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Author Topic: Grown son with most BPD traits  (Read 834 times)
Sunny28

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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
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« on: October 19, 2020, 03:44:35 PM »

Hello,    My youngest son started exhibiting personality disorder traits around the age of 16.   He is now 19.    My instinct told me it was something more than teenage angst.   I looked for ways of getting him some professional help but because he was so resistant, I was never able to get him to a professional for counselling or diagnosis.   I never really cared so much about the label or the diagnosis.  I was really just interested in getting him some therapy and coping skills for his emotional dysregulation.     I sought counselling for myself at the time to help me cope.   I was told that he might mature and grow out of some of his behaviours so I waited.   I did see him maturing and thought that he would always just be a difficult person to get along with.   In the last year, he's been more out of control with anger, rages and tantrums directed at his family members.   He started lashing out at his long-time girlfriend who has since left him.  He was never physically abusive but very verbally and emotionally abusive to her and to me - his mother.    He has an intense jealousy of his older brother who had recently moved home.   The tension built and finally exploded in a huge fight and my youngest son making physical and death threats  against my oldest.  My oldest son suffered a panic attack as a result.    Our family has completely broken down.   Friends tell me to kick him out of the house.   I want him to leave but he's just started college (online due to COVID) and I can't contribute to derailing his future by kicking him out.  I want him to leave home but I'm afraid when he's out in the world, he won't control his outbursts, anger, rage and tantrums.   I really would like him to get some therapy to help him but we've tried without him even budging.  We've set consequences (ie we stopped letting him drive our cars until he shows us that he's dealing with his anger) I'm trying to set boundaries at home but find myself walking on eggshells to try to keep the peace.   I feel like he's controlling the house.   My older son is now estranged from us and won't set foot at home again.   I have no more family unit and am finding myself very depressed.   I feel like both sons and my husband hold me responsible (Mom shaming is rampant in my life).    Just looking for others who understand and don't judge and can maybe offer advice.   
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
Swimmy55
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Relationship status: Estranged
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« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2020, 04:53:58 PM »

Thank you for writing in. No judgements here.
Good for you in getting therapy for yourself .
1. Know that everyone in the household is as important as the adult BPD child.
2.  Decisions need to be made keeping the whole family / household in mind.  Your son's illness is indeed running the house, but you can get control back.  It will take fortitude and it won't be easy, however.  . I would suggest starting with trying to get on the same page as your spouse  and this is where your therapist could help you.  From there, some small boundaries can be established such as when he is calmer, a rule can be established about abusive cursing and yelling( possibly- each person/ situation is different). At the beginning before my adult son got too dysregulated, the rule was if there was any aggressive language, ranting, I would go to another room for a time out.  Yes, me, not him.  He would be too enmeshed in yelling to be able to extract himself .   This could be a small thing to start with.  It worked with my son for a while until it didn't.  However, your situation can be different .

As an FYI you can also click onto anyone's names here to get previous posts and thus more backstory .  Please know you are not alone. 
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Hopetoo

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« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2020, 07:41:00 AM »

It has been several weeks since you posted and I hope you have found support and good information to help with your very difficult family challenge.  I have two sons and they too had a fight that changed their relationship.  For the past few years they have not spoken to each other. It is my younger son, now 25, who struggles with taking responsibility for his own life.  He has found a lot of people, including me, who are caregivers and willing to accept responsibility for him.  My challenge has been learning what my boundaries are and making choices that allow for him to be responsible for himself.  My priority was keeping the peace; I dislike conflict a lot because I am afraid of being raged at. I have been seeking help with how to handle someone's (including my son's) rage and anger.  Some self-defense courses teach assertiveness and safety skills. COVID has prevented me for taking a class as of today.

A difficult thing I have had to do is let natural consequences teach my son. (Ex. when he doesn't pay his rent I don't let him move in with me.) I have learned what some of my boundaries are and I have set boundaries that he can not literally and figuratively push me over.  Most days I sufficiently manage the background noise of terror that my son will die.  Each time he was put in a position to choose therapy or a physician's help he declined.  I drove him to the hospital during an episode and he refused to stay. I do not think he sees a problem with how he is acting.  At some level he achieves something he wants, even if that something is to push people away.  I used to think it could not be true that he would deliberately alienate people; yet he told me that he prefers to do that when he is not getting what he wants. That way he can be mad at the person who did not help him rather than problem solve for his own solutions.

