Husband says he figured out that I'm planning on divorcing him.

[Gerda]

I had a scary incident Monday night.

Last weekend I took my 4D on a campout to see the total solar eclipse with some friends of mine. They rented a campsite in the path of totality and invited me and my daughter to come along, but not my husband. Several months ago I ended up telling one of the friends about my husband's abuse (included the violent threats), and she ended up telling some of my other friends, which is why H wasn't invited.

(Also, H previously acted like he doesn't care about the eclipse and doesn't want to go on the campout anyway. That was the excuse I used to go with just my daughter and not him.)

H doesn't know I've told some of my friends about the abuse, but he does think my friends are all turning me against him and hate him for no good reason. I did tell him about the campout months in advance, but Friday is when he freaked out about it. I got off work early Friday afternoon to pack before it was time to pick up 4D from preschool, but didn't plan on leaving until Saturday morning. But that afternoon I started getting the barrage of angry text messages from him about how he doesn't want me to go and take 4D. I had therapy that afternoon and told my therapist about it, and she said I should just pick up 4D from school early and leave before H gets home from work instead of enduring his rage until Saturday morning. So that's what I did. I texted H letting him know that's what I was doing.

We had a lovely weekend except for my husband spending the whole weekend sending angry threatening text messages to me. I had spotty cell phone service, which made a nice excuse for not responding right away, but he kept threatening to either come down there himself and get 4D, or calling the sheriff's office to report her kidnapped.

Those ended up being empty threats (which I thought they would), and we came home Monday afternoon after the eclipse just like I told him we would from the beginning. When I got home, he was acting nice and normal again... until Monday night.

4D and I were really tired and went to bed early, but at about 11:30 pm my husband shook me awake. I thought he wanted sex and started undressing (since I'm not allowed to say no to sex with him), but instead he wanted to "talk," and said that he's figured out that I want to divorce him.

He started listing some of his "evidence." I've been working overtime at work, I recently donated a lot of our daughter's baby stuff, I didn't plant a vegetable garden this spring. These are all things that, yes, are partially because I plan on divorcing him, but also I'd have other reasons to do that would give me plausible deniability. I've been working overtime because three people in my department just retired and we are short staffed. I donated the baby stuff because it's certain now that we aren't having another baby due to my infertility and not wanting to go through another IVF cycle. I didn't plant a vegetable garden because I don't have time.

Those are all true excuses, but ALSO will help once I divorce him. And I was really tired and couldn't think straight, so I started to panic because I was afraid he had found me out. He also started ranting about how my friends are turning me against him and probably spent the whole weekend convincing me to divorce him. I made the mistake of revealing to him that I told them that he had been texting me threatening to call the sheriff on me, which in his mind morphed into me "publicly ridiculing him" at the campout.

Finally I realized that if I didn't stop this conversation he would keep me up all night ranting, and I had work the next morning, and I was tired and would probably say things I shouldn't say, so I told him that's it, I'm going to bed.

Then at about 3 am, he woke me up again, still in a rage. He tried to keep it going some more. I told him I'm not going to let him keep me up all night with this, and if he does, I'm going to leave and go sleep at a hotel. I ended up physically shoving him out of the bedroom, begging him to just let me sleep and quit bothering me, and locked the bedroom door. After that it took me a while to get back to sleep.

The next morning he was all nice again acting like nothing had happened. He said he wants to work things out and thinks our relationship is going to be OK. I was exhausted and sleep deprived. I got our daughter to preschool and got to work, and that afternoon he started texting me again, this time saying I have to choose: him or my friends. He said I can't stay friends with these people who all hate him, so if I keep staying friends with them, he will divorce me. Later he texted saying I could only stay friends with them if I get them to apologize to him for "ostracizing and bullying" him.

I ignored the texts (I was at work, after all), and that evening he was acting nice and normal again, grabbing me and forcing me to hug and kiss him like he always does after a fight.

So I'm still processing this. For one thing, HE KNOWS! Or at least, he's starting to suspect something. I had hoped my divorce preparations so far had enough plausible deniability to not trigger his suspicions but apparently not. So now I'm worried about doing more preparation that might look even more suspicious.

He's demanding that I stop seeing my friends (some of whom I've known longer than him - over 20 years) because they are turning me against him. But um, they kind of are. At least, now that they know about his abuse they said I have their full support divorcing him and are concerned about my safety.

