwed up by accidentally allowing her to hear my conference call, my plan fell apart and I panicked. Once she knew I was home she wasn't leaving.

Small blessing in this... had this been a normal day, my mom would have still been at the door when my daughter got off her school bus, creating a very bad situation. It just so happens that because she had to go to the doctor, my wife picked her up from school and took her straight to the doctor. Not the first time circumstances worked out in a way that helped us "dodge a bullet" with my parents.

So now today I'm struggling to keep my mom's words from sinking in deeper. Things like telling me my brother has been crying over this (same brother who hung up on me, didn't care what I had to say about defending my wife, called me a snowflake, etc.). Or how my sister is devastated over NC. Or how the first thing my dad supposedly asked after his surgery was if I showed up (my siblings didn't go either, aside from the rest of the context, and never mind the fact I didn't know when and where it was). Anyway, all was stuff that was immediately dismissed (laughably in some cases) by friends/family/etc who are on the outside of this but have been on the sidelines witnessing and helping. However, with me being in the center, and it being my mom and my FOO, I have to work very, very hard at rationalizing and looking at it objectively.

I mean, my first clue should have been that she made it clear multiple times that she just wanted "me and her" to talk. Despite my wife being the primary subject of their verbal abuse. My wife heard a bit of the conversation remotely through the doorbell camera, and she caught where my mom said something along the lines of "husbands and wives talk these things out", but used that example in the context of my relationship with her (my mom). I really hope my wife misunderstood or my mom misspoke because I'm very uncomfortable thinking about that.

Anyway, way more to dissect/vent/whine/examine from the whole thing than I can say right now. I'm just trying my best not to let it consume me.

Turns out D7's hand is in fact fractured, so we've been dealing with that this morning. I feel horrible for her. She's being a little pitiful but taking it well. I guess if there is any good to come from it, it's forcing us to think about her and not all this.

[Panda39]

So now today I'm struggling to keep my mom's words from sinking in deeper. Things like telling me my brother has been crying over this (same brother who hung up on me, didn't care what I had to say about defending my wife, called me a snowflake, etc.). Or how my sister is devastated over NC. Or how the first thing my dad supposedly asked after his surgery was if I showed up (my siblings didn't go either, aside from the rest of the context, and never mind the fact I didn't know when and where it was). Anyway, all was stuff that was immediately dismissed (laughably in some cases) by friends/family/etc who are on the outside of this but have been on the sidelines witnessing and helping. However, with me being in the center, and it being my mom and my FOO, I have to work very, very hard at rationalizing and looking at it objectively.

FOG and possibly some projection on her part.  I know it's hard and hurtful but try to see this for what it is.  She is using this stuff to pressure you.  Where there is pressure there is usually FOG.

Panda39

[Methuen]

I guess if there is any good to come from it, it's forcing us to think about her and not all this.

Good for you for seeing the silver lining

Once she knew I was home she wasn't leaving.

Well...I'm going to challenge this.  If she doesn't get a reaction from you, she can't sleep on your doorstep...  Maybe it's a matter of waiting her out? (...even if she knows you are there.) If she doesn't get a reaction, she's going to have to leave eventually.  The challenge for you is to stay intact and not give her the reaction.

Do you live in an area where there are neighbors nearby?  My thinking is that my BPD mom is obsessed with her own image, and she would be aware that her presence at the door could be visible to others, and she would eventually become paranoid about others seeing her there for too long...and what that would look like.  She would eventually leave, mad as H , but it was her choice to do what she did, and to own her own emotion for it.  Not my problem.  Your door is your boundary for emotional safety...kind of sounds like your doorbell/camera/intercom broke that boundary...?

Once I accepted that my mom was never going to change (it's been a relatively recent acceptance for me these past few months), that I could NEVER rationalize with her, that I couldn't ever explain, defend, argue or justify in the same way I could with 95% of the global population, but that doing those things would only make it WORSE, I realized that I could only help myself by changing how I interact with her.  I haven't JADED since I accepted that.  Having said that, I'm pretty sure worse times are coming for me as my fragile mom continues to age, and eventually there's going to be another huge crisis.  It's only a matter of time.  If it happens on a day when I'm emotionally vulnerable, I could easily screw up .  We all do because we are HUMAN, not robots.  So forgive yourself, learn from it, stay NC until your amygdula has calmed down after this episode, and move on with your daily life.  This too shall pass.  Your mom isn't going to change.  So what would you do differently next time?  You know she's going to show up at your door again (because she successfully drew you in last time so that behavior was reinforced), so what's your plan?