Einstein is credited with saying that we can't keep doing the same thing and expecting a different result. Walking on eggshells and keeping the peace were only bringing me closer to an ulcer.  I found this BPD site and it is helpful to read about other's who share my pain.  But commiserating only goes so far for me. I need action steps and those are also found here in some of the videos and reader feedback. It has been helpful to read about being a caregiver (I didn't think I was a caregiver.  I was just a mom. As a caregiving mom I thought I had to take whatever was dished out and make it better.  Now I know there are ways to preserve ones sanity and still care give without enabling.

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guiltymom

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« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2020, 09:36:06 AM »

Your post sounds so similar to my situation. My son's behavior has totally destroyed our family unit; for years I used to just say he had a "difficult personality" and hope that he'd outgrow it. I also relied heavily on the fact that the parents of his friends seemed to adore him—thought he saved up all his bad behavior for his immediate family. I now realize that the signs of BPD have been there since he was about 12 or 13, and got much worse at around 18. In a way I'm glad that he hates us, because having him visit for only a week has made me a nervous wreck. An earlier post mentioned misophonia—he definitely has a severe case of it. I have it too but not nearly so bad. He stopped being able to eat meals at the table with us in seventh grade, and to avoid conflict I just let that continue.
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Sunny28

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Relationship status: Living in same home
Posts: 6


« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2020, 12:41:04 PM »

Hello,

Thanks for the replies.    I am grateful for the commiserating and agree that I do need some constructive action to help my entire household.    We did move our oldest son out of the house.  He had moved home during COVID and can't afford to live on his own now so we are paying his rent temporarily.   My husband and I acknowledge that under no circumstances can both sons live under the same roof so we did what we needed to do.   My oldest understands that this is temporary financial help and it is to save what we can of our household and also to preserve his mental health.   His younger brother has broken him down and I think he's suffering with depression as a result.    It's better for him to be out of the house but he can't visit for holidays, Sunday dinner or anything.   It's horribly sad.   It bothers me that my youngest essentially got his way and got his older brother out of the house but we had to do it for the rest of the family's sanity.    I have been better at setting boundaries with my BPD son.   I won't tolerate his outbursts and will only engage in relatively calm conversations.    If he begins to rage, I leave the room.    It usually results in him slamming swearing and carrying on - but at least not at me.    He continues to lie and argue his distorted version of the events that resulted in a huge fight with him and his brother.   I usually try to disengage from the conversation as disagreeing with him will only result in escalation.  He is in his own reality and I will never be able to change it.  I read in another post about BPD children rehashing events from the past.   My son obsesses over things that happened years ago.  Most of his issues are very exagerated as well.    I've empathized with his feelings over these issues and also reminded him he can't change the past but he can act in the present and change the future.   He continues to obsess.       This may seem trivial against the big picture but as we get closer to the holiday season, I'm looking for advice from those who have teen or early 20's children who are estranged from each other.    I'm still feeling such grief over the loss of my family that I cannot begin to decide what to do about the holidays.   My BPD son lives with us and my older one speaks with my husband and I but won't come in the house.   I don't feel like celebrating the holidays at all but wonder if I'm punishing everyone.    Any advice is appreciated.
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NorthernMom

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Relationship status: Estranged
Posts: 19


« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2020, 10:50:08 AM »

Hi Sunny28 - thank you for the update and sounds like you are doing what is best for both sons!

The guilt and grief I feel for the loss of "what I thought I had" as a family unit is real and I read that in your words as well.  I am trying very hard to look at this as a catalyst for change and to get creative with a new family definition.

Some things that come to mind when I read your post are:
-  to redefine and enjoy time with your oldest son in terms that foster a sense of security and devotion to him and only him - without the cloud of the younger son's  situation even in the equation.  He cannot come to your place but can you set up a pattern of going to his place and enjoying time together as a redefined family on a semi-regular basis?
- Christmas together (for this year anyway) may not be realistic but can you create a holiday season that is?  Finding time and activities done with the younger son (short durations) and separately with the older son?  Are there community events that take you out of the house that can be enjoyed separately with each son?  Volunteering, fundraising, community dinners for the homeless or other things that focus outwardly vs inward?

I find that being the Mom, everyone is looking to me to lead this rat-pack crappy situation.  So, I am hell bent not to let it be crappy :-).  Different, new, sometimes tough.  But no sense with trying to keep up with appearances.  I won't have my family together this Christmas and it will be obvious why my BPD daughter isn't home.  That's a fact.  But I will support her while also compartmentalizing that situation and ensure my other 2 children feel supported in their own unique ways as well.  That is my commitment to redefining this family.