The waking me up in the middle of the night thing is scary because in that sleep-deprived state I can't think straight and sometimes say things that I shouldn't have said (he's done this to me before). It's also a bit dangerous that I ended up physically shoving him out of the room, because before he's said that if I shove him, he's then legally allowed to defend himself by punching me or shooting me because I was the one who first "got physical." The thing was, if I hadn't shoved him out of the room, he would have kept me up all night ranting at me (because he's done that before too).

It looks like he's back to love bombing right now, so I'm safe for now, but this whole incident has made me nervous about moving forward with my divorce plans if he's already suspecting something. I'm going to have to be extra careful.

Also, my plan was to move out and take 4D with me while he was at work, so we're already gone to a safe place when he gets home and finds a note (or something like that). If he reacted that way when I took 4D camping while he was at work, after I had already told him my plan and where we were going and when we are coming back, I really am not looking forward to how he reacts when I leave him for good.

And before this he had been good for at least a couple of months. I even started thinking there might be a possibility we could do this divorce thing in a reasonable, amicable way. *sigh*

[ForeverDad]

We had a lovely weekend except for my husband spending the whole weekend sending angry threatening text messages to me. I had spotty cell phone service, which made a nice excuse for not responding right away, but he kept threatening to either come down there himself and get 4D, or calling the sheriff's office to report her kidnapped.

I hope you've had some interviews or consultations with several family law attorneys.  They're either free or relatively inexpensive.  The lawyers can guide you on what your spouse can or cannot do.

Threatening text messages are a no-no.  Whether they're actionable for you to do something about it, a lawyer could say.  If not now, then you might be able to save and use them later when you file.

No, he can't come and get your daughter.  She is in your care and possession.  If he should come and the police are called, likely the officer would decline action and refer you to family court to resolve the dispute.  Likely all the officer would do would be to calm down the incident, usually by separating the two of you.  And since D4 was with you, she should stay with you, since without a court order stating otherwise then "possession is 9/10 of the law".

Report his child kidnapped?  I recall when my then-stbEx tried that.  I had given notice of a vacation well in advance and she thought she could deny the vacation, as though my notice needed her approval.  She went to the sheriff's office and demanded the deputy declare an Amber Alert.  His answer, as listed in the incident report, was that her claim did not meet the criteria of an Amber Alert.  How could she argue with "the criteria"?

All of the above was my experience in my state.  Elsewhere, your mileage may vary.

[Gerda]

I hope you've had some interviews or consultations with several family law attorneys.  They're either free or relatively inexpensive.  The lawyers can guide you on what your spouse can or cannot do.

Threatening text messages are a no-no.  Whether they're actionable for you to do something about it, a lawyer could say.  If not now, then you might be able to save and use them later when you file.

No, he can't come and get your daughter.  She is in your care and possession.  If he should come and the police are called, likely the officer would decline action and refer you to family court to resolve the dispute.  Likely all the officer would do would be to calm down the incident, usually by separating the two of you.  And since D4 was with you, she should stay with you, since without a court order stating otherwise then "possession is 9/10 of the law".

Report his child kidnapped?  I recall when my then-stbEx tried that.  I had given notice of a vacation well in advance and she thought she could deny the vacation, as though my notice needed her approval.  She went to the sheriff's office and demanded the deputy declare an Amber Alert.  His answer, as listed in the incident report, was that her claim did not meet the criteria of an Amber Alert.  How could she argue with "the criteria"?

All of the above was my experience in my state.  Elsewhere, your mileage may vary.

I haven't talked to any lawyers yet, but I plan to do so soon (within the next month or so).

I have been told before that I can't kidnap my own daughter. Even during the campout when I told my friends what was happening, they said even if he did call the sheriff's office, they wouldn't do anything. After all, I had told my husband for weeks (maybe even months) in advance about my plans. When I would leave, where I was going, when I would be back. The only thing that changed is when he started freaking out and texting me on Friday, I decided to leave Friday afternoon instead of waiting until Saturday morning. I did text him on Friday letting him know of my change of plans because of how he was acting, and that we'd see him Monday afternoon. It's not like he came home Friday evening to find his wife and daughter missing with no explanation.

But if this is how he acts in this situation, I am really not looking forward to getting my daughter out of here when I divorce him. He must have sent me dozens of texts over the entire weekend, along with some voicemails that I haven't gotten up the courage to listen to yet. My therapist told me to save all of them for evidence.

[CravingPeace]

Not a lawyer but I believe in state you are ok.

