Stepdaughter (non BPD) wants us to come for brunch

[beatricex]

I have two adult stepdaughters, the youngest one is the sBPD.  The oldest is her flying monkey, however.  As a result of the oldest one, the younger one has cut us off from her and her children (ultimatum given by sBPD was that my husband must divorce me, or he will never see her and her kids ever again).  This ultimatum was the result of me texting sBPD's sister's ex husband during COVID, and being kind to him.  As is typical in any dysfunctional system, I went against the code that I must hate who they hate.  This is really tiring and triggering for me to keep this up.  Example: I attended the youngest's baby shower and her older sister wanted me to say I hated the younger sister's MIL (because she said this to me right after we got there).  Since we were at the youngest's MIL's house for the baby shower, I thought this was totally inappropriate because she was hosting the party, and being nice to everyone as usual, but I was kind of in shock and said nothing.  This is the repeating pattern, my stepdaughters pick fights with all the women in every family, and my husband and I are expected to take their side.  Two years ago, my husband finally had the courage to tell his girls (he made a short video and mailed it to both of them), we are not going to "hate who they hate anymore," it's not acceptable as there's grandkids who are old enough to comprehend this now, and his girls are asking us to hate the kids' grandmas (also sometimes their Dad).  This is common sense, after a divorce you don't bad mouth the other party, who the kid's live with.  Kids internalize this stuff, since they love everyone.


Last week, my husband received a text from his oldest daughter inviting us to "brunch" at her new house.  New house, new boyfriend, potentially totally new instant family, complete with a new MIL for her to live with (she hates the ex MIL who she also lived with, and expects me to too).  It's the honeymoom period, so new potential MIL is being love bombed, no one hates her yet (I don't think). I am a bit floored as we have not spoken to her except to arrange to pickup and spend time with her kids (boys, aged 8 and 9) in the last 2 years, and now it seems she's inviting me to a Mother's day brunch?  Wow, it's really a stretch I've never even gotten so much as a thank you or Happy Mother's day from her or anything (despite my husband and I helping her out financially when she went through a divorce and got in trouble with the law).  Also, she was supposedly "livid" I texted her ex husband, and isn't speaking to me.  My husband is very angry, but I've convinced him not to respond until he's calmer.  Because she's trying to impress her new MIL and new boyfriend (they all live together), suddenly it's as if nothing happened?  Does she expect me to go to her new house and wish her a happy mother's day?  I really don't know what to think.  Will her sister be discussed?  I have no children of my own, btw.

Just had to get this off my chest with people who get it.  I think it's just more crazy making and quicksand, which I'm avoiding getting stuck in.

b

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Sancho]

Hi Beatricex

I think the word 'quicksand' is so spot on! I'm going through that sort of a patch at the moment. You see very clearly the patterns that are associated with the BPD journey: new MIL who is wonderful etc etc, old MIL awful etc. Then with time the circle continues and round it goes again.

And yes - if you don't agree or don't want to join in the put downs on someone, you are 'on their side' etc etc.

At the moment, this last couple weeks I have been trying to hold on to something to not go into the sand. It is really exhausting to try to hold a line, somehow to keep loving and walk beside dd but not get drawn into the chaos and not let her bring the chaos here more than necessary.

Mother's Day has come and gone here - always a day of chaos. Whatever you decided to do - go or not go - I hope you were able to hold on to something that prevented you going deeper into that sand.

Glad that you are able to have contact with the children. You and your husband seem to handle things pretty well.

Thank you for posting.

[beatricex]

Thank you Sancho

My husband didn't even answer the text.  We are picking the grandboys up next Saturday to take them fishing (first time for them on a boat).

I'm thinking about getting tee-shirts made "Ain't gonna hate who you hate"  (only slightly joking here).  When you are at your wits end, what do you do?

I need some concrete advice if you don't mind giving some.  I can't exactly ask anyone else what to do here, it's so bizarre, my situation.  Most friends I've tried to share with just go silent, like I have a horn growing out of my head.  Their relationships are perfect, everyone gets along, there's no chaos.

Question:  The oldest grandson the last time he visited was hanging out with just me while his grandfather (my husband) was playing with his brother.  He is very sensitive, intuitive (reminds me of me when I was younger).  The conversation went to his mom and I said something like I couldn't text her, I didn't have her number in my phone anymore.  He said something like "ya, she doesn't have yours either MEAN."  So, the kid is comprehending what's going on, I mean he's almost in 4th grade.

What would you say in response?  Do I say nothing about the situation between me and his Mom, do I acknowledge there's tension?  I keep changing the subject to him, how much I missed him (we did not see them for a year and a half because of COVID) and how he's a good kid.  He's also very good a sports, so I compliment him a lot on his abilities. 

His younger brother seems unplussed, the oldest is the senstive one.

thank you for listening

b

p.s. Again, this is the non BPD step daughter, defending her sister's (sBPD's) honor - and hating on me to appease her sister (I think).  It's the unspoken code in the family to band together and hate on others.  As far as I can tell the entire relationship between my stepdaughters is based on this one thing:  bad mouthing others.  Many holidays have been spent bad mouthing their bio Mom, me just listening or taking their kids outside to play just to escape the dialogue.  p.p.s I am a "kid" person, if you haven't gathered, kids are typically drawn to me since I pay attention to them

[GaGrl]

What about something relatively non-committal, like...

"It would be nice to have a friendlier relationship."

[hi:)191abc]

I’m sorry you’re dealing with that! It’s a no-win situation. My BPD child invited me to Mother’s Day dinner after not talking to me for a year and a half over something minor. Then the entire time him and his girlfriend bad-mouthed my daughter, told lies to blame her for everything, denied all the bad-mouthing I know he’s done about me the past couple years, and caused chaos between me and my daughter. And now him and his girlfriend are mad at my daughter and her partner. I was happy to get him back for a moment, but on the other hand it causes other problems because I have to play into all the lies in order to have him not mad at me. There seems to be chaos regardless. I know the feeling of friends looking at you as if something must be wrong with a mother that has continuous chaos in the family. I wish you luck in your situation!

[Sancho]

Hi Beatricex. The little ones are so fortunate to have you and your husband. Fishing outings etc - just great.

Thinking about your question: I think my guide is not to create triangulation. BPD seems to thrive on putting 'piggy in the middle' - as you notice with being pressured to join in the hate game.

Children do pick things up as they grow older and I think it is really important not to put them in the piggy in the middle position. Another trigger for BPD - if a child prefers the company of a grandparent or other relative.

So looking at possibilities: I don't think you need to say anything to a  statement. He was letting you know that he knew the situation and how he felt about it.

If they ask a question it is different of course because you need to answer. If a question comes quickly and puts you on the spot, I think it is good buy a little time so that you are able to think. I think its also good to try to turn things to a general comment eg 'Why does mum always fight with   . . . . .' Perhaps something like 'Some people are not very confident themselves so they can get a bit easily irritated by other people.

It is hard to answer your question because you never know what a child is going to ask or say. It's important for them to be able to say what they think, and I feel that the fact that they have the space to do that is more important than your response (as long as you avoid criticising etc).

In my experience children seem to just want to say what they think and feel, rather than exploring things too deeply.