Keep writing...you are helping us out too!
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Hopetoo

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« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2020, 07:23:40 AM »

NorthernMom:  I love what you said about redefining family. In America it seems like we are bombarded with "follow your dreams" ideas.  When one of those dreams is a cohesive, happy, loving, etc. family unit and it doesn't work out even with one's best efforts it is hard to accept.  Your comment about redefining is helpful.  Some dreams we are forced to redefine.  I think the lie in "follow your dreams" is that we are following something that is not reality. Families coping with the crappiness of members with BPD traits or diagnoses live in constant uncertainty and that is our reality.  Remaining a hopeful, loving, caring person so the crappy is more happy is a challenge. 
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Sunny28

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Relationship status: Living in same home
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« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2020, 09:11:36 PM »

Thank-you, we did make it through the holidays with a "redefined family".    Actually COVID helped excuse us from any gatherings with extended family which was a relief on a certain level.     My husband and I cooked 2 dinners - 1 on Christmas eve with my BPD son and then another on Christmas day at our cottage with our oldest.   Both my husband and I spent some time with my oldest before the holidays to make up for the fact he couldn't be at home.   It seemed to work out.  In my mind, we are similar to a divorced family except it's the kids who are divorced instead of the parents.   My older son seems to be doing alright living on his own.  He misses home but realizes the reality of being at home will not ever be the same.   My BPD son has been calm except if the topic of his brother arises.    It continues to trigger him into rages and threats against his brother and his distorted view of reality.    I avoid it all together as I accept I can't change him.    He is doing fairly well in his online classes and my husband and I are looking towards him moving out if he can attend classes in person in the fall.  We are not confident he will leave home.    I have been better at "letting go" of his life and accepting that he has to accept accountability (which he doesn't).    I am still suffering with what my family has become but my goal is to hopefully see both my kids thrive and be happy even though we will all be apart.     Thank you for your comments and support.  It helps knowing that I'm not alone.
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guiltymom

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« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2021, 10:03:13 AM »

Hello, I haven't posted in a long time, but was just rereading this thread to remind myself that I'm not alone. It's amazing how similar our situations are—I have also compared my sons' estrangement from each other to divorced parents. We're a family of four that can't all be together under the same roof, and we've had to accept the fact that we have to spend time separately with our non-BPD son—Zoom calls once a week or so (ideally when the BPD son is at work) and occasional visits out of state to see him.

BPD son moved back in with us last month and is saving money to move to Hawaii. I wrestle with the dread of him being that far away and getting into some kind of trouble (I can imagine him getting into a fight caused by noise—he has severe misophonia), but am also so excited for him to be far, far away from me. When he is here in the house, his mood dictates everything, even though I know I shouldn't let it. When he does something that shows how little he cares for our feelings and our property (the latest thing is spilling a Cherry Coke on the rug in his room and not trying to clean the stain), I feel dead inside. He is 23, and I have a feeling we'll be having to help him financially for years and years.

Thanks for the reminder that other people have children like this.
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Sunny28

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« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2021, 09:44:36 PM »

Hello - Guiltymom your family sounds very much like mine and sadly, it's comforting to know that someone out there understands.     We are doing alright - status quo.    No reconciliation in sight for my 2 sons which I'm getting better at accepting.    I don't hope for it and if they ever did reconcile, I don't think I'd trust it.    I'm accepting that we will never be a healthy family unit and that all I can do is try to have healthy relationships with both my sons separately.   My oldest is doing well.  He's working and moved into an apartment with a friend so we are no longer supporting him.  I think he misses his brother (or the version of him that once was) but has been hurt by him so badly that he reminds himself that he can't have a relationship with him.  He recently has been able to come home on occasion as my younger, BPD son has moved to college - 6 hours away.   I'm very wary of what he's like and how he's getting along there.  I'm afraid he'll have an outburst and bail and want to come home.    On the other hand, I'm thinking maybe being out in the world and away from his usual kicking post (me) might help him function better.  I think it could go either way.    It's sad as a Mom to say it but I don't miss him.    I want him to find happiness away from home.   Fingers crossed.    I really relate to your comment about your son's mood dictating everything.  My son gets this look on his face and I know right away to just get away from him.   It's a sign that he's agitated and I just can't stand it anymore.     It feels weird because for years I was so sympathetic and hurting for him.    I love him and support him but I'm not hurting for him anymore.   He's 20 now and a grown man.  I've done everything I feel I can for him as a parent and am letting go of a lot of the guilt.   I'm dropping the guilt and shame but I still worry a lot.   I heard an analogy of a Mom being like a bus driver.  She drives the bus until it's time for the kids to get off (adulthood).  She lets them off the bus but they keep trying to get back on and ride with her.   That's how I feel.   I worry that my BPD son will not be able to function well in the world and will always depend on us.   He's very smart and doing well in school but I find myself hoping he pursues a career where he can work in solitude and not deal with many people.    I'm dreading the holidays again.   I have not shared with either my husband's or my family about the estrangement.   My family is very critical and judgmental and I just can't subject myself or my sons to it.  COVID helped me avoid any family gatherings but I won't be able to avoid it much longer.   P.S.  my BPD son also has misophonia - couldn't stand the sound of his brother chewing - I think I have a bit of that too.
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guiltymom