Crossing state lines may cause issues, depending on different state laws.

Going international without consent I think could be an issue.

I know going into Canada one time my wife was asked for a letter signed by me.

[Gerda]

The scariest part of last weekend wasn't my husband threatening to call the sheriff's office on me. I was always pretty sure that was an empty threat.

The worst part was him waking me up in the middle of the night after I got home saying he's figured out I'm planning on divorcing him. I didn't think he was suspecting anything before, but now I know he is.

I've still been trying to figure out how I'm going to break it to him. Do I tell him in person? Do I just move out while he's at work and have someone else serve him the papers?

I can tell already that he's not going to take it well, and I really don't want my daughter to be around when he finds out, because he's already shown that he's completely incapable of controlling his emotions around her. I don't want her to be there to witness whatever horrible outburst he has when he finds out it's really happening.

So if I tell him in person, I'd have to have my daughter somewhere else, perhaps being babysat by one of my friends he hates. Or I'll be somewhere else with my daughter, and he'll freak out and call the police and accuse me of kidnapping her.

I almost wonder if I should talk to the police ahead of time. Tell them I'm about to break up with my husband, I know he's not going to react well, so I'm taking my daughter to such-and-such safe location, and that's where she'll be when my husband calls you to report her kidnapped.

I know, I should talk to a lawyer about this. I just can't help but run the scenarios over and over in my head though, and this past weekend reminded me that I need to prepare for the worst.

[kells76]

I've still been trying to figure out how I'm going to break it to him. Do I tell him in person? Do I just move out while he's at work and have someone else serve him the papers?

What would you be hoping for, if you told him in person? Based on past history, do you think that what you are hoping for is likely, unlikely, other?

It can be normal to use a letter, email, or papers to inform your spouse about a divorce, when conflict is high and when safety is a factor. People have done that before.

I can tell already that he's not going to take it well, and I really don't want my daughter to be around when he finds out, because he's already shown that he's completely incapable of controlling his emotions around her. I don't want her to be there to witness whatever horrible outburst he has when he finds out it's really happening.

That's good to focus on what's healthy for your daughter. Yes, she doesn't need to be there when he finds out about the divorce.

So if I tell him in person, I'd have to have my daughter somewhere else, perhaps being babysat by one of my friends he hates. Or I'll be somewhere else with my daughter, and he'll freak out and call the police and accuse me of kidnapping her.

To me, after reading some of your history, this sounds like a volatile option. While it would be good to have your daughter elsewhere, my concern is that if you are there in person, and you know he isn't capable of managing his emotions healthily, and you're telling him something big emotionally that he probably won't like... I mean, you've never divorced him before. This would be the first time (as odd as that sounds). So you know that he doesn't manage emotions well and gets controlling and violent, and then this would be a new situation of 10/10 emotional intensity -- he already doesn't really have skills for familiar situations, and a new situation... While ultimately, it's your decision to make (we aren't there in your life, there may be more context), from here, it's hard for me to see that any benefits of telling him in person would outweigh the very possible and (to me, very serious) downsides.

I almost wonder if I should talk to the police ahead of time. Tell them I'm about to break up with my husband, I know he's not going to react well, so I'm taking my daughter to such-and-such safe location, and that's where she'll be when my husband calls you to report her kidnapped.

Great idea    I wonder if you'd have time during lunch today to do that? Let us know how it goes.

I know, I should talk to a lawyer about this. I just can't help but run the scenarios over and over in my head though, and this past weekend reminded me that I need to prepare for the worst.

From your perspective, what do you think is holding you back from interviewing some local lawyers?

 

[Gerda]

I guess telling him in person would be the more "decent" thing to do. I've read advice about breaking up with/divorcing someone that said you should do it in person when the kids aren't present, and then tell the kids together afterwards.

But I guess that's how it works when "normal," mentally healthy people are getting divorced. Since we hadn't had a fight in a couple of months, I was starting to get up hope that maybe I could handle it that way, but after this past weekend, I'm back to thinking I need to prepare for the worst.

My plan is to do it this summer. I'm an educator, so I have summers off of work. That will give me a lot more free time to work on things like this. That's why I haven't talked to a lawyer yet. I've been telling myself I'm too busy right now and I'll wait until after final exams are done. Though I admit that part of that probably is procrastination. The thought of actually talking to a lawyer instead of just thinking about it gives me a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach.

Final exams are the second week of May, though. That's only about a month. It's getting close.