There's no question it's harder when kids are around.  This requires a lot of careful thought.  I can't remember if you have a T?  Is this something you could bring up with T? How to "avoid" her at the door with kids around, and your door camera?  I'm not a fan of including young kids in conversations about their BPD grandma, but every situation is unique, and calls for unique approaches.  A bit of risk/benefit analysis might be in order.  What would be worse?  Including your family in a plan of "playing quiet" if grandma comes to the door (something you don't have to go into explanation for with your kids ), or having them witness a crisis between you and her?  I worked in a women's shelter for a year as my "retirement" job after retiring from my career job.  We had a specialized children's counsellor for "children who witness abuse", so in that context (I know it's different because this is conflict and not abuse) I'm aware it's not helpful for kids to observe conflict either.  They are actually learning relationship skills and coping mechanisms at any tender age.  I have no idea what's best.  Every situation is unique and everything has consequences. Consult with a few sources before you decide on a plan.  Just putting the thoughts out there.  

[Imatter33]

PD,
A lot of wonderful suggestions have been given so I will add this thought because it appears to be new.

For the time being, your NC was a boundary that your mom did not respect. Things happened and the boundary was broken. (Not anything to beat yourself up about, just realize)

My Therapist looked at me straight on yesterday and says, Ok so what if (your )mom doesn't respect the boundaries?  The short answer was... take what you learned and start over.

A personal aside, I am thinking this is what a relationship with a person with BPD is like, they are boundary pushers and breakers, so until "we" the loved ones without BPD get excellent at putting them in place, it is trial and error.

Thinking of you.
I hope your daughter heals quickly ...and it is an amazing here and now distraction for you and your wife. 

[formflier]

I want to offer a different perspective.

Is this accurate?

Your Mom showed up at your "work" and interrupted you trying to provide for your family.  She knew you were on a work call and interrupted anyway.

First of all...do I have this right?

If so, what does this say about her values?

I've got a bunch more thoughts about this, but probably wisest to hold off.

Oh yeah, what was your Mom apologizing for?

Best,

FF

[TelHill]

PD,
A lot of wonderful suggestions have been given so I will add this thought because it appears to be new.

For the time being, your NC was a boundary that your mom did not respect. Things happened and the boundary was broken. (Not anything to beat yourself up about, just realize)

My Therapist looked at me straight on yesterday and says, Ok so what if (your )mom doesn't respect the boundaries?  The short answer was... take what you learned and start over.

This is a great point, lmatter.  My solution to my mom perpetually trying to break NC/my boundaries was to move far enough away that dad & she dad could not comfortably visit.  

What do you do when that's not feasible?  Her "I'm going to stop you from NC" tactics are not what normal people do.  I may be wrong and hope I am...this may not go away so easily by not answering the door.

I don't mean to catastrophize your dilemma. I know out of hand (& clever) my mom is when boundary breaking. Mine reminds me of the monster in that old horror movie Alien (the first one.). That's why I deliberately choose to live far away.

I sincerely hope you can keep NC with holding fast to boundaries and fine-tuning them when need be. Good luck! 

[Harri]

Hi PD.  I am sorry she is not respecting your request for distance and time. 

Do you think it would be possible in the future to talk directly to her and simply say "Please stop doing this, I am not going to change my mind, you need to stop", and then shut the door or something like that?

It seems cleaner to me.  I am not saying that she will necessarily stop or go away but one clear and clean statement made directly seems like it might lead to more empowerment for you which might help you become even less enmeshed (emotionally) over time.   I am also trying to think of a way to handle this so if, for example, your child did come home while your mom is there, you are not at the whim of luck.

Is saying something short and simple something you want to eventually be able to do or try?  If not, that is okay too.  You get to choose.

I do like the suggestion of a doorbell that you have more control over (like volume and even an off switch).   

[ProudDad12]

FOG and possibly some projection on her part.  I know it's hard and hurtful but try to see this for what it is.  She is using this stuff to pressure you.  Where there is pressure there is usually FOG.

Panda39

Thanks, I'm trying to remind myself of that.

Well...I'm going to challenge this.  If she doesn't get a reaction from you, she can't sleep on your doorstep...  Maybe it's a matter of waiting her out? (...even if she knows you are there.) If she doesn't get a reaction, she's going to have to leave eventually.  The challenge for you is to stay intact and not give her the reaction.

Good point, and I know that's technically true. Unfortunately I was on a clock wanting to get to my daughter's Doctor appointment, which I ended up missing anyway because of it. And on any other day I'd be risking my daughter getting off the bus with her out there.