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« Reply #10 on: September 24, 2021, 09:00:38 AM »

My husband also waited a long time to tell his parents about our sons' estrangement. I think he was embarrassed and didn't want them to worry (they already have a lot on their plate with an alcoholic 55-year-old son). It is highly embarrassing and I feel the judgment of some of my friends, even though I know they don't mean to be that way. I guess it's just so far outside the experience of most people—children in their twenties who can't be under the same roof. I also am trying to accept that this is my life now—having totally separate interactions and relationships with each son. 

Sunny, that's encouraging that your son is still in college. I realize that a college degree is by no means a guarantee of a good job, but I still wish my BPD son had toughed it out for one more year to graduate—at least that would be one less thing going against him as he tries to start his own life.

The misophonia is really interesting to me, and I totally sympathize because I also have it, although not nearly as bad as my son. It's possible that this is just as crippling to him as his BPD. (Why the hell did I never mention it to his pediatrician? It started when he was about 12! Argh.)

I'm making progress by not worrying as much, not always wondering how he's doing, etc. I hate having to be unemotional about my own child, but it sure does help! Leaf, I know you've talked a lot about this. Thanks to everyone here for the understanding and recognition.
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
Leaf56
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« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2021, 11:24:18 AM »

Just thought I'd add my 2 cents here on this subject because there is a possibility that this is about to happen in my family too. My sons have always been close but have also always fought like siblings do, nothing that would've ever ruptured the relationship though and no more than me and my sister did. My middle son lives far away out of state at college and stays there year-round, and my elder BPD son lives nearby with their dad. They recently attended an out-of-state funeral for a family member of my ex-husband and had an altercation in which my elder son physically threatened my middle son. This incident led my middle son to tell my elder son that he had about a year left of this nonsense before he loses his relationship with him. (It's interesting because after the recent incident I had with my son at the park where he loudly screamed in public, I told him the same thing. If you want a relationship with your family members, you have to treat them with respect and behave in a civilized manner PERIOD!) Edited to add that my elder son called me after he got back and I really gave it to him for about an hour, telling him that none of us are going to stand for this BS etc. and he promptly called his brother and apologized and his brother said he sounded more normal than he had in a long time.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2021, 11:29:41 AM by Leaf56 » Logged
Sunny28

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Relationship status: Living in same home
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« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2021, 10:00:09 PM »

That sounds like an excellent example of setting and maintaining boundaries.  Kudos to you!   I need to take a page out of that book.      We recently attended a family funeral of a close relative.  Both sons attended but kept their distance and didn't speak.   I was fine with that and I didn't ask more of them.   My eldest son opted out of the lunch afterwards.   He wasn't trying to be hurtful but was just being realistic knowing that something might erupt and he didn't want to be anywhere near it.   My BPD son was almost doubled over with a stress related stomach ache - he's 20 for goodness sake and it reminded me of when he was 7.    I had told them before hand that if anything erupted, I didn't care who started it.   I said I would not have either of them in my life again if they caused a scene.  We got through it and then I could breathe again.     We will avoid all family gatherings again this holiday season.   I still suffer from worrying about judgement which I know I shouldn't.    To Guilty Mom - I found a lot of support when my son was 16 and I joined an in-person parent support group in my area.  I am surrounded by people who have happy family units (or at least the appearance of it).   When I joined the group, I was shocked to meet parents who had kids just like mine and were having the same experiences.   I felt like I could talk to complete strangers more than anyone in my life.     They would help by sharing strategies for dealing with specific situations that I might be facing.
   
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