I also still have a lot of other things to do to prepare. Gathering up papers and documents, for example. I haven't already done any of that stuff yet either.

But I'm worried about how he's already suspecting something because I've been doing some decluttering around the house, didn't plant a garden this year (because I don't want to plant a garden only to abandon it), etc. I'll have to be a lot more careful and secretive moving forward.

I also feel bad about reassuring him that I am not divorcing him now that he's suspecting something, because that's not true, and I don't like outright lying to him like that. But I don't feel ready for him to know yet.

[yellowbutterfly]

I too thought it would be "decent" to tell my ex in person about divorcing but after the advice here I made other plans. Despite that, it did not go well.

It transpired as such...

I had a safety plan and was faking my interactions with him until the filing day. The plan was to file on the 15th and to tell him from afar so that I would be safe from whatever reaction he would act out. I was going to leave and stay with friends without his knowledge and then have him served and if he would not leave the home consider an OOP to have him excluded as he was an unsafe person to be around. My xH uBPD was abusive, I don't know about yours but not only was I dealing with his possible inability to respond like a rational adult to the news of divorce, but also with the possibility he could get violent.

He had suspicions I was going to do this, or so I thought, despite my efforts to keep it under wraps. Several months later, I learned he was tracking all my devices and reading not just my texts/emails but listening to my phone calls. He knew my plan and thus coerced me into telling him after hours of circular arguments and word salad from him. I broke down and just said this isn't working, I'm divorcing you. I made the mistake of assuming he could handle the news since we'd briefly discussed it in the past. I was wrong. From there on out it was like all hell broke loose. Thankfully, he didn't physically assault me then, but the ramifications I suffered from his lies, delusions, and attacks were like nothing I'd ever seen.

This is my story, not yours but if I could impart one important lesson I learned it is: have a plan and STICK TO IT. It sounds like you have some very rational and helpful friends. Find a lawyer now, make a safety plan with your therapist, a plan for your daughter, and a plan for how the divorce will be conveyed. You can get orders to remove him from your home if it comes to that.

You do not owe it to him to tell him in person. Consider that, if you do, having someone there with you or having the police be aware is likely necessary.

With respect to your comment about gathering important documents, do it while he's NOT home, and take them to a trusted friend. Doing this and taking any small high-dollar items like my jewelry out of the house is one of the best pieces of advice a friend gave me.

I am sorry you are going through this. I understand how stressful it is. We are here for you.

[yellowbutterfly]

One other thought...

I also feel bad about reassuring him that I am not divorcing him now that he's suspecting something, because that's not true, and I don't like outright lying to him like that. But I don't feel ready for him to know yet.

LIE LIE LIE and do not feel bad about this as it is necessary to keep yourself safe. Do whatever you need to within reason to keep up appearances at home to protect your plans.

I had several weeks prior to enacting my exit and I too felt bad about lying and pretending all was ok. I even went to marriage counseling with him (he made us cycle through 3 therapists). For each one, I reached out to them separately to tell them he was abusive and I was leaving and I had a safety plan. They all supported it.

My own therapist, friends, family, police, lawyer, and DV advocate all backed up the need to protect myself by lying to him until I could leave. It's not uncommon for people in these high-conflict situations to have to do so for safety.

I said I wanted to work on it, I didn't hire a lawyer, I wasn't divorcing or leaving him. All necessary safety lies. In the end, I stopped feeling bad about lying to a person I cared about. Because I loved myself MORE.

Give yourself the grace to know you are hiding your plans in order to protect yourself, it's not a reflection of you or that you did/do care for this person. He is mentally ill, unpredictable, and you need to think of you and your child first. It feels bad but the consequences are high as you stated yourself.

[yellowbutterfly]

Last thing, I'm not trying to be alarmist but just conveying my experience divorcing my xH uBPD. He was extremely disordered not just from BPD but also abusive and reactive. A few other things I did that were helpful to me:

- pack a go bag/hide it somewhere (could just be a gym bag with a set of extra clothes, meds) and have a trusted friend ready to always answer my call in case I needed to leave sooner
- alert my friends, family, and local police of my plan
- hire a lawyer > like FD says most will talk to you for 30 mins or so to understand your case. I interviewed several. Know that it will take several weeks for them to prepare the paperwork for a divorce. You want this ready to go. It won't take much effort once you ask around and find one you can afford (If not reach out to a local DV or Family Court Advocate and they can help with finding you someone)
- I did not share a joint bank account with him so I could place the retainer for the lawyer without him knowing. If you share finances, consider alternate ways to have funds set up for yourself
- documented what was happening when I received threatening messages - you can use locked notes on your phone. If incidents happen be very succinct and include dates/times especially if he is threatening you.
- the app iMAZING is relatively cheap and will export all your texts into a court-admissible format. Look into this.
- I had an issue with him stealing my physical iPhone, so I had my dad send a backup one to my office so I could access it in an emergency
- keep myself grounded in therapy

[Gerda]

Thanks so much for your replies, yellowbutterfly. This is exactly what I needed.