Do you live in an area where there are neighbors nearby?  My thinking is that my BPD mom is obsessed with her own image, and she would be aware that her presence at the door could be visible to others, and she would eventually become paranoid about others seeing her there for too long...and what that would look like.  She would eventually leave, mad as H , but it was her choice to do what she did, and to own her own emotion for it.  Not my problem.  Your door is your boundary for emotional safety...kind of sounds like your doorbell/camera/intercom broke that boundary...?

Yep, we have lots of neighbors, several who know of our situation, and a couple of them saw some of this go down (one joked to my wife about grabbing a chair and popcorn). Anyway, my mom is extremely image driven and freaked out every time a car came down the street or someone walked down the sidewalk. Sheer panic, both amusing and sad. To be honest I was surprised she tolerated it as long as she did.

There's no question it's harder when kids are around.  This requires a lot of careful thought.  I can't remember if you have a T?  Is this something you could bring up with T? How to "avoid" her at the door with kids around, and your door camera?

We do. We talked to him about it a bit last time but it was more in preparation for my dad, not my mom. You're right, we have a lot of thinking to do about this.

My Therapist looked at me straight on yesterday and says, Ok so what if (your )mom doesn't respect the boundaries?  The short answer was... take what you learned and start over.

A personal aside, I am thinking this is what a relationship with a person with BPD is like, they are boundary pushers and breakers, so until "we" the loved ones without BPD get excellent at putting them in place, it is trial and error.

Thinking of you.

That's a good way to look at it, I appreciate it. My mom definitely does not respect boundaries, in our experience their mere presence offends her. But I'm getting better each time at holding ours.

I hope your daughter heals quickly ...and it is an amazing here and now distraction for you and your wife.  

Thanks. We're frustrated because the doctor closed early without getting us referred to the orthopedist like they were supposed to... so she's having to wait until tomorrow for the cast. We got a bit angry over that, but luckily for her it isn't so bad that it can't wait.

Is this accurate?

Your Mom showed up at your "work" and interrupted you trying to provide for your family.  She knew you were on a work call and interrupted anyway.

First of all...do I have this right?

If so, what does this say about her values?

I've got a bunch more thoughts about this, but probably wisest to hold off.

My wife read this post before me and got a kick out of it .

What you said is dead on. But what you don't understand is, God put it on her heart to come up here and do that! I say that in jest but it really is what she said. At no point have they shown respect for my work day, it's been an ongoing irritation and one of the reasons I typically don't respond. I have to wonder if they would still do that if my job didn't allow me to work at home when I'm not traveling for meetings, and was instead in an office. In any event I took advantage of my failed NC efforts and made it clear I was not happy for the disrespect of my work day and the impacts of that disrespect.

While I don't think I can do the mental gymnastics right now to get my head around her values, I know her values do not involve boundaries and respect. A fact I have to remind myself of, and I appreciate that reminder.

Oh yeah, what was your Mom apologizing for?

Everything! Even for my dad and siblings! According to her she was ready to apologize for everything we threw at her, and bear the responsibility of everyone else too! All we needed to do was tell her what to apologize for. I mean, except for when she was blaming my aunt and cousin. And whoever else she needed to blame. Like the ambiguous "they" who wants to disrupt and take down our perfect and well liked family, similar to how people like to hurt or bring down celebrities due to their success. I'm serious, she made that analogy.  

I won't belabor everything I said, but I told her she couldn't be responsible for others, and that we were more interested in action/change than words. And that the person needing to hear apologies wasn't home. And that we didn't want to check off offenses with apologies, but want to steer clear of them in the future.

To her credit, she did make it clear that she knows she messed up the first night she raged at us, and didn't try to shy away from that. But that was one night, 4 months ago. I don't think she grasps the fault in everything else.

This is a great point, lmatter.  My solution to my mom perpetually trying to break NC/my boundaries was to move far enough away that dad & she dad could not comfortably visit.  

We tried that once! Moved 7 hours away. That was when they all hounded us about moving back. And when my mom casually used her suicidal thoughts to let me know how hard it was on her we were gone. And to this day we have to hear about how amazing my mom was that time she drove those 7 hours to get our daughter and take her back to their house that one time we were sick, something my wife to this day hates herself for agreeing to. This was before my eyes were opened, and our circumstances eventually resulted us in moving within 2 hours of them. Wishing now we had gone in the other direction, farther north!

What do you do when that's not feasible?  Her "I'm going to stop you from NC" tactics are not what normal people do.  I may be wrong and hope I am...this may not go away so easily by not answering the door.