I'm getting pretty depressed today that it's come to this. I wish we could do this in a decent, civilized manner, but I guess not.

[yellowbutterfly]

It is depressing and scary. I am here to listen and acknowledge what you are going through.

Can you think of some small next steps to take that might feel helpful? If so, what is one? When could you covertly do it?

[ForeverDad]

I'm getting pretty depressed today that it's come to this. I wish we could do this in a decent, civilized manner, but I guess not.

• It is what it is.
• Do what you have to do.

[Gerda]

Well, last night my husband threw another fit while I was trying to get our daughter ready for bed. I was reading her bedtime story, and he started yelling at me about how he demands an apology for what I did last weekend. I kept telling him to please leave us alone, I'm trying to get 4D to bed, but he wouldn't stop.

I ended up shoving him out of the bedroom and locking the door again. Then he just started yelling at me from outside the door, saying "I bought this house! This is my house! You have no right to lock me out of any rooms in this house!" Then he moved on to saying he wants to kick me out. "I want you out! Get out of my house right now! But you can't take [daughter] with you! But I want you out of my house right now!"

I just stayed quiet and tried to comfort 4D and hoped that he'd give up, but he kept going, and 4D started saying things like, "I'm scared," and "Why won't he stop?" and "I thought Dada said he wouldn't fight anymore."

H then moved on to saying he demands an apology right now, and if I don't apologize tonight, he's calling a divorce lawyer tomorrow. Then he said the only reason why he hasn't divorced me already is because he doesn't trust me to be alone with our daughter, and then asked what am I doing in there with her, "You have no right to keep me from my daughter! I don't trust you in there! I just want to kiss her goodnight and you won't let me!"

Finally, I opened the door and told him it's 9:30 now, bedtime is supposed to be 8, and asked him to please stop so [daughter] can go to sleep. I told him she's scared, and reminded him that our marriage counselor told him MULTIPLE TIMES to stop fighting in front of her, that this is not good parenting, and he needs to just leave us alone. He tried to blame it on me, and I reminded him that I was just peacefully reading her her bedtime story when he started all this. Then he demanded that I "let" him kiss her goodnight, so I stood aside. He went in and said he was sorry to her, "for having to witness this," and kissed her goodnight.

4D then looked at me like she was happy that Dada said sorry and everything was OK now, but then H started demanding that I apologize again or else he's calling a divorce lawyer first thing in the morning, so I was like, "That's it! You're done! Get out now!" and shoved him back out and locked the door again.

By now it was so late that 4D fell asleep relatively quickly, but I had trouble calming down and falling asleep for quite a long time, especially since I was afraid that any minute he'd start up again.

Of course, this morning when I got up to get ready for work, he's grabbing me and forcing me to hug and kiss him again and says we're making up now.

Ever since I decided that I was start really working on divorcing him as soon as finals are over in May, I've been waffling between "wow May is coming up fast," and "I'm not sure if I can make it that long." Right now I've definitely swung back over to the latter.

One thing I need to do before actually interviewing lawyers is write down all the questions I want to ask them. I think I'll have time to do that today. I want to use both the questions that are in the book Splitting and also some of my own that are relevant to my specific situation. I also have a list of local lawyers I want to try. I just don't think I'll have an opening in my schedule to actually go to the appointments with them until May, and I'll have to be much more careful moving forward since my husband is now suspecting what I plan to do.

[eightdays]

Advice given to me from a clinical psychologist who had some experience with this was to allow a lawyer to include a letter with the service of papers that explains that the relationship is not working for the client along with the settlement offer, and to not be there for this event.   If they act out or threaten, or try to use the legal system against you it is recorded and witnessed that the subsequent behavior is after they were served and may be seen as retaliatory.  I can't report the results personally, but I believe this makes sense.   It is cynical, but do what you can to protect yourself.   You already know this isn't going to go over well.

[Pook075]

Then he moved on to saying he wants to kick me out. "I want you out! Get out of my house right now! But you can't take [daughter] with you! But I want you out of my house right now!"

Things appear to be escalating and if you plan on leaving anyway at some point, why not agree with him?  Now would be the perfect time for you to grab the kid while he's at work and go to a relative's house.  Then inform him by text that you complied with his demands.

I know you're not fully "prepared", but this isn't about preparation.  This is about protecting you and your daughter from abuse.

[yellowbutterfly]

Gerda,

This was a very hard post for me to read because minus the child involved this behavior was so similar to my xH's at the end. So many triggers for me. The demanding apologies, telling me I couldn't sleep in the bed because HE bought it, threatening me, trying to attack me physically, and more.

It only escalated for me from this behavior. I worry it will for you as well. I hope I don't sound harsh or too instructive below. I just feel for you and want you and your D to be safe!

I cannot emphasize enough since you've decided you're divorcing him to protect yourself and your D. You can meet with the lawyers on the phone or zoom. I didn't meet mine in person for months. Call them on your lunch break, bathroom break, whatever. That is what I did. Also, you want to call the local divorce attorneys first and make sure you make contact first. That way there is a record of you having a conversation with their firms and he cannot use a lawyer from those firms. It's a conflict of interest typically. My xH knew that and read my emails to find the firms I was emailing and made sure to call them. Psycho behavior.

Also, my situation escalated once he figured out about the divorce filing coming up and the xH retaliated with so many false charges against me. Things I never thought someone could make up much less he could. It was insane. He abused the legal system too.

Things appear to be escalating and if you plan on leaving anyway at some point, why not agree with him?  Now would be the perfect time for you to grab the kid while he's at work and go to a relative's house.  Then inform him by text that you complied with his demands.

I know you're not fully "prepared", but this isn't about preparation.  This is about protecting you and your daughter from abuse.

I would consider leaving before you are "prepared" as Pook says. It is becoming increasingly unsafe.

I would also consider going to the police when you leave and having it documented that you feel unsafe having your D around him and telling them your plan like you said before. Text friends/family too so it is in writing what you are doing and why - he is unsafe for you both to be around. If you do contact him when you leave, I might inform him that not only did he ask you to leave on x night, you feel unsafe around him with D and are staying elsewhere until further notice. He will probably retaliate so it would be good to state WHY you left, if you want to engage with him at all.

You can also talk to a family court advisor and a lawyer to consider a temporary order of protection. Ask the lawyer you speak with about this. You may be able to get one stating you're in the process of filing for divorce and need protection from him. This would allow you some time to file. I am not a lawyer so ask their opinions. I found all the family court lawyers I spoke with to be very understanding, helpful, and NOT charge me in my situation for that first-hour consult. They were gracious and understanding. 

Alos, in my state (US), the first person to apply for a temporary order of protection (TOP) was granted it. He knew that and beat me to it with lies. When I, the actual victim tried to get one the judge even said she was sorry that she couldn't help me because he got there first. Call some lawyers tomorrow (yes Saturday) the family lawyers often take calls on the weekends in cases like these because of the nature of the conflict.

The police ended up telling me my xH was "unhinged" and warned me they see this all the time. They warned me he could kill me.

They and the DV advocate had to explain to me > YOU ARE BEING ABUSED. This is an unsafe situation! I couldn't see the escalation in behavior because I was in it. They could. It was so hard for that to sink in even though I knew it. I felt like something was wrong with me to be in this situation and not be able to take the steps quickly enough to leave. I want you to know, you are doing the right thing for you and your D.

Again, this is not to scare you but to share my similar experience. I really feel for you and I am here when you can message back.
 

[ForeverDad]

Most of us never found the "perfect time" to take action.  Sure, it's good to plan and prepare, but sometimes you've just got to take what and when you can.

If you do have to exit (or file for protection and that your spouse leave) sooner than later, you may have to take some days off to deal with the family emergency - and so you can personally care for your child.

I write this since if you don't have an order of protection that includes the child then he could just pick her up from daycare if you're not there.  (Without an order stating otherwise, both parents have equal but unspecified parental rights so then it becomes a wild west scenario where, to use an old phrase, possession is 9/10 of the law.)