What's sad is I still have to force myself to be aware it's not normal. And I'm afraid you're right, and I think it's still going to get worse.

I sincerely hope you can keep NC with holding fast to boundaries and fine-tuning them when need be. Good luck!  

Thank you, I really appreciate it!

Hi PD.  I am sorry she is not respecting your request for distance and time.  

Do you think it would be possible in the future to talk directly to her and simply say "Please stop doing this, I am not going to change my mind, you need to stop", and then shut the door or something like that?

Thanks Harri! I'd be afraid to open the door, not trusting myself to not give in when face to face. I did try the short response thing over the doorbell, something like "I don't want to talk and I am trying to work". Not perfect by any stretch, but I wasn't thinking clearly in the moment. Plus I kept talking after she responded, so I mucked it up. She's really good at making it excruciating to not respond.

I do like the suggestion of a doorbell that you have more control over (like volume and even an off switch).

We can do that with ours and it's pretty handy. Though "in the moment" me didn't think about that.

Edit: Sorry, that was a very long post I just made!

[Harri]

PD, I think you did well.  You learned from this so that makes it a success in my mind.     This of this as practice.  With each encounter you learn more and get stronger.  You can identify areas that need some more work or tweaking.  All of that is good!

[formflier]

I'm agree this is practice!  I'm also going to give you high marks for how you handled it.

What one thing are you most proud of "doing" or "not caving in on " from this last episode?

What one thing do you wish you could do over again?

Think of this as "post-flight debrief" with FF.

Best,

FF

[pursuingJoy]

PD, I think my mouth was ajar as I read your post about her showing up.

I remember some of your first posts and this is me applauding you on the hard work you've done to get where you are.     I'm with FF - I want to know what you're proud of!

Do you think that the mental preparation for your dad to show up helped you navigate this? I know they can be creative with their tactics but to some degree, their behavior is predictable. You said you think they'll try something else. Do you imagine she would do the same thing again or are you expecting a different tactic? Predicting various scenarios and planning my response helps me stay calm in the moment.

[Methuen]

Predicting various scenarios and planning my response helps me stay calm in the moment.

For me this can be helpful up to a point, but I was taking it too far, obsessing, and just imagining too many bad scenarios, and then exhausting myself at trying to strategize a way out of each one.   I was an emotional mess.

I think the key is balance.  At a point, I definitely lost my balance taking this strategy too far.  I was living in constant fear.  T told me to go LC.  When I felt centered again after some time, I slowly reached out to make contact on my terms.

Planning is always an excellent idea, but I caution about going down the rabbit hole of "way overthinking it".  It's exhausing.  That was my personal experience.  Someone else's experience would be very different.  

I think the key with planning various scenarios and then planning responses is to know when to stop.  I got carried away and kind of didn't know when to stop planning...

[Notwendy]

That would have shaken me up too. Remember, it's a learning curve with how to keep boundaries. It takes some practice. We don't all do it perfectly.

When my mother gets pitiful, it's awful to see. I have a difficult time dealing with it. What is frustrating is that much of the time, she's faking it to get what she wants. She can snap into "waif" mode in an instant and out of it just as fast. I have no way to tell when it is real and when it isn't. She's that good. During these times I feel like I must be an ogre to resist her. Yet she doesn't respect boundaries and when she wants something, she does what she can to get it.

On the other hand, I am not sure she's completely aware of the effect of her behavior on others. She still perceives herself as a victim when I don't agree to her requests. I don't know if she makes the connection between how she has treated me and why our relationship is the way it is. I have rarely heard an apology from her and don't expect one.

I think a hard part of seeing her act out in waif mode is that, even if it is an act, she's so focused on her own difficult feelings that in the moment, she believes I am trying to cause her discomfort and so that aspect is real. She then sees these issues as all my fault, and so doesn't consider her behavior. I don't know how to change this perspective. It is what it is.

[Methuen]

Wow Notwendy, you just described my mom perfectly in your last 3 paragraphs.  I think you just articulated what I haven't yet been able to do - especially the last paragraph.

[GaGrl]

My mom has some BPD traits, and the situations that frustrate me the most are her waifish behaviors. I have to work on my ability to manage my reactions, because at 93 years old, she isn't going to change.

[ProudDad12]

Hey everyone,

I apologize, there was a lot of helpful stuff said here, and I haven't responded. I actually had a long response typed out last month, and then lost it right at the end due to a copy/paste error while trying to quote. After that I couldn't get the motivation to try saying it all again. I know this thread is old at this point but I wanted to thank everyone for their advice and insight, it was a big help.

[pursuingJoy]

How are things going for you, ProudDad?