[Gerda]

Right now I'm probably OK because he's swung back to the "love bombing" phase. But for him that means grabbing me and forcing me to hug him and kiss him any time I try to walk past him in the house. That's his idea of "making up." I wish he'd just leave me alone.

Tonight he'll probably want sex, because he thinks forcing me to have sex with him is forcing me to love him. I know all this "affection" is his way of reassuring himself that I'm not leaving him. So I'll have to play along with this for right now until he finally calms down.

So far all of his threats have been totally empty. He never called the sheriff or came to get 4D while we were at the campout. He never actually kicked me out of the house. He never called a lawyer.

I've heard it's really difficult to get a temporary protective order in my state. As I understand it, I have to have solid proof that he's an actual *physical* danger to me or my daughter. Screaming and yelling and empty threats are probably not enough. He's never actually hit either of us. He's threatened to hit me before, but I'm not sure if that counts, and I have no real proof of it.

I told a couple of my friends that he threatened to kick me out of the house Thursday night, and they also said I need to get a bag packed in my car just in case. I did have one before, but I put that stuff away to make room in car for camping equipment and luggage. I'll have to re-pack it some time when I'm home but H and 4D aren't, and that's not going to happen again for a bit. I'm typing up this reply real quick right now while H and 4D are outside in the backyard playing.

Unfortunately I don't have any friends or family that live close by, except for H's family. My closest friend lives more than an hour's drive away, in the opposite direction from my job. If I ever had to leave suddenly, I wouldn't have anywhere to go except maybe a hotel.

[ForeverDad]

About what is "actionable" ... Yes, family courts in different states vary in what they recognize as actionable abuse.

However, more actionable variables to keep in mind are whether:

• the abuse is toward you (iffy if only verbal)
• the abuse is evident to the child (maybe if only verbal)
• the abuse is toward the child (more likely if more than verbal)

This is where speaking with the agencies or professionals will be helpful.  Information reduces the helpless feelings we experience.  In my case, when I called Children's Protective Services (CPS) I reported that my preschooler was exposed to abusive incidents.  I was told to call back if abusive behavior was ever directed at my child, then 3 years old.

A few years later I called on a more recent incident and the lady on the phone told me to call the agency in child's mother's county.  I asked why, informing her I had residential status as parent.  (Perhaps by that time I was also custodial parent which I obtained a few years after the divorce.)  So be aware that even agencies can make faulty assumptions.

[EyesUp]

When you search for an atty, explain that you'd like a few minutes to interview to see if there's a fit for your case.  You'll typically get :30 minutes at no cost.  If you ask for an initial consultation, you might get charged.

Suggestions for attorney interviews:
- find out who are the most aggressive and expensive attorneys in your area - call them, even if you don't intend to use them.  this will generally preclude them from taking your H as a client.
- explicitly ask if they have experience with high conflict cases in which a PD may be present.  most attys will say that they have experience with high conflict cases because virtually all divorces have conflict. politely ask them to explain one or two instances in which a PD was present and how the case was resolved - what was the strategy.  listen carefully to what they say
- explain your current situation and concern about how/when/where your H is served, and ask how it can be scheduled and coordinated for your safety
- ask if there are any concerns if you need to make a 911 call prior to formally serving your H, what are the considerations, and how such action might impact your case   
- ask if the atty has direct experience in your county and already knows the judges you may be assigned
- ask if the atty will handle your case directly, or assign certain aspects to an assistant or paralegal. if you find an atty you're comfortable with, ask to review an engagement letter and all terms before you agree to sign.  understand the retainer and hourly rates.  ideally, you want an atty who will be with you from start to finish, including representation at hearings and trial if needed - who will also offload some admin work to a lower cost paralegal when possible.
- you want a litigator, not a negotiator.  a majority of attys are negotiators.  they will advise mediation, and expect that you will more or less follow the process of the typical divorce.  this is not the type of atty you need.  keep interviewing until you find an atty who is 100% ready to litigate - actually go to trial.  this is the type of atty who will give you a chance to settle - and who will also be prepared to represent your best interests in case you actually need to appear before a judge.  you will be told that most cases settle - this is true - however, unfortunately, it's cases like ours that are in the minority that actually go to trial because one or more participants are not reasonable - so you need to be ready for that possibility from the start. 

In my experience, I interviewed a LOT of attys. The one I wanted to hire had a $10k retainer that I could not swing, but I learned a lot from her when I asked her to explain approach.  I was able to convey this to a younger but still aggressive atty who I ended up hiring with a $5k retainer.  It took a while for my atty to understand that I was reasonable and my X was not, i.e., it can take a while for the atty to gain conviction in your case. 

As you go through the process of speaking with multiple attys, the interview process can help you boil down the story of your case to a more concise format...

I suggest that you use WhatsApp or Google Voice or similar to keep the atty calls off your phone bill, just in case.

Do not use your atty as a therapist.
Do not explain long narratives about emotional issues.
Do prepare a concise statement about who/what/when
Do keep a journal of your H's outbursts and events, especially anything that's occurred in front of your D
Do have a complete list of any potential witnesses, confidants, and providers for you and your D

This last one can be difficult.

You are the CEO of your divorce.  Your atty is your general manager - they report to you.  It's ultimately up to you to determine what you want to achieve.  If you get a good atty, you may be able to ask them how to achieve it, but in many cases you might need to figure that out, too.

It's hard to know how to do this - you've never done it before, the atty does it every day.

Still, the atty will say that every case is different.  Things that could be cut and paste are recut from whole cloth over and over again - this is to the atty's benefit as they get paid by the hour.

For example, my atty drafted language re: parenting time that prescribed how my X and I would manage "state and federal holidays" - well, it turns out that there are a number of other no-school days that are not state or federal holidays, and therefore our agreement is silent on how to manage these days, and of course my high-conflict X always finds a way to make these a problem.  If I was the atty, I would have asked to see a copy of the school calendar for my client's district and drafted appropriate language accordingly.  Or I would simply use the more inclusive "no-school days and holidays" rather than the specific (but incomplete) "state and federal holidays" language.  There was no way I could have anticipated the problem with this language until after the decree was finalized...   it's just one example of how even a well-intentioned and experienced atty can have blind spots.  ergo, it's up to us to think carefully about, well, everything.  In the end, it's your agreement - you need to sign it.  Make sure you understand it, like any other legal agreement or contract.

Please don't hesitate to ask for advice here.  You might also do well to seek out resources for women / single moms in your area who dealing with abusive situations.

You will get through this.

[yellowbutterfly]

All very good points from Eyesup having been through this process recently. One other point, I found my attorney through a much more expensive one. Don’t be afraid to tell them you cannot afford them and do they have a recommendation in your budget. The one I hired was a close friend of a much more expensive lawyer I interviewed.

[zondolit]

As I moved slowly toward divorce, my husband, who had always been very angry and accusatory, also became delusional and paranoid, which was very scary.

I struggled with how to tell him I was divorcing him. There is absolutely no way I would do it in person. No freaking way. What I settled on was a farewell email, coordinated with my lawyer contacting him two hours later. I knew he'd never believe my email saying goodbye without also hearing from a lawyer, but I didn't want the lawyer to be the first way he heard about it. That's how I tried to thread the needle, and in retrospect I can't think of anything better for the situation I was in.

I made arrangements for my children to spend the night with friends, since I didn't know how angry he might be, and I also exited the house that night. (He actually wasn't so angry at first; he thought he could cajole me out of divorcing him.)

We told the children, together, several weeks later. He was totally against telling them--that would make it real--but I essentially said: I'm telling them. You can join me (best practice) or not.

[PeteWitsend]

Right now I'm probably OK because he's swung back to the "love bombing" phase. ...

Aside from the practical advice people have given you, I want to say you need to get yourself sorted out mentally here.  You cannot let this disordered person's mood swings affect your mood or your thinking. 

It's like not knowing which direction the ground is while you ride a roller coaster.  But it's there in the same place, the only thing changing is your momentum. 

His behavior is intentional, even if he may not be able to articulate it - or admit it - and intended to keep you off-balance and dependent on him so you're too afraid to leave or otherwise coerced into staying with him.  He may or may not have "figured out" you're planning on divorcing him, but regardless, he'd accuse you of it, because as a pwBPD he's paranoid about being abandoned, and so he will read an intent to leave him in every action you do, whether or not you were even thinking about it. 

Remember that's all HIM... you didn't enter into this marriage planning to leave and abandon him... he pushed you away with his unhinged behavior and inability to control his emotions. 

[yellowbutterfly]

Gerda, checking in on you...

[Gerda]

I just posted a new thread on the latest husband-craziness.

Next week are final exams, and then I'm on summer vacation. I've got a huge amount of work to get done in the next two weeks, but then I'll be done.

And then it's time to start interviewing lawyers.

[yellowbutterfly]

you got